Hey so my firebird 2.8 has a knock and i wanted a little more kick so instead of putting another 2.8 in which would be stupid, i want to put in a 3.4, its bassicly the same engine and everything is the same mostly, what else should i know besides needing to relocate the starter with the jig kit from rodney dickmans?

 

Look in the v6 forum, you'll find all the info you need. Since you mentioned relocating the starter, I think you are referring to the 3400 from a FWD car, which cannot be easily swapped. You want to get the 3.4 out of a 4th gen Camaro/Firebird and swap that. THAT engine is basically identical to the 2.8/3.1. The 3400 is quite a bit different.

 

wait i thought the 4th gen 3.4 and FWD 3400 where the same??? no one ever told me that in the fiero forum when i asked (sold my fiero for firebird) so does this mean for a 3.4 swap i wont need to relocate the starter? or am i still gonna need to do that? cuz idk if the starters for the 3rd gen and 4th gen are on the same side

 

No, those engines are quite different, both inside and out. In addition to relocating the starter, you would need custom motor mounts, exhaust, turn the intake manifold backwards, and this is just off the top of my head. The 3.4 RWD block is identical (externally) to your 2.8. You can take the 3.4 long block, bolt your 2.8 externals on to it and go. There are a ton of threads on doing that swap. The 3400 swap has even been talked about, but no one has done it since it's such a PITA.
You could take the 3400 top end and put it on the 3.4 short block, that has gained popularity, but there is a bit more to it, like swapping pistons, custom push rods, etc to get it to work.

 

i went and read the 2 main 3.4 swap threads, so what im seeing is that i have to take all my 2.8 external parts off and put them on the 3.4 block?? i cant just take the 3.4 with all of its part and swap it in without tearing swaping the externals to eachother??

 

You would have to swap out the wire harness and ECM/sensors to make the whole 3.4 work since it's SFI, not MPFI. The main difference is that the 3.4 system uses speed density, while yours is MAF. It's easier to swap over your externals than having to redo all the wiring and ECM and all that to make it work in your car.

 

Ok then, being that im taking my car to class so ill have all 20 or so guys helping me this should be easy and fast, we are taking carbed 2.8 out of an s10 right now, so i guess i gotta go get new 3.4 gasket set right or id it 2.8? And probly a new timing chain to be safe? The swap thread also said leave the headers on, but what about the cylinder head do i swap that to?

 

Now it starts getting a bit interesting.
The exhaust manifolds are different, so you have to use the 2.8 manifolds.
If the 2.8 you are pulling out is 85 or newer, then the cylinder heads are the same as the 3.4, if it's 84 or older, then you would benefit from the 3.4 heads (you will need 3.4 head gaskets).
You would need 2.8 gaskets for the intake and timing cover/oil pan.
You will need a timing chain for a 3.4.

 

Posting the year of your bird and the year of the engine will help pinpoint exactly what you need.

 

Its an 86 idk bout the engine though



Shouldnt it be the same year as the car?

 

Also do i use the 3.4 alternator, water pump and that stuff or the 2.8 ones?

 

You use almost everything from the 2.8 on the outside of the engine, all accessories, brackets. You are only using the 3.4 long block (heads/block), injectors, flywheel/flexplate and balancer. Valve covers, intake, water pump, oil pan, etc all come from the 2.8. Do a search for KED85's "3.4 swap boogie". That will have just about everything you are looking for.

 

2.8, 3.1, 3.4 head gaskets are the same where the gen1 is concerned. ALL IRON 60 degree V6s are generation 1, regardless of the application they were installed in. There are FWD and RWD differences, actually let me clarify that, there are longitudinally mounted and transversely mounted differences, since the Fiero is RWD but uses a FWD set-up. So if we forget that the Fiero exists, then FWD is transverse mounted and RWD is longitudinally mounted engines, and that's the accepted designation of the engine differences.

ALL RWD are iron head, AKA gen1. Only pre-87 FWD were iron head. Anything 1987 and later in a FWD car will be gen2 or 3, with only a couple exceptions, including early '90s APV, but those engines will not be on your radar anyway. So if you want to keep your swap easy, look at F-body engines in the 2.8, 3.1 and 3.4L sizes that include years up to 1996.

So to back up...

The 4th gen F-body 3.4 will bolt into your car, without issue, other than changing the intake and a few exterior differences that will be obvious.

You can use your original electrics on the 3.4 without swapping intakes, BUT, you also need to swap the distributor, and this requires modifying the upper intake manifold due to a crossover that is on the rear of the 3.4 upper intake. It's easier just to swap the 2.8 intake manifold as a complete assembly onto the 3.4. The engine itself doesn't care whether it's run from an SFI ECM or an MPFI ECM. These are simply a difference in how the injectors are fired on each engine (batch fire) which is used on the 2.8L, or each injector in succession, as in SFI.

What is this about taking the engine out of an S10? Is this a separate project or is it going to end up in your car? It will be a 2.8, if it's the original engine. The S-10 only ever had the 2.8 in 60 degree V6 form, it never got the 3.1 or 3.4. (4.3 is a 90* V6).