Ok... i'm doing an engine swap to a lt1 or a ls1 next spring... i've got a small problem.. our law states the the engine weight of the new engine must not change over 20% when compared to the engine of choise from same body.

I can chose the engine i want to compare to.. the other factor i have to compare are hp and displacement... i have a 25% tolerance in hp and 20% in displacement... so... the question is... what is the lightest and most powerfull engine the 3rdgen firebird was made with.. i can't compare to the tta cause the displacement will go over...

the ls1 is all aluminum.. the l98 is cast steel block and heads. so will the weight difference exeed 20%?? the other problem if that the l98 is rated at 240hp.. the ls1 has 305-320hp... that won't fit in the 25% that i have to work with...

what would you guys do if you were me?? i am prepared to order the engine for over there... (the lt1 costs $4000 with 120kmiles over here)

what engine should i use for the comparisson (sp?)?? what year? i know the output had differences... i really want and ls1 and can't figure a way out of the problem.. am i stuck with the lt1?

it would also help if anybody had info whet the engines weights stock.. what did gm officialy mark as there weight..

I've though i could try and sneak the engine in the car and just falseful the statement but i think i'll get caught fast... i need statments from gm to prove that all of the limits set by law are with in limits...

I hate the law over here...

sorry for the very messy post.

-Crisis-

 

Compare it to the 91-92 Firehawk. 350hp 350ci V8.
LT1 might be about 50lbs lighter than the Firehawk motor, which is about 10%. Not sure what an LS1 weighs, but it is all aluminum.

 

How are they gone to tell if you changed engines and how to the inspectors check the weight??? Not that much diffence in appearance or weight of 350 SBC. I bet your inspection people in Finland would't know the differences in SBC engines if one hit them.

 

I agree, some of the "R" Firehawks had an aluminum block. Then you can run anything you want. The aluminum blocks were 4-bolt main, but the LS1 is too. I don't know about the weight of the aluminum, but that should work for you.


Also, since they made this a law, I'm sure they have a list of how heavy each motor can be when fully dressed. Mabye you can find a list at the local government site, or maybe you can ask them for a list. Tell them you were just wondering what you could put in the car, and choose one that would work.

 

I could swear i read in a magazine (PHR?) that an LS1 weighs about 75lbs lighter than an average SBC.

So if the average SBC is about 500lbs, that makes an LS1 about 425 lbs

so an LS1 weighs around 85% of what a SBC weighs in at.

15% difference in engine weight between the LS1 and a SBC like the LT1 or L98. Looks like the LS1 is still an option

 

Sorry, but I must butt-in here...

1. All '98+ V8 powered F-bodies had aluminum engines.
2. The LS1 actually has 6 Bolt Mains... 4 in the usual spots, and 2 that go in through the side of the block.

 

are you sure about that... My build sheet for the 363 (iron block, aluminum heads) has a dry weight of 396 lbs. Fluids might be anoter 25-35 lbs at best if even that and aluminum intake manifolds are like 5 lbs lol, they are REALLY light, so like 440 lbs complete. I always thought an LS1 was towards 350 lbs or so...

 

I'm pretty sure... GM says that a factory built (minus accessories, etc) is 496lbs wet.

And a 454 is 609lbs wet.

 

496 vs. 440, hmm 50 lbs is about the weight difference between an iron headed engine and an aluminum headed engine. hmm.

 

The LS1 is 150 pounds lighter than a regular SBC. Does your state actually weigh the car? Why report the swap anyway?

 

I think the state would be happy if he's swapping an LS1 or LT1 in, those engines are 100s of times cleaner and more efficient than old gen I chevys

 

I agree. More emissions headroom for mods!

 

Just add the difference in weight to the car (sandbags in the trunk?) for the test, hehe.

 

the problem is that if they notice that i've done an engine swap i have to prove what engine is in the car.. if they can't prove i've changed anything.. well then..

Oh and people are right.. usualy the inspection engineer wont tell the difference beteen sbc:s.. but tpi and tbi are very different in looks..

youve only talked about weight.. the bigger problem is hp... whats the fastest thirdgen firebird of any official product line?? i know people are gonna say TTA... what about the late 91-92 firehawks???

Oh and if they can prove my engine isn't stock i'll have to dyno it to prove i'm with in limits of the law

"I can chose the engine i want to compare to.. the other factor i have to compare are hp and displacement... i have a 25% tolerance in hp and 20% in displacement... so... the question is... what is the lightest and most powerfull engine the 3rdgen firebird was made with.."

 

This is a classic case of why tree hugging socialism sucks. They would actually make you go that far? In essence you are putting a cleaner burning, more efficient engine in the car and they seek to peanalize you because of the simple fact that it is not original.

The lightest most powerful engines for the thirdgen cars were the TT-V6 and the all alumininum version SLP firehawk.

The SLP cars were sent to SLP for conversion. I am not sure if the engine can be traced to the VIN number other than an option code on the build sheet.

 

Compare it to the Firehawk... it had 350hp from the factory.

 

dude.... why does it matter, do they actually put the car on the dyno and get hp and tq specs?
and even if they do those are rear wheel specs not the flywheel numbers you see from the car manufacturers.

so are they going to pull the engine to dyno it,

or try to prove your over 20% with a rear-wheel dyno,

either your not telling us something or Finland is pretty F***ing STUPID!!!!!!!

either way .if they make you do a chasis dyno the numbers will come up about 20% less than what flywheel numbers are, so you can figure you can go up at atleast 40% more horsepower.