Black Z28

iTrader: (2)

Omg that looks freakin sexy! I found a '97 camaro in a yard that had v6 in it and thinkin about taken the dash, cluster, and wiring, hvac vents and all that good stuff. got one question for the time being and thats how easy is the wiring for the gauges and dash lights an all that good stuff? ive been reading that the lighting switch is a pain but i can figure that one out but im jus more concerned about the gauges

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

i need to bring down the dash a bit more on the dirver side. my dash pad rattles a bit because it doesnt stay in place corectly. toher than that it doesn shake much . compared to my old dash which rattled too much on the freeway

The_Wraith

My 4thgen dash has barely any rattles. Only because I mounted on 4 separate locations underneath not including the steering column mount. I used bendable metal strapping and formed several support braces.

85camarojunkie

I dont want to get of topic or sound like a broken record, but i was reading about dash swap, read alot. But i'm lookin at buying a 96 i think is the year. wrecked, but has the lt1. If i do the dash and motor, trans swap do i still have to splice wires to wire it up to my 85 coupe. I thought that splicing the firewall plug was for motor swaps or just dash. Or can someone lead me to a better descrtion if im doing both. I planned on using the steering column and all. I mean practically stick the 4th in my third gen. Does that make sense to anyone....

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

anyone have info on the 4th gen hvac controllers and using our 3rd gen vaccums? i searched but not much

pm asap i wanna get this done this week

noboostnogo

iTrader: (4)

this is looking great. Good Job. have you figured the hvac controller yet??

did you reuse your 3rd gen fuse box or did you rewired everything to the 4th one that goes on the side of the dash?

BTW i really like your car, it looks like the camaro version of my trans am, haha beautiful color, what color is it if you dont mind me asking?

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

updates workin on the 4th gen ac.

i got the hvac to work .
1/8 adapters and vacum hose to let the actuator to opend

ShMaCk2004

how did you go about mounting the lower bracket? the long metal bracket the goes from one side to the other?

BrOdBaNd

iTrader: (8)

For the driver's side, I just mounted the 4th gen style bracket to the steering column, and on passenger side I made a bracket. Both sides of the 4th gen support brace that goes across there are a couple tabs that you need to grind off, nothing to complicated.

BrOdBaNd

iTrader: (8)

I still have yet to get pics of my HVAC setup. You can use EVERYTHING on the 3rd gen end of the vacuum hoses, including the 3rd gen main power connector with no splicing of that. To attach the lines, I used small vacuum hose that would slide right over the stock vacuum lines for both the 4th gen and 3rd gen hoses. Use zip ties to act as clamps. Worked perfectly fine for me.

ShMaCk2004

yea i know all that i was just wondering if someone one here came out with a really nice way to mount it or if it was a make your our bracket type of deal.

BrOdBaNd

iTrader: (8)

I cut my dash cover today, the fitment is pretty good. The only problem I am running into is that my dash is kinda peeling up where it should be adhered down at the top where the dash pad meets. I need to find a way to get it stuck back down so my dash pad doesn't stick up. Any ideas?

stage20

iTrader: (3)

sorry i didnt respond to your IM earlier.
the area to be glued, will it be visable?
i dont think it will melt it, but if you can see it, be careful.
get some contact cement and put a dab on each side and let it dry up 10-15 minutes, then stick them together.
never move.
you can also get it in a spray can, which in 30 seconds makes a permanent bond.
not the 3M super 77 or whatever. make sure you get REAL contact cement if you get the spray.
brush on will be easier in your case.
good luck.

budofbama31313

I've got the same problem on the downward slope to the right of the steering wheel hump. I was going to use Shoo Goo, but since I had to come back to Iraq I figured I would get back to it in a year. I used that stuff on a pair of running shoes one time and the sole on a pair of my boots back in OIF III and it held for the rest of the deployment. Post what you use and results for the rest of us.

1981LT1

iTrader: (1)

I will be doing exactly what you are talking about. The 4th gen wiring and bulkhead connector are very close to the 3rd gen. I will be using the 4th gen LT1 engine compartment harness to take advantage of the relay center, headlight wiring, washer reservoir and pump, etc.... Check out my progress at https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/inte...-overhaul.html

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

hey guys havent posted any updated besides the lsx thread.

i was able to adjust the drivers side problem.
it slightly went up .
i used spacers to bring it down a bit down.
it aligns pretty good.

now i have fill in the open space.
im planning to work with clay and cover it with fiberglass or material .

let me know what you guys have in mind.

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

hey guys new plans.
i finished the headlight switch. dimmer. (minus the interior light and dome light selector)
my fogs are connected to the 4th gen fog light switch
i have a functional 4thgen hvac switch (minus the temperature ****)
and my dash pad fits in snugg.

im going to attempt the 4th gen door panels.


any info ? i saw how stage20 attempted them and had them done ! they look nice!

budofbama31313

I installed a pair of 98 Firebird panels in mine and all i did to the panels was cut the tabs off the back slip it on the inner door skin and drill new holes for the new screw locations. That is as far as the panels, but as far as the door handle and the lock slider those are a total different story. It took a lot of measuring and measuring again before anything was cut or attached. Plus on the pass side I used the linkage from my car for the lock slider, and on the driver side I used the linkage from the bird I got the panels from after cutting and rebending it. Turns out the driver side locks and unlocks better than the pass side when I hit the switch to lock and unlock the doors. Before I attempted this install I saw where somebody on here really cut the inner door skin pretty bad (finished product looked good) and I didn't want to do that so I tried it by only cutting the tabs off the back and it worked. Good luck with it.

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

budofbama31313 any visuals?

Orinackra

Heres a link to my thread on installing 4th gen panels.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/inte...or-panels.html

pics: http://s236.photobucket.com/albums/f...nel%20Project/

I did alot of hacking, and adjusting. I trully think its trial and error to get them to fit. I'm sure they'll look great though, just like the dash!

Heres my finished product:
IMG00394-1.jpg?t=1260137619

The_Wraith

4thgen door panels do not work. I had them in my car and they look fairly pleasing to the eye when shown in pictures , as everyones do. But they fit horrible and there is no real way to do them with without major cutting and glassing. Even the link above only shows selective shots that look ok. But I am more willing to bet it's not so nice close up. They are horrible for day to day use as the panel itself is slightly long and puts pressure on the existing plastic near the door frame. IMO they were not worth cutting up my doors for. The doors also don't close as nice with them. Furthermore the front top end hits the 4thgen dash and looks like complete garbage when your in the car and the door is closed. The best attempted fit I have seen based on pics what Shrooms interior build. But as always nobody ever posts major close ups of all areas. Speaking from personal use don't bother with them.

Which is why I opted to try out a custom blend of 3rdgen and 4th. I rigged this up as more of a demo , I do not have the passenger side done yet but I have everything made for it. I am also in the process of refining the panel got rid of the felt added a fiberglass buildup cap and im going to refinish in felt rather then vinyl as I am just not all that great and stretching vinyl on a piece like this , hence the crap seam up top.

ShMaCk2004

what did you use to cover the corners where the a-piller are? i like how it looks and thats what im going to try to do on mine

stage20

iTrader: (3)

you can make them work.
mine look 100% factory. it takes more than just tossing them on the door. you have to chop the door, chop the panel, get creative with your mounting options. i made modifications to the door opening(beat the lip with a BFH) so the door would close softer, etc.
i spent countless hours making them look factory.
the only thing i dont like is how i shaved the back of my factory 3rd gen door seals at the top rear corner. when i want to waste money on new gm door seals, ill redo them, but they still look 99.9% great.
only a true 3rd gen guy would know they arent perfect.
i have a cage in my car and use the door handle for getting in and out. i can assure you, you can hang off my door panel and it wont go anywhere.
im 260 and put pressure on the door panel constantly.
no shakes, squeaks or rattles.
as much abuse as my car takes, if they were going to fail, they would have.
i take care of my stuff, but i use it too.
but, i will say.... most people can suffice with just cutting all the tabs off and screwing it to the door. im to **** for all that. everything has to be hidden, IMO.
its not a project you want to do unless you are commited.
there is no going back. ill need new doors if i ever want to bolt up another 3rd gen panel.

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

stage any modifications to the rods so they can work with the 4th gen door panels?

The_Wraith

I highly doubt they look 100% factory ,maybe you could post various shots up. I am well aware of what it takes to put them in. I also cut my doors to mount them. It's not at all possible by leaving the panels in stock form. For instance the front top hump looks like garbage no matter what you do with it they were just never meant to be mounted on a thirdgen door. The panel goes flat and then flares out and looks out of place. They look real good in selected shots but are a far from looking stock at all. Not to mention the huge opening at the bottom. I could see them looking somewhat stock with cutting and glassing of the panel , without that there are flaws everywhere no matter what you try to massage into place. I was happy with mine at first but overtime it was crap , the cheap panels GM made didn't help. These panels creaked and cracked on factory 4thgens they are not strong at all, and as typical 90s GM interior built very very cheap.

I have actually seen your swap pics and you too have the typical cut-open top area as everyone else. I also remember asking for close ups which nobody ever seems to want to post. Not to mention the 4thgen panel goes from zero to 1" on the lower bottom area. Don't get me wrong im not bashing your work it looks good but hardly 100% stock. But they still don't fit right. Peoples door panels look real good in pics but its another story in person. There is no way to make them look factory without serious work. In any case you can get them to fit with a more then poor factory build quality look.

BrOdBaNd

iTrader: (8)

After stage20 put his door panels on, I went to look at them. (I was progressing on my 4th gen dash swap and wanted to get a better idea of what to do with various panels.) I've owned a couple 4th gens, as well as my thirdgen, and I got down on my hands and knees with a flashlight and looked at his 4th gen door panels. I would have to agree that they look, feel, and fit like factory panels. I had a hell of a time locating any flaws whatsoever and believe me, I tried.

budofbama31313

By the time I'm able to post pics you will be complete on your car. I just started another trip to the desert, won't be back in the states till late next year. But my panels turned out good to me and pretty sterdy. That is a big thing with me as to how study they were, and I've tried to pull them loose. Yes my driver side panel does strike the plastic interior pieace on the back of the door sill but I just didn't get to it yet. May be I can get my wife to snap a few pics of them installed but forget about seeing the inner doorskin or connecting rods cause she anin't gonna look at a screwdriver.

The_Wraith

Other then the obvious far front top area? Everyone else I have seen has cut that area.That area alone makes the panel look out of wack, persoanlly I got tired of the tackyness of it , looking over to the passenger side and seeing the panel appear to be on crooked at the very bottom which also can't be fixed without glassing into the door.

One of the cleanest installs on here and that area was cut as well
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/body...oor-panel.html

So it would be cool if stage could post some closeups of that top area it would be interesting to see how that worked

stage20

iTrader: (3)

ill get some pics up of the top.
i cut a good portion of the front of the panel and tried to keep the same contour as it was originally.
if you stand RIGHT ON TOP of the front corner, yes.... there is a gap, but all you see is the weatherstripping.
yes... there is the gap at the bottom, that is unavoidable with a swap like this. different door, different panel, its not going to mate like it did on the 3rd gen, but i can tell you, its the cleanest door panel swap ive seen, minus fatal88, but thats comparing apples to oranges.
no pics will help you, just drive or fly down here and check them out for yourself.

stage20

iTrader: (3)

i was going to put in 4th gen rods, but they were a bit different. seems i read in a thread one guy got them to work, but it was a no go for me.
used the stock 3rd gen rods.
id say i cut around an inch off.
word to the wise. measure, measure, measure. you want to re bend the rod before you cut it off or it will be hard to bend it with 2 pair of pliers unless you remove the rod from the car and put it in a vise.

The_Wraith

I know what your saying , and trust me I am not saying you did a bad job. You mentioned you tapped in a certain area to get the door to close better right? See I never did any of that because I did not want to dig too much into the car in that way. I was also not very confident in the door frame and taking as much off. All this could have led to better fitiment. But the panels themselves drove me nuts while driving such as that 1" gap on the bottom and I couldn't stand how the top area bubbles up on that front edge but thats just me.

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

sounds good. i stole a few pics off your threads

one of the cleanest installs!





wished u had more pictures of your brackets. etc.
but i havent even looked at my door panels.
i will sometime this month .

The_Wraith

That's what I'm talking about there that crooked bottom that is unavoidable. It blends nicer with a black door to match but if your car is a lighter color it doesn't work well. Also it would appear you used after market belts? There's another issue factory belt clearance. 4thgen panels will never be 100% stock looking in stock form.

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

that's as good as its ganna get buddy.
4th gen dash, 4th gen panels, 4th gen seats and 4th gen seatbelts cant ask for more.

i didnt want to go with classic industries panels.. theyre overpriced..
i didnt wanna go with the gta panels. they dont look good with the 4th gen dash .

i was ganna go with the 4th gen trans am ebony panels. but they are pretty pricey and rare.

so i got a pair of camaro panels for 25 bucks locally
and ill be tearing some apart. just hope they look as good as stage20s

back on track with my thread.

The_Wraith

Are you Ganna up some pics of your panels when they are done?

stage20

iTrader: (3)

a 83-92 seatbelt will have issues, thats just another part of the swap.
82 door seals and 4th gen belts worked perfect for me.
several ways to get the job done, but it takes an effort to mod the suurounding area of the door panel.
its comming a flood here. im not going to go outside and melt.
hope to have pics later today.

The_Wraith

Maybe not you but other people may not be satisfied with the results.

Thanks for the heads up

What are GTA panels? never heard of them

Cool thanks for the heads up

Sweet deal


Yeah let's get back on track now , we Ganna talk about the panels

So in reality it's not hard to make these panel's appear stock but certainly not 100% not even 90%. Now I found some old pics when my interior was coming along here are the reasons why I pulled them off. For future reference for onlookers. Bear in mind I did not butcher the crap out of the frame of my door to get these to look like this I took off half of what stage20 did , I also didn't hammer my chassis in anyway. I couldn't justify it for cheap plastic door panels. Regardless they still fit on but are horrible because they have buildup in area's where it looks like garbage or they just don't cover all of the door. I based this on when I was driving the car. I got compliments on them but IMO they were junk. I also used 4thgen seat belts which I didn't like simply because it was impossible to find a 82' sill to make them look right.

First major problem- Looking at that gap while driving , another non f-body car buff pointed that out for me.



Secondly this general area. The build up at the top looks stupid and does not fit in well. These door panels don't even look like they match up with the dash when they are closed anyway. They look out of place and are cheap as cheap can get. I also had a set of bird panels with the same thing. Another thing to consider is fabing up speaker pods for camaro door panels because you are going to need them.

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

sorry but ill rather have stock 4th gen panels that fit okay


over this..

[/QUOTE]


notice i said ok. not.. perfect but ok.
.

and these are gta door panels
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/87-92...Q5fAccessories

The_Wraith

To each there own we all have different tastes. I didn't like the 4thgen panels so I tried a custom setup! My posts were not asking if you prefer what I prefer or not , but rather some information, and the final fitting and quality of a 4thgen panel when you get them in.

Hmm those ebay ones are the same panels I used as a template but they are not from a GTA they came out of a firebird. GTA door panels

stage20

iTrader: (3)

they are not gta panels, its just what they are referred to. i believe its deluxe or something, but all gta's came with them from what i can remember.
i had them in the car for the longest time with a stock dash, and with the 4th gen dash.
they are ugly when used with the newer dash. i couldnt take it anymore so i finally put some 4th gen panels in.
the "gta" panels do look good with a stock dash, though.

The_Wraith

I find modified they flow well , with the stock armrests no way.

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

im working getting my temperature window working with a lt1 cable.
im afraid i might have to drill into it. and somehow work a miracle.

as we speak im also working on a replica of my hvac box for the ls1 people who want ac.
mine worked great.. its nice having a ls1 with the 4th gen compressor.

once i am done with this its time to put those 4th gen door panels to use.

87CIZ

iTrader: (8)

you have any advice for the HVAC stuff? And any wiring diagrams or pinouts?

tim84berlinetta

good job man it looks nice

ShMaCk2004

asking again

TPI TERR

iTrader: (9)

haven't filled anything in there yet

shr00m

iTrader: (2)

So.... I have to agree with the Wraith on this one. The wreck shortly after posting my teaser pictures started a spiral into a 5 year project mostly caused by bureaucratic red-tape from the salvage title.

4th gen panels are wider then 3rd gen doors, they are not flat on the back side (they are curved out on the bottom and front), and they are shorter in the front then they are in the back.

Like Wraith said, no matter what you do they are not going to look stock. Whether they look good or not is up to you. My teaser pics were admittedly skewed to not show you the areas I didn't want anyone to see. They still might have worked out had I never put the kick-panels back in. They will hit the kick-panels.

The door panels are still the last thing on my list. The only acceptable (to me) solution is to glass the 4th gen panel to a blank 3rd gen panel. You pretty much have to cut everything off the back of the 4th gen panel, trim the front, top, and back to fit within the confines of the 3rd gen opening, and the then mate the two together and paint/wrap it.

I'm still working on them, but the lower portion is going to be completely redone to house a 6.5" sub and 5.25" component set. Here's some pics of the progress.











Kevin D.

Orinackra

hey Shroom, good to see you back to work on the car!

Wraith is right that those areas he marked out dont line up perfectly, but I think you can get pretty close. The top corner is kinda tough. But the bottom corner I think I might have a solution to that I'm gonna work on this winter.

4th gen kick panels. Made to line up with 4th gen panels obv. I have them in, and they are shorter than the stock ones in the back by about 2 inches, so you need to make an extension. But you can space them up to line up with the bottom of the panels, so I think that'll help alot. Might be something to think about.

stage20

iTrader: (3)

any pics of the kick panels?
i have yet to find a set cheap enough i could throw away if they didnt work out. i knew about them being shorter, but i wasnt sure if they got in the way of the door shutting like the 83-92 seat belt retractors.
thanks!

The_Wraith

Very cool idea. This kind of thing is what it takes to get a perfect stock looking panel. There is just no way a factory un-modded 4thgen panel is going to look "completely" stock with minimal massaging and trimming as some claim.

I came across this .Here is a guy that is doing a similar thing to a 2ndgen.His final piece doesn't look much like a factory 4thgen panel though more of a Car Craft rad rod custom look.





http://www.extremefirebird.com