http://www.camaroperformers.com/cama...uspension-kit/

I'm cosidering buying some components from this kit for my car.

I already have hotchkis subframe connectors, lower control arms, and a panhard bar. I just installed a BMR torque arm as well.

With these Hotchkis springs will the ride be to hard on the street?

 

Those springs would give you a very nice ride. THey are not stiff @ 600lbs. Stiffer springs are more in the 800+ range. Those really are not performance springs @ 600lb fronts. What makes them nice is all the coil winds. There is ALOT of coil wire length that make up the spring height so as long as it does not go into coilbind with decent shocks to control them, you will have a very nice ride- better than factory

 

What kind of dampers are you running? (shocks and struts)

Those springs with high compression Koni Yellows will give you a very nice ride.

Koni Yellow fronts are known for having a bit too much compression dampering. BUT with a lower rate spring like this the Konis would balance out very nice for street driving. General rule of thumb is when you go down on rate you need to go up on compression valving (an vica versa) I would not run these with KYBs or such. You need higher rebound dampering for a decent handling so the car will not roll abruptly going into a corner

 

Thanks for the replies. I know my suspension is overdue for some attention. Aside from the aftermarket stuff that I mentioned everything is as it came from the factory so stuff is really worn out.

I was planning on going with Bilstein struts in the front and Bilstein shocks in the back. I've still got the original Bilstein rear shocks on my car now.

What part numbers should I be looking for with Bilsteins for lowered cars? I've found that Bilsteins have one part number for the struts (stock height or lowered) and a couple of different struts for stock height or lowered cars. I'm assuming that the shocks for lowered cars would have a higher damping rate to deal with the increased spring rate.

The KYB's that I have seen are usually cheap and aren't up to the standard of the shocks that thirdgens came from the factory. I know a couple of people who have installed KYB's and they were not satisfied with how they performed at all.

I would like an increase in handling but I just don't want to have a bone jarring ride and bounce all over the place.

Sounds like with the Hotchkis set up there should be a real increase in the handling department while the ride quality should still be good to. I don't take my car to the track - my car is 100% dedicated street car but, I do like going on twisty mountain roads where I live.

 

THose Hotchkis springs are basically the same exact coilsprings that Summit racing sells. They are aporx 7 wind coils with about a .625 wire. (hence as stated they are both aprox 600 lb springs/ Summit AND Hotchkis)

I have seen many people claim they thing the summit lowering springs are not as good as the Eibach prokit springs for handling, but then also say the porkit is miore harsh. That is solely because they are marrying the springs with KYB shocks in most cases, and not the Koni Yellows.

I would take these Hotchkis springs and Konis, over the Porkit and KYB's any day of the week when it comes to everyday street performance and especially ride quality. You want a little stiffer ride for better conrering then go to the SUspension Techniques spring package for V8's a vetter spring combo then the Eibach prokit in my opinion. Or just go with the Moog 5662 and cut a coil off them- they believe it or not are a very good spring.

What ever yoy do though, for good ride quality you want to use a very good shock/strut like a Koni Yellow. I am not a fan of Bilstiens, not even on my Mercedes where this is the same crowd that preaches Bilstiens and H&R springs, and they all ride more poor quality than stock

 

I posted specs of my springs I ran in my built V6 car but I can not find the info on them (it was on my old computer- but is also in a post somewhere here on TGO- probably under my Vetruck name or maybe even V6rsr)

My front springs were 12.5" long from what I recall- withOUT any isolators in the front end. I wrap the upper coil end with grip tape like you would see on a baseball bat (a little electrical tape works decent with about 5 loops to pad it., and then I moly grease the **** out of it and stick it up into the can (actually wipe moly grease up on the metal of the can where the spring sits into the pocket, and oon the a-arm index too) My coil winds were something like 6.75 free coils and my wire was over .800 thick. They were rated at a little over 800lbs rate on a light weight V6 car. This car was stiff, but it was not bone jarring and rode VERY nice at speed. Slower around town commuting was just a tad abrupt because the Koni Yellow vompression valving was a tad high for my spring rate. I wish I could have revalved the konis just a click of two lower in compression but they are only rebound adjustable. So, if you keep the spring rate lower, the Konis are the EXCELLENT choice for ride quality and decent performace. Stiffer springs and KYB's are the harsh budget ride quality car with decent cornering, but harsh ride. Koni's and supsension technique type sporings will give great cornering and good ride. Koni and Hotchkis will give good cornering and great ride

Hope that helps.

Also note that all cars are different based on build sheet wieght bias and options. What works for one car will be a little different on the next. Each has to be custom fitted for best results. Springs are the hardest theing to pick out, and then custom taylor to your specifice vehicle. No one fits all spring out there.

 

Thanks for the advice.

Yeah I'm just figuring out things and doing some research before I make a commitment and purchase parts. Thats part of the reason why I haven't changed anything on my suspesion with the exception of the minor bolt on's that I have made and the weld on subframe connectors.

The different spring rates are based on options for that specific car - so the factory springs are GM factory custom made springs for that application.

The aftermarket stuff is mostly a one size fits all hat so that makes things more difficult to judge as well.

 

Not really, you can get just about any reasonable spring rate in just about any free length. You just need to look beyond the "normal" spring companies.

Take a look at the stock car spring suppliers.

I agree with Slick, the Konis can ride really well. I run them with 850lb front springs and the car is firm but comfortable.

 

Just to see what the stock replacment springs were I contacted Eaton Detroit springs. I've heard good things about that company and they have the factory specs on most of the springs that they reproduce.

They said they had the stock springs for my IROC and wanted $159.95 per pair for both the front and the rear.

I sent them an email back asking what the spring rates were and I'm waiting to hear back from them. If I decide to get these factory stock replacment springs I'll probably rebuild my suspension back to original specs.

If I decide to go with Hotchkis from what everybody is saying I should look at Koni's strut and shocks for sure. Sounds like everybody feels they would perform the best and still have good street ride quality.

 

That's too much money for stock springs. Moog 5662 (front) and 5665 (rear) are much cheaper than that. And they have good rates. 707 lbs and 107 lbs. (107 lbs sounds small for the rear, but this with Koni yellow rear shocks set in the "0" full soft position equals a firm but not too stiff car.)

Hotchkis are a softer spring than the Pro Kit. (Pro Kit fronts run 715 lbs), but the common perspective is that Hotchkis have a better stance than the Pro Kits.

The trouble with KYB AGX struts/springs is that they have one **** that adjusts compression and rebound simultaneously. Konis have fixed compression and adjustable rebound (or adjustable compression and seperate adjustable rebound)........For 99% of us, the Koni with rebound adjustment only, is the best way to go. Because that way you can't mess up the compression settings.

Bilstein rears are HD and Sport. Same shock, but the Sports are designed for lowered cars. With Hotchkis or Pro Kit, I think you wouldn't have a problem with the HD. The Sports are more designed for super low cars (Sportline or custom cut springs)

But my take is to spend as much as you can on struts/shocks and save money anywhere else in the suspension. In my case, I saved $200 by going with Moog springs instead of Pro Kit/Hotchkis and then put that money into better (Koni Yellow) struts and shocks. I wanted stock height anyways. Best of both worlds. Better ride quality (no bumpstop hits), great performance.

 

Thanks for the advice. I just got an email back from Eation Detroit springs. They asked me for the options that my car has and the modifications that I had made. I've got an option level 3 car and I gave them the list of mods that I had made.

Eaton springs says for my car they came up with a spring rates of 706 lbs in the front and 104 lbs in the rear.

I know somewhere on here in another thread that I talked to someone that said the stock IROC/Z28 spring rates were 548 lbs in the front and 104 lbs in the rear. I don't know if thats an accurate base line or not because each car had different options on it so they had a different spring rate according to those specific options.

Hotchkis says that their spring rates are 600 lbs. in the front and a variable rate between 100 lbs - 140 lbs. in the rear.

Ha ha this is all a lot of information.

My cheapest option would be to get a set of MOOG stock replacement springs then get a set of Bilstein HD or KONI shocks & struts. Then I could get a poly bushing kit for the suspension components that I already have and save some money there too. I could also go to MOOG and get the steering rebuild components that they have on their website.

I don't necessarily want a lower ride height than stock but my suspesion is as old as my car (24 years old now with 200,000 miles) aside from the minor bolt on parts that I have put on and I know it's worn out so its long over due for an over haul.

If I went the aftermarket route I would probably go with Hotchkis springs and their sway bars to match since I already have Hotchkis lower control arms, subframe connectors and panhard bar.

I want to do all this stuff once the first time with the best components (at a good price) so I won't have to go back and re-visit this stuff 6 months later down the road because I made a bad desicision.

 

You were right. That was way too much money for stock springs. Especially since the spring rates that he gave me were the same that Moog has for less than $100!

I was quoted $159.95 for the front pair and $159.95 for the rear from Eaton Detroit springs

Then they told me that the shipping for the front springs would be $46.50 and the rears would be $37.00.

So that would be $319.90 for the springs plus $83.50 for the shipping for a grand total of $403.40!

That is way too much considering I haven't even bought bushings yet or shocks & struts.

So I'll either outfit my car with the Hotchkis stuff or go to Moog rebuild my suspension back to stock specs.

 

Keep in mind that putting Hotchkis or Pro Kit on your car would result in probably the same ride height you have right now. The stock original springs will have no doubt sagged by 1-1.5 inches.

I really like the Moog + Koni combination myself. Never grow tired of it.

 

Yeah I fully expect that there would be no change in right height due to the sagging stock springs. I just couldn't believe how much money Eaton springs wanted for there springs when Moog offers the same spring rates than they do and they want much less money!

Hotchkis and Eibach wanted significantly less money than Eaton and at least those are aftermarket springs that have higher spring rates than stock.