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Getting close to 12's

Old Oct 23, 2002 | 08:23 PM
  #1  
84305HO's Avatar
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
Getting close to 12's

Finished the year OK but slightly shy
of very low 13's goal. Last and best run:
2.084
5.668
8.642 @ 82.26
11.211
13.373 @ 104.07

Above run was against a friends 2001 Corvette and went neck and neck with
him winning by 0.092 secs. Lots of fun !
My question to the forum is what are
the next mods to reduce ET by .38 secs.
I am thinking exhaust cutout and lower
pressure in the DRs since I run them
way too high at 24 psi.
Attached Thumbnails Getting close to 12's-camaro1_comp1.jpg  

Last edited by 84305HO; Oct 23, 2002 at 08:43 PM.
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Old Oct 23, 2002 | 08:31 PM
  #2  
BillZ28's Avatar
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Car: 84 Z28
Nice, what modifications do you have done? I have the exact same car.
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Old Oct 23, 2002 | 09:00 PM
  #3  
Mark A Shields's Avatar
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From: Someone owes me 10,000 posts
Car: 99 Formula
Engine: LS1
Transmission: T56
Axle/Gears: 342
Originally posted by BillZ28
Nice, what modifications do you have done? I have the exact same car.
They're in his sig. I'm hopin after my head swap I'll be near that too.
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Old Oct 23, 2002 | 11:59 PM
  #4  
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From: Ontario, Canada
Car: 1988 Firebird S/E
Engine: 406Ci Vortec SBC
Transmission: TH-350/3500stall
Axle/Gears: 7.5" Auburn 4.10 Posi-Traction
I'd go with a high stall converter. A 3500 stall should do it.
http://www.converter.cc/index.html
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Old Oct 24, 2002 | 01:20 AM
  #5  
rezinn's Avatar
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A higher stall converter would cost a lot of money and actually make him slower--he'd have to get an automatic tranny for that Have you done any porting? A bit quicker 60' would definitely help. You could try some more suspension work and reducing weight.

I thought you were running that time with the 305 for a second Impressive anyway.
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Old Oct 24, 2002 | 03:09 AM
  #6  
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From: Ontario, Canada
Car: 1988 Firebird S/E
Engine: 406Ci Vortec SBC
Transmission: TH-350/3500stall
Axle/Gears: 7.5" Auburn 4.10 Posi-Traction
Originally posted by rezinn
A higher stall converter would cost a lot of money and actually make him slower--he'd have to get an automatic tranny for that .
Guess I bit into that one ,,, eh!

What would he do with that extra petal too....
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Old Oct 24, 2002 | 07:53 AM
  #7  
84305HO's Avatar
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
Definitely considering porting. If I could go back
to when I bought the longblock I would have taken
the SR Torquers off and either ported them or sold
them and replaced with Pro Toplines.
On the drag radials, they are 225/50 15 and are only 23.5 inches tall ! They look terrible but give the correct overall ratio. Car is at 5400 rpm
going through the traps,(perfect). The next size is 235/60 15 would give a larger contact patch but
compromise gear ratio.
The cam (222/222 467/467) could use a lttle help from 1.6 ratio rockers but that would require modifying the the guide passage in the heads. That
would be done if the heads are pulled for porting.
The 1.6 rockers were about the only thing that
didn't transfer from the 305.
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Old Oct 24, 2002 | 09:59 AM
  #8  
Mark A Shields's Avatar
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Car: 99 Formula
Engine: LS1
Transmission: T56
Axle/Gears: 342
Originally posted by F-BIRD'88
Guess I bit into that one ,,, eh!

What would he do with that extra petal too....
I made the same mistake, that's why I edited mine, usually I do that alot, forget to check if they have an auto or not, and I say get a higher stall.
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Old Oct 24, 2002 | 12:28 PM
  #9  
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From: Calgary, Alberta, Republic of Western Canada
Car: 1986 Sport Coupé
Engine: 305-4v
Transmission: 700R4 and TransGo2
I would guess you need more camshaft to dip into the 12s. If you think the World heads are perhaps a bit weak, then maybe a dual pattern cam would help that. And, of course, a roller cam would help even more

Still, I think you've done very well to be in the 13.3s!

Last edited by Sitting Bull; Oct 24, 2002 at 12:30 PM.
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Old Oct 25, 2002 | 09:01 AM
  #10  
84305HO's Avatar
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
Thanks guys, I guess I, and all northern members, have the winter to think about it and collect more ideas from the forum.
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Old Oct 25, 2002 | 05:01 PM
  #11  
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From: Pitman, NJ
Car: '89 IROC-Z
Engine: Canfield 195 headed 358ci
Transmission: TH350, Art Carr 9.5"
Axle/Gears: 3.92 Dana 44
It looks like traction is the big issue to me. 104mph is good for a high 12 second pass. If you can get your 60' out of the 2.xx's I think you'll easily bust a 12.
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Old Oct 26, 2002 | 11:04 AM
  #12  
94-6spd's Avatar
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From: W. Kentucky
Car: 83 Z-28
Engine: 406
Transmission: TH350
Axle/Gears: 3.70
I have two low buck mods that will help your car. First get the cutouts. They reduced my et 4 tenths. My car runs low 12's though. It should give you at least 2 tenths.

Next, get some v-6 rear springs from or AutoZone. The coils are thinner than the 84 Z-28 springs. This will help your 60' time by weight transfer. At Advance Auto they are only about $50.

If that doesn't get you a 12 sec pass remove the front sway bar if you haven't already. I'm confident that these mods will definitely work. I drive my 83 without the sway bar all the time and there isn't a big difference. People will tell you that it's scary and dangerous but if you're not road racing you'll be fine.
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Old Oct 26, 2002 | 12:05 PM
  #13  
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From: Philly, PA
You're close! Like was suggested before- you've got 2 of those 3 tenths on the launch. I can crack a high 2.0 on street tires in my Malibu and that thing doesn't hook worth a crap. With your upgraded LCA's you should be able to pull a low 1.9. If you find that difficult and have checked everything else then try a set of weld-in subframe connectors. They do wonders for the launch on 3rd and 4th gen cars. You wouldn't think they'd do much but they make a noticable difference. My brother's 87 GTA laid down a 1.92 60-foot time on street radials (Firehawk SZ-50s???) with better LCAs and subframe connectors.

Say, that reminds me. Another great traction mod is LCA relocation brackets. They alter the rear suspension geometry slightly so that the tires get shoved toward the ground during a hard launch, instead of the neutral, possibly negative behavior of the stock suspension geometry, which was never really made for dragstrip launches.

BTW- in that burnout picture I can't tell if the diver's side tire is spinning or not. Is that just smoke from the right side making it's way left? I see smoke behind the tire but not coming out of the wheelwell around the tire, like one would expect. You sure of the condition of your old Posi?

Engine stuff..... have you played with the timing, secondary air valve adjustment and other tuning parameters? I've had some success with using a fast-release vacuum canister on the QJet. The one on the pass. side of the carb that slows secondary air valve opening. Stock, they take way too long to open. I've got mine down where it opens fully in about .5 seconds, no bog. Stock they're closer to a full second, maybe more. You can buy one already modified from The Carb Shop 909-481-5816. This helps the secondaries come in a lot sooner and faster in the all-critical first gear when you lay it to the carpet.

Last edited by Damon; Oct 26, 2002 at 12:07 PM.
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Old Oct 26, 2002 | 05:26 PM
  #14  
84305HO's Avatar
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
Wow, thats what I like about this forum,
sharp people! I was wondering if anyone
would pick up the tire smoke only coming from the pass side. The original posi is
tired and the Zexel Torsen is in the basement. I have got most suggestions
covered, no swaybar, relocation brackets, modified vacuum canister. I have really followed Damons Qjet knowledge and the carb runs great. One
exception is CE rods. I guess I will look more closely at sub frames and an exhaust cutout.
Thanks again guys........
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Old May 28, 2003 | 09:41 PM
  #15  
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
Dug out the old post to give an update. I tried my own suggestions from the Fall; lowered the rear tire press to
21 lbs and disconnected the exhaust (instead of cutout).
Also installed Torsen differential and Moser axles. With just
one run because of crowded day:

1.909
5.507
8.479 @ 82.78
11.028
13.174 @ 104.92

Finally got a decent 60 ft, but if you multiple the difference of
last years 60 ft and this year by 1.5 I should of run 13.11. I
think the problem was the density altitude which was running
1000 ft.
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Old May 29, 2003 | 02:51 AM
  #16  
Odyssey's Avatar
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From: under the hood
I'd say dump the ZZ4 intake in favor of an Edelbrock Performer RPM !
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Old May 29, 2003 | 03:32 AM
  #17  
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From: Salem, NH
Car: 1999 Z28
Engine: LS1
Transmission: 4L60E
Axle/Gears: 3.23 10 Bolt
lowered the rear tire press to 21 lbs

Finally got a decent 60 ft, but if you multiple the difference of
last years 60 ft and this year by 1.5 I should of run 13.11. I
think the problem was the density altitude which was running
1000 ft.
the lower tire pressure could affect the ET adversly, the wider contact patch helps out on the launch, but the softer sidewall and more rolling resistance slow u down a tick at the end of track, guess theres a little bit of a trade off.
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Old May 29, 2003 | 12:47 PM
  #18  
84305HO's Avatar
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
SLP -good point, added rolling resistance is a
different factor from previous run.
As for the RPM manifold, every test in magazines
that adds just the RPM manifold, from stock 305s
to built 383s, gains 10-15hp over the performer.
It is so tempting but I dont want to deal with the
hood clearance issues....
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Old May 29, 2003 | 03:30 PM
  #19  
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From: Oklahoma
I cannot believe you where cutting 2.08 60 ft times with 3.73s, one wheel peel, and a manual trans. That is pretty impressive.
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Old May 29, 2003 | 09:24 PM
  #20  
84305HO's Avatar
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
Posi was working, just not real good. When doing a brake
holding burnout (no line lock) only one tire would spin. But as I released the brakes both would spin. With the new Zexel Torsen
both tires were spinning.
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Old May 29, 2003 | 10:16 PM
  #21  
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From: Pittsfield, MA
I'd drop the pressure alittle bit more, it's not gonna hurt to make a pass with the pressures down some more and see how it comes out.

Your traction still kinda stinks, what are you using for radials?
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Old May 30, 2003 | 07:47 AM
  #22  
84305HO's Avatar
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From: Hopewell Jct., N.Y.
Car: 84 Z28 Camaro
Engine: 350ci
Transmission: T-5
BFG drag radials. My concern with these tires is
just the size 225/50-15, so they are only 23.5
inches tall. They look terrible but give the correct overall gearing, crossing the line at about 5400 rpm. The next size up 235/60-15 would have the car out of the power band in 4th gear.(would need 4:10 gears).
Dan - I see you live in Pittsfield so you must be
familiar with Lebanon Dragway - nice track IMHO.

Last edited by 84305HO; May 30, 2003 at 07:58 AM.
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Old May 30, 2003 | 05:11 PM
  #23  
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I would deffinatly change the cam to a spilt cam, maybe the crane 222/230 to help out the exhaust side. Also I take it those TES headers are shorties, what about change to lt?
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