I have a 1991 firebird formula it had a 305 tbi motor in it non vortec I'm putting a 350 motor made between the years of 87-93 with a set of 906 vortec heads with a lunati cam SBC Hydraulic Roller Camshaft RPM Range Idle - 5000 Lift .492"/.492" Dur.@.050 210/218
I have roller rockers and hyd lifters I want to use my old tbi and computer how do I do that? Please it's my only vehicle I sold everything after I lost my last job to build this car I really need help

 

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tbi/...i-buildup.html

 

That's on a l31 LONG BLOCK motor 1996 and up out of a truck already built for vortec heads STOCK
I'm using a 87-92 SMALL BLOCK CHEVY and putting built 906 vortec heads on it as I said in the the beginning

 

No different really. Just uses a different timing cover and balancer.

 

It's different in at least one fact I know I'll have to run a bypass from the water pump to the intake so the heads don't over heat up before the engine does. On a long lock set up for vortec already that information would be invalid because it's already set up to cool the heads.
Makes me wonder what other facts would be true for a short block of the years 87-93 that wouldn't be for a 96 and up long block vortec. I'm turning a motor that isn't vortec into vortec so I need info on that account as well as putting in my 1991 formula I appreciate the help though it's always better to have more then one head thinking on it

 

You still have to run a bypass for a L30/L31 long block. I know. I have that motor.

I can tell you a sure fire way to have your thread fade into the forgotten is to continue arguing with any advice given by one of the most respected members here.

 

I was not arguing I pointed out KEY facts explaining why I couldn't draw the all info I needed from that forum the devils in the details as we all know. his answer simply suggested another forum on a project very loosely based on my question but containing a completely different build from the block up. I read it and did not find all answers I needed or I didn't know already. I thanked him for his effort and I was not rude I only provided facts not slander or hate. Although You sir are instigating and neither myself noir the other gentleman actually trying to help and not just start an argument deserve that. It's unappreciated :/

 

And I don't run an external bypass. The stock heater plumbing with the 3-port valve works great for a bypass.

 

Not trying to start an argument, just felt it spelled out a lot of the needed information.

 

There is nothing different about the cooling of a vortec head. It's the 96+ block that is sometimes built without a bypass hole at the water pump flange. The stock heater plumbing is 4x the diameter of that tiny bypass. I have built 4 of these engines in older GM vehicles, never plumbed a bypass yet. The factory heater setup continuously bypasses to the radiator.

 

Okay that makes sense I appreciate your information and trust fully it is truth
I'm having a ex engineer of hypertec burn a chip for the computer in that car he said it will cost 399$ is that a fair deal?

 

Hell no it's not. You can get ebl for Less than that iirc

 

or there are people with 1000x the tbi tuning experience of that guy that'll do it for 1/4 of the cost. total ripoff.

 

Really! Wow I had no idea I just figured it was one of those times you just grit your teeth and sell something to pay for it... But if there's a better way..? could I be so bold to ask you to tell me who I need to talk to and how to contact them about burning a chip?

 

And no that was not sarcasm it was a sincere reply and question
If there's someone experienced in burning chips who can do it right for a moderate price I would like very much the proper info to contact them

 

Go with EBL

 

Process of burning chips is slowly going away since no two engines (drive trains) are the same. There are few people left in the business of 'burning EPROMs', but based on recent feedback I would not recommend any of them. What I hear from people who try to deal with them - basically you get airline attendant style attitude of the worst kind.

OBDI style EFI systems are not complicated and available information is very extensive and well understood. Yes, there is a learning curve involved.

//RF

 

That is VERY true and while I worked for Danny's rod shop (a speed shop) I found most hot rodders are switching to those systems however they are quite costly and I'd rather pay 399$ Right now to get a car on the road. I'm strapped for cash as it were. If I could get a efi I would without a second thought but I haven't seen a stand alone Efi baised fuel system for under 1000$ And at this moment I haven't the necessary funds to spend that much on my fuel delivery system right now. Later when I get the money I will for sure but for now a chip is the cheapest route even at 399$ if you say the people who burn them that follow this forum Arnt worth it I'll take you at your word and go with the ex hypertec engineer I know. Okay how about serpentine systems I have a sbc complete system but will it work with vortec heads?

 

I don't think you are fully understanding
what he is saying. The TBI you have is an EFI system. He is saying it isn't difficult to learn to tune it correctly.

If you are talking about the stock thirdgen serp system, it will fit.

Take our advice and go with EBL flash, its cheaper than what you will pay for your "chip" and you'll end up buying it down the road anyway.

Next, you will need to upgrade your fuel delivery system REGARDLESS of whether you go with the canned tune or EBL. Your stock 305 injectors will not supply enough fuel to the vortec motor and neither will the pump.

This is all already posted information by Fast355 in the stickies above.

 

I know Iv already bought and installed a set of 350 injectors that came out on a 1991 police caprice tbi..
As I said his thread had GOOD SOLID information but it wasn't specific to my drive train and I needed more personalized help which you all are very generously providing and I thank you all very much
Now the ELB flashing tuning I know there's forums already on here for learning to use it but where could I buy what I need and who makes the best one for the price?

 

Well there is only one person who makes EBL linked below. $380 if you provide the ecm. $350 if you install yourself.

Edit: forgot the link
http://www.dynamicefi.com/EBL_Flash.php

 

True, that cam + vortec heads flow are certainly capable of making decent power. I higly doubt the features of the stock ECM even with a tuned chip will be up to the task to allow taking advantage of the engines power capabilities.

 

I have tuned more cam than that in a 305, but it is definately not for the novice or first time tuner.

 

This is defiantly what I need to do I noticed also tuner pro is free? Is that true? I'd install it myself to save money just like everything lol also if I took my car and the computer to a speed shop could they tune it for me? I'll be honest I can tighten bolts and referb interior and put the motor together but I'm not sure I wanna tackle "tuning" my engine with not past knowledge of tuning with a computer software.
THANK you for this link by the way

 

Yeah it's not a monster cam at all it's got a good lobe and a great aggressive ness about it but I wanted something I could drive often and still afford to put gas in it'll stand out but it's not huge. Your right I haven't done any tuning with computer software so I'm not comfortable with trying to tune myself I'll have to find someone to help me in my home town.

 

They may not be familiar with the system but they should know the tables. In all honesty, the community here can help a lot. A good baseline tune will do wonders and after that its just tweaking it.

 

That was not exactly my point, I was more drawing attention at features like the vacuum referenced fueling tables, extended SA tables, ...

 

What gear drive should I use with this lunati cam part number 20120312 it's a reto fit hydrolic roller. The stock retainer plate won't work I need to use a gear drive with a cam button but I can't figure out the right gear drive for this cam any experienced suggestions? Btw I will post a video of the car and motor running after I finish

 

DON'T USE A GEARDRIVE....The harmonics will drive the knock sensor crazy and it is harmful to other components such as the crankshaft. Use a double roller timing chain with a cam button and a reinforced timing cover.

 

^^^^^Fast355 is correct. Using a gear-drive is crazy.

Why don't you just buy the correct cam, with the step machined in the nose? The OEM retainer plate is a far better solution than the aftermarket buttons.

 

^^^^^^ Fast355 is on the money. No gear drives - the worst thing you can do. A quality single or double roller timing chain with a cam button and a solid timing cover to prevent cam walk.

 

Thank you that's what I'll do then

 

Because Iv already bought this cam and it'll work with a button just fine. I planned on using a button when I bought it I just was asking opinions on a gear drive. But it looks like the general agreement is non gear drive so that's what I'll do

 

Thank you very much I had a mechanic that works extensively on ls engines buffalo me into considering a gear drive but I'll believe experienced sbc people here on third gen over a very prideful local mechanic any day of the week. double roller it is

 

How about button type nylon or steel? And should I degree the cam? Or install at zero ? I know you all have built more engines than me and a lot of times experience is better than anything they teach you in the books

 

I would use a quality single true roller chain, like for exemple Cloyes 9-3157.