Although the chance of the valve grind not being what the cam card says you should still check the cam installation.

My ignition is locked at full advance. A race car doesn't need mechanical or vacuum advance. I originally started the season with my timing at 36*. I've advanced it as far as 46* and didn't want to go any more in case I was going to hurt something.

Today I used a degree wheel and piston stop to put #1 piston on TDC. My timing marks were out 8*. What I though was 46* is actually only 38*.

Just goes to show that even though you think the timing is correct it might not be.

Yup, very good advice. Even if the cam is ground correctly, there can always be variation in either of the timing gears, or the keyway on the crank.
So... back to my original question, since there seemed to be some disagreement last time I asked. I'll be degreeing in a cam for the first time next week... do I or do I not need to use a solid roller lifter to degree in a roller cam? I've got an entire degree kit from Summit, including the low tension springs. And if I do need a solid roller lifter, where do I find one?

To degree a cam, yes you need to use solid lifters. Hydraulic lifters bleed down and won't give a proper reading.

As for finding a pair of solid rollers (set of intake/exhaust) you could always try buying a pair from your local speed shop. Not everything is sold in complete sets. If you only needed one roller rocker because one got damaged you wouldn't want to have to buy all 16. All you have to do is ask them.

I never did degree my cam. I just needed to know where TDC was but that's the first step in degreeing the cam.

I told you
That, and every instruction that I read concurred to that fact.
CompCam, Crane, Lunati, some other websites to boot.

New lifters will bleed down with hardly any pressure. I was geting a little bleed with just the pushrod attached to my dial gauge.
You don't need that inconsistency degreeing a cam. That **** gets old after rotating it over fifty times trying to get the reading to match your last.

BTW: I got the summit kit also, and attached the wheel to the balancer. It was imposible to attached it to the crank only without it moving. Get a clothes hanger, and make a new pointer to fit.


Good Luck,

Ron

I saw JEG's had a cam degreeing wheel by itself. It was alot cheaper than the kit. From what the catalog said it sounded like the wheel would work by itself. Any thoughts on this?

You'll still need a piston stop. You'll also need a dial indicator if you plan on degreeing the cam.

There is a special cam follower available that has a special radius
on the bottom that simulates the action of a roller lifter on a roller cam during cam degreeing. It can be bought from most of the cam companies and special tool companies.
You can also setup your dial indicator on the edge of the body of a hyd lifter to avoid "lifter bleed down" from affecting your measurements.

When degreeing in a cam with hydraulic lifters, bleed down of the tappet isn't really an issue. The only force that is applied to the lifter is from the dial indicator plunger. If you are using a new hydraulic lifter, first make sure it is full of engine oil. Do this by submerging the tappet in engine oil & stroking the plunger with a push rod until it gets difficult to compress the plunger. When setting up the dial indicator, take an old push rod & cut it to the appropriate length & let the indicator ball tip ride on the inside diameter of the push rod tube. Make sure the end of push rod is deburred. The lifter, your cut down pushrod, & the dial indicator stem must all be in straight alignment, not cocked. The dial indicator mounting must be completely rigid. The dial indicator reading should then be repeatable to .001". Degree the cam in using either the max lift point, or as I prefer, the opening point at .050" tappet lift. Keep in mind when zeroing out the indicator on the base circle of the cam, the basecircle will have some runout, ~.0015". To sum it up, unrepeatable indicator readings are usually due to a flexing or crooked setup. Don't even bother to degree in a cam by mounting the indicator to read valve position. The light valve springs provided in the kit are for checking piston to valve clearance, which is a separate operation from degreeing in the cam.

You really do not need a solid lifter. Put the dial indicator on the side wall of the lifter, not where the pushrod would normally be. This will give you a solid spot.

That’s with the heads off...Most of us are not going to remove the heads to do a cam swap...
There just isn't enough room to get the dial indicator straight on top of the lifter with the heads on…

Ron

You can do it correctly with either type lifter, WITH the heads in place.

Using an hydraulic lifter, place your mag base on the intake side of one of the heads. (If you are replacing the cam with the intake still installed, you are an automotive magician.) Set the indicator point on the edge of a lifter body, find TDC and set the degree wheel, then start rotating. (It ain't rocket science, since I can do it.)

On the other side of the coin, a pair of solid lifters is only about ten-fifteen bucks, so you can do it the lazy way if you want, on top of the head.

Unless stock heads are cut a little different. I played with it for a while and could not get the indicator on the lip of the lifter, straight up.
It was on Performer RPM heads 64cc. #1 intake & exhaust.

I settled for the push rod method.

Ron

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