Someone broke into my '89 Camaro and cracked the steering column, and also a little metal rod that goes into the steering column. The key now turns freely, with no spring action. I've taken the steering wheel off, but I can't take the rest of the steering column off. Neither the radio or the power windows work either. Lights are OK. Has anyone had to change out the steering and knows how to take this thing apart?

I've taken the 2.8 and put in a 355 small block with Vortec heads, Holley carb, Edelbrock intake, Comp 280H cam, backed with TCI TH-350. It sounds awesome, I don't blame them for wanting it, but that's pretty pathetic. I don't drive it much so I thought about going with a switch panel for ignition, starter, etc. (Moroso has some) and just forget about the key, except for locking the steering wheel.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. If anyone needs any help on swapping a small block with a carb into a third gen with a 3 speed, I can help.

 

dont think i can help you on that, as i havent done it before, but wanted to say i know how bad it sucks having your car broken into. when i was a sophmore in high school, someone broke in my honda and stole my 12" sub and my amp(about 500bucks in all). now i laugh at it, and am sort of glad, because im sure it was horrible on my ears. anyways, enough about me, so yea, sorry to hear ur car got messed up so much by such a sorry person

------------------

• 83 Z28--ttops, 200k miles--very ragged out. sold, thank goodness
• 74 Z28--slightly modded 383, TH400 tranny, not too quick but fun to drive

 

Thats exactly what happen to mine.. The person made a mess of mine. Lucky for me my insurance covered most of the repairs and it only cost me 100 bucks. Fixed it all up with brand new parts from the dealer, and they did all the work.. Sorry I can't help you with the repair. one thing I give the person credit for, it at least got into the car with out making a big mess of my black paint.

------------------
89 RS Camaro, LO3 305 TBI
L69 Duel Snorkel Intake
Dynomax Ultra Flo Cat Back

 

Do you have the VATS passkey security system?
If not, buy a new ignition switch as your first step. They aren't too hard to replace.
If you do have a VATS equipped car, I'm pretty sure you'll need to go to a dealer to get a new ignition switch put on.
You should also ask the all-knowing GMTech. He'll know what to do!

 

Daupf,

Here is a cutaway showing what you should expect to find:



And a couple of pages that might help out, too:

Steering Page 1.pdf

Steering Page 2.pdf

------------------
Later,
Vader
------------------
"I'm'a do Things My Way - It's My way or the Highway."
Adobe Acrobat Reader

[This message has been edited by Vader (edited March 27, 2001).]

 

Most likely You busted the linkage Rod that Connects the Ignition switch to the actualy Ignition "switch" further down the Colum.


find yourself the Pin puller ( or get creative with a 8/32 machine screw, a matching nut and some washers, and an appropriatly sized Socket )

Then bust off the lock plate with a scredriver and some muscles

And Tear into it, Remember where **** goes there is alot in there hahah...


Once you get in, You will see whats wrong.

You may be better off getting a Junkyard colum and using that, and just switch your lock cylinders, you wont have to fiddle with the whole damn thing as much.




------------------
60 Ranchero - Project ( Money Hole )
85 Sport Coupe LG4 - Daily Driver

Just another Hot Rod kid, or thats what they all tell me.
Livin' the Stereotype

 

Yep, I do have the passkey system. That's the first year it was in Camaro's. I think the only thing that's actually broken is the metal rod that goes to the ignition. Also, the shift lock doesn't work. You can shift it without having the key.

I actually got the car to start so I could move it though. I just ran wires from the battery to the ignition and fuel pump. Then jumped the solenoid and starter with a screwdriver. It started and I was able to move it before the battery died (No Alternator excite). There is no computer.

Thanks for all the help guys. BTW, How do I get in touch with the GM Tech?

Aaron

 

Also, after looking at the exploded column, #63 is in pieces. Looking from the outside, that appears to be it. What controls the power windows and radio power?

 

This switch assembly (#64) or ignition switch is operated by the ignition cylinder. It provides power to the power windows and accessories (radio, etc.). Because the rod to operate this switch is broken, it is not able to work this switch to power your windows and radio.

Your lights work because they are powered directly from the battery, not through the ignition switch.

 

its easy as pie. go to the junk yard and pick up a column that is similier to yours, with assesories matching, like cruise, tilt, etc, you dont need the wheel. just drop your old column, unplug the harness, unbolt the shaft from the steering linkage, swap everything to your new column like the ignition switch and slap back in. when sliding the steering shaft into the steering linkage, dont worry, it only goes in one way, it might be real snug, but work with it, and you will get it. also, dont forget about swapping your ignition cylinders, (especially if you have vats) (you have to keep the same resistance-senser matched with the security system)

------------------
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http://www.formula350.com

or click below to email me
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my steering column is also been broken into, I'm trying to work on it right now.

Except, my dimmer switch rod is not attached to anything and i need to know how it works.

My winshield wiper switch doesn't work and i can't turn on my high beams.


Anybody can help me? I really could use it.

------------------
'86 Camaro
2.8 MPFI

 

It's not hard at all to remove the whole column, and once you do that you can decide what to replace.

First thing, Look under the hood and remove the bolt that you'll see holding the steering shaft to the box - it's the toughest part of the whole swap - the first time I had to get under the car to reach it but I put it back in the other way so it's easier now . Next, drop the panel under your dash (7mm screws) and also the smaller panel under the column itself. Pull back the carpet near where the column goes through the firewall, and remove the three bolts (10mm i think) that hold the toe portion to the body. Disconnect all the wiring harnesses you see, then remove the two 13mm bolts holding the column up to the dash - it will now drop down. You can pull it out and work on it out of the car.

You can figure out how to fit the ignition/dimmer switch assembly back on right - just fiddle with it, I think the dimmer bolts on first but I'm not sure. I do know how to adjust it - loosen the bolts and slide it closer to the wheel side of the column, then retighten. Although I guess you could have a problem of it being to close to that side, but that's unlikely. Like Bort said, without the special tool you'll need a biga$$ c-clamp and/or some muscles to take out the internals which I wouldn't recommend.

Depending on the year of you car, columns are EXPENSIVE. Will Passkey you need the same year column to replace with and there's some other specs too like trans that have to match up. I'm not sure if you can swap plastic shields without going into the column itself, but if you can, that's the way to go.

Oh yeah, and installation is the reverse of removal

[This message has been edited by I ROCK (edited March 28, 2001).]

 

Hmmm, how about that? For all the people who never wanted to fix there system because they were to lazy, or would rather spend the money else where, here is a good example of why you SHOULDN'T bypass the system. Had he bypassed it, he wouldn't be posting how to fix it because it would be GONE. Looks like I was right after all....


------------------
If you live in Southeastern US, check us out!
South East Thirdgen

GM Master Tech
ASE Master Tech + L1
Savannah, GA

'87 Trans Am
S/D TPI retrofit including functional PassKey,
22# injectors,
Whatever chip I feel like burning,
JET AFPR, Ported Plenum,
TB Coolant Bypass, Custom Cold Air,
SSM SFC, KYB Shocks, Boxed LCAs, Wonder Bar,
8mm Accel wires,
Flowmaster Exhaust,
16" GTA rims,
Corvette Servo,
-->14.97 @ 94.9 MPH<--

'97 Bonneville SSE

 

What do you mean VATS...... He has a carb car that used to have vats....

You can use either a vats or a regular column because you don't use it anyway.

 

It's entirely possible that the starter kill part of the VATS system is still working.



------------------
"Beware he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master"

'84 Black Camaro ZZ4 M5 (V-6 in a former life) -- street beast
'91 Medium Blue Metallic Z28 A4 (UB-HSTRY's old ride) -- currently broken
'99 Navy Blue Metallic Firehawk #120 M6 (99.44% stock) -- daily driver

 

Some **** tried stealing my wheels a few weeks ago. Luckily for me, the idiot didn't know how to drive a stick. Anyway... Call around the local bone yards and dealerships, and you'll find a guy that can rebuild columns. It's not exactly a common practice. I live in Cleveland, and had to drive to Toledo, Ohio to have mine done. He did the work on the spot in about fifty minutes, and only charged me 85 bucks. Nothing works right until you get this fixed! My key cylinder was fine, but even if it isn't, have them shove the vats under the dash and have a kill switch hidden in the car. As soon as the weather clears up, I'm tearing the VATS out of mine. What ever you do, DO NOT TEAR THE WHEEL APART yourself. As soon as you dig past a certain point, plastic pieces and springs come out like something out of the cartoons. Have this fixed. It's cheap, and not fun to do...save your talents for louder, faster things. Email me if you have any questions. During this time, your car us vulnerable to somebody else ripping it off. I popped a fuse and used the blown one where my ecm fuse was... figured this would be hard to trace, as well as disconnecting my injectors. Good luck! Heath

 

The start kill feature of vats only shuts off the fuel injectors via the computer.

Sometimes you can get a complete column out of the junkyard WITH the keys. That will save ALOT of work. (and finally explain a good point of gm having seperate keys for the doors and ignition!)

 

>>>The start kill feature of vats only shuts off the fuel injectors via the computer.<<<

VATS does 2 things. kills the injectors via ECM, and kills the starter.

Last week VATS cost me a tow truck, but I'm definately replacing the lock cylinder on the first warm day. For the mean time, it is bypassed

 

Yes, VATS does two things. First, it kills the starter. That alone is usually theft deterent enough, since many crooks are not very bright, but for those who are, VATS will also "turn off" the fuel injectors.

Even though he has a carburator, the start kill can still be funtional. VATS operates off of an entirely different module, and w/ a carb, is acting as a "stand alone" system. Research the topic a little better before you critique someone's post.

Once the column is torn apart, there is usually more damage inside. Not to scare you away from trying to fix this yourself, but it can be overwhelming trying to put this back together since some if it is already busted apart. It doesn't sound like they broke a whole lot though, I have seen worse.

If you do put another column in and it does not have VATS, you will need to "jumper" or somehow bypass the start inhibit relay behind the drives kick panel. It seems as though it saved you though, so I would definatly keep it.

------------------
If you live in Southeastern US, check us out!
South East Thirdgen

GM Master Tech
ASE Master Tech + L1
Savannah, GA

'87 Trans Am
S/D TPI retrofit including functional PassKey,
22# injectors,
Whatever chip I feel like burning,
JET AFPR, Ported Plenum,
TB Coolant Bypass, Custom Cold Air,
SSM SFC, KYB Shocks, Boxed LCAs, Wonder Bar,
8mm Accel wires,
Flowmaster Exhaust,
16" GTA rims,
Corvette Servo,
--&gt;14.97 @ 94.9 MPH&lt;--

'97 Bonneville SSE

 

That was the all-knowing GMTech I was telling you about. I'd listen to him before anyone else.

 

Someone tried to steal my buddies ford probe the other day. He got up and went into the parking lot, and the lock was pulled right out of the drivers side door. He found the lock a few days later in the lot. After examining it I could tell that someone used a slide hammer to pull it out. I put it back in for him (the retainer clip was lying in the bottom of the door), and I had to re-fabricate the area around the lock with fiberglass. We figure someone must have scared the person away because nothing was stolen from inside the car... they were obviously going for the whole car. I guess they came to their senses and decided to go steal a good car. They would have been doing him a favour by stealing the probe... then he could get a thirdgen.

 

Quote:

Research the topic a little better before you critique someone's post.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Soooooo... I guess you never f(ck up?



[This message has been edited by JoelOl75 (edited March 30, 2001).]

 

Now Joel, that wasn't very nice.

Has GMTech ever F'up? Maybe when the moon turns green. And probably not that often either.

He's not a GM MASTER Tech for nothing.

But for those that have been on this board for any length of time, Bernard (GMTech) needs no introduction. If I had a question about my car (again, maybe once everytime the moon turns green), Bernard would the FIRST person I would think of to ask.

 

Joel, the issue isn't f ucking up, the issue is posting information that is wrong, acting like you are right, when you actually are just guessing or misinformed. If you're going to post something you are not sure of then make that clear, like phrase it as a question..."how did VATs save him if VATS only shuts off the injectors?" To which someone could have told you about the starter relay kill as well. Instead you came in like a know it all, and had to be corrected. Corrections aren't meant as a personal attack, so don't take it as one. It's meant to stop anyone else from reading your incorrect info and believeing it. Thats the only way anyone can learn, including yourself.
...ed

------------------
Ed Maher - Moderator @ The Carb Board
92 Z28 Convertible - Quasar blue / Tan top
LB9 4L60 GU2 G80 - stock, soon to be sleeper
-=ICON Motorsports=-

- Definitely prototypes, high powered mutants of some kind. Too weird to live, too cool to die

 

Good points Ed. Also, there are so many "things" that sometimes we ALL forget about some other part. I find this especially true with PROM burning where there is sometimes a "new part of the code" that no one even knew about, or you just forget about another parameter. Not all of us are "walking encyclopedias/shop manuals".

Joel, probably a response like "thanks for the info about the starter..or.. I forgot about the starter" would have been more appropriate reply to Bernard.

Yes, even the "experts" (which I do not consider myself to be) sometimes forget about something or discover something they never knew. But they thank the person for setting them straight, they don't criticize them. None of it is intended to be a "flame". It's kind of an "board etiquette".

 

Somebody broke into my car too! Stupid bastards. They busted up all the plastic on the left side of the steering column on my 92 RS. Now it says I have on my brights whenever I turn on my regular lights, and my windshield washer fluid doesn't squirt out anymore. And my starter thing turns without a key. Luckily I have those keys with the sensors on them which prevented the guy from taking the car. I haven't tested the cruise control but that's not too big a deal. Does anyone know how much this would cost to fix? And do I just go to a chevy dealer and ask if they can fix it?

 

I used to be a GM tech 13 years ago. I'd bring it to a Chevy dealer. Even if you know how to, you still need a wheel puller, and a "plate pusher". Otherwise that column is not coming apart.

 

been there done that. someone DID steal my camaro, same method as mentioned above. only reason i have it today is because when i parked the car i left the high beams on. when they busted the column open the rod for the high beam switch broke off causing the high beams to stay on. the car was found abandoned on the side of the expressway halfway to detroit. getting to the point now, $50.00 junkyard column and 2 hours labor to install it. i personally wouldnt attempt fixing a column, its probably cheaper and easier to replace it.

 

You don't need a lock plate remover if you're creative, I've removed my lockplate twice alone with a small screwdriver and a bit of creativity. Basically you tilt the plate one way and bend the side up then pull it with pliers, you WILL destroy the snap ring, but you're supposed to replace that anyhow. Columns are hard to do, but it depends on your type of skill. They aren't all the complicated, just a lot of parts, they are straight foward for the most part. I'd pick up a donor column if I were you, chances are they broke a non-servicable part.

I don't see the point of bypassing VATS, that ranks up there with leaving your doors unlocked. Carbed cars are at a disadvantage sadly, there are plenty of ways to jump a starter and they could hotwire the coil (still would need to break the ignition otherwise they wouldn't be able to steer). I've started on a small project of a self-contained VATS style system. Basically, a chip looks for the correct resitance (mounted inside the cap as to be near invisible) inorder to supply power to the ignition module. I'm having trouble getting it down to size though to fit into it's intended spot.

------------------
1984 WS6 Hardtop Trans Am
Former L69 Car under restoration
1984 T-top Trans Am
4-bolt main 350, performer intake, headers, Holley 650, T-5, hayes clutch, dual elec. fans and 3.23's.
Daily driver and restoration
13.98 @ 101

 

JoelOl75, let me personally apologize, I didn't mean to put you on the spot. Nobody is perfect, but sometimes I think that half of the problems people post about, are do to mis-information. For example, I remember a post when to board was the "old style" message board, somebody posted "Help! My buddy told me that if I pull my drums off and hit the brakes, I could see if the rear brakes are working, well I did that, and the wheel cylinder pistons shot across the driveway, am I screwed?"

Had his buddy shut the hell up since he didn't have a clue, this guy wouldn't have had this problem. This may seem like an extreme case, but it happens, and it doesn't have to.

Sorry if I pissed you off or embarassed you, just trying to keep facts just that, facts. Later.

------------------
If you live in Southeastern US, check us out!
South East Thirdgen

GM Master Tech
ASE Master Tech + L1
Savannah, GA

'87 Trans Am
S/D TPI retrofit including functional PassKey,
22# injectors,
Whatever chip I feel like burning,
JET AFPR, Ported Plenum,
TB Coolant Bypass, Custom Cold Air,
SSM SFC, KYB Shocks, Boxed LCAs, Wonder Bar,
8mm Accel wires,
Flowmaster Exhaust,
16" GTA rims,
Corvette Servo,
--&gt;14.97 @ 94.9 MPH&lt;--

'97 Bonneville SSE

 

No prob, sorry for sounding sore... I'm a little miffed at mis-information I recieved here also so I just paid myself back!


O.K. I mis-stated forgetting all about the started disable relay. Now if he actually listed to my advise (wrong as it may be) how much money would it cost to fix the problem. Free.... A piece of wire.

(Now someone will post saying it will cost alot when someone actually steals his car next time because he disabled vats completly, but never getting stranded because of vats screwing up could be mentioned as priceless)

So I admit to being 50% wrong 1% of the time so i'll shut-up while i'm ahead.


[This message has been edited by JoelOl75 (edited March 31, 2001).]

 

Sounds like eveyone here talking about near miss stolen cars is pretty lucky. If you do not have an VATS system of any kind (I mean like aftermarkert alarm/kill/tracking systems) you should get one. I was talking with a friend of mine who is in the insurance bus. He said that the F-bodies w/o the VATS are extremely easy to steal. The lock pin can be exposed and smashed to unlock the wheel, and the starter rod can be smashed and manually engaged w/o the key. then the crook drives to his chop shop, rips the car apart in a day or 2, sells the parts w/i a few days, and there isn't much to recover. The good news is that our cars do not rank nearly as high on the most commonly stolen car list as say a camry does Still, it would be a good idea to get a good, not necessarily touchy/annoying/dumb Anti-Theft system.

 

Ohhh no it sounds like an ebay story!!

Yeah, I guess I have it pretty lucky living in a small town, but I had my share of mis-haps. My first car had the window smashed (drivers) to get some stereo stuff I left on the seat (I'm not too smart, but hey, I was 17 {well i knew better, but was in a hurry}). It was a 80 toyota, so it really didn't miff me too bad because I had an aftermarket alarm and it freaked them out... a window was $5 from the yard.

I got rid of that pos (even though i miss it in some sick perverted way {never stranded me}) but my next car (camaro. still own) had the rear window smashed and my stereo stuff (amp, x-over.....blah blah not intrested anymore stolen, but miss all 250 CD's)

I was 10 feet from the damn car and never heard a thing because I haven't even hooked up the alarm yet! Thats what you get blasting a stereo with the windows rolled down. Free advertisement to 'steal my stereo now'

I'm into the 3rd gens now, and have to have them looking tip-top (x-cept winter).

I don't believe in wasting money. So I made my own simple alarm (not going into details... It's somewhat original, but got the base idea here)

Ummmm... If I was in a city (a real city) I probably would drive a pos just so everyone would leave it alone and have to deal with it, so i feel somewhat fortunate....
Usually the person who does this kinda stuff knows you (so called friend).


I haven't had a prob in the last 6 years though, random 3rd gen violence isn't as random as you'd think!)

 

Thanks for all the helpful info. I think the VATS is still working on the starter. I did completely pull the computer out, but as stated before, it is a completely different system.

I'm going to call a couple of junk yards, see about a whole column. If I can't find one, I know a couple of mechanics that could tear it apart. If worst comes to worst, I'll take it to my local Chevy dealer. OUCH

You're right, I'd much rather spend my time pulling the rear end, which is next. I don't like little springs, I like big motors.

BTW, How does one go about becoming a GM Tech? Is it a job title or a certification?

 

Heh, thats pretty humorous! You can become a "tech" at a GM dealer, or even a "lube tech", and still call yourself a "GM Tech". How far you take it is up to you.

I wasn't satisfied untill I got my ASE Master tech, but then that wasn't good enough for me, so I got my advanced level ASE (L1). Then that wasn't good enough, so I pursued my GM Master Tech, and now that I have that, I don't know what I will do.

Your first step is to get your foot in the door, even if it means being a "lube tech". Then learn as much as you can, take as much training as they will give you, etc...

The more you know and can do, the more "weight" you can throw around when it comes time for raises, or competing for another tech job. I could get a good paying job at ANY dealership in Savannah that I wanted to, but when a dealer knows they have somebody good, they take care of them!

------------------
If you live in Southeastern US, check us out!
South East Thirdgen

GM Master Tech
ASE Master Tech + L1
Savannah, GA

'87 Trans Am
S/D TPI retrofit including functional PassKey,
22# injectors,
Whatever chip I feel like burning,
JET AFPR, Ported Plenum,
TB Coolant Bypass, Custom Cold Air,
SSM SFC, KYB Shocks, Boxed LCAs, Wonder Bar,
8mm Accel wires,
Flowmaster Exhaust,
16" GTA rims,
Corvette Servo,
--&gt;14.97 @ 94.9 MPH&lt;--

'97 Bonneville SSE