Hi there,

my name is Brisc and I'm an American car enthusiast over here in Europe. I have spent a few years in the US for a living and got infected with the LS engine virus. That was about 15 years ago, when Chevrolet had a so-called "rev-it-up" day event in California where I first drove a C6 Corvette. I only had my license for 2 years and they allowed me to go nuts on the car and do whatever I wanted on a closed-off track. That changed my world. The Chevy guy at the event looked at my German license and said "he can't really accept it but if I just walk past him and queue up he wont stop me". None of this would ever happen over here in Germany. F***, I remember that day as one of the best days in my life. It was an ordinary day but Chevrolet made this my best car day ever without me paying a dime. I expected nothing when going there and it turned around my entire life. I was literally a different person after this event. As if I had taken a magic capsule that turned me into a super hero. That is how I still feel since that day, no kidding. Over here in Europe, they go **** if you want to sit in the car before buying it. Car salesmen wear suits and are just simply uncool in every aspect and fashion you look at. I remember wanting to buy a new Audi and when I was in the car revving it, the dealer told me to stop as this is nothing we do here. I asked him what he means by that and he didn't reply and looked at his workmate saying "this is why we need to get rid of manual transmissions". That was the last day I ever went into a German/European car dealership and I am Chevy for the rest of my life. I am looking at LS cars and big muscle ever since then and do not want anything European anymore. I also own a beautiful 79 Silverado and a C6 Vette that I am swapping a new forged motor in. The LS2 from the Vette needs to go somewhere and I do not want to sell it. I put so much care into this motor that I would rather have it sitting in my bed room then selling it.

Since yesterday, I am a proud new owner of a 1985 Camaro with a broken 305 engine in it. The car was imported from the US to Germany and the previous owner spent 2 years on trying to fix the motor. It used so much oil that the spark plugs would foul up within just a few kilometers of driving. He pulled the rocker covers to install new valve guide seals but that did not help so he stopped there and sold the project. Awesome for me because I did not spend a lot of money on this car and it is my absolute favourite 80's car of all time. Top picture is my car, bottom picture is how I would like it to look after the project is finished.




This thread will accompany my build project. To start off, I was wondering if any of you could give me some insight into the following questions I have. Thanks heaps in advance.

Current 305 engine and short time fix to drive it
- before pulling the motor and performing the engine swap I have in mind, what would you do to fix up this engine?

Mid-term LS Swap
- I have lots of parts of a 2005 C6 base model Corvette here that is no longer functional. This includes wheels, the LS2 engine and all sorts of parts. I want to swap these into the 3rd-gen Camaro
- Corvette C6 LS2 motor: what do I need to swap this motor in?
- Current gearbox: what is the current gearbox in the car? Is it a 3 speed or a 4 speed? How can I find out?
- I would like to keep the current automatic gearbox in the car
- wheels: I would like to fit C6 wheels on the car
- brakes: can I swap over the brakes from the C6? Is this possible?
- transmission torque arm: should I update?
- rear diff: should I upgrade to anything else?

Thanks heaps for your inputs. There is a lot of knowledge on this forum that I would like to tap into.

 

Thanks for the replies, really appreciated.

After googling for a couple of months, I've noticed that all these plans are crazy.

I will be swapping the motor for a 350 and that's it.

 

After driving this thing for a few months: I really do not like the open differential. I do not want to go crazy on that car but need to do something about that open differential.

I've read through this post:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tran...lip-works.html

and would like to consider upgrading to a 28-spline Truetrac:

https://www.hawksmotorsports.com/198...or-gm-10-bolt/


Question: what other parts do I need to do this swap?

I want to be honest about these performance upgrades - should be about 400hp max. Will swap a Corvette 94' LT1 and have a blower with intercooler here that will run at about 5PSI. That should get me there. Don't want or need more go. Just going through the most necessary upgrades here.

Thanks

 

Well, I never saw the thread to start but I'm going to guess that with all that info listed, it's very hard to give an opinion. Especially when you're in Germany, we don't know what is available to you let alone what you're capable of doing.
What you want to do with your car is more your decision than anything we can give an opinion on, especially when you seemed to have little self direction.
Community opinion is a lot easier to get when the poster has more goals and less back story.
Your post should have garnered more attention. A nice 350 and it'll be danged nice car. Cool ride.

 

Thanks for the reply. Parts are all from the US - I get them shipped to Europe. Any input on the differential rebuild/upgrade? You seem to know just about everything on these third gens.

 

an open differential is a terrible thing. I agree you should swap it. The amount of work to properly install a new differential is pretty precarious, though other than bearings and shims and seals, you don't need much. Though you often need a lot of tools that you may or may not have. You may have better luck getting a complete assembly. Hawks also has that available to handle more power as well. A 10 bolt is a bit weak but reasonable to use at 400hp but you can get an upgrade to it if you see it viable.

 

I know my share but I have questions all the time. The great thing is this forum usually has already answered it at some point. And by the way, I love a good ol' LT1. You 'can' get a 24x conversion and use LS1 type electronics to remove the sometimes problematic optispark.

 

That's what I am planning. I am very familiar with the Holley HP/Dominator EFI systems and have a HP laying around. This is the conversion kit that I will be getting:

https://www.eficonnection.com/home/p...t-w-ckp-sensor

Looking forward to do this build over the winter...

 

I've rebuilt a differential before so not problem on this end. What is the weak spot of these 10-bolt diffs? I would like to get the 28-spline truetrac / where do I get the axles from?

This is what I am thinking:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axl...olt-build.html
https://www.lpwracing.com/Axle_Tube_...ing_brace.html

 

I've never 'blown' one up personally (I haven't used one in years) but lots of reading suggests that nearly everything is a weak spot. Everything is generally small in comparison to stronger diffs. Ring and pinion would likely be the next victim given your question.
Again, not saying say 7.5 10 bolt can't handle what you're looking to throw at it but GM never designed it to take a whole lot of power. It was a economical axle that got thrust into the performance market.

 

Read this: https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/orga...ngthening.html
The weak link is he small size of the 10 bolt ring and pinion itself. The problem gets even worse when you change the ratio to numerically higher.
But it can last a long time with 400 HP, the proper upgrades and not running slicks at the track.

 

What is the most economical upgrade if I do want to upgrade the entire diff?

We are quickly at 1k with all the stuff I need...
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sme-8510400nl
https://www.hawksmotorsports.com/198...or-gm-10-bolt/
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/spz-36216
+ axles

Not sure if it is worth throwing all this money into?

The post above tells me this is a waste of my hard earned dollars.

What is the most economical upgrade? Ford 9"? Can I find something used?

 

You probably would have a better chance of winning the lottery, but try to find a complete bolt-in Dana 44 axle for f-bodies.

 

Thanks. Where can I go if I want soemthing off the shelf? I found this option

https://www.strangeengineering.net/p...s-brakes.html/

Rather expensive. I was hoping to stay within 2k

 

These cars are antiques now. Yours is 35 years old. To find new parts, sitting on the shelf and ready to go, you would have to have the DeLorean time machine from Back to the Future and get it up to 88 mph to go back to 1985.

 

If you're staying under $2k then look to upgrade that 10 bolt. Otherwise Hawks has a viable option
https://www.hawksmotorsports.com/82-...-end-assembly/

 

Haha, damn yes!

 

Ok, ring and pinion: what do you suggest? Which ratio is strongest? Higher ratio lower strength?

26-spline axles - where can I find them?

Want to make a quick parts list here before continuing.

 

Cool / just found this add:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/engi...bolt-posi.html

This should do what I am after?
Excited!!!!!

 

I'd check with axle vendors. I wouldn't say all of them are going to have your interests in mind but there must be one that has credibility and advice is worth the time. In which case they'd also be worth pursuing from.

 

Do you have a contact?

 

No sir. I'd be researching same as you.

 

Hi, I never saw the original post either. I am (sort-of) your neighbor in the Netherlands taking another go at a formerly stranded project.
I've bought an LS3 engine about a year ago and I'll be doing the LS-swap soon. I wouldn't actually recommend it, unless you really want it.
Everything you need is bulky, heavy and expensive to import. A nice 350 would enable you to recycle many parts and you'd still get good performance.

I'm saving some money, by having everything relayed to me from a single address in the US. This saves me massive for small parts.
I know another guy who sent me my new transmission by boat. It won't be free, but much cheaper ... if you're not in a hurry.

Anyway, Nice car !

 

Thanks for the post Fuchs. I have an LS3 here with no use, but decided against using it as I picked up a 350 for peanuts and I do not want to wait 5 years because I am modifying stuff.

I do the same with shipping / typically works without a fuss.

What diff are you using on your project?

I have not seen photos of broken third/gen diffs / still do not understand what the real limitation is here.

 

Have you guys heard about the "Camaro Performance" Handbook by David Shelby? Just reading through it. He suggests to run a fully brazed torque converter with 3000-3800 rpm stall. On this end, any suggestions on which torque converter to use? I will make a maximum of 400hp. What about the lock/up clutch? Do I need or want this? I have heard that it is wise to have when you install a high rpm converter. Can I manually control this lock/up clutch?

Thanks

 

You just have an LS3 sitting around? Wow. Well, at least you know you'll have good performance somewhere in the future.

I have the 9-bolt BW rear. I've read that it should to be able to hold most of the LS3's power for street use.
I've bought a rebuilt carrier from 9bolt-dot-com. I'll just see how it goes, no experiences to share yet, unfortunately.

The TH700 lockup is very easy to control manually. I'm not sure what transmission you're thinking of, but a TH700 that was once behind a 305 engine will not take 400hp.

 

Thanks Fuchs for the reply. What I have concluded: "the 700R4 needs a different stall converter but will otherwise work until about 500hp according to some of the posts I have read all across the internet". Do you think this information is false? I am changing over to a brazed torque converter with 3500 stall and a lock-up. I will be installing a Holley HP EFI so the lock/up can be controlled by that as well.

 

Pulled the engine, took about a day with all the preparations.

 

So here is that Corvette LT1 and the supercharger kit for it. I am relocating the supercharger to the right/hand side. Here some images:





I measure roughly 420mm free space from the engine mounts forward




Just about the same distance on the engine - it will get tight but theoretically fits

 

Can you spot anything that "certainly does not work" or "needs some rethinking"?

I have a few concerns:
- crankshaft wrap of the serpentine belt, is this enough? I only want 5PSI not more (To lift the LT1 up to about 400hp, supercharger kit is "1GF211-SCI")
https://treperformance.com/i-2090544...led-p-1sc.html
- is that procharger orientation OK (will ask Procharger)
- optispark no longer fits but I am getting the EFI 24x conversion anyway
- no idea where to mount intercoolers, this will be custom and done when engine is in the car
- what radiator shall I use? 3/row or 4/row?
- original radiator fan will likely not fit, but since it is electric, this relocation/replacement is possible
- what torque converter suits this application?
- where can I find suitable 26x spline axle shafts?

 

Question on boost control:

I would be running a Holley HP EFI system, that system can do boost control. I am running an electronic vacuum pump. Can I use this vacuum source (always available) to actuate the boost control? If so, what valves would do the job?

Thanks

 

what vacuum pump are you using and what amount of vacuum does it run at? i am curious for another project and can't really give advice on how it would work fro boost control, sorry

this does sound like an awesome project. I like your attitude about living in Europe but being fond of American cars. awesome!

 

Thanks man / the vacuum pump is a Hella UP5.0
They are the best automotive vacuum pumps out there. A friend of mine works at an automotive supplier and they found that this thing is - apparently - miles ahead from anything else out there.
Takes about 5seconds to pull down from ambient (14.5PSI) to 5PSI.

 

Electronic boost control and vacuum circuit


Engine idling:

The intake manifold vacuum is high and opens the BOV. This allows the engine to idle properly since any additional pressure from the compressor is vented. The solenoid valve between the BOV and the manifold allows the manifold to evacuate and actuate/open the BOV. The electric vacuum pump is always on but does not affect the overall system is this state. The brake booster has vacuum through both, the intake manifold and the electric vacuum pump. The transmission is directly connected to manifold vacuum.

WOT (wide-open throttle):

There is no manifold vacuum, the manifold is at positive pressure/boost and as such, the BOV is closed and the compressor provides full boost to the engine. The brake booster is isolated from boost through a one-way valve. The electronic vacuum pump ensures that the brake booster has vacuum and can operate. The transmission sees the boost, which is typically not an issue for moderate boost – here 6 PSI. For higher boost applications, an extra blow-off valve is required as the boost pressure can otherwise damage the vacuum modulator.

Electronic boost control:

The boost pressure is monitored and communicated to the ECU, where we have electronic boost control enabled. This is done in the HP ECU. Here, we can simply create curves and tables to adjust the boost pressure as functions of rpm, speed and gear. When the solenoid valve switches, the BOV is connected to vacuum and opens. The spring in the BOV defines how aggressively the boost pressure is vented. Start with a weak spring, which vents the boost pressure aggressively and use stronger springs to ensure it vents less aggressively. If done properly, with a small pulley on the supercharger, you can run full boost at fairly low RPM and adjust the electronic boost controller and the BOV such that the boost will not increase with increasing RPM. This is the “ideal” supercharger – which creates the same boost pressure independently of RPM. Theoretically, looking at the thermal limits on the piston, you actually want to reduce boost slightly as RPM increases.

 

Guys can you help me identifying what these things are? LT-1 out of a 1996 C4 Vette.

1 what is this vacuum actuator here on the fuel line?
2 this is a sensor plumbed to the intake manifold, underneath the vacuum actuator / what is it?
3 ?
4 what is this and what is the hard line here?
5 PVC valve? Where is it? Cannot find it, hose just connects to head covers
6 what is this valve?
7 what vacuum source is this?
8 what are these studs for?
9 what is this hard line?

 

Question on lock/up converter control: this is a function of the ECU, correct?
The Holley HP does not have a transmission control / so I want the original functionality of the camaro here / leave the original ECU as is.
The Holley HP would run in piggyback mode.

 

1. Fuel pressure regulator.
2. Probably the oil pressure sensor
3. Not sure off hand
4. Pcv
5. see 4
6. Evap solenoid I believe
7. Probably heater related.
8. Vette beauty cover stud Probably
9. Steam line from back of both heads goes to the TB

 

Thanks - do I need this vacuum fuel pressure regulator? Why is the manifold pressure regulating the fuel pressure? The fuel pressure should be constant over rpm and loading, no? At least the Holley HP EFI systems simply have a mechanical fuel pressure regulator. What is going on here?

 

1. I don't know, what will your system require?
2. Need more fuel at wide open throttle (low vacuum) and less fuel when the throttle is closed (high vacuum)
3. That's just how these systems worked.
4. I don't know enough about Holley efi. The efi regulators I know are vacuum referenced.

 

OK - did some reading. Fuel pressure regulators are mechanically set and always provide a constant differential pressure between "fuel in - the fuel rail" and "fuel out - the manifold". For this to be achieved, they are always referenced to the manifold vacuum. So at idle, we have say -10PSI and the fuel pressure regulator spring is set to provide a delta-pressure of 40PSI of fuel pressure. The vacuum reference now closes the regulator slightly so that we do not have 40+10=50 PSI. It basically reliefs 10PSI from the mechanical spring so that the delta pressure across the injector is now 30PSI (spring but relieved with the manifold vacuum) plus 10 (the negative pressure in the manifold/vacuum, so 30+10=40 differential.

What I have written above seems incorrect, the fuel pressure regulators are always referenced to the manifold. The amount of fuel per injection does theoretically not change with RPM in the first instance but then does as the volumetric efficiency changes / this is adjusted by the fuel pulse width.

 

sensors
a) throttle position?
b) manifold air pressure?
c) ?

 

B is the idle air control
C is the map sensor

I don't mind answering but you do realize this information is all easily available in a search?

 

Thanks - I did search but did not have the English names for these at hand / if I use my mother language with LT-1 I get nothing useful. Thanks again.

 

Not a problem. Usually you can find an image that says what is what because many people have asked. But google may not come up with the same things there as they do here.
Again, I don't mind answering, just know it is out there, it is a small block chevy after all.

 

Are these injectors on the SBC and the LT1 "EV6" style?




Seems to be from comparing these on google / so this harness will plug into them directly

https://www.holley.com/products/fuel.../parts/558-201

Am I missing sth?

 

i borrowed the image from somewhere else, luckily they put their copyright on it, so credit belongs to them

 

Thanks - that would have not worked. I just found out that there is a plug/and/play harness available:

https://www.eficonnection.com/home/p...holley-efi-ecu

This saves me a lot of hassle!

 

Just wondering / now I have a full harness for the LT1 to work with the Holley HP computer.

I am not removing the factory harness of the 85 Camaro, which previously ran a SBC engine with 305CUI - what additional connections between the EFI harness above and the factory harness in the car do I have to make so that everything works? I mean all the instruments and so on.

The transmission is excluded from this - I want to control the lock/up clutch with
a) vehicle speed
b) manifold vacuum
For which I use this kit:
B&M P/N 70244 (Mechanical speedo) $175.95 TCC kit
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/bmm-70244

And I will wire an additional vacuum switch in/series that is connected to the manifold vacuum / so the clutch disengages when the vacuum is too low (gas pedal depressed too much). This way the clutch really only engages when cruising....

 

Team - did some yoga - realized that I am not sane.

Long story short - I am considering to run this project with the Optispark and the original computer

Question - how can I tune these computers? This is apparently the original one - it came with the LT1 - what software do I use to access this thing?

 

http://www.tunercat.com/
Poke around here they sell LT1 tuning stuff

Or read around here they have lots of info too
http://www.lt1pcmtuning.com/