L695speed

Alright guys, I've since decided my days of screwing around with carb motors at least on this car are done.

I have a possible plastic tank located waiting to hear back. The LS sending unit in the tank is long since gone, but the filler neck, tank, charcoal canister and some of the lines are still there. Now, I know we need to use a sending unit with a 0-90 ohm rating, and I know of the Grand Prix swap, I even have the part number, but I'm confused on one thing.

The sending unit usually holds the pump too right? So why is it when I see pics of the parts for the Grand Prix sender swap, I don't see an actual container or unit for the pump to go into? Am I missing something here?

Here is what I mean... See the pics...
http://www.ebay.com/ctg/ACDelco-SK10...nsor-/79148131

That was the grand prix setup,

Now look at your standard LS1 tank, note the giant hole sending unit assembly? Do you get that with the Grand Prix parts?

http://www.tnfbody.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14630

Thanks

camarotucker

iTrader: (2)

You wil basically have three parts, the pump itself, the level sender, and the bucket that holds before mentioned parts. You will only get the level sender itself. Imo I would pass on that tank and wait for a complete tank assembly.

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

The pic you have found in the eBay link is what's included with the Grand Prix parts. The "fuel level sender" and "sending unit" are two different parts, confusing I know. If you are missing the entire cylindrical sending unit from the ls1 tank, you will need to source one, as well as the Grand Prix fuel level sender.

L695speed

Even if it is 30 bucks? The bucket may be there. Can't really tell.

http://images.craigslist.org/3kb3Fb3...29179c14e1.jpg

Looking again, the bucket may be missing. But even so? At 30 bucks?

But I would need one of these to complete that tank in the picture right?
http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/pr...it-New-GM.html

I'm just trying to figure out whether I'm better off just getting the tank then get the new sending unit and level sender from the GP. These tanks have sending units that are over ten years old now, perhaps new is the way to go?

Sorry for all the edits...

camarotucker

iTrader: (2)

The bucket is missing in the picture. If the bucket is missing you will need the part in the picture (Hawks) as well as the GP level sender.

I paid $100 for my tank complete and the only reason I paid that much for it was it had an Aeromotive pump in it. There were other tanks on Craigslist at the time for $50-$75. Cost of CL tank ($30) Hawks bucket ($160) = $190. If you can find a complete tank for less $190 (and you can) you would be money ahead. The upside to getting that tank and bucket is that you would have a new fuel pump. Just a judgement call you will have to make.

Keep in mind that the GP fuel level sender ($130) will come with two senders and you can sell the other one here on the boards bringing your cost down to $65. The sender will have to have the connector de-pinned and the orininal connector installed back on it, so it doesnt matter which of the two senders you use.

On a side note. If you dont care about your thirdgen tank you can sawzall the filler neck off of it and remove it, as well as install the fourthgen tank without having to drop the rear end out.

L695speed

Alright, I'll think about it, if I go down to pick up the tank it will be on Saturday. Chances are I may go through with it and have a new pump, bucket, and sending unit as opposed to having one that is 11+ years old that could break at any time.

I've found the GP sending unit (Delco part) for 93 and free shipping. So really its coming down to do I want to hold out, spend 75 for a tank complete, and hope the bucket is in good shape, possibly getting a whole new bucket anyway, or do I get this one for 30 and get a new bucket. That is another way to look at it. This particular car is not going anywhere. So I don't exactly mind if I spend a lil more on it. I won't sell this one. Still it would be nice to save some money.

Thanks for the tip on selling the other sender. Would the LS1 pumps support 500 crank horses without being upgraded? Or would I need to change the pump out as well? I know that sounds stupid but it could affect the decision I make regarding the tank I found. Especially considering the cost of replacement pumps. If it can support 500 horses, then it is a new pump that I won't have to shell out for separately. I know the pumps are running 250+ even from rock auto.

skiroulertx447

For my plastic tank swap I ended up buying a brand new level sending unit for a grand prix and using a V6 bucket since it will have a return line on it. I then purchased a racetronix fuel pump so I could retain the bucket and pulse line to keep the bucket full of fuel. The racetronix pump should support something over 400 hp, IIRC they also had an option for a bigger pump. What are you doing for fuel lines? Also my tank was complete with the filler neck, charcoal can, and sending unit and f/p for around $50 IIRC

L695speed

This one has the filler neck and charcoal can. Just doesn't have the bucket. Problem I have with the yards is sometimes they don't care and wreck some things or don't include things, its a gamble on what they have. Maybe what I will do is make a run at some of the yards. If I find a couple within reasonable driving distance I will tell the guy that I want to try for one that is closer first. That way if I do wind up getting a pump, I'm only springing for a pump and GP sending unit.

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

When I had my ls swap tuned, my tuner says 450 rear wheel HP is about the max safe limit with a stock pump. If you are going ls, keep in mind the regulator is built into the bucket on a ls1 tank. if this is for a lt1 or TPI car, you'll need to regulate down further yet, regardless of whether you get a v8 or v6 tank. as already stated, a v6 bucket has no regulator, v8 has regulator for about 60 pounds. BOTH v6 and v8 have return lines in the bucket.

L695speed

This is going to be an LSx motor, not sure which one yet as it depends on what I find, but it will definitely be an LS base. The V6 cars are more commonly found. I will likely find one in a yard out of a V6 car. If that is the case then I will pick up a Racetronix pump or something to use in the bucket. I've read that a vette filter has a built in regulator or something. May likely go that route if I get a tank from a V6 car. I don't see me getting lucky and getting one from a LS car for reasonable cost.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

If you're going to use the Vette filter/regulator, you might as well keep the 3rd gen tank and put a good in-tank pump in it.

L695speed

Wait WHAT THE!? Ok now I'm really messed up here. You're telling me, I can use an LS motor, with TPI fuel lines, with a third gen tank and sending unit, if I upgrade the in tank pump to at least 60 PSI? What pump would work with the wiring and sending unit to fuel a LS motor if I go that way? I am wondering if I would have to pull any crazy stunts with the hard lines if I go that route too. If I can keep the factory tank, then I'll just save the plastic one for the future when my rear blows up.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

I didn't even use TPI fuel lines. I spliced the carb lines where there was rubber and put in hard line. Even used a carb car tank. Swapped a fellow TGO member my carb pickup for his EFI pickup, put a Walbro 255 in it, and a Vette filter in the stock 3rd gen filter location. I picked up the stock return line at the filter back to the tank and removed the part of the return line going to the engine compartment. At the engine, I flared the supply line to attach a Russell 640940 fitting to attach an LS line to the fuel rail.

L695speed

Ok, My fuel lines are not worth saving, my tank was replaced recently with one from a 92 Z28. But I kept the carb pick up. However, I got a EFI pick up with the tank I picked up. I suppose I can use that pick up (was a 305 TPI car) use EFI hard lines vs using the carb hard lines to make it easier for me especially since I need to get hard lines anyway, run them down the side of the car, use aforementioned pump, vette filter (gotta figure out how I'm gonna secure it) and just figure out how I will hook up the return line. And hook up the supply line to the rail. Doesn't the fuel supply go to the rail on the driver's side anyway?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

V6 and EFI models, the fuel lines went up the driver side frame rail. Factory V8 carb had the line cross over the top of the transmission tunnel over to the passenger side frame rail to the mechanical fuel pump.

The car I was describing above was factory V6, so the line went up the driver side. The other LS swap car I did was factory V8 carb - I removed all the stock lines and ran a new aluminum hard line up the driver side frame rail.

If you have 3rd gen EFI lines, they would be fine to use.

You can rig up a bracket on the frame to bolt up to the Vette filter mount. I just let the lines support it - I suppose some day I should get under there and rig up a support bracket.

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

If you use a vette regulator on your stock tank with upgraded pump, it would be easiest to do your return like this picture. The 90 degree bend is the supply, the line facing rear of the car is return, and the empty port in the block is the supply to the rail. This IS NOT a vette filter, but your fuel lines can be plumbed in the same manor. This saves you from running two lines to the engine.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Actually, that's not what you want to do. If you use a 4th gen plastic tank with the pressure regulator in the return, then, yes, you T-block the filter outlet so the one line goes to the engine and the other goes to the pickup return. The "pressure regulator" is basically a spring-operated relief valve - if pressure increases above the set point, the valve opens more. If pressure drops, the valve closes down. Very simple, but effective.

The Vette filter/regulator has the inlet and return on one end of the filter body, and the outlet on the other. So, you basically leave the inlet and return lines parallel to each other where they connect to the filter, and the outlet just keeps going to the engine from the other end of the filter. Oh, the pressure regulation in the Vette filter is done exactly the same way as the 4th gen LS1 tank.

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

Ok, the vette filter has the return on the filter rather than a Tblock. The what I was trying to iterate is, the return line does not go to the engine bay as factory EFI thirdgen setups do.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Correct. The Vette filter has 3 ports - inlet, return, and outlet. No T-block needed.



You can put the Vette filter anywhere you want. If you put it up next to the engine, you'll have both the supply and return going to the engine bay. There is a reason to do that, but most people just put it back by the tank.

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

Cooler fuel in the rail I would think....?

camarotucker

iTrader: (2)

On a second look side note, the CL tank is missing the bucket retaining ring and the new bucket doesnt come with one.

L695speed

I wound up not getting it because of what five7 suggested. Seems it would save me plenty of headaches, and money. Already have an EFI sender, third gen tank (duh), considering I'd have to get new lines old ones are rotted and not worth the trouble and an upgraded pump anyway to make the power I am after, the filter you'd need to get a fuel filter anyway too. So really all I am spending vs before is for the connections to the vette filter. Looks like a quick connect type, would need the adapter. Can run the vent line to the stock third gen canister too. Guess the only question is, where do I put the filter in. I'd put it in the stock location just for ease of use, the line is already broken there anyway for a filter. As for the return line, I'd just clip it off and flare it and adapt the connections if needed ending it at the filter.

6SIX6

iTrader: (35)

Heres an idea if you ever put a vette filter in. This is what mine is with an fittings and braided line with a vette filter. Sorry its a far shot but its all I have at the moment