Hi my name is Emanuel, I'm new on here and need some help. I live in central Illinois and been playing with the idea to purchase a Third Gen Camaro or Firebird. I want to use it as daily driver and autox. I always liked the clean lines of the third generation Chevy. A friend of mine has a 4th gen SS and he let me drive it a couple times. And while it was great fun, the class he drives it in requires expensive r-comps and the engine is too large for the class I would like to compete in. Aside from that the 3rd gen was quite a bit less weight, which always helps.

So I'm trying to learn more about the third generation, to make an educated desicion. But I'm a little confused as to what year and engine/transmission combination is the best.
For the class I want to prepare the car for, it can have maximal 5.1L displacement. So I guess 302 it is, but I also want to know which year the strongest 302 was pared with a 5 speed transmission and a good short rear end, possible positronic and all together in the lightest car? And of course if I cannot afford that with my >$5000 budget, what would be the best alternative? While the car can have some suspension and wheel upgrades and cat back exhaust systems are ok too, it would make my life much easier if the rest of the car would as much as possible original, hence I'm posting in this category.

Oh one more thing, I would prefer a model that didn't came with an airbag.

I'm an ASE certified master technician, but since I'm from Germany, you could say imports are what I know most about. However I'm here to learn.

I would also apprechiate leads to potential cars for sale that fall within the above mentioned criteria.

Thank you very much.

 

Your engine choices are 2.8/3.1 V6 or 5.0(305).5.7(350).

What are the class rules? The "strongest" factory car would be the 91/92 due to the stronger way of the unibody attachment method. Both od which were with the drivers side airbag & no 3rd gen ever had a passenger side air bag. If you can add subframe connectors in the class then any year 3rd gen will suffice in strength & you can get the82-90 to avoid the airbag.

The lightest wheel/tire combo would be the crosslace wheels from the TA/GTA. Again...If the class allows you swapping parts from matching bodies them any year Camaro/Firebird could use he crosslace wheel.

I think we need to know more about the rules before we go any further suggesting or chasing leads that just run into a dead end wall.

 

Autox rules are really complex and it would take forever to explain some of the stuff to people that have no affiliation with that kind of hobby, even experienced autox'rs get it wrong occasionally.

Here is a guy that is prepping a first generation Camaro for the same class. He is part of the group that makes SCCA rules, so he oughta know what he is doing. His website includes the rules (2010 but basically the same now what my question concerns) and a lot of useful other information.

http://www.rhoadescamaro.com/build/?page_id=260


As buying a car goes the more original the better, as every diviation from stock has to be either allowed by the rules or be returned to it.
However in STX the class I want to play I don't have to worry about wheels, most suspension or exhaust changes much, as these are things that are allowed. That will broaden my choice of available cars, as I could imagine only very few Third Gens are in original condition by now.

It cannot have any internal engine modifications and it has to have the same engine, or a direct replacement of what came stock with it.

So basically I'm looking for the strongest (5.0 with ~225hp+ if possible) with a manual transmission in the lightest car (no extra iroc or z 28 body work, leather interior or T-tops).

I can use bolted on longitutional subframe connectors, so I guess I would prefer a pre '90 model, as it allows me to install a steering wheel of my choice, rather than to live with the kind of ugly big OEM airbag equipped one.

Hope that helps clarifying it a little better.

 

You can't ask for help & not expect us to know how to help you without sharing. There are LOTS of SCCA people here & those that know will help.

Give us a little credit before you dismiss us as being able to help you because we certainly cannot help you, without knowing what rules to follow. Give us the class you want to run in or we can't help you. C? SM? F? Prepared?

 

BTW.....You posted this thread in the completely wrong section of TGO. contact a Moderator & ask for it to be moved. Over there you will find LOTS of help, not so much in the section you posted in. I just happened to see it. https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/orga...ing-autocross/

 

I am sorry, I didn't meant to imply any disrespect. I'm here the find help!
All I tried to say is that the extend of those rules is hard to explain, and there are lots of discussions about personal interpretation even between long time SCCA members.

The class I want to prepare the car to is STX. I mentioned it in the previous post. The link I provided opens a window, where the specific rules for this class are outlined.

Here is the complete SCCA rule book for 2012.

http://scca.cdn.racersites.com/prod/...ules_March.pdf

I appologize again, my talent of unintentionally stepping on peoples toes doesn't seem to let me survive a single day on a new forum.

PS: How do I contact a moderator?
I felt that this might be a good place, since I'm asking what original manufactured car would serve my goals best. However you are probably right, that this should go to the forum you mentioned. I just didn't see that before.

 

I dont know anything about "unibody attachment methods" being superior in 91 and 92, but in general you'll get a newer car with newer bushings. You DO want a hardtop car, though. They're much stiffer than the T-Top cars. You're not going to find a non z28/IROC that has all the good performance goodies on it. Those were exclusve to the ground fx cars.

However, you can always get a Formula Firebird, which is exactly that. A stripped down TA with the good engine (usually). Unfortunately the Firebirds were considered slightly higher end than regular Chevrolets, so they came with a lot more sound matting and usually more expensive, heavier options. Just depends though.

You could never ever get 350s with a 5 speed. So if you want a manual transmission car, I would definitely suggest seeking out a 305-T5 hardtop car. Just make sure you get a Tuned Port Injection car. If it doesnt have Tuned Port, pass on it. The TPI is the ONLY induction system that was put on the performance oriented engines. The exception is the L69 305 "HO" cars that got a quadrajet, but those are very rare in comparison. They made very few of them, and you'll spend forever trying to find one that's actually a 305 HO, because everyone thinks their 305 car is an "HO" when they're selling it and its difficult to identify an L69 from an LG4, and that's an awful, awful, awful mistake to make.

If you can get pretty good at finding the SPID sheets (91-92 cars got them in the rear compartment on teh door on the side of the hatch bay and earlier cars usually had them in the console) you can identify a LOT of options. Look for F41 or FE2, G92 and/or G80, LB9, L69, or L98, and 1LE.

If you spot a 1LE car, it's supposedly the holy grail of Camaro/Firebird race cars, but all it was was a front brake upgrade package. Not really much else to it. Has a bit of lore around it now.

 

i would go with a 3.1/5speed car for an autox car, swap in a set of 3:73 or 4:10 rear gears and ti would be a blast on the autox course

 

Can't swap gears in STX. OEM ratio has to stay.

 

Thanks, this is very useful information. Bushings and stuff can and will be replaced asap with performance parts, so I'm not too worried about that.
I like the Firebird a little more than the Camaro, so if a Formula is the way to go, that would be great.

According to the tech data on the home page the LB9 with TPI was available with the 5 speed starting at 1987.

Where can I find information about the curb weight of these cars? So far I only found the curb weight for a '92 Z28 Iroc supposed to be ~ 3150 lbs. I would imagine older cars to be lighter.

Also thanks to whoever moved this into the correct spot.

 

The L69 305 HO cars (available 82-86, maybe 87, prob 86) with the 5 speeds, when ordered with the G92 option, got 3.73 rear gears. They are factory ratios. Does that change anything? I seem to recall being allowed to swap amongst factory replacement parts, like springs, sway bars, etc. Also, for the record, the L69's were always the unsung heroes of the lineup. Everyone wanted the Tuned Port or the crossfire cars, but the L69 cars were usually faster, ESPECIALLY when they came with the good gears. They were the cars the Fox body guys always had to worry about. Peruse the production numbers and look into them farther if you're interested. They can be had, but the "HO" buzzword is really thrown around way too carelessly. It's a very specific model in our case, and one with very few obvious identifiers.

Expect it to be between 3300 and 3700 lbs. For some reason in my anecdotal experience, the 89-90 cars seem to be the lightest. Firebirds tended to weigh more, Formula's tended to balance it back out to an even keel. Im sure some of them were lighter.

If you get a 5 speed car the T5's are MUCH lighter than 700r4's, and that alone will edge the weight to your advantage. I would assume 3300-3400 lbs is average, but it depends on a LOT of factors.


By the way, check out FRRAX.com if you haven't already.

 

cant swap in another oem ratio gear set ?
2.8 cars all came with 3:42 gears
3.1 either got 3:23 or 3:42 depending if it was an auto or stick 2:23 is the stick ratio

a v6 car with a set of v8 swaybars will out corner a v8 car anyday even with stock bars id take a v6 over the v8 cars for the corners any day, with the gear change the performance of both will be very damn close and the v6 car is lighter

 

Yes you can swap in factory option gear ratios, but only for the specific year and model.

How much lighter are we talking about? And was there a version that had the 3.73 final gear as factory option?

Autox usually plays in second gear and a car that can push out of 25 mph sharp corners all the way to 65+ mph in second gear, is what you want. My autox buddys shake their heads at my plans, but I cannot afford $15-20K for a car that is used mainly as weekend toy. Here are the cars that usually rule the STX class.

The RX8 for example weights ~2900lbs and has ~200 whp through its Torsen equipped rear end at a 9500 redline. And while a little low on torque it has one of the best suspension layouts and weight balance normal mortals can afford.

Acura RSX, ~2700lbs, 180 whp, LSD and good suspension, but FWD.

BMW 328i or the 1st gen M3, ~2800lbs, ~190 whp, pretty good suspension, but fairly heavy engine and struts in front.

There are a couple other and I'm sure next year the new Scitoybaru 86 will mix up the field as well, ~2700lbs, ~180 whp, lowest point of gravity on American streets since the Porsche.
Torque is the main trump card for muscle cars, especially in a class where everybody runs on the same size tires and the top guys have fancy multilink or double A-arm suspensions, which are able to compansate for lost camber when the car leans.

Now despite all those numbers the loose nut behind the wheel still makes the biggest difference, but given these numbers, are you sure a 3.1 V6 could keep up with those guys? I'm not trying to be rude, just asking if you believe what you wrote and could give me data that proves your claim?

To tell you guys the truth, while I don't really like Fords (they are just no fun to work on) and love my Silverado, I was disappointed how the GTO felt on the autox course and cannot afford the class the 4th gen SS runs in.
After getting some co-drives in various Mustang GT, I was already looking into SN95 Mustangs ~2950 lbs, ~200 whp, yet struts in the front, but a couple friends said to look into 3rd gen Camaro/Firebirds instead.

While I apprechiate opinions I will need facts to start this adventure into automotive new (for me) land.

Thanks again for helping me. Sorry if I'm too German. I don't mean to be rude, just like to get some good information.

 

it depends on how far ur willing ot bend the rules and the class if id take a v6 car or not

ur typical stripper v6 car i.e no power options will run around 3100 pounds.
any of the better suspension parts from the higher up models are a bolt in upgrade
the 3.1 vs a 305 tbi or 305 carbed lg4 the 3.1 would win in a race if it has a good driver

depending on what tthe class alows as far as mods theres a few nice upgrades that can be done to the v6 motors and theres always the possibility of a 3.4 swap
its basically a 3.1 thats bored when u drop in a 3.4 longblock and reuse the 2.8/3.1 timing cover and intake there is no way to tell its identical to the bone stock engine

same with suspension stuff u could get some good stuff on the v8 rs models which u could swap right on bigger sway bars springs etc


im not sure if any of the cars ever came with a 3:73 rear gear option

ideally its going to come down to what u think is a better choice the v6 or the v8
if u can get a tpi 305 with a 5 speed it will deffinatly run away from the v6 in the strights the v6 will win in the corners though

 

Hmm, carburator. I think my last carburator equipped car has been some 15 years ago or so. I have to see if I remmber how to adjust those.
How does the fuel mileage compare to the TPI engines? Do you think the hp numbers given for these 4bbl from the factory were underated?


3300 - 3700lbs That seems a lot to me. I was hoping with some legal weight shedding (usually around ~ 100 - 200lbs in ST) I can get well under the 3000lbs mark, keep in mind 265 street tires are the maximum in this class. I guess I don't have to worry to get heat into them on cold days.


I have not, but thank you for this link, I will go and check it out.

 

The best you're gonna get out of a 3rd gen is around 18-22mpg if it's in good shape. My slow 305 got about that. The carb ones didnt do terrible, but understand the awful LG4 engine looks very close to the L69. Same carb and intake. The differences were pistons and camshaft. Higher compression.

I've known a couple of thirdgens to eek down to the 3000 mark. Definitely the exception, not the rule. Fiberglass hoods came factory on some of the 82-84 Z28s (the "SMC" Hood. Smc = sheet molded compound) and thats a great way to drop weight and look stock. With 16s you're not going to get wider than 255s on all four corners.

https://www.thirdgen.org/1986-pontiac-firebird

The last year of the L69 - note the gear ratio chart. There were manual gear ratios, and Manual ratios with the G92 option. Otherwise 3.42's and 3.45's were available most years with the G92 option also. Those are great ratios for a T5. Watch out of the 9-bolt differential. It's an upgrade over hte 10-bolt, a factory option, but parts are difficult to get (not impossible, tehy're there) and they're a bit more expensive to work on. They're stronger than the 10-bolt for several reasons, but for a stock drivetrain it may not matter all that much. THat's your call. But if you get a 9-bolt, your options for swapping around gear ratios are severely limited - used gears just arent out there for it at any kind of affordable price. I suggest you stay with the 10-bolt.

Another interesting point to be aware of, is the rear disc brakes from 82-88 are terrible. The 89-97 rear disc brakes (89-92 for third gens) are excellent.

 

I will give my best to go to the full extend of the rules, but not further.

Thats good to know.

The "it isn't cheating if you're not cought" principle does not apply to me. While perhaps almost nobody else would know I would, and every victory would feel stale.

Yes this is legal in STX and something I will have to look into to safe money.


The L69 4bbl 305 did. And some others had that option too. You know I have to smile every time I read 373. My nickname in Germany was Ele and my start number is been 373 since 5 years now. Get it?

Have you ever done an autox?

 

Hmm, thats average or highway? My current beater with a heater is a 1995 Monte Carlo with a 3.1 automatic. On daily commute (10 miles to work, mixed town/highway) I get about 20mpg and on long distance it manages ~27mpg. How does that compare?

My company just hired a new programmer person and she drives a third gen and I have heard that her family owns about 10 Camaros. I will have a chad with here once I'm back from Kentucky and see if she could help me find the right engine.

Hmm that SMC hood thing is interesting, even if that means the car I'm looking for just got older. The best tires for that class are available in 17 and 18 inch and there is no restriction other than the tire width.

I think with stock power and street tires the 10-bolt should do fine. Thanks for the info though.

Do the better brakes fit on the older year axle? If so I can swap them out legally). Good to know, thanks.

 

If your country is using the standard SCCA rules, then update/backdates are allowed as long as the CHASSIS (not just year specific) came with something OEM.

In other words, the light SMC hood will be legal on the "stronger" 92 chassis. And just because the 92 rolled off the assembly line with a 3.08 open drum braked rear axle...The older 3.42 disc braked posi rear is perfectly legal Or....The car came with heavy power seats, there is nothing stopping you from putting in lighter manual seats.

I'm thinking you are over thinking the rule book & being stricter on yourself than the rule book is.

 

The autocross, I run allows you to clone a model and use it in the class.
must be a "complete package"
(they don't hold to the rules all the time so take my comment with a gran of salt)

But there have been a couple of guys running 1le clones in STX (5 liter cap) and STU (5.7 goes here but have fun with the AWD cars)
Most people I know run f-stock but usually get killed by the newer muscle cars.

I ran my old V6 3.1 in g stock
(I hate my old RS)
got beat many times by 3.8 l 4th gens and newer v6 mustangs

My current car sits totally uncompetitive in x prep.

if your new to autocross my suggestion:

Stage 1
Buy any hard top 305 tpi auto or manual. and have fun

Stage 2: clone 1LE in detail
replace the bushings, springs, and shocks
iroc sway bars (if starting with z28)
1le brakes and wheels with good tires (hot tires change yearly)

 

i tried it a lil with my v6 car, being my v6 car was setup for drag racing,it made a much better drift car then an auto x car mainly due to the spooled rear end

before my car went mostly drag racing i had 1le swaybars, wonder bar, strut tower brace and rear 1le springs with adjustable shocks ,poly bushings, boxed factory lower control arms and 255/50/16 tires all around . that car would out corner and of the countless v8 thirdgens i have owned

 

The infamous Dean (A lot of the suspension board stickies were written by him) had a v6 RS that he claimed handled better than any v8 thirdgen around. said the weight balance was perfect and it was much lighter. I bet he is right.

But what fun is a v6 car?

And I got around 20 mpg delivering pizzas years ago. Mostly driving through town.

And also, I wouldnt get too hung up on the year. If you're stuck with year-specific parts, the tradeoffs from the whole span of 82-92 would probably turn out pretty even. Even if you couldnt use an SMC hood you could get a 89-92 car with the better rear disc brakes. Or you could get an IROC with its 16 inch wheels and wonderbar and slightly better suspension than the 82-84 Z's....

It's all tradeoffs, there's no year that really stands out as being the best. THey got better and better over the 10 year span, it's just that some of the more interesting options that were available early on were eliminated - like the L69 and the fiberglass hood.

 

Unfortunately this is not correct. Update/backdate is not included in the Street Touring Xtreme allowances, nor in any other street touring classes. It is preserved for Street Prepared and upwards from there.

If I would plan to turn a regular 3rd gen into an 1le clone like tjl IROC suggested, I would've to buy the same year car in order to make a fully legal conversion.

You are the first telling me that I'm stricter than the rules, because I think some of them are very much in favor of people with money and I said that already many times.

But back to topic. I'm not looking to win the next national championship, but I would like to be fairly competitive locally and have as much fun as I can have for my money. I have driven boring cars now long enough.

 

I can believe that a V6 handles better, because it has les weight on the front and considering that most V8's didn't had much more hp, I would think a race between equal driver could very well go in favor of the V6. Yet as you said what fun is that?

I been there and done that, not with a Camaro V6, but don't laugh I currently own a Miata and before that I was sporting a green Subaru station wagon.
Hey I had to start all over 7 years ago here in America. I met my wife while she was studying abroad and her parents made it clear that the only way they would bless this relationship, was if I move here. So without any international degrees other than the skills of my hands and having to work and pay the system to get a green card, money was tight.
Considering that I think we do alright. Yet money still doesn't grow on the lawn unlike the grass around our little house.

In 2006 the previous mentioned friend invited me to give autox a try as I kept complaining about the lack of corners in flat as a pancake Illinois.
I got to drive said '99 Camaro SS and ungreatful as I am was immediately faster than him. After the second time he said next time I have to bring my own car, so all I had was the Subie.

There are essentially 3 races going on at any given autox. Everybody wants to do well in class, well in PAX and there is nothing better to be mentioned when they read the top ten times, preferably as the very last person before everybody goes home.
Now the Subie did well in class and PAX and I won Rookie of the year in 2007, and actually tied for the local championship with a guy sporting a Z06 in 2008.
I sold the Subie a year later to purchase an RX8, but that didn't work out and probably was good so.
I bought the Miata last year and it did very good in class and extremly good in PAX, but since our local courses tend to favor power I got top honors only once and usually placed somewhere around 10th place in raw time. Nonetheless I won the Championship a second time in 2011 this time putting 2 points between me and the guy with the Z06.
Ok thats enough bragging.

Now the Miata was fun and all, but fairly slow, not really practical and especially on those square streets not really fun in the daily grind and is not exactly anybody first choice in the winter. It is basically like a 4 wheeled motorcycle.
When I told my wife that the Miata didn't make me as happy as I hoped to be, she said that the next car has to stick around for at least 5 years, seat 4, need lees fuel than the truck and it can only have as many sets of tires as her CRV. One for the summer and one for the winter!

So given that I have about $5000 to spend initially and a yearly autox budget of ~$1500. I figured my choices come down to either a late 90's Subaru, a late 90's BMW, a mid 90's Mustang or a third gen GM. I know what you would choose. I loved my Subaru, but I feel I want something more exiting and I love V8s, who doesn't?
I'm fairly skilled in welding and everything mechanically, have my in laws machine shop on standby, so I figure I can risk something here.

I'm shooting for doing well in class, well in Pax and raw time on extreme performance street tires for the least amount of money possible, all while being able to use the same car as my main vehicle.

So that's my story as short as I was able to make it. Do you think I'm crazy?

How reliable are any of the third Gen cars year round? My Chevy truck is bulletproof, can that be said for you guys favorite car too?

Now since you know all that, what car is the right one for me?

 

I think your far better off LSX swapping the Miata

 

Well Im going to tell you to get a thirdgen. But beware these things are 20+ years old now. It's 80s GM build quality. I think it's better than early 90s build qaulity, but an extra 10 years does a lot to a car. 20-30 years of age and use will bring out the worst qualities of a car.

But these cars are some of the easiest to work on I've ever messed with. I've heard a few people say the Fords are a lot more logically laid out in some ways, but there's very few things on my car I just dread messing with. Troubling fixes for most are heater cores, fuel pump, and power window motors. But there's tons of room under the hood, most things are easy to get to. Lots of parts can be upgraded to 4th gen parts (like comfortable seats!) Aftermarket parts are avaialble.The only real weakness they had was the weak rear axle and the lack of a 350-T5 package.

For what you want, an 87+ 305 TPI 5 speed car I think will be perfect. Anything TPI will have a lot of the "good" parts on it, sway bars and the like. The T5 cars generally got hotter cams and better gears too when put on the performance models.

Note that after 87 they went to roller camshafts. With modern oils, that's a pretty big advantage. No worries about lifters failing and so forth. Gives you nice cam options later if you choose to go down that road.

Will it be as fast as a Miata in an autocross setting? Probably not. Faster than a subie or a BMW? Probably not. Definitely faster than a mustang.

Be aware that thirdgens can take a good fight to the BMW's and Subie's on an open track if power levels are comparable. (Remember most of the subaru's and BMW's you're going to see are 15+ year newer cars than ours) You just wont get the refinement and ride quality out of a thirdgen. But I'd take my car with all its quirks over one of those other cars any day if I had to choose one or the other, regardless of which was faster. I wanted a thirdgen since I was old enough to talk in the late 80s, got my first one in 2007 when I was 22 and it's been a joy ever since. Logic and rational choices have very little to do with why I chose my car, but luckily these cars are very capable for the things I've wanted to do with them, and that's autocross and eventually track days. Even more fortunately, they're good at drag racing too. Probably one of the most versatile muscle cars built, as I dont think 4th gens are a significantly better vehicle, especially when you ignore the drivetrain advantage (since they can be easily retrofitted). I mean I have a T56 out of an LT1 car.

LSX swapping the Miata would be a much better option if you'rej ust worried about performance. But if you just like 3rd gens and like the idea of a torquey 5 speed v8 muscle car that can handle, the thirdgen is a great option.

Peruse this thread:
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/orga...-thirdgen.html

And watch these:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUYDrPuTnjk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RX8X5AJao6Y

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbG9nVz7Ieg

 

http://www.pbase.com/beagleracing/the_lsx_project
YES!

 

I agree an LSx in a Miata would be fun, but does it put 2 extra seats in it and can it be done for $5000? How will a car like that behave in the winter?

About 2 years ago I got to drive a Datsun 1974 240Z with a LS1 Camaro engine in it, and that thing was a blast to drive on real race tires and a curb weight of just 2300lbs. I still dream of that day. I considered something like that, but that is a little more of a project vehicle than what I'm looking for in the moment.

 

Firebird Formula w/305TPI and 5spd. If you had to choose a pure stock car to Auto-X with, the Formula would be it.

 

Ok, who has one for sale? Or should I start a wanted thread? Because I find it hard to search the classifieds section.

 

You won't find many here. They are too valuable. They also are a low production model.

Search the used car web pages like auto trader and such.

 

what is the advantage of a Firebird Formula w/305TPI and 5spd
over a 1le or iroc w/305TPI and 5spd ?
is there a weight difference?

 

I said that based on the mag articles posted on this site. The formulas always won the handling contests.

 

If you plan to drive locally, just get the best condition car you find and run ESP on good street tires. I think you are barking up the wrong tree in STX. If a BMW is staisfactory for a daily driver find an early e36 325 and work from that. You have had better double duty cars in thepast with the Subaru, RX8, and Miata. Outside of ESP and CP, the F body's ability is not up to the top competition. And would require a significant budget unless you find someone getting out of a car.

 

get a 91-2 Formula 305 5spd hard top.(good luck)
Mid 91 and up GM used a adhesive on the major body seams b4 welding so they are a stronger body.
Slap on some crosslace rims(use 4 front wheels),1LE front brakes, remove all your A/C stuff and you pretty much have a 1LE car.
Grab some sticky tries and go have some fun!

 

Wheel and tire choice is going more important than you think. Why use a stock wheel? Tire options suck for our stock-ish sizes. And a 265 tire is going to feel sloppy on a 16x8" wheel, the sidewall will roll over a lot and will translate to lazy a lazy feel. Step up to a 17 or 18x9 and run some Nitto NT-05 or similar. Also remember that you can use a shorter tire in order to make the car feel like it has shorter gearing.

 

From experience, in Phoenix SCCA at least, the Miata will beat the FBody just about every time.

But we're running a bone stock 1990 IROC convertible in ESP and only losing to a 2011 5.0 Mustang by 15 points on the PAX scoring for the Spring cycle. And by bone stock, I mean still has the original shocks, springs, and bushings on every corner with a drum brake rear and 700R4 trans. Driver skill can make a big difference in some of the classes.

The other car we run is a 1988 GTA in CP. Also within 10 points of winning the novice ladies class based on PAX scores. But everything about this car has been modified. It would not be very competitive at the national level though as it is still setup as a daily driver with no cage, AC, and a stereo system in the trunk area. But as it is, the weight balance is 55/45 front rear and it holds the ground well enough the local instructors like to take laps in it to push the limits of the car. It runs in CP because the engine is now a 383, the rear end is a 12 bolt, it has welded in SFC's, etc. GM did the sheet metal and most of the interior. But in CP Ladies with my wife driving, it is close to winning the Novice Ladies bracket. After she can't run novice any more, we'll make more changes to fit the next class.

If you can drive, a 3rd gen can be very competitive locally and still be a daily driver if the local group is heavy on the Miatas like the one in Phoenix is.