keeperofthe7key

i have a 1990 iroc and whenever i put the key in an try to start it , it dosent even try to start , like te batery is dead. i replaced the ignition switch and it is still doing it , it does it usually after a drive , any help?

onthedownlow

iTrader: (4)

Sounds to me like what just happened to me, the car suddenly wouldn't roll over or anything. I took a guess thinking it must be the starter itself. I knew from experience that if a starter is worn out it will act like this, and I also knew a little trick to get it going. So I got my gf in the drivers seat and told her to turn the key like she was starting it and told her to hold it, at the same time I used a hammer handle and lightly knocked on the side of the starter and or solenoid and it started right away. Hope this helps.

keeperofthe7key

yea downlow , i did just put a new starter in about 2 months ago , so i dont its the starter itself but ill still try it ,
and i did put a new batery in about 4 months ago

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

You need to break the test light out and do some homework.
The starter circuit is a simple one (relatively, compared to others).
http://www.austinthirdgen.org/mkport...n8_starter.jpg

You can start backwards directly from the starter solenoid. Put a test light on the purple wire (which activates the solenoid) and it should light up with the key on. CAREFUL, the engine might turn over. You can prevent it from starting by pulling the coil wire.

Work your way backwards through the transmission switch (if automatic) or clutch switch (manual) and the VATS Starter Enable Relay (behind the left kick panel or above the knee panel). Find out how far your starting power goes. Might not be a starter problem, could be one of the components I mentioned above.

Hope this helps.
Lou

keeperofthe7key

thanks bigbad ,i think one of my relays is bad ,my fan comes on right when i turn the car on and before i start it , could the starting problem be in that relay as well with the cooling fan?

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

Nope. The starting and cooling circuits are completely separate. No common relays.
That's just another different problem. You need to tackle these one at a time.

Question: when you say the car won't start when warm: does anything else work? Do the fans come one? Does your instrument cluster work? Do headlights light up?

jermdm

Is your car not cranking or is it cranking and not starting? Alot of people say my car doesnt start and we find out that its not cranking. Cranking over or not starting would be 2 different problems. If its not cranking, does the instrument cluster turn on when you turn on the ignition? If the IC turns on and when you turn the key to the start/crank position and get nothing or sometimes cranks and starts, it almost sounds like it would be a VATS key problem. This is usually the most common problem with our cars when sometimes it cranks and sometimes it doesnt. If the car is cranking and not starting, it could be fuel problem, ignition system problem that will give you an intermittent crank and start or crank and no start. My iroc had the same problem with it not wanting to crank after driving it, then after it sat for a while, it would crank and start like nothing happened. Found out that the chip on the key was worn down enough to give a bad connection and put the VATS module in theft mode. Bypassed the key and havent had the problem since.

coachice11

My car cranks buts does not turn on when i turn the key and other times i get no crank so i was thinking it was the key or could it be the fuel pump

keeperofthe7key

bigbad yes my car does have lights and other power , jus when i turn the key to the start position everythi then cuts out .

jerm my car dosent even crank , when i tirn it to start position everything cuts out , and everything is quiet , no clicking or starting or anything , i just bought another key from GM and its not the key that is worn cause it didnt work

jermdm

Since the car isnt cranking when the ignition switch is in the crank/start position, I would start by looking at wiring, relays, etc. You could replace the starter enable relay for the VATS. You said you replaced the ignition switch. Was it the lock cylinder for your key or was it the switch located on the steering column under the dash?

TreeFiddy

If the battery is in fact ok, check the two big cables from the battery - the (+) to the starter and the (-) to the engine.

Odd are there's a connection or terminal that's broken or rusty. Good enough to power most things, but giving up when presented with the massive starter current, and robbing voltage from everything.

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

You should have told us that in the first place and you could have saved yourself the cost of a new ignition switch and other parts you already threw at this problem.
That's why I asked if anything else works. That's the biggest clue.

Your cause of no-start is a bad battery cable connection.
That said, you need to realize that a battery cable makes multiple connections. Terminal to post, cable to terminal, cable to other terminal and other terminal to other post (on the other end of the cable).
The most common fault is a worn out terminal that's not touching the post in its whole width. Reaming the terminal with the right size tool usually helps temporarily but replacing it is the way to go.
The second common fault is bad oxidation on an aftermarket terminal where the thick cable is held with just a little "bridge" plate. Oxidation there builds up and cuts off all power to your vehicle's electrical system.

So take a look at those battery terminals and let us know whether that fixed it.

Hope this helps.
Lou

keeperofthe7key

kerm, i replaced ignition switch on the column not the key switch

keeperofthe7key

big bad , when i had the starter replaced 2 months ago and i toldem to check the battery cables and he said they were fine , he coulda been lieing but ill checkk anyway

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

You bet your sweet a** that they could lie. That's how they make their living (most of it), by performing unnecessary repairs. You might have never needed a starter, just a cable.

Please do check your cables, that is the #1 cause of your symptom.

Let us know what you find.
Lou

89bigbird

I had the same problem about 2months ago and it ended up being the starter, once replaced it fired right up

schwaljenator

I removed my Hood latch and now my battery keeps dying didn't ever do it till I disassembled my Hood latch... is there any lights or anything that can be coming on from the Hood not being latched? Any ideas? Please let me know I'm getting very Aggravated

xavier_pr84

are you from texas lou?

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

Yup. Feel free to PM me to avoid littering this thread.

TreeFiddy

I've had cables and connectors that looked fine before too. Only to find internal corrosion, diabolically hidden behind pristine looking insulation. Give each cable end a few nice big tugs, see if it goes crack or breaks off.

keeperofthe7key

see i just went out for 2 20-30 min rides and and each time i came back i turned car off and tried to start right away and waited 5 mins and it started again , it just starts when it wants to basically
and if my cables were bad wouldnt it be not starting all if not most of the time?

TreeFiddy

Could be doing anything. Last time I had a cable problem, it would be fine for a couple of days or weeks, and then suddenly refuse to even turn over, in whatever random carpark I happened to be stuck in. Wait several minutes or hours and off she'd go. Was an extremely annoying but fleeting problem, and took a while to track it down.

That turned out to be really bad corrosion where the neg battery cable joined the batt terminal, inside under the insulation. Looked perfect from the outside. Shattered like glass when I stuck it in a vice and gave it a good heave.

keeperofthe7key

i see what your saying fiddy , but it didnt start when i first tried today and it didnt even try to start and i wiggeld the key and **** and tried a couple more times and it started and tried starting it about 15 more times throughout the night after driving a good 25 miles , so it could be just the key switch itself??

TreeFiddy

Sure, but I thought you already replaced that. It could be anything of course. We're just all here online trying to make educated guesses about what the problem might be, based on your description of the symptoms. Hopefully someone gets lucky and pins it for you

In the meantime, you might have to break out the test light or voltmeter, and try a little troubleshooting when it's deciding to fault out.

keeperofthe7key

no fiddy i replaced what they a ignition starter switch under the column like.. but my battery is givig out volts but it just also be a 50/50 chance each time i put the key in te switch, wheather it connects right or not ?

TreeFiddy

Ah, so you already replaced the ignition switch, but not the key BARREL. All the barrel has to do it rotate and move the internal mechanism and rod, that actuates the ignition switch. If it rotates all the way and feels normal, its ok.

Your previous description of everything cutting out, really makes it sound like a battery/connection/cable problem, since the whole electrical system is affected. You definite that EVERYTHING electrical ceases to function when you attempt to crank? Eg radio, dome light, gauges - stuff like that?

keeperofthe7key

see when i start it and it still dosent try to start but my headlights are still at full power ,

TreeFiddy

Ah, so everything DOESN'T cut out when you crank. You just get no crank. Doesn't rule out batt cables, but it moves them further down the list.

Now off the top of my head -

* maybe ign switch not mounted right on the column - actuator rod not engaging properly
* maybe bad park/neutral switch (you ARE trying to start in park, right?)
* maybe vats issue (I know nothing about that)
* or some other fault in the wiring - time to break out the multimeter, I would start by probing around the ign switch and see if 12v appears on the appropriate wires.

keeperofthe7key

i just replaced the neutral saftey switch , well see what that does for us then

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

Do yourself a big favor and stop throwing money/parts at your car. You need to FIND what's causing your problem first and THEN you can replace it. Follow my advice in post #4.
Otherwise you might end up replacing the whole car in the end, capisce?

keeperofthe7key

since i changed the neutral switch it has been starting good for past 2 days ...

BigBadLou

iTrader: (3)

You got lucky that it was the second part you replaced.