Okay,,,Moates sent me an ARAP bin to burn into a chip. He feels that if this chip is loaded in the car I may finally be able to link up Tunerpro RT.
It's worth a shot so I downloaded the ARAP bin to a thumb drive to transfer over to the lap top.


Questions,,,,how do I read or look at this bin? Do you bring it up in Tunerpro? I need to remove VATS and a couple other things before I burn it into a new chip. I wish there was a manual with illustrations on how to do this, us newbies are in the dark.
What are the proper steps to go about burning this into a chip once I have the ARAP bin ready to go? Any help is much appreciated,,,Larry.

 

Just out of curiosity.

Have u tried reading the huuuuuuuuuuuuuuge stickies up top.

One of which happens to be a TunerPro guide/manual?

It would help you out and answer all of your questions.

You "newbies" have it easy now compared to the days of yore :-)

If u have further issues after reading that, feel fre to ask.

And remember, one change at a time and take notes, dont jump around.

later
Jeremy

 

The ARAP broadcast code (bin) is for a $6E mask and must be viewed in TunerPro using a $6E definition file (.XDF file) which should be included in the TunerPro application in the "Bin Definitions" folder. You need to open up the arap bin and the $6E definition file in TunerPro to view it.

What equipment will you be using to burn the new chip?

 

Thanks, that makes a little sense to me. I have Tunerpro RT along with APU1 which connects between the ALDL on he car and the laptop. I have not been able to link to the car to read the stock chip so at this point Moates has suggested burning an ARAP chip to install in the car, hoping that will allow Tunerpro RT to link up from what I understand. My new problem now is, I have ARAP on my laptop via a thumb drive but haven't been able to look at it, and I need to change a couple things before I burn it into a chip, which will be another huge leap for me when I get to that point. UGH!
I will give it another shot and see what I find, maybe I can explain it better after another look.


To answer your question Jeremy, yes I have read and re read those stickies, I even have them printed out and organized in a binder so I can take them out to the car with me and read back through it again, but something just doesn't jive. I think it was Mangus who has gotten me this far, actually got Tunerpro to start thinking about linking up,,,lol but still a no go. Since I have changed course temporarily to burning a new chip first, I am at a new sticking point. It's very hard for me to comprehend what is written here without actually seeing someone do it. None of the stickies I have found so far explain exactly how to open a chip to read it, or exactly how to burn it, where and what to click on in Tunerpro etc....I don't know if you can imagine my confusion or frustration but I am sure if this ever starts working and I figure it out it will be a wonderfull tool.
Does the APU1 and laptop have to be hooked to the ALDL in the car to look at a new bin/chip and then burn it into a blank? Or can I simply do this in the house on the laptop? Larry.

 

Quick primer

Connect your AutoProm and make sure it is reconized after step 1.
1.) Load up TP (should see your AP, note on the bottom of the screen)
2.) Select your XDF bin definition

optional for now but needs to be done anyway.
3.) Select your ADS definition (for logging later)
4.) Select the log file you will use later (in the comm setup box)

5.) Load your bin file
6.) edit your bin file (just small changes till you get used to it)
7.) SAVE the bin file (new checksum will be calculated for you)
Install your chip per the instructions on Moates site with regard to wherethe notch should go and the physical placement in the slots.
8.) Open (under "Tools") "Moates I/O"
9.) Select the chip you have to work with.
10.) Click "erase chip"
11.) Click "load file to buffer" and select the bin you just saved.
12.) Click "Program Chip"
13.) Click "Verify chip with Buffer" to be sure the chip burned correctly.

Install and turn on the key.
You should see a quick blip of the light as the prom is loaded.
That will confirm you got most of it correct.
A quick drive will prove the rest.
If the light goes on steady after starting, you did something wrong and will need to repeat from 7 down again.
Good luck.

It doesn't need to be hooked to the car to burn/edit the chip.
Jp

 

That is the kind of instruction I need, step by step, great for a computer newbie that doesn't know his way around the screens,,,,it's not like there is an icon jumping out at you saying, click here to burn chip,,,, I will give it a shot right now,,,,thanks a million Larry.
----------
I am not sure I should move past step one since I don't see anything on the bottom of the screen that tells me the auto prom is hooked up.

 

I am not sure I should move past step one since I don't see anything on the bottom of the screen that tells me the auto prom is hooked up.

 

I got the Arap bin to show up on the left side of the tunerpro screen in small boxes but in the middle an icon came up and said
"mismatched ADS and XDF file" I know this is something simple Larry.

 

Never mind that last post, I figured that out,,,,now I can actually see interesting info in the small boxes to the left of the tunerpro screen but I see no numbers and the screens are small, what do I click on so I can see what the numbers are and make any subtle changes? Larry.

 

If I am understanding correctly, you've got the arap bin loaded along with the $6E definition file in TunerPro and you are seeing the "Constants / Scalars", "Flags / Switches", and "Tables / Functions" boxes on the left, each with a bunch of parameters listed, correct?

If so, you just need to double click each description (like "Single Fire FI Size @ 40 psi", etc) and a pop up box should appear, allowing you to make the adjustment for that parameter.

Before you make any changes, you should do a "File, Save Bin As" and save the bin with a new name (creating a duplicate file to make changes to, leaving the arap bin that Craig sent you in it's stock form) so you can always compare it to the stock bin.

 

okay, I found that if I double click on an icon in the small box, another small box comes up with the actual numbers where I can make changes.
I changed the fan on/off temps with a/c off which was one main thing i was interested in.
The other is vats,,,since my car won't run with it,,,,but when I double click on that, the box that comes up is basically a box with a check mark in it that says, "set",,,,I remove the check mark and it still says vats enabled in the screen. I know I have seen a sticky somewhere that speaks of removing vats but I can't find it now. How do I get rid of that. thanks, Larry.

 

I believe removing the check mark and saving is all you need to do to disable VATS.

Glad to see you are making progress

 

Very cool, thankyou,,,,I removed the checkmark and saved it,,,,can't believe it is that simple Anyway, I will finish carefully reading your previous post on all the steps and see if I can burn this to a chip,,,then install in the car and cross my fingers it starts Larry.

 

Okay I get to step 8 and click on tools and I see Moates I/O but it is not highlighted so I cannot click on it. What does that mean? Larry.

 

Means I forgot to tell you to plug it in

Be sure the horizontal switch is twards the middle of the AutoProm.
Towards connector is AutoProm,
away from connector is "Pass through" (just a cable)

Once the AP is plugged in and found by the software, the Moates I/O will be enabled.

Check in Winders and see if the device is even there
(My computer or control panel, System, Device manager)
Should be listed under one of the USB items or as another device.
If you don't have that then you must install the driver for the device.

Also, go to the Preferences under the Tools menu in TP and set the ALDL/Emulation to AutoProm.
That could be it too.
----------
Magnus always likes to remind me of the extensive help file he has created for TunerPro.
It shouldn't go un-noticed

 

Okay I had the wife check since that is way over my head.


She checked and says the driver is not installed for the autoprom,,,where do I find that? I guess it needs to be downloaded into the laptop? Larry.

 

Okay she came over and downloaded the driver from Moates' site. Installed it on the laptop and I brought up Tunerpro and now Moates I/O is highlighted and working,,,,wooohooo
I will continue the chip burning process and see what happens. I have one more question that has me curious now.
Could this be the reason that I could not link up to the car in the first place? UGH! Larry.

 

If it was in AutoProm mode, yes.
That and the preferences not being set.

At least you have a co-pilot for tuning now

 

Thankyou, the chip burning was a success according to Tunerpro, now I just have to install it into the car and see if it runs.
First I may try to link up to the car one more time now that I have the autoprom driver installed on the laptop. Just for giggles to see if anything is different. Thanks again, Larry.

 

I installed the chip with a moates adapter, unplugged the 9th injector and it fired right up, a little rough,,,smelled rich, then I remembered I had fuel pressure at 48 lbs, I turned it back down to 44 lbs. and the engine smoothed right out, nice throttle response etc,,,,but it is throwing a code 41, faulty or incorrect memcal.
I cleared the code and fired the car back up just to double check, it came right back.
It's just a big blue peice of plastic with a small black box on top, then the chip goes on top of that, I don't think the car would even run if I had this stuff in wrong. Any ideas? Larry.

 

It is important that the chip be oriented properly in the adapter. I believe the little notch on the end of the chip has to face outward, meaning those pins at the "notch" end of the chip would line up with the outermost sockets on the adapter. Hopefully that makes sense...

The car would definitely run if you had the chip in the adapter backwards (even if you had no chip in the adapter at all, actually) - but it would be in "limp home" mode, not referencing the chip for anything.

Definitely locate that little notch at one end of the chip and double check the orientation of it in the adapter.

 

Thanks for responding,,,I appreciate it. I went out tonight to double check the chip, I have it in correctly with the indentation towards the outside. Just for giggles I installed it the other way and turned the key on.
The fuel pump runs and never shuts off and the check engine light doesn't come on so I knew something was wrong right off the bat.
I reinstalled the chip the correct way, turned the key on, fuel pump ran for 2-3 seconds and shut off and the check engine light came on,,,everything was working as it should, so I started the car and within 2 seconds code 41 comes back I removed the Moates adapter and rechecked the pins again to make sure one had not bent or something stupid like that, everything looks good, I snap it back into place, cleared the code and refired the car, code 41 comes back again,,,,bad memcal.
What I don't understand is if this is bad then why does the engine purr like a kitten and have crisp/excellent throttle response? I haven't driven the car, didn't see any reason too really and it's supposed to rain tomorrow.
Anything else I should try? Maybe try burning the chip again? I don't really think that is the problem though but I will try anything. Thanks again, Larry.

 

You're not using a V6 memcal are you?
That will show a chip select error or bad memcal with a V8 bin running.

May want to set the mask ID to "AA" so the checksum is ignored.
Should be one of the first items (by address number) in your bin.
That will show you if the error is due to the chip programming.
If the error goes away then it was your chip causing it.
Remember to wait 5-6 seconds after turning off the key before removing the chip.
There is still power on it and can cause some problems with chips over time.

Look at address 09 in your bin.
Do you have "00" there to signify 8 cylinders?
That will do it.

 

I will go back into the programming and try to look at what I did.
I do remember when I actually burned the chip a new checksum was assigned, not sure what it was. I will have to look around and see if I can find something about checksums.
If I can't find it I may just burn the chip again with mask ID to AA like you suggest so checksum is ignored, I will play with that and see if I can figure it out.

I will look for address 9 in the bin and make sure 00 is there, again this may take me some time as I am still feeling my way around the different screens and having trouble finding them This may take me couple hours then I will report back. Thanks, Larry.

 

Okay I checked the info in Tunerpro, I had "00" for 8 cylinders so that was ok.
The mask ID says 6E
I went to Checksum and it says 5B96,,,"shrug" I don't know what that is for or what it means, can you enlighten me?

To make sure I understand this correctly, you want me to change the mask ID to "AA" so the checksum is ignored, then reburn the chip and install it in the car and see what happens?

As to the V-6 memcal question, not sure how to tell the difference, I ordered this stuff from Moates for my application. I assume when you say memcal you are talking about the blue chip adapter that goes into the ECM? It's a long skinny thing, blue in color, with a small black box on top, and the chip goes onto the box on top. Thats it. The blue chip adapter also has prongs coming out of one side, I beleive that may be for the computer ribbon that I also have, maybe for emulating or real time tuning? I am guessing here.
The chips I am using are 27SF512 which I believe have more memory than the original chip in my car, 16 verses 32? I remember reading somewhere that something special has to be done when burning these chips, something like burning the tune in there twice or something? But when I burned this chip I had to select the type of chip I was burning into during the process so I assumed it took care of that for me? I don't know, I am grasping here,,,lol.
Larry.

 

I'm not sure what the "check sum" line is for, but Mangus told me to set it to "AA" and forget it, so I would advise the same for you

The 27SF512 chip does have more memory than needed for the binary file you are loading onto it, so you need to use an "offset" as described here:

http://www.moates.net/documentation....ntation_id=20]

Give that a shot

Dan

 

Okay I checked the offsets and everything was good. I looked at some pictures on moates site and found installation instructions for the chip adaptor and it actually had pictures so I could actually understand what to do,,,I immediately found the problem,,,I did not have my original memcal attatched to the adapter memcal, that is what the prongs on the adaptor are for So I installed the original memcal onto the adaptor memcal and poof,,,,no more code 41. I still don't understand how the new chip will work when my old chip is still on the old memcal,,,,
Anyway now the car starts and runs,,,,it idles a little rougher and when I rev the engine with a quick snap of the throttle there is a hesitation,,,which tells me the engine needs more pump shot (carb lingo) not sure what you computer guys call it but it's basically a lean spot from opening the butterflys and I need more fuel to cover that up. Make sense? Not sure what tables to play with to do that though
What bothers me the most is I reset the fan temps (fan 1)at on 185 and off at 175 with A/C off and sitting in the garage running and getting pretty warm, neither fan is coming on So I went back and reburned the chip and changed the temps for fan 1 with A/C on as well, and also found a column for fans to operate you have to reach a certain mph, which was 35 mph, I changed that to 0 mph thinking that was the problem, I then reburned the chip and reinstalled in the car, still no change,,,I am afraid to drive it if the fans won't come on. Is there something else I am missing for changing fan temps? Thanks a million, Larry.

 

I went back out and decided to try and link Tunerpro up to the car. I was floored, it actually connected and started giving me data, I guess the car had to have that newer 6e ARAP bin after all.
I had it running and was looking at some things, mainly the engine temperature as it started to climb, got up to 210 degrees and still no fans I went back into the chip program and made sure the temps I selected were still there, Fan 1, on at 185 and off at 175, with the a/c off,,,I checked with a/c on,,,fan 1 on at 185 and off at 175. I checked the mph for fans to be enabled, or something like that,,,and I have that at 0 mph, which was 35 mph before.
What really puzzles me now, the secondary fan that I believe is not controlled by the ecm at all (I think) is also not coming on. I have a hypertech sending unit in the passenger side head for that to come on at 200 degrees and off and 185 degrees,,,and it's not coming on either.
Did I do something wrong in the chip program when changing the fan temps? Larry.

 

If you look closely at the adapter, the new chip is connected and the old chip is not. That's what the adapter does for you so you don't have to solder a new chip or holder directly to the memcal.
Keeps damage to a minimum.

As far as the fans go, your relays may be bad if they don't turn on at all.
When you were running without the memcal, they should have come on immediatly.
Something to look into.

Once you've gotten the hang of making the changes and saving the bins it will be time to refamiliarize yourself with the tuning guide.
The basics will become clearer to you and figuring out what the sequence of changes should be.
Start with fueling for cruise and get that close, then move into the bogs and hesitations. Doing it in a sequence will give you the best results.

The checksum is the bin file added up into one number so to speak so there is a check that when the program is loaded it is what it is supposed to be and not any "strange" bits being changed.
If the program is added up, it should match the checksum value.
Also since you are burning chips one at a time (instead of emulating) you should not use the "AA" in the ID if possible. It is just a tool to keep from going into limp mode when you are making changes where the file can not be recalculated into a good checksum. Some programmers do not automatically perform the calculation and would set the SES light. Having the checksum always recalculated by TP each time you save the bin will give you an indication if the "burn" went bad during the programming. With the $6E in the ID, the checksum is confirmed and the program is operating properly.
When you emulate, the "AA" allows changes on the fly and the checksum will not throw an error indicating the program is not confirmed.
HTH

 

At least you're making progress

The PROM chip on your original mem-cal (or cal-pak - I forget the terminology) is not referenced using the Moates adapter because the pins from the adapter don't plug into that portion of the mem-cal.

Acceleration Enrichment = pump shot. There are a couple of A.E. tables to play with. I'd start out with the A.E. factor vs. change in load table.

The fan issue is interesting. What are you looking at to determine the coolant temperature? The guage on the dash is NOT connected to the CTS (coolant temp sensor). You should definitely be looking at a data log for coolant temp - then you'll see what the ECM is seeing for coolant temp. A faulty CTS sensor can cause a boatload of problems, including making the engine run very rich.

If you are using Tuner Pro for the coolant temp data, and it is at 210 and the fans are not coming on, then we'll need to do some more troubleshooting...

 

This is all starting to make sense to me now.
I will keep the checksum in mind,,,,I have not figured out how to tune on the fly yet but that is my next step,,,,I figured I would start with this ARAP chip and start making small changes on the fly, so maybe I will keep the AA for now so I can make changes on the fly.

As far as the coolant temps, I was watching the tunerpro screen, it has engine temp when started, and then above that is current engine temp when the engine is running. What has me puzzled is the fans worked fine with the original chip in the car. So I am thinking the relays should be okay,,,at least I hope so,,,there are so many damn relays on this car I wouldn't know which one to replace Anyway, tunerpro had the engine temp at 210 degrees and still climbing, down below that there was a line that says something about cooling fans and whether they were being commanded or not, and it said it was, but they were not running so I shut the engine off.
Thats pretty much where I am now. Guess I need to trouble shoot the fans or maybe reinstall the factory chip and see if they come on? Larry.

 

I think I remember reading somewhere about when switching over to $6E, there is some type of cooling fan switch that needs to be checked in order for the fans to operate properly. I haven't gotten this far with my tune yet, but it's ringing a bell about something I came across a while ago on this board while doing my "research"...

Try this - go to the "Flags / Switches" box and scroll down to the "Cooling Fan N/O Req Input" line. Double click it and put a check in the "Set" box. Reburn the chip and see if that fixes it.

 

I found the flag you mentioned, it was not checked, so I checked it and then reburned the chip. Still no cooling fans
I waited anxiously for the temp to climb to 185,,,I let the engine run to 210 degrees and still no fans.
I turned on the A/C because that has always made both fans come on, still no fans. I can watch the screen in the flags section, and it says the a/c has been commanded to come on, and just below that is a cooling fan flag, it also says the cooling fans have been requested,,,,still not working though.

If nothing else at least I am getting alot of practice reburning this chip But the fans have me puzzled, they have always worked in the past,,,,"shrug"
I turned the key on and then grounded the wire that goes to the pass side cylinder head for the secondary fan, which I thought would make that fan run, all it did was make the fan relay click,,,so I replaced that relay with a known good relay and still just the same clicking from the relay.
I thought the secondary fan was supposed to run if I grounded that wire, since that temp sending unit is nothing but a ground anyway,,,,right?

I am not sure how to jumper the main fan to make it run. They both spin freely by hand. I am tempted to install the original chip, hook the 9th injector back up, and fire up the car and watch the cooling fans for a while and make sure they come on,,,,I know I am not losing my mind here, I was driving the car up until I started playing with chips and it was working fine,,,,really. Larry.

 

Damn! I was hoping that was it. Sorry to mislead you

I wonder if it has anything to do with the ALDL cable being hooked up and the grounding / resistance (or lack thereof) between terminals A and B??

Maybe try disconnecting the ALDL cable and see what happens just for kicks (with the cooling fan flag checked and then unchecked to cover that base as well)??

I'm not sure what the correct troubleshooting procedure would be at this point, as I'm really just sending you in 87 different directions

 

Ya I was hoping that was it too. Oh well. Not sure whats up. I will try starting the car without the computer hooked up and see what happens. Worth a shot. If not I may install the original chip and fire the car up and make sure they still come on. After that it's time to get out the GM book and start troubleshooting it I guess. I may not get back to it until late tonight as this is the time of day I start getting busy with a few other things. I will post back after I try all of the above..... Larry.

 

Did you get those fans running? On my car, there is a inline fuse before the fan relays (20 amp?). When you ground the wire going to the coolant sensor on the left head, the fan relay should "click" and the backup fan should come on. If it does not, then you want to check the inline fuse before the fan relay next to the battery tray.

I had issues with my fans and found out that the fan drive transistor in my ECU was burned out. Rather then replace the transistor; I connected both fans to the coolant temperature switch on the left head. I replaced the sensor switch with a lower temperature switch (185 on and 195 off), so now both fans will come on based the switch and not from the ECU.

If needed you can find the switch at Summit Racing, part number =
JET-60600 for around $39....
Regards,
Nate
Classic GT Motorsports

 

Nope the fans are still inop.
I reintsalled the original chip thinking the new one I made had something to do with it.
Still no fans. For some reason they have stopped working at the same time I decide to work on something else
I was grounding the wire that goes to the temp sender on the passenger side head, and the relay was clicking, but the fan did not run, I swapped the relay for a known good one, got the same clicking but still no fans.
While engine was running I even turned on the A/C for a while which has always turned both fans on at the same time, still no fans.
I eventually had to turn the engine off for fear of overheating.
I did not know there was an inline fuse for the fans,,,I will go out and check that right now and report back. I hope it is something that simple. Otherwise I will have to get into heavy diagnostics with a manual. thanks a bunch,,,Larry.

 

Well I checked around the tray, I did find and inline fuse, actually it's at the end of a group of wires that just dead end into a 20 amp fuse. The fuse is fine. But I did find something of interest. There are 2 other seperate wires down below the battery tray, one is read and one is orange and both have a quick disconnect on them. I pulled the red one just to check and it is fine.
I was looking at the orange one and it appears it has been hot, some discolor on the orange insulation at the begining of the plastic terminal,,,so I went to pull it apart and it was severely stuck. The plastic inside had melted around the terminal connection, it finally broke free but not without ruining the quick disconnect. ugh!
Now I have to run to the store and try to find a duplicate of this connector and put this back together. I am not sure if this has anything to do with the fans but it's something that needed attention none the less. "shrug" Larry

 

Fans are now working as they should. It turns out that the orange wire must be the power feed wire for both fans as not both of them are working fine, the main fan #1 comes on the the temp I selected in the chip, the secondary fan comes on a little later with the Hypertech switch in the cylinder head. Although I had to run all over town to find the correct weather packs and terminals to fix it properly.
I finally got to go for a drive, car runs fine, no audible pinging. I thought this ARAP bin was supposed to be aggressive with the timing but my car is not objecting to it. Seems to run strong although from a 20-30 mph roll it used to lightly haze the tires in first gear (with 2.77's,,,lol) now it is not doing that, so I suspect this ARAP bin is going to need some fine tuning.
Now I know how to link up to the car, and I can burn a new chip.
All I have to figure out now is how to datalog info while driving, and also learn how to make changes on the fly while driving. I would like to try to datalog first and see how things look, Thanks again guys, I am starting to see some light at the end of the tunnel. Larry.

 

You sure that's not a train

Once you get to logging and seeing whats happening, the tweaking and the questions never end. There's always something thet "could" use an adjustment to make it perfect or how to make this react the way I want kind of thing. The stickys and the guide will be your savior.
Remember you WILL need to take a step backwards now and then when tuning.
Sometimes after I get a bunch of things tweaked nicely, I'll start all over with a stock bin and retweak the values I know are good and start over.
Helps keep you going in the right direction.
Making lots of changes can get you going in circles real fast. Be careful when emulating, it happens easily.

 

Awesome - glad to hear it Larry - congrats!!! Enjoy the never ending quest for the perfect tuen...