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82 pace car, very rough idle/stall/no power/bogs on rev

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Old Mar 1, 2004 | 09:33 PM
  #1  
bobdole369's Avatar
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From: South Florida (NW_Broward)
Car: 1989 Firebird
Engine: 2.8L V6 MPFI
Transmission: Beat to heck 700R4
82 pace car, very rough idle/stall/no power/bogs on rev

This car has sat for quite a while (more than a year). Before it sat, it had a pinhole in the radiator (fixed), and managed to strip the gears on the timing chain (fixed). I just put new plugs, replaced dist cap/rotor/coil/pickup coil/ign module. And of course while doing the plugs and the cap, I managed to get 8, 6, and 3 all mixed up somehow, and a few days of no-start, and replacing batteries, and a starter (warrantied luckily ) I figured that out hi hi..

Currently the car starts right up, but doesn't want to rev above around 3000, (pops, backfires in the exhaust, and bogs down.)
Timing seems OK, get a nice bright blue-white spark on number 2 but there seemed to be more carbon fouling than usual for a spark plug thats only run for 10 minutes or so. The car will idle, but it seems like it really wants to stall all the time. Poor throttle response, it takes a few seconds to "catch up" after I press the throttle. Any insight? I'm going to pull the plugs one by one and replace if fouled.


NOTE: At one point this car caught fire after somebody plugged a hole with "QuikSteel" "that didn't look like it should be there" on the large pipe that come up from around the exhaust manifold (I'm thinking it had something to do with the emissions.) The owner drove right after and the quiksteel ignited, all the oil and gunk around the exhaust and plugs and the TB's caught and well......... fire dept..... etc.

The owner took it to a shop that got it running again but it hasn't been the same since.
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Old Mar 1, 2004 | 09:41 PM
  #2  
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From: San Lorenzo, California
Car: 1987 Firebird Trans AM
Engine: 383 TPI...very soon
Transmission: TH700R4
I'd say double and triple check your plug wires, make sure they are in the right order and all correctly seated down.

Check around for vaccum leaks, make sure all vaccum lines are not cracked and indeed hooked up.

When you had timing chain issues, are you sure that none of the valves were bent/broken? Could a rocker arm stud have busted off?
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Old Mar 1, 2004 | 09:57 PM
  #3  
bobdole369's Avatar
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From: South Florida (NW_Broward)
Car: 1989 Firebird
Engine: 2.8L V6 MPFI
Transmission: Beat to heck 700R4
When you had timing chain issues, are you sure that none of the valves were bent/broken? Could a rocker arm stud have busted off?
Quite possible. The car just wouldn't start while out at the mall, and had it towed home. I tried starting it for quite a long time before I got some good tips here that pointed to it. When I replaced it about 1/2 of the teeth on the gears were stripped off.

As for vacuum lines, I replaced the vacuum line to the EGR solenoid, but the EGR solenoid looks like its literally going to fall to pieces. Just touching it is risky. I don't think it works at all, the top half of it is just sitting there. (looking for a part now...) I also put the line from the primary TB to the air cleaner/cold start diverter, even tho I believe that whole system is rusted shut. Better to plug these lines to preserve vacuum for now? I do plan to get the solenoid. I know EGR would make it idle funny.
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Old Mar 2, 2004 | 12:33 AM
  #4  
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From: GO PACK GO
Car: 83Z28 HO
Engine: Magnacharged Dart Little M 408
Transmission: G Force 5 speed
Axle/Gears: Moser 9" w/Detroit Trutrac
Better to plug these lines to preserve vacuum for now?
I'd agree with that. I'd guess your EGR is non-functional by what you're saying anyway. I'd unplug the wire connector too and tape it up just to get those out of the picture. Maybe even block off the EGR, in case it's stuck open. Never caused a Check Engine light on my car.

Triple check the firing order if you hav'nt already....

Did you put a stock timing chain on, or aftermarket?? Check your cap and rotor too for any arcing....

Last edited by Confuzed1; Mar 2, 2004 at 12:36 AM.
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Old May 22, 2004 | 03:50 PM
  #5  
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From: South Florida (NW_Broward)
Car: 1989 Firebird
Engine: 2.8L V6 MPFI
Transmission: Beat to heck 700R4
Plugs fouled

Several plugs fouled beyond recognition

I replaced them all, and checked every plug for spark. Same good blue white bright spark on all 8. However, same results, I had a few other problems (alternator adjust bolt stripped fixed with a straight thru bolt, washer, and nut on the other side.)
I rechecked all the plugs and found severe fouling and no spark on several, (but if I put a good one in, it sparks right up) . I'm guessing compression test is next right? Looking like a head job and maybe tear it down all the way to replace all the rings if its not the valves doing it.
Seems like 3 cylinders it fires on, but doesn't ignite, then it gets fouled till theres no spark.
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Old May 22, 2004 | 08:33 PM
  #6  
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From: Southwest Chicago 'burbs
When waas the last time you did a complete tuneup? Cap, rotor, wires, plugs?

Did it ever run right after you did the timing chain? Valve timing could be off.

Are the plugs oil fouled, or fuel fouled?

If you pull the vacuum line going to the pressure regulator, does any fuel come out or it? If the diaphram is ruptured, it will leak fuel right into the manifold.
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Old May 23, 2004 | 12:56 AM
  #7  
bobdole369's Avatar
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From: South Florida (NW_Broward)
Car: 1989 Firebird
Engine: 2.8L V6 MPFI
Transmission: Beat to heck 700R4
Complete tune up was done right around the same time the timing chain was done. (didn't time it tho)

Car ran OK before it sat for a year. After that is around the time the timing chain went, and it ran well enough to drive (but still not well enough as it did before.)

Plugs are fuel and carbon fouled.

There is also an exhaust manifold leak on the driver side. Smoke comes from there and comes out the hood as well as the tailpipe, (mostly black from the tailpipe, whitish blue from the hood)

I'll check the vacuum line in a bit
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Old Aug 15, 2004 | 12:55 PM
  #8  
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From: South Florida (NW_Broward)
Car: 1989 Firebird
Engine: 2.8L V6 MPFI
Transmission: Beat to heck 700R4
Been a while :'/

Ran like absolute crap after replacing the plugs. Ran so bad that it won't go anywhere in gear, it just stalls...

Unfortunately now it got to sit for another few months.

I discovered 3 plug wires which were mixed up, and now I can get it to start everytime, but I have to lay on the gas. Unfortunately now those plugs are fouled and not working again... Oh the joy of taking them out again
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Old Aug 19, 2004 | 01:58 AM
  #9  
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From: Topeka, Kansas
Car: 82 Camaro
Engine: 305
Transmission: TH-350
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Is it carbureted or Tbi/Tpi? And does it have an O2 sensor? If it does, the O2 sensor would try to compensate for the exhaust leak, and run it real rich, fouling the plugs, and in turn fouling itself pretty quick
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Old Aug 19, 2004 | 06:12 PM
  #10  
bobdole369's Avatar
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From: South Florida (NW_Broward)
Car: 1989 Firebird
Engine: 2.8L V6 MPFI
Transmission: Beat to heck 700R4
CFI

Well, it's Crossfire, so I'm not positive which one that falls into, and yes, it does have an O2 sensor, and <smacks forehead> for not thinking of that.... LOL
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Old Aug 20, 2004 | 02:20 AM
  #11  
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From: Topeka, Kansas
Car: 82 Camaro
Engine: 305
Transmission: TH-350
Axle/Gears: 3.08
just make sure you disconnect the ECM for 30 seconds to clear out any trouble codes that may linger around
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