So far, i have aquired the following parts:
GM Fastburn heads
350 4 Bolt Main Block

I want produce at LEAST 500rwhp, so i would like opinions as to what intake, cam, and headers i should use. Remember, i must stay somewhat smog legal in the smog **** peoples republik of kalifornia, but non-smog legal combinations are welcome as well. I will be keeping catalytic converters no matter what also.

 

I like that you have an overall goal but you need a plan BEFORE you purchase parts. Just a wee bit ahead of yourself here.

To get that much horsepower and still meet emissions you need either nitrous or supercharger/turbocharger. You won't get even close on the engine alone. Nitrous is less expensive and will be temporary power... but honestly, what full throttle blast isn't just temporary anyway?

My recommendation is to build the engine as a hot street performer at 400 to 450 HP at the engine. You'll be happier with the part throttle response, driveability, and mileage. It will work greate 99.9% of the time. And frankly, you'll be doing good just to use that much power with street tires. For the other 0.1% of the time, use the nitrous on the track with slicks.

Good luck and keep us all posted on your progress and results!

 

Never going to get there without a lot more cubes or F/I.

 

Both AFR and TrickFlow have some GREAT aluminum heads that are smog legal. AFR has a 180cc and 195cc head, and TFS has a 195cc head. I'm not sure if the GMPP FastBurn heads are, but I doubt it. You'll also want as many cubic inches as possible. If you have a 350 block, then put a forged steel 383 crank in there. Technically, the 383 crank is not emitions legal, but they will never know its there unless you tell them. You'll want a forged crank and forged pistons for that kind of power level. Just flat top foged pistons will work.

I think induction is going to be your biggest hurdle if you have to keep it smog legal. In a '91 model, carbs aren't legal (anything '88 and newer is not, since they didn't come with a carb). Some aftermarket EFI systems are smog legal, but very expensive. Probably your best route would be a retrofitted LT1 intake and EFI system.

There are supercharger kits out there that are smog legal as well IIRC. That is about the only way you are going to hit 600hp aside from nitrous. If you go with the SC, you'll obviously need a SC cam to match, to get the most out of it.

 

I agree, i have the block but i was thinking of stroking it to a 396, if at all possible. I'd really like to have at least 520rwhp, but i would like to avoid the extra plumbing involved with installing a charger. I also don't want any juice.

 

why would he need either of those? The 350 you have listed in your sig claims 501rwhp... why would he need more cubes? ...I gotta ask if you make that much HP why are you only running 13.6's @ 99mph? I'm hoping thats a joke, right?

 

See that nice whipple kit in my sig? Notice how my reply said he'll never get to 500rwhp N/A with only 350 cubes?

I ran 13.6 with just long tubes, 3000 stall and 2.73's back when i was N/A. I'll be deep into the 11's now when the track opens.

 

Not sure the Fastburn heads are up to giving you the rwhp you are looking for. I had them on a 406, 11 to 1, XE294 cam, Super Victor Jr, 850 Demon, Hooker 2206 and ran a best of 11.86 @ 113.211.

Like others have said you may need a power adder.

 

I haven't read all the posts, but I did read the first one.

It's not gonna happen, I don't think you understand how much power that is, and if you did, you wouldn't be asking people on a message board about how to make it.

A 350 with 500+ RWHP, with no juice? I guess that means no blower too?

Can you make that much out of a 350? Yeah. Are you going to be able to drive it on the street? Thats debateable, my opinon is no.

If you were talking about making that kind of power with a 427 SBC or something of that nature, it makes it a little bit more realistic.

Smog legal? even somewhat? ahhh no.

and the fast burn aren't going to get you there either.

 

I'm open to stroking the motor, i was just pointing out what i had and what would be the best way to achieve results. From what i understand it is possible to get 500HP out of a 383 or a 396, which is the direction i am most likely heading. I would just like opinions on how to do that, in terms of cam selection and heads.

 

Also i just wish to keep the smog equipment. So this is not a possible goal with a 383 with good street manners?

 

Not a chance without a power adder.

 

what kind of power are you making with your 383?

 

So whats the best i can do with a well tuned 383 that doesn't shake the car apart at idle with all the smog gear attached, a Accel super ram and 3/4 headers?

 

I don't know, haven't dynoed it. Certainly well under 500 HP at the flywheel, let alone the rear wheels. In any case, there's no way in the wildest reaches of imagination that it could ever pass smog in California.

 

What do you think would be a more reasonable goal?

 

yes the stoking to 396 is possible
summit use to keep kits in stock --also I know of an engine builder who was at mankato,mn napa who would do it with honda rods and a 2 inch main crank with cstom pistons--I have know clue if he is still alive or what parts he used to make the motors
later
rick king

 

You can build a 396 with off-the-shelf parts, but not necessarily cheaply.

I don't know what's available to meet California emissions, but a more reasonable goal would probably be something more in the neighborhood of 400 flywheel HP on a smog legal engine. It will still be more than enough to put a smile on your face on the street.

 

400 FWHP isvery pleasing.

Unless some people on here are liars, I know you can pull 400+ out of a 383, BUT I don't believe it will be that easy (or possible) with SoCal regulations.

 

I just need to pass the sniffer, i have a guy, but i want to keep all my smog equipment intact in the event i am pulled over.

 

Heres a nice build up

 

I don't think a Speed Demon and a Victor Jr. are going to pass a visual inspection.

 

sorry, was stuck on numbers lol.

 

A lot of the smog equipment can be made to look operational. For the cats, just saw one down the side and weld the shell to the exhaust pipe. Instant fake converter!

 

How would that setup feel with a TPIS Miniram and SLP 3/4 Non-Air headers and dual randomtech cats??

 

A Miniram and non-AIR headers won't pass a visual inspection either.

 

500rwhp ....not gonna happen. 450 fwhp is achievable quite easily just depends on how much money yur willing to toss around.

Not wanting a power adder makes things pretty rough though.

 

You'll be doing quite well to hit anything over 400 HP and stay smog legal.

 

just out of curiosity... why are you bent on producing 520hp at the wheels?? what rear end are you putting this through?? what trans? there is no way you are going to pass smog in CA, your cam choice is going to have to be quiet tame in that case....

do yourself a favor.. go to the SoCal board and find Dyno Don, he is the local engine builder for thirdgens.. he only works on thirdgens.. talk to him 1st before you start playing the "i bought this part" game..

he built my engine.. as well as other members engines on this board and the socal board... some of the guys are pulling low 12's/high 11's with full smog compliance in CA.. thats not easy to do.


his shop is in Anaheim CA, near the pond.

 

Yes, he installed my subframe connectors. 520 at the wheels is a bit much, i'm thinking around 400 at the wheels would be fine. I would push this through a 700R4 built by Dana at Probuilt and a Moser 12 bolt. I'm starting to think a fully smog legal LT1 swap would be the way to go now, as it has a good flowing smog legal intake, and if i grab one from a 1996 Impala i don't have to keep the A.I.R. system.

 

if you're going to go with all the trouble of an LT1 swap.. go with an LS1 instead.. you can produce the HP you want with an LSX type engine with heads, intake and cam swap.. and i wouldnt go with a 700R4.. go 4L60E or 4L80E.. epecially if you do an LT or LS engine swap..

 

500 rwhp on a tpi based smog legal engine is going to be hard. You would have to run a 383+ afr headed, super ram, and a massive cam. Then add a 150 shot of nos. And everything would need to be extrude honed.

An lt1 swap would be good but if you're gonna spend the money to get that engine up to 500 rwhp, it would be easier with an ls1. The ls1 with a head and cam swap can put out 520 if you have the ls6 intake and buy a free flowing exhaust and 90 mm throttlebody. The ls1 will also be a lot more streetable than an lt1 or super ram engine. You probably could get there with a stock ls1, exhaust, and 150 shot of nos also.

I vote for an ls1 on juice.

 

i have the same setup as this guy http://www.jdsoffroad.com/store/INDE...limited.htm%22 and he is making 487ftlbs of torque on his motor at the flywheel, however i can tune my engine so it will pass unless they see my heads i will fail. so u can see how tough it is to pass smog but if u can tune your cam right you can make pretty good horse power at the flywheel,but 570 to 600.

 

I guess i was being a tad bit optimistic. I may settle for a LT1 with the Lloyd Elliot LE2 package.

 

sorry bro, but to be honest i dont think you know what your talking about.

why do you need something to pass emissions and have at "LEAST" 500rwhp? is it going to be a daily driver? who needs that out of a daily driver? but if you really do need it, start readin up, because it wont be the easiest thing to pass emissions and make 500rwhp

 

You know, nothing is impossible. I feel that i was being a tad optimistic before but i think that at least 410rwhp is totally possible with a smog legal engine swap.

 

definetly!

 

Even at 410 RWHP you're still shooting for nearly 500Hp at the crank. Pretty big task for a naturally aspirated 350 engine while being emissions legal. You likely need a power adder or stoker kit. The statement that anything can be done is missing, "... if you have enough money." Don't set out to meet a goal just for the sake of meeting a goal. Look at different options, weigh the pro's and con's, the cost, and come up with the solution that is the best balance of all these factors.

Let's work a real world excersise. I had a '94 Vette (LT1) with a stock cam, computer, and injectors (emissions legal). The heads were ported, it used forged JE pistons at 9:1 compression, 1.6:1 roller rockers, and a Vortec S-trim supercharger with a modified intake pipe (9psi pulley making 12psi with modified intake). Not exotic but not every day either. The result was 420 RWHP on pump gas and clean emissions (those are great numbers for a stock cam by the way). 121 mph trap speeds in the 1/4 mile. My engine without the supercharger would have made about 300 RWHP. Essentially, your task is to take a fairly healthly engine like mine and figure out how to make another 200 RWHP without the supercharger or nitrous - and pass emissions. Hopefully this puts things in perspective.

 

realisticly, if your motor is a 500RWHP motor, you will NOT past cali emissions standards no matter what.

your engine would have to be too radical, OR your would be using forced induction.. and thats obvious on a visual inspection.

the only way to possibly do it is to make a strong shortblock motor thats as close as possible while being "legal" and then spraying the hell out of it.. im talking a huge shot... you'll probably want a nitrous computer at this point (i like the NX maximizer, but whatever you want)....

thats the only real way to get there that i see..


if you ditch the cali smog requirement, id dump those ****ty AFRs ( ALL current AFRs are ****ty compared to modern heads.. even AFR admits that.. they have new ones coming out soon) and get either the newer ones if you want to stay 23* or some better heads with a shallower valve angle... up the displacement, up the compression and a big nasty cam... run carbed or run with a single plane intake converted to EFI.... that will get you your HP goal, naturally aspirated... it will also run like doggy poo on the street until you floor it. lol.

another non smog legal option is to build what you have to the best of your budget, and go forced induction.. that would also net the power, and be more drivable on the street... you could even do it with those heads... but you'll have to pick this route before you start... you dont want to have a motor together, THEN decide to go FI....

 

LS7 baby, 520+ dyno hp stock!

 

I was thinking of grabbing an LT1, building it up with the Lloyd Elliot LE3 cam and heads setup and retain smog equipment. plus an exceptional tune.