Wanted to ask what you guys think about these plugs. I'm not too good at reading plugs, but want to ask for some opinions before I say what I am thinking. Don't want to influence anyone. Here is number 2, 4, and 6.

 

Closeup of numbers 2 and 4.

 

And here is 7, 5, 3, and 1. There is a bit of oil on #7 on the threads, which I am assuming was from when I was setting valve lash. There was quite a mess of oil. After that, I had pulled the plugs, and reinstalled them. I'm assuming thats why there is oil on the threads.

 

Didn't work the first time. Heres the closeup of # 2 and # 4.

 

look at the brown pattern on the plugs porcelin.
They are side fireing. shorten the length of the ground electrode a little. its a little too long. then regap at .035"

 

make sure the oil is not from blowby.

 

I'll go ahead and do that. Right now they are gapped at .045.
Don't they they look excessively clean to you guys? Maybe I'm just accustomed to pulling out fouled plugs that were running on a pig rich engine ( the old L03).

What exactly causes side firing? Never seen that before, but I would assume the spark was jumping across the shortest distance. Could weak spark aggravate this?

As far as the oily one, I'll clean it up and run it for a while, then recheck it. The engine has roughly 300 miles on it, and I was sort of expecting it to eat some oil at this point. All the plugs I've seen before where there was poor oil control had really oily electrodes, and didn't have anything on the threads.

As it was getting dark, I was trying to fix another problem the car has when I noticed that there was some smoke coming out of the exhaust. I immediately turned it off, and when inside to grab a flashlight. Came back out, turned it on momentarily, and the smoke seemed white. Didn't smell like oil, and like an idiot I stuck my face in it to try to smell if it was coolant. Well, I felt kind of funny for a few moments, and very lightheaded. Couldn't smell anything though.

I pulled the dipstick to check the oil level, and the dipstick is dry. I almost had a heart attack, thinking I ran it low on oil 300 miles after building it. Oil pressure has been at 60 psi when cold, and 30 psi hot at idle ( I have an M55 with a high pressure spring). Anyway, I can't find any oil leaks whatsever, and the plugs don't really look they are burning oil. I'm going to drain it out tomorrow, examine the oil, and see how many quarts are in there. I'll do an early oil change.

Anyways, I don't know what to expect, but something was definitely wrong with it.

 

Side firing? Hell we used to do that on purpose by cutting the damn electrode clean off. The electrodes are fine, cut backs are when you want to do to increase the face of the spark into the chamber, broadening, allegedly, the flame front, which is not a bad thing at all. Neither is indexing spark plugs, it's just a PITA.


Those plugs look like they are glazed. Toss 'em and install a fresh set. The insulators are now conductive and some of that color on the sides is melted deposits and probably some arcing. You are lucky you haven't had a lot of misfire from that yet.

If it happens again with the new set, try a colder set.

 

Ok, lifted the car up today, and checked for oil leaks. I noticed the front seal was damp, ran my finger through it, and it looked like coolant(I'm using dexcool which is red, so its not as obvious as the green stuff). Drained the oil just to see what it looked like, and it was fine. No water in the oil. However, I only drained 2 quarts ( I never took the filter off, so I figure there was another quart in there). Where did the rest go?

well, my first thought is that its burning oil. But the plugs sure don't look like it. Anyways, I filled her up with fresh oil, and I'm gonna keep an eye on it daily.

The white smoke is still there. It starts immediately after I fire the car up, and doesn't go away. Its not oil, I have smelled it before, and rememeber it. It is odorless as well. I am assuming coolant.

The radiator is full. Nothing missing from there. However, the reservoir tank is an inch and a half lower than it was when I filled it a week ago.

The car is performing very very poorly. I double checked the timing today, its at 6 degrees base. My old L03 was as fast as this engine is now.

Is it possible that the plugs are that color not because of glazing but because they are being steam cleaned? I don't see how a bad head gasket, bad manifold gasket, cracked block, cracked head, or anything for that matter can cause all 8 plugs to burn coolant, without there being water in the oil.

Why???? WHY Does this crap only happen to me?!?!?!

I want to borrow a compression tester to check compression to check for a bad head gasket. I'm already expecting it to be a fruitless effort, because a bad head gasket can affect at most 2 cylnders (from my understanding), not all 8.

 

I spun a bearing two weeks ago and have been carless since. Don't feel bad, at least yours runs.

 

5 months for spun bearings here

 

You'd notice if there was coolant in your oil, level wouold be higher as well as the chocolate milk color, oil on your plugs looks to black to indicate coolant getting into your oil.

Temp range on the plugs is dead on, notice on the electrode the black line, or better yet, where the black line stops. It's right in the elbow of the electrode where you want it, so stay with the same heat range.

Drop gap back down to .035 and leave it.

Hard to say exactly since the plugs are oily, it takes a clean plug to really tell what your mixture is indicating. Not only that how are you wanting it mixed, for WOT or part throttle cruising? If you want it for WOT you must go out and give her heck, and while at the top of the gear, shut 'er down and coast to a stop and pull a plug, otherwise the reading will be affected by the part throttle time getting back to the pits, house, etc...if you want it for part throttle crusing, just check it after coming home much like itappears you have here. Either way, the plugs indicate you could use some more fuel in the mix.

Throw in a new set and get some readings with a fresh set of plugs and see how you come out. I've never ran the cut back electrodes until this year because my set-up needs them, so just run a fresh set and see how they come out before making the change to the race type plugs.

 

Well, I just got the car to where I can use it two weeks ago. I've had it in pieces since August. Rebuilt a 350 I picked up, spent a month getting it to run, fixing hard to trace problems, only to have a taper in one cylinder that caused one piston to rock in its bore. It would seize as it got hot, and the starter wouldn't turn the engine over. I spent quite a while looking for a charging/starting problem that didn't exist.

I ended up pulling it back out, getting it machined, and assembling it again.

 

Right now, I am trying to focus not on tuning, but on figuring out where the 2 quarts of oil dissppeared to, and why the car won't stop blowing out white smoke. Its odorless.

It hasn't done this during its first 300 miles.

 

It might not have an odor, but the color smoke is the same principles as if it were coming out of your tailpipes.

white : coolant/water
white w/ bluish tint : oil
black : pig rich

Hopefully your block isnt fubar'd and has a crack in it from the machine shop boring too close to a water jacket.

If anything I bet you have a small oil leak coming from your valve covers, dripping down to your headers, and the heat from the headers are burning it off.

 

You ARE burning oil and your plugs show it. It's coing in through the intake valve with the A/F mix (valve guide seals or other intake side leak). Not a lot, but some.

Doubt me? OK. Put a mark on the outside of those plug's porcelain with a sharpie that is in the same location as the dark patch on the center electrode. Put them all back in the EXACT SAME plug hole they came out of and tighten normally.

EVERY SINGLE MARK YOU MADE ON THE PLUGS WILL POINT DIRECTLY AT THE INTAKE VALVE FOR THAT CYLINDER.

Trust me. Been there, done that.

 

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I spun a bearing two weeks ago and have been carless since. Don't feel bad, at least yours runs.
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5 months for spun bearings here
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Two Weeks for me!

 

The smoke isn't from the engine bay, its from the tailpipes. It is white, I can't see any traces of blue. The block was only bored .030 over, so I really don't see them hitting a water jacket.

Damon, I am going to go outside and do that test and see where the mark points. I have a question though, supposing the valve seals were bad, shouldn't it only smoke on startup? By the way, when the motor was assembled, the heads were apart, and I replaced the valve seals. I am using the o rings on the valve as well as the seals on the valve guide boss whose name I can't remember right now (intake has a rubber one with a metal clamp-type thing, exhaust has a hard plastic one). These were the seals that came in the Fel Pro gasket kit.

Also, what do you mean by "other intake side leak"?

This thing was 2 quarts low in 300 miles. Thats all the engine has been driven since it was fired up after assembly. I know that there is supposed to be a little poor oil control initially with the rings, but 2 quarts is just too much.

I'm having a hard time picturing valve seals causing two quarts to dissappear, but maybe it accounts for some of it. I'll get back with the sharpie test results.

 

Damon, all the spark plugs have the mark pointing upwards towards the intake valve.

I've driven the car a couple of times today around the neighborhood to see if the smoking ever goes away, and if it does, under what conditions.

Drove for about 15 minutes, and parked it. It wasn't smoking. I shut it off, and turn it back on right away, and it smoked very lightly for 2 or 3 seconds, then stopped again.

I noticed the grommet on the pcv valve was oily, and pulled the valve out. The engine was around 200 degrees, and there was white smoke coming out of the valve cover as well. I shut the car off, and while it didn't stop smoking out of the valve cover altogether, it did slow considerably. I'm using stock covers with baffles, pcv on driver side, breather on passenger side.

I've never seen or heard of a car smoking out of a valve cover before. Any ideas?

 

Sounds like you may have some blow-by, which is usually indicative of a problem with the rings. I'd check the compression, especially on the driver's side since that's where you saw the white smoke. If toy leave the PCV in and pull the breather on the other side, does it smoke like that too?

 

Well, apparently I'm just ignorant. I did some searching online, and found that it is normal for it to smoke some even with baffled valve covers. Its just oil vapor. I'm going to try pulling out the breather and leaving the pcv valve in to see what happens.

 

Yep mine does too. However, this smoke isn't really white. Its a bit bluish.

This leads me to believe that the smoke coming out of your tailpipes is also a bit bluish, and that you are losing oil and not coolant

Now, figure out where!

 

It could also just be condensation in your tail-pipe, though blow-by is a bit more serious of a problem... hope those rings set correctly pretty soon for yah.

 

I dont have a new motor but i know that i have blowby and when i take my oil cap of i get smoke out of the valve cover and its (smoke) slightley pressurized when the engine is running. I would get a friend and let him ride behind you and get on it a few times through the gears and see if you blow anything out. I have gotten into the habit of glancing in my rear view mirror sometimes when i stomp it. Good Luck

 

Well, I've driven the car quite a bit today, and it hasn't done it at all. Not at startup, not idling, not on the street. I had someone drive behind me to check while I was driving normally, as well as when I got on the gas hard , and they didn't see any smoke.

I've been keeping an eye on the dipstick and coolant, so far I don't see any missing fluids. I have yet to do the breather test though.

Now, I've been asking myself what changed between yesterday and today. This is what I've come up with so far 1) weather has been unusually cold these last couple of days, and I think it was less humid today. 2) I started with a fresh bin and forgot about the previous tuning work I had done.

I'm going to continue to keep an eye on the smoke thing, but everything seemed to look good today.

 

There's a difference between how leaky guides act when the seals just aren't sealing (even though they may be new and soft) and how they leak when they get old, hard and brittle. When they get old, hard and brittle you'll get that big puff of smoke first thing in the morning and then not much the rest of the day. When the seals are new and soft but there's just a leak somewhere it will be more constant (like revving it up hard a few times in the driveway and seeing oil smoke on the rev-down). Slightly worn guides and the fact that stock heads are just hard to seal up tight with some/many kinds of aftermarket seals is just kinda the nature of the beast. I have tried a LOT of different seals and nothing seem to work as well as just getting the guides cut down and putting some quality posi seals on it. The rubber ones with a metal spring around the outside that just push down over a stock guide are notoriously bad for sealing up and sometimes just ride off the top of the guide boss and start going up and down with the valve instead of claming onto the guide boss, providing no sealing at all.

By "other" intake side leaks I mean one of 2 common problems. Intake gaskets not sealing the intake port up and drawing oil vapor from the lifter valley OR.... screw-in rocker studs that are sucking oil past the threads into the roof of the intake port becuase proper sealant wasn't used on the threads (or NO sealant was used on the threads). Both of these can drive you bonkers if you've never run across them before.

You're on the right path. You've done some diagnostic work and you'll figure it out. BTW- the oil vapors coming out of the valve covers is no big deal. ANY running engine when fully warmed up will have some blow-by from the rings forcing oil vapors out the valve cover if you yank the PCV valve out. Unless it's chuggin' like a freight train you shouldn't freak out too bad. Modest oil vapors drifting out casually is no big deal. It's not likely a ring seal problem you are experiencing. It's almost definitely oil coming in through the open intake valve along with the A/F mix that's darkening your plugs.

If you do NOT have baffled valve covers you might try running for a while with the PCV valve pulled out of the cover and see if there is any difference. It's possible with non-baffled valve covers that you could be drawing oil DIRECTLY through the PCV valve into the intake manifold and darkening the plugs. If you have factory-style baffled covers this is very unlikely unless you have a LOT of blow-by from bad rings.

 

Wow, I sure would never have thought of screw in rocker studs causing oil consumption. That would have been one major b1tch to trace. I don't have screw in studs though, mine are pinned.

As far as the manifold not sealing well, and drawing in oil vapor, that would explain oil consumption in one, or possibly even two cylinders. I don't think all 8 could have a bad seal. What are the chances of that?

Now I'm curious though. If that were to occur on one intake port for example, that would mean that the engine has an internal vacuum leak correct? Suppose the oil consumption wasn't noticeable in this case. How would one figure out there was an internal vacuum leak? I figure it would shake and run a little rough at idle, and vacuum would fluctuate a bit, but what I am trying to get at is how would one test for that?

You can spray starting fluid around fittings and vacuum lines all day and it wouldn't make a difference.

 

Yeah, if you were drawing vacuum at all 8 ports you would have one heck of a rough idle. It would usually be caused by incorrect intake gaskets or some other basic parts mismatch.

If you were leaking on one you might just have a slight quiver or skip to it at idle. I just mentioned those 2 possibilities becuase you were asking about what "other" causes I was referring to.

If you only had one leaky port drawing in oil/vacuum then only the plug on that cylinder would look bad. Maybe a SLIGHT discoloration on the other plugs that are near it or share an intake manfiold branch with that cylinder. It would be obvious that something was wrong on just that one cylinder.

I think you're leaking past the guide seals if I had to take a guess from a thousand miles away.

 

Yep, as Damon stated, looks like you're pulling in oil through the intake valves. Look at the picture of one of my plugs in this post https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=271690 Looks just like your plugs!

I was burning a quart every 400 miles with only at 8000 miles since a rebuild. To make a long story short, I was pulling in oil through the PCV system under boost. I still had the stock "closed loop" PCV system. I modified the stock system by using a K&N breather on the passenger valve cover and put an oil separator inline between the PCV valve and the throttle body vacuum port.

I took me almost two months to figure this out. Unfortunately I tried the "hard" things first like replacing intake manifold gaskets (I have to pull off the blower so it makes it a PITA). I thought there was no way the PCV system would pick up that much oil....well, it can (especially under boost).

Hope you can get it figured out soon....I know how frustrating it can be to figure these things out!