Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Hey all,

I plan to do some mods to my suspension over the winter, and I already have a few parts to install and I'm looking for more. The most major thing I'm doing is lowering the car a bit...not to the ground or anything as I have to get it out of my driveway and the ramp is kinda steep. I'd rather not ruin the ground FX every time I need to take it out.

That being said, here's what I have so far:
-Trans mount/TQ arm relocation bracket (UMI) still need to install
-LCARBS (weld-in for 9" Moser) still need to install
-UMI torque arm - installed
-Lakewood LCA's -installed
-ES poly bushings everywhere -installed

Here's what I'm looking to get:
-Lowering springs (which ones, height??)
-Struts and shocks
-Caster/Camber Plates (Founders most likely)
-Panhard bar (on or off car adjustable? And does it matter?)

I'm not trying to break the bank with exotic one-off stuff..but I'd rather have good reliable stuff reasonably priced parts that will work well together.

The car is a weekend cruiser, and is more of a straight-line car - not intending it to be a road racer by any means. So to you guys have done this before, whats decent out there? If you could post up where to find the stuff for the best price, that would help a lot!

Here's a pic of how it sits as of right now:

UMI Sales

Nice car confuzed. And supercharged as well!

I'd go with Hotchkis Sport lowering springs for approx $259.

We make an awesome CC plate for $217.99. http://www.umiperformance.com/catalo...roducts_id=402

And a veritable plethora of PHB choices. Single adjustable requires pulling one bolt to adjust the PHB while double adjustables are movable on car. Saves a few minutes. Both work equally well.

http://www.umiperformance.com/catalo...dex&cPath=6_84

The biggest price fluctuation is with shocks and struts. The least expensive "good" ones are usually around $429/set of 4. KYB has a nice AGX set out.

This list is a nice solid, basic high performance suspension.

ramey

micktroup2

I got an adjustable panhard bar and LCAs from HotPart that really made the back feel solid. The LCAs have a balljoint in the bushings that stop binding under cornering they say. I didn't race the car, but it 'stuck like glue in the corners', according to my 8 year old son!
I bought new Moog springs from Summit and cut them to get the desired drop. Worked fine(with the heaterhose isolator treatment) and got just the right drop I wanted. No effect on ride or handling. That is my experience anyway... good luck!

jrz28

iTrader: (6)

Love the Founders caster/camber plates and the price can't be beat either. I just put the Eibach Pro Kit springs in my 84 this summer and I love the stance and the ride quality. I got an on car adjustable panhard bar, but like said above, they are all very similar.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

UMI - Thanks! Yeah it's a Magnacharged roots blower on top...I'll be buying a single adjustable panhard bar real soon from you guys. I don't mind taking it off once and setting the adjustment. And you're right on with the price of struts/shocks...that's about the cheapest I found those KYB's...
micktroup2: Thanks, but I hope I don't need luck as much as advice! I have newish Moog springs all around too and I've given cutting them some thought....is there any disadvantage in cutting stock springs vs. lowering springs?? (except for the obvious money savings lol) - do they perform the same as a set of lowering springs or no?
jrz28: Funny you should say that...I just found out the price CAN be beat! On another thread in here, I found out Colorado Speed had JM plates for 30% off and I just ordered those...nothing against Founder's ...I think they have great parts too.

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

you done the rear heater hose mod yet? Pop out the rear rubber isolator and just use some 5/8" heaterhose around the top coil and see how she sits. In the front cutting a 1/2 coil would probably get you where you want to be for a drop. Did it to my car years ago. Just an air cutoff wheel and 30 seconds a side. Don't use a sawzall, it'll heat up the spring a lot, the cutoff wheel flew through it with no issues. I wouldn't mess with anything but a double adjustable panhard bar, it's much easier to adjust on the car, trying to align the rear after making an adjustment is a pain for guys with poly bushings trying to push the rear over.

itsMikey

as far as springs..id reccomend MOOG springs front and back then cut them to the height that your looking for..i cut a coil and a half to get my bird slammed

Reid Fleming

iTrader: (2)

Basically you have the choice of Hotchkis or Eibach Pro Kit. Either kit are advertised as 1" drops all the way around.

Hotchkis are:
600 lbs front (linear)
100/140 lbs rear (progressive)

Pro Kit are
714 lbs front (linear)
109/177 lbs rear (progressive)

From a performance numbers standpoint, the Pro Kit should be better. On the other hand, it will ride rougher than the Hotchkis. And the Hotchkis tend to have a better stance on the car (although not always). Six and one half dozen really.

Personally I like the stance your car has right now. You can actually see the tread pattern on the tires and the least chance of scraping. Also going to have the best ride quality.

Struts/shocks.....Go with the Koni Yellow. They are the best performance, best for lowering, great for a daily driver (my car). And several different settings for adjustability. If you're going to spend money anywhere, spend it on the struts and shocks. My take is to save the money by skipping the lowering springs and instead put that money into the struts and shocks. That's where the performance and comfort will be.

I'd put my money on a Koni yellow/stock height spring car for performance over a lowered car with KYB AGX. And you'd also get a comfier ride too.

For the panhard bar, I have a nice shiny black Spohn panhard bar with delsphere on both ends sitting in the other room waiting to go on. I don't think the on car/off car adjustability is much of an issue with a PHB. It's easy enough to remove and you're only going to set it once.

I agree with your choice of strut mounts.

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

id go with founders on most of the stuff you listed above. price is cheaper than most people around

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for the replies guys...

xpndbl3 -What's up buddy? I just might do exactly as you suggest with the springs. These are relatively new springs on it...I doubt they're Moog, but some other off-brand I'd guess since I got them from JC Whitney about 5 years ago.

Probably half the reason it sits up as high as it does. I just don't see the huge difference between these "lowering springs" and regular springs except for the fact that the lowering springs are shorter. But I imagine the "progressive" springs are probably a better choice than cutting springs...but I don't intend to run the twisties too hard with DR's on the back anyway- lol. I'll also take the advice on the panhard bar....I guess it'll be worth the extra few bucks to get it aligned just right.

itsMikey - Although I really like your ride and how it sits..I could'nt come close to slamming my car that low. I'd NEVER make it up my driveway (or other places) around here with it that low. I'll try 1/2 coil up front and see.

That leaves the choice for shocks/struts....For pure straight line grip (which I could always use more of) I like the sound of the Lakewood 70/30's up front and 50/50 rears. But I'm sure the ride won't be near as nice as Koni's....decisions, decisions...

On anothernote, my J&M CC plates JUST shipped yesterday...took 4 days to "process" them??? Oh, well. Glad I wasn't in a hurry...

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

With a 5 speed if you want it to hook off the line, I'd look into the 90/10s up front, it'll pop the nose up and keep it up there for weight transfer. The progressive springs always felt squishy to me over bumps in the road, because the first inch or two is a very low spring rate, great for a grocery getter, not great for a car you want to race. The 50/50s are really nice, I'll be popping mine off this winter and swapping to a double adjustable rear shock.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Which double adjustable shocks are you getting? Just curious...

"Not great for a car you want to race".....there's a dilemma I have with myself right there I suppose. I don't plan on doing any serious racing with it really. I've given thought to taking it to a Test-N-Tune night at the track - but I've never raced on a drag strip and have a lot to learn I'm sure.

There's a good chance I'd get my A** handed to me by an automatic car with the same or slightly less power level at the track since I just can't bang gears fast enough to be competetive with a well set-up automatic car. I normally spin like crazy off the line and an automatic pulls away a good 5-6 car lengths...until I hit third gear at about 50 mph....then I start gaining on them like a banshee! I don't know what would happen on a full 1/4 mile run...

But - it WOULD be fun to see what kind of times I could pull in the 1/4 mile!!

But in the end, I guess I'm looking for a good all-around handling and best traction setup I can get for my own amusement for weekend warrior type street use.

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

strange double adjustable shock for a fox body actually I'm putting on there. Pick up a set of drag strip only rims and some 28x10.5 stiff sidewall mickey thompsons and you won't have an issue with spinning anymore. Then again if you hook it, you might not have a trans anymore It's all downhill from here, after your first few passes you get hooked, then the UPS guy knows you by name and drops off box after box of more speed parts.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

I've thought about getting a set of rear slicks just for the track....but I doubt I'd go there enough to make it worth-while. I if I really did get this thing to hook, it's got the torque to pull the wheels off the ground I bet....that's where the UPS and FEDEX guys would come in...Cha-Ching!!...

EDIT: Once I decide what struts/shocks etc. I'm going with, I plan to begin adding a bunch of suspension, exhaust and ignition upgrades on top of what I already have. I'll take a few lousy pics and share my installation frustrations with the board...it's a great way to vent!!

Thanks for the advice everyone!

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Well, I just got a set of J&M caster/camber plates a couple days ago, and I just ordered a set of Eibach Sportline Springs last night. Still need to look at shocks and struts a bit more. I'm hoping I can find a deal on a set somewhere...

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

perfect, good luck and post pics of the updates

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Well, I've ALMOST got the suspension parts except for struts/shocks. I've amassed quite a few parts to get on in the next couple of months. Here's a quick pic of a few of them...not all suspension so I'll be busy!

Doesn't include the MSD box, plug wires etc. that I still need to buy also..

Reid Fleming

iTrader: (2)

Why did you go for the Sportlines instead of the Pro Kit?

Pro Kit are
714 lbs front (linear)
109/177 lbs rear (progressive)

Sportline: 700 lbs (linear)
80/137 lbs rear (progressive)

The Sportlines drop lower, but have less powerful springs. You're going to be on the bump stops all the time. They're designed to use the bump stops. (Crazy in my opinion)

Pro Kit = performance
Sportline = looks

micktroup2

Looks like fun! And by 'luck' I didn't mean that you put on a blindfold and pray- just hoping that it all comes together for you. I had an MSD coil on my car, now it is a burnt out hulk... not slandering MSD, but I have my suspicions as to the cause of the fire...

88FormulaKiller

iTrader: (8)

im running 1 coil cut moogs in the front, 1.75 drop SLP's in the rear (no isolators), bilstein HD's all around, LCARB's w/tubular LCA's, stock arms in the front, adj founders p/h bar and founders plates. Car handles like a dream around tight corners and smooth as glass yet grippy over 160mph. just my set up and my own .02.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

According to all the literature I've read, the difference between the two is only 1/2". I didn't see the lb. rating, but yeah, I guess they're a little lighter.

i would hope I'm not "riding on the bump stops"...that sounds downright hazardous to me! I must've missed any advertising that states they're supposed to run that way. I'd rather cut my existing springs than to have that happen.

I'm hoping to get decent performance (straight line) with the springs...and of course a better stance for looks. The car's not set up to perform well on the twists anyway since I'm running DR's in the rear, and the sidewalls flex too much in the sidewall to allow any serious curvy road type driving...I wouldn't run this combo for a DD car...this is a weekend car only anyway.

The MSD I was referring to is a multi-spark w/boost retard. I have a boost retard on it already, but W/O the multi-spark. I'm hoping it'll make it run a little cleaner and smoother at idle. I already have it anyway ready to install, so I may as well use it! I'm really hoping there's no "fire"..

I'm considering Bilstein's or Koni's for struts/shocks...talk about sticker shock!!

SDTransAM

iTrader: (5)

You posted in that parts picture, and Edelbrock carb? You are running a blower and a edelbrock carb?

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Well, I guess since I posted a pic, every part in it will will get scutinized....

Yes, it's an Edelbrock carb. I'm currently running a undersized Demon carb. It's been proven over many years that Edelbrock carbs work with a blower. If you look at the universal E-Force blower, (very simular to mine) -there's a specially calibrated 800 CFM Edelbrock carb that comes in the optional kit. I got the carb at about half the price of a new one on fleabay. I called Edelbrock to see what the calibration is, so I got the needed hangers, and high flow jets. I figured I'd give it a try.

I know it's not the best performer on a N/A car, but the difference is much smaller on a roots blown car. And -it has an electric choke - which is a huge plus...if you've ever heard a cold start lean backfire on a blown car without a choke, you'd know exactly where I'm coming from.

It'll sound off like a shotgun....for real. Not too good for the blower either.

SDTransAM

iTrader: (5)

Oh, that's good to know. I know for N/A performance they arent the greatest. So I was wondering why you were changing from a demon to an edelbrock.

Very nice car, I have an '83 as well and I am planning to build a blown 350.

And I also hope you dont mind but your car is my new desktop picture. Mine will be as nice as yours someday! Are those Torq thrust II wheels what brand? Your car is what I have very similarly invisioned for my build.

LivinLarge

Wonder what your stance is going to look like with those springs. And anyone know how those lakewood shocks ride and handle?

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

I'm changing because it's a bigger carb, it has a choke and I'd like to try it out. There's also no power valve to blow either...I'll dyne it again to get the A/F ratio set, and as a side note see if there's any more power since it should breath a little better in theory...along with the headers I'm installing it should help.

Desktop picture?....Sure!

The wheels are MB "Old School"...Discount Tires Plus. Good luck with your build! If you want to know what NOT to do, PM me! lol
Better I hope. Along with the LCARBS I'm installing too, I hope I'll get better traction off the line. If I decide on Lakewoods, I'll let you know. The Lakewoods are more for straight-line performance really..

SDTransAM

iTrader: (5)

LoL, this is my 5th F-body and I've built many, many cars. DSM's, honda's Camaros, trucks, lowriders, I know what NOT to do, that's why I am back with a Camaro haha.

I'm gonna look into those wheels, thanks.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

I'm gonna eventually be off work long enough soon to get a little progress done with her....even though the parts appear to not be popular, just pretend it's the pricey stuff...it mounts up the same..lol

And SDTransAM: I've never built the types of cars you've worked on....Hondas, DSM's (what are those?) or lowriders. I can only tell you what to not do on regular (high mileage) cars, blown engines and maybe boats if you're bad at fishing!

But seriously, post up your build!! Not enough old school "blowers" around!

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Well, I'm going to get little really done with my schedule at work, but I'm going to at least post up a few beginning ride height pics. These are not the original sagged out original springs....not Moogs either but some off brand that I've had on it for about 4 years now.
FRONT - (27 3/8ths)

REAR - (28 1/8th or 1/4)

CAR:

Looks like it actually does has a very "slight" rake after all. Still need to get struts, but with the Sportlines I think it's going to drop quite a bit...but I hope not too much...

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

I haven't done too much to the car lately...been too cold really. I did manage to get my torque arm relocation bracket on though. I put a angle finder on the bottom of the torque arm before I started to get my reading, since there's a few different settings on the new relocation bracket where the front bushing (clam shell) bolts up. I put it right back on the money where my tail shaft mount was. Not too hard at all, but the garage floor was REALLY cold!!

It's not absolutely needed I suppose...since I've never heard of anyone snapping a tail shaft off a trans even with the original setup, but it least I should have "piece of mind" it won't/can't happen now.

I know the angle is most likely gonna change a little when I put my lowering springs on, but I'm hoping it won't be too much.

I'd like to figure out a way to put these caster/camber plates on without changing the front end alignment setting....but I don't see how I'll do it. Looks like I may need to get the car re-aligned after the install...unless someone knows a way??

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Well, I got a couple more things done today. I decided to put on the Bilstein rear shocks that arrived the other day. While I was at it anyway, I also put in the Eibach rear springs.

-The first pic is of the car on jacks in the air.
-The second is the Bilsteins.
-The third is comparing my old stocker springs to the new shiny Eibach springs. I counted the coils in each...the stock springs have 10 coils, and the Eibach's have 9 coils. As you can see in the pic, the gage of the Eibach springs are also slightly smaller.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

-First pic is of the torque arm bracket I put in a couple days ago, along with the UMI torque arm. I had the arm on it for a couple years now...still looks new.

-Second pic - You can see the rubber isolator piece which goes on top of the rear spring. The upper coil needs to be "indexed" into the isolator. I knew this already, but I figured since I had it out I'd take a pic. EDIT: I did need to have the shocks off and loosen up my sway bar end links in order for the rear end to drop far enough to allow me to get the old springs out, and the new ones in...

Third pic - Found out that one bump stop is missing, and the other is torn. I'll need to replace them...funny how you always find something else you didn't expect when you have your car in the air...

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Last pic is of the springs and shocks installed. The bump stop above the drum is ripped halfway across...looks fine in the pic though!

Amazing how nasty it looks underneath in the pics....it's really a lot cleaner looking in person...really it is!

-The rear springs/shocks are a breeze compared to changing out the front springs/struts. I'll have the Bilstein struts in the next couple of weeks -That'll be next!

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

When its back on the ground you'll have to see how much travel you have between the bump stop and the lowering springs, I cut out that whole bracket and never had an issue, but then again I'm not loading the hatch up with 300 pounds of suit cases either

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

According to a post above, someone's saying these springs "use" the bump stops....sounds dangerous to me, and darn if I found that info anywhere...If I did I would've gone with the Pro kit instead of the Sportlines...

Obviously though, I've bumped the stops one too many times with stock springs on it. Could have been the worn out Gabriel VST's I took off the back didn't help any -or the near 300 pounds of me in the car...lol

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

I think using the bump stops is for the fronts, not the rears, but doesn't hurt to double check you have all 4 of them now

obeymybird

iTrader: (4)

I really didnt like the pro kit going to be going to a camaro this year and i might give the sportlines a try, really nice work so far...

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Thanks obeymybird.

I've started installing my front springs. Huge difference between the Eibachs and the stock springs... I discovered that I had put the "flat end" in the A-arm pockets when I installed the ones I'm now removing . That's not how the stockers were when I removed them...ooops...

-First pic is of the huge difference in height.
-Second pic is of how I opted to hold the insulators in place so they wouldn't move...electrical ties are awesome!...
-Third pis is the DS installed....


//

keeslinger31

Ya they are def shorter. thats about where my bumpstop is on cut springs too

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

all done?

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Oh no....still got a lot to do. Still waiting on my front struts to ship, CC plates, headers, carb, plug wires,MSD box all still need to go on...along with several smaller things. It's never-ending.

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

haha don't worry my list is still a lot longer, but I've had this chest cold/cough for the past week and a half that has sucked any spare energy right out of me.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Well, all the springs are in now. Unfortunately, I'm in a holding pattern on the suspension until my struts get shipped to me.

Whenever I get the struts, I'll put those in along with the JM CC plates. Still pondering whether I should weld the LCARBS in myself or pay someone to weld them in for me. I did my SFC's myself about 4 years ago and they're still holding tight....but talk about some ugly welds...lol

Plenty of other things to do till then though I guess...

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

Bring it by, I'll weld them up

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Don't laugh Steve...I might just take you up on that!! I have a Cheap Clarke MIG welder, I'm thinkin of doing a couple of practice passes on a 1/4" plate I have lying around. We'll see

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

i have a 220 volt lincoln, so it does alright

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Well, I know this doesn't have anything to do with suspension, but I'm installing my set of Dyno Don's headers today while I'm still waiting on my struts to arrive. They dropped right in and I actually have more room than I did with the Edelcrock TES headers! It's great to finally be rid of those AIR tubes!

EDIT: At least the drivers side dropped right in...the passenger side is another story..

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Been at my real job lately, so not much time to get a whole lot done with the Z28. I have Y-pipe issues with the Dyno Don's headers I'm putting on. Basically, the Y-pipe crossover that runs between the pan and K frame is too close, (hits the pan) and the down pipes won't quite cinch up to the headers...gotta do something about that, not positive what quite yet. Had to re-route my fuel lines to get the passenger side header to fit...glad that's over. I hate tube bending now with a passion!

I did get my Bilstein struts last week! They look awesome, but nobody'll ever see them really...kind of a shame...lol If they perform as good as they look, I'll be golden.

I'm also puttng the JM CC plates on too while I'm at it. Got the passenger side done yesterday, doing the driver's side now. I tried to figure out a way to keep the alignment as close as possible while swapping so at least it would be close enough to drive to the alignment shop, but I couldn't really find any way to do it since the aftermarket CC plates are shaped so different than the stockers....and the sperical bearing itself adjusts. I'll take a couple lousy pics after they're in...

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

if you need an exhaust guy i have a GREAT one down this way. Trailer it down and I have a great alignment guy too, that will put it to whatever specs you want at a firestone, I like them because he used to be a racer as well and they have a laser alignment machine. I get a touch up every spring, sometimes my stuff moves .2 degrees a season, who knows.

Confuzed1

iTrader: (4)

Man, that sounds tempting Steve....let me mess around with this thing a little more just to make sure theres nothing else I can do with it - and if that ends up being the case, I'll let you know.