85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

I am going to be installing a procharger onto my 383 over this winter. A few questions that I have are
1. What fuel pump should I run
2. What size injectors should I use
3. After converting to speed density, do I need a 2 or 3 bar map sensor? I plan on running 10 pounds of boost.
4. How much boost could I get out of the D1SC on an intercooled 383?
5. What should I set my fuel pressure at

I will post more questions a as they come up. Modifications are in my signature. Soon to be installed will be an msd distributor and 6all box plus a new snow performance water meth kit. Thanks

Guest

P-I-C-S-!


-pics

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Walbro will be fine...

Minimum of 30-lb injectors for your targeted 10-psi of boost, I'd recommend 42-lb's...

Stick with a 2-Bar MAP sensor, no loss in resolution...

If switching to Speed Density, go EBL-P4 and never look back...

Depends on how restrictive your engine is, and which pulleys your running...

You'll know after a few datalogs, but as a base a few pounds higher than stock.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tech...-my-383-a.html

You still sticking to that plan?

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Kind of. I wanted to start a new thread to get some more small details since I keep on getting recommended different things over time. It seems switching to speed density would be a better bet. Don't know if I should do the cyclone swap or not either. I want to get it running good enough for me so that I can take it to be dyno tuned.

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

I have heard that the walbro pump might be borderline for my set up. Would this pump that I found be better?
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ae...maro/year/1985

Here are two different injectors I found as well from your guys help. Would the 42's be too small or would the 60's be too big?

http://www.southbayfuelinjectors.com...2_TPi_NEW.html

http://fuelinjectorconnection.com/sh...p?productid=65

I am still completely up in the air over what to do for an ecm. I get so many different opinions whether to go with a stock ecm (and maf vs. map as well) or to convert to an aftermarket set up. The place where I get my car dyno tuned installs aftermarket ecm systems. If I would benefit going that route over a factory set up I will. Thanks again for the help.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I would buy 60's for room. 42's could work but you will be close to maxing them out with 10 psi. Your talkin 500-550 whp easily. Single walbro will be borderline. May want to try a 340 lph pump that drops in. Or buy an inline assist pump.

Ecm if you arent tuning yourself then use what the shop is comfortable with

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Thanks, I found this aeromotive pump that's 340lph. Seems to be a drop in pump for our cars.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Yup one of those i believe will work in our tanks, not positive but should beable to make them work and 340 lph will support the 600 hp cars

Guest

Wheres my pics.

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

What would you like a picture of?

Guest

The setup-

BlwnSS

since you not going intercooler , and you think you will be able to run ten lbs you better have meth injection if your not using an ic .

AutoRoc

iTrader: (1)

Meth kit mentioned..

Not using an intercooler will help it make more boost too. I think a D1 can feed 900+hp if I remember correctly. They are loud too! Goodluck!

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

I can't get pictures of the supercharger set up since I didn't buy it yet and the car is still getting repainted. I am going to be running the intercooler set up.

topradman

A quick note on no charge air cooler. I build custom charge air coolers and radiators. Though I am not a dyno tech, I work with one on a regular basis. "More boost" is true but not more power. I built this charge air cooler and we installed it in a Renegade Mustang with a Vortech. Car was using 26 lbs of boost but burying pyrometers on intake temps. Installed an inner cooler and indeed, the boost dropped to 21 psi........ but.... the rwhp went up about 120HP. Cold dense air is much better than hot expanded air as we all know, more O2 molecules in dense air, bigger bang in the cylinder! Just a thought. I know it's a pain in the a$$ to install & plumb and expensive but results are typically worth it. Other options are the methanol injection previously mentioned.

topradman

I just got in on this thread and reviewed what the original target hp was. Man, I could be wrong but I think your hp numbers are going to be disappointing ( sorry ). I have done extensive work to my car. Started out I bought it with a 383 roller motor and a P1SC. Wasn't too satisfied with that. Put on a D1SC, Had Trickflow heads, Big Mouth intake, oversized runners, factory comp with Ed Wright chip burnt on the dyno, way bigger inner cooler than any of the procharger stuff... only got about 430rwhp at 10lb boost. I was pretty pissed. Juggled with a bunch of different pulley sizes and spent money hand over fist. Ed Wright said he didn't think it would make 500hp if he threw a brick on the pedal! Sooooo, went back home, replaced intake manifold with TPIS intake and oval throttle body, installed larger injectors, more fuel pump (A1000), bigger fuel lines, installed a FAST computer, dual sync distibutor (ditch the batch fire), etc.....$$$$. Put it on a different fellas dyno that I work with now. He tuned and worked with this thing, still only about 580rwhp????? So, crank up the boost!!! How??? Pulley change, not quite that simple.... began to have belt slippage problems and couldn't get a consistent boost number.... so, nothing another $1000 wont fix, went to 8rib belt system, results were lack luster. Ok, I'm gonna fix this crap. 12 rib system, more $$$$, but now its making 13lbs consistent and all done at about 640 rwhp. Here was the next bad news. I am now exceeding the hp limits of a GM block!!!! ( SkogenDickie confirmed this as well as a number of other respected engine builders ) This is the kind of stuff most fail to mention as you are shoveling money down a hole. Well now what? Alright, now I'm really pissed. Had Advance Engine Machine, a very respected high horse experienced machine shop put me together a Dart Little M 414cui with Callies Big Snout, Carillos, JE's, Crower shafts, solid roller .710 lift, AFR's, crank trigger, hotter ignition and an F1. I made the intake myself (front loader reusing the TPIS oval TB, 185lb injectors on E85, Aeromotive Eliminator pump, -10AN fuel line forward & back, exhaust is 3" collector SuperComp straight into 4" side pipes ( empty and louder than hell!). Last dyno pull was 782rwhp at 14.4lb boost and intake temps about 15-25f above ambient (very big charge air cooler). We anticipate approx. 850rwhp for this street car with A/C after some exhaust mods but won't know for a couple more weeks. Anyway, point being, once you get past a number, it all gets very head spinningly expensive!!! I guess the biggest kick in the nuts was "your exceeding the horsepower limits of a GM block".... something everyone failed to mention along the way except for my dyno guy I use now since we do business back and forth. FYI, Chris Lovett of Wichita Dyno in Wichita, KS. Hope your journey is better than mine has been. I don't know on what planet Procharger gets some of the horsepower numbers but it has to be with the supercharger bolted to the crank or a cog belt that you can't safely use on the street. I still have belt slippage issues with the 12 rib!!! I am a Procharger dealer and their pump is awesome but the serpentine drive systems lack a lot to be desired but most of the problems are probably not fixable. Don't get me wrong, like I said, the pumps are awesome, just get real satisfied with about 9-10lbs of consistent boost with a serpentine belt system on sbc's. Can't attest to any other application but belt slip is a problem with 6,8 &12 rib and that's with adding an additional ilder pulley to tension against and I can't even install a belt without loosening the blower out of the bracket to get the belt rolled on before tensioning. The 12 rib I have is a banjo string when it's all on and have added a strut rod at the outside edge of the blower that bolts to my strut tower to keep the blower bracket from flexing.... Just sayin.... anyway, good luck!

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Highest d1sc dyno number i ever seen was 800 whp on a ls3 based vette i believe. Seen several motors on this site making 600 rw on d1sc's. 383's and similar. Good heads and cam plus rpm. Tpi holds it back alittle so hp numbers may be down some compared to a short runner.

I would dump tpi in favor of an efi single plane

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

I will be running an intercooler set up along with a water meth kit. I know TPI will be holding it back, however I don't need huge hp numbers. Mid 600's would satisfy me. It's my daily driver in the summer time. Thanks.

86Z

iTrader: (4)

depends on how the motor was built, matched components...

my 305 destroyed my buddies 383 p1sc

i didn't see where he was wanting 900hp..

someone mentioned the d1sc should be good up to 900hp

stick with the stock gm computer setup, load code59 and tune it, no need to waste money on aftermarket stuff...

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

I was talking to the place that tunes my car, and they recommended an aftermarket ecm set up to get the full power potential from the set up.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

No way will it make 600hp.

Back in the early 2000s I was experimenting with fully ported aftermarket TPI style intake vs a singleplane I made. The singleplane picked up 10mph in the 1/4 and over a second with the same long block and blower.

-- Joe

topradman

Agree with this guy! Also, no way the oem computer chipped does as good of a job as and FAST XFI. OBD1 just too slow to respond, especially if street driven. This predominately applies to big horsepower cars. I know it can be made to work but only to a degree.

topradman

600 rwhp is a big number! I know for a fact that there are some dyno shops blowing out unrealistic dyno prints to satisfy their customers. ( i.e. corrections ) so try to find someone that's interested in your car. I know a guy that took his 4th gen procharger car to a dyno shop which I will not name, that got a 900+hp number out of them. After a few runs down the strip he took it to my buddy at Wichita Dyno and had it checked and it was no where near the numbers he had been given, but when he onced over the tune and made some adjustments, the car was much faster, even with the lower numbers.... Hmmmm. This is the kind of crap that gets discouraging. After my 1st dyno experience where the guy was nothing short of rude and my entire dyno sheets were a joke ( he pulled my car with the pass side slip tube coming loose from the head and kept going! I had to back the car out myself to find header bolts on the floor and the car sounded terrible as you can imagine. He was no where to be found but his wife took my money and handed me the paperwork! If I mentioned his name or business, a lot of you would know who he is too. He did mail me my money back later after I bitched ) After that, I decided to go a little closer to home and Wichita Dyno has treated me great!! Anyway, be careful out there.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Actually i think the oem code has more driveability features compared to most aftermarket. But for all out wide open performance, aftermarket has more resolution

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

this. to make the power you have to move the air. no sense in feeding 600hp through a 4ft long straw.

i am working on a ysi LT1 car right now. its taking forever to get done with it! i made a custom motor plate and blower bracket mounted on the front. im using cogs, and impeller speed should be around 60k rpms at 7200. hoping to see somewhere around 20lb boost and 650-700rwhp. has meth injection.

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

I meant 600hp at the crank not the wheels. The car is at 420hp at the crank now.

gta324

Well, nice to see someone else that have big cubes and a procharger
Any pictures of your intake?

PS I have zero belt slip with my setup spinning the F1 to 70k+ , search! I have made a new brakcet and tensioner system It works really good!

BlwnSS

haha 900 out of a d1 , you need to do some research . 700 out of a nice ls at the wheels if your lucky.

GenX'Motorsport

There are members here making 600+ RWHP with ported TPI's on less cubes and boost. So why not?

And of course. The singleplane will do a better job.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Like who?

-- Joe

GenX'Motorsport

TurboTPI. NuffNuff Sp?

Only 2 I can think of right now. Because they have been active.

ZZ3Astro

I can also vouch for a friend (the one I always mention that I did my build based on) who produced mid 500's rwhp and over 600 rwtq with a completely stock TPI intake on a 355. It was with about 25 psi though LOL

topradman

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Well, TurboTPI's best pass of 129mph in 2010 is abour 570whp as he stated. Which sounds about right, since a T62 is good for around 600hp on a 5 liter with a good intake.

Here is a post from NuffNuff in June of this year:


I don't know what he's making for power, but, obviously even he realizes TPI is handicapping him even if his fans don't.

-- Joe

GenX'Motorsport

^ Not a "Fan" just correcting you. If you read his other thread you would see the dyno runs of over 600RWHP..

Why must you insert backhanded derogatory remarks in posts you dont agree with?


And BTW, ZDADDY made over 600RWHP with same car on 305 cubes.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Marty made enough to go 9.3's I believe it was or 9.5's? 700+whp but thats with nitrous too, but it was a TPI. Not sure what was done to it.

GenX'Motorsport

But you say he dosent have a "good intake" What are you saying then??

And I said. of course youre leaving HP on the table. Single planes are extremlly better for high HP combos.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Backhanded derogatory remarks? I think you're a bit sensitive.

Your not correcting me. TPI intakes have no place on high HP builds. Despite the fact that some people are forced to use it because of the political climate in the republik they choose to live in doesn't all of a sudden nullify the fact that they don't flow nor do they support high RPM operation.

We've been over this time and time again on here.

The OP's 383 TPI motor with a D1SC won't make 600hp at the wheels. I stand by that. I also stand by the fact that he can sell the TPI intake to someone in SoCal, and buy a nice singleplane.




-- Joe

project89

iTrader: (1)

ported plenum 58mm tb , and eventually a aftermarket base and 9.17 i belive was the end result

iirc the fastes runs were with the aftermarket tpi base and 471x ( 417x) heads with twin ta49 turbos

project89

iTrader: (1)

tpi drops off way to sharply to make big numbers with a blower , as with a blower the higher u spin the motor the more power they make

stock tpi on a turbo car will still fall off at 5,400 ish same with a blower instead of the turbo(s)

project89

iTrader: (1)

btw i have a tpi on my twin turbo car , its basically a copy of martys build nitrous and all.
im still ditching the tpi for a single plane in the near future as fast as the car can go with the tpi i can do it alot easier with the single plane efi intake on it

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Should I upgrade to the 12 rib set up over the 8 rib? I don't want to have any belt slipping problems. Also, do I have to run a bypass valve or isn't it necessary?

gta324

Its never wrong to have a wider belt...

and yes you need some kind of surge/bypass valve!

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Does the procharger kit include the valve, or is that something I need to purchase separately?

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

Should come with a bypass valve.

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for clearing that up. Does the D1sc come with the 12 rib set up or is it 8 rib? If changing to the 12 rib from the 8, do I just need to buy 12 rib pulleys and a different belt? I'm not buying the kit yet, it's going to be my winter project. I will post up pictures when it's all put together.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

You should be able to order the kit with the 12 rib pulleys as a option.

85Iroc-Z

iTrader: (4)

Will the bypass valve that comes with the d1sc kit work well for my set up or is there a replacement one that would work better for me?