MY '89 TA with 115,000 miles been trying to rough it out thru this very freezing cold winter again in Boston...

I got some leaking of A-freeze on the engine block on Left -Driver side of the V-8. THere is a little pooling of green stuff (A-freeze) liquid squeezing up thru the Intake manifold (I'm guessing) gasket area.

HOW bad is this for me, ya think ???


I have never had to do any major engine work on the car - it needs a spark plug change badly....
I have only had to add about inch or two of A-freeze into the overflow bottle about once a month ... so far.

Car is running kinda rough and little rougher as days goes by.

QUESTION: Just because I can visibily see Antifreeze leaking up above onto part of engine block - Does that necessarily mean I got A-freeze leaking INTO inside the engine mixing in with the OIL ?? LIke do I have probably A-freeze leaking and burning up inside the engine block, ya think ????

I know if that happens - it's really bad for the engine and pistons etc to have a mix of A-freeze with OIL happening.

It has beeen reallly cold lately like in 10-20F range most day & nite.... gaskets and rubber get pretty brittle and do not perform so well under such cold, right.


Is there anything I do like try edging out part of intake gasket and re-sealing or caulking the area with some gasket stuff to try and hold back the leaking which I can see now ???

Anytthing I can do besides getting some $$$ hundreds of dollar INtake manifold job fix-up ???

Thanks

 

Oh yeh... I don't really see anything weird or any antifreeze on the oil dipstick when checking oil level.
Car even starts ok on first try in freezing cold mornings usually.

What does Antifreeze mixed into oil look like on the Oil dipstick ??

 

Where exactly is the coolant pooling? Near the front or rear corners? Water outlet/thermostat area? Under the throttle body?

Coolant mixed with the oil tends to lighten the color of the oil, and can present a murky, foamy, or milky appearance.

 

A little more discription should be good like vader said. If you had to replace the intake gaskets, its very easy. But for being new at this also it shouldnt take you more then a half a day and about 60 bucks in supplies (gaskets, oil, antifreeze, RTV and an oil filter)

BTW I believe in your profile you have an automatic 4 speed. There isnt a Auto 5 speed out there for our cars.

 

I have an auto 5 speed.

no i dont.

I changed the thermostat in August and used forma-gasket. My car had a slight pooling of a freeze on the top of my intake manifold, but I ignored it. As the temperature dropped here in Philly, the forma-junk blew out and anti-freeze EMPTIED onto the top of my engine. A new (real) gasket and two gallons of a freeze later, my car is fine.

Just for the he|| of it, and being its only 4.95 at pep boys and an EASY 10 minute job, replace your thermostat housing gasket.

 

Also check the hose and the housing where it connects to the hose. If you have a slight leak there, it will pool up on the driver side of the manifold. Also, check it with the car running.

Good luck.

 

I had/somewhat still have that problem. I replaced my intake gaskets a few months ago due to a sloppy job I had done before. I had replaced the intake gaskets and decided to clean up the intake-gasket mating surfaces but noticed that whomever owned the car before had scraped/scratched the heck out of the surface. After removing the gasket between these scrapes I was contemplating whether to replace the intake or not before reinstall but I didn't have any extra $$$ so I reinstalled it and torqued it to spec.

Prior to this last replacement I didnt have this leak but it looks like that extra surface clean messed up the sealing ability. A few weeks after the motor developed a cold start ticking (would last until the motor warmed halfway to 220*) from either the rockers or lifters. I didn't have time to trace it down, but from exploring I noticed 4 corner leaks, a leak from near the starter, and the oil cap had some yellow gunk. I figured the coolant was leaking into the top of the block via the corners of the intake which led me to retighten the intake. I should have replaced the oil right away but eventually the ticking went away, the starter leak went away, but I still have a slight leak on the front passenger corner of the intake.

My problem now is that I seem to have developed an oil leak appearing from the rearmain seal from the neglect. Could the extensive usage with coolant in the oil have caused this?

 

Thanks really for replys...

My leaking is near front on Driver side - it is pooling up a little in the little well impressions just below the valve cover on the same level where the Thermostat housing connects in.

Oh yehh - back about 12 years ago I had the thermostat changed out by a GM dealer and the mechanic had b*tch time taking out & putting in new one (mainly I think cause he shortcutted not taking some other parts off first to clear the way for the two bolts holding the housing in - so as I watched him whole time - he had tough time getting power wrench onto inner bolt to tighten it properly)....
Ever since then I had noticed a tiny bit of coolant leaking slightly right around the T-housing. I of course just ignored and hoped for best.

BUt now I'm getting more coolant pooling (leaking from "around here" somehow) coming out in area I said above.

Someone said:
"Also check the hose and the housing where it connects to the hose. If you have a slight leak there, it will pool up on the driver side of the manifold. Also, check it with the car running. "

Should I wait till engine gets up to full operating temp and temp up to 200 or so to check the T-stat and housing and hose ??

I only checked in early morning after JUST starting car and saw no spurting or bad leaking pushing out - but car was barely warmed up.

I guess this whole thing must be a lot affected by:
- TEMPERATURE (outside air temp & engine underhood temp)
- Barometric pressure (maybe) of the outside air (for that day)

Anybody have a clue about above - how Temp and Barometric pressure affects all the flow of liquids and tightness of seals and rubber-like connections, etc...
(makes me always think of the SpaceShuttle Challenger blowup -due to the O-rings freezing in early morning cold weather in Florida and the rubber not holding back the hot gases etc)...

It gets WAY colder here in Boston most all mornings and nites during winters here...

THese F-birds ARE definitely not made to stand these cold temps very well. Really just a Florida or hot state car - I guess... tooo bad.

 

From what you describe the "mechanic" that replaced the thermostat gasket may have caused a couple things;1) if he used an air ratchet he may have over torqued/tighten the T-stat housing.That could have cracked it causing a slow leak or 2)Poor surface prep resulting in a bad seal(do the TPI cars still use a standard gasket or an O-ring?).
I have a similar problem.I noticed a coolant puddle behind the T-stat housing/water crossover on my 305.Simple to change out the gasket(and t-stat since I'm in there).Button every thing back up refilling the system and notice coolant in the same spot.So I start cleaning/watching.At first I think the gasket didn't seal-not that,then it looks like it's seeping out thru the intake itself,it's a CFI motor w/aluminum 2 piece intake.Then I notice coolant around 1 of the intake bolts on the driver side head.It's seeping around the bolt.Apparantly the intake was taken off in the past by a PO and the gasket didn't seat properly or the bolt wasn't torgued correctly.Once the motor comes up to temp the intake expands enough the seeping stops.
You're noticing it more now because of the colder temps it takes longer for the motor to come up to operating temps and the intake to expand slowing the leak(unless the t-stat housing is cracked).Best thing to do first is to R&R the t-stat yourself or have someone you trust do it.

 

They use a gasket. I'd definetly replace the thermostat just in case. They're easy to do and it would be nice to know that your housing isn't cracked from the air tool the guy used. BTW i also use RTV black on those gaskets and haven't had any problems sealing.

 

I use one of those felpro rubber ones. I have remove and installed it 50 times. For the 3 bucks more, its worth it

 

Welll.... MY gasket blew y-day on way to work up highway.

I'm toooling along, bout 60mph - & see out rearmirror - a lot of whiteish smoke coming from behind car (like exhaust).
Thought first it's just the vapor from cold morning - but it aint that cold - more like 40F...
My temp & oil gauges show ok & looked normal - no overheating (yet).
I get off - head back home - only feel safe to go about 1 more mile & stop at nearest selfserve Gas pit.

Now lots of whiteish steam smoke blowing up under hood.
Pop it.

My intake gasket Front corner Driver side was spraying like a garden hose all over L engine side.... Real bummmmer.

Let it cool offf.. Call the flatbed-man... towed to my trusted TA
Firebird local gas station mechanic...
I didn't want to chance driving it one more foot & chance Overheating and wrecking engine if water gets into engine & oil.
So towed it.

First I called around- A GMpontiac dealer srvc mgr - quoted me -
$800-1000 to fix gasket etc. He advised just drive it home, park it, NOT worth fixing since its 16-17 years old. (117,000 miles) Parts mgr did NOT even have the gasket - nor was a '89 part available anywhere in state (looked up on his computer)... must order or get thru Autozone/Napa places.
He said they hardly stock/store parts at GM dealers even like 10 years or older. More like 6-8 yrs more like it.

Another local mechanic saw me in distress - came over - advised me - My '89 TA EFI fuel injection Chevy350 smallblock engine is VERY much harder to fix Intake gasket versus a carb 350 engine - since I got so much Smog/pollution control stuff and the fuel rails, etc etc all on top & has to be taken off to get at Intake Manifold.... Lot harder to do more labor intense.
This guy said he could do it tooo.
About 8 hour job at $60/hour rate.

Sooo that pretty much XXX'd me out of attempting job myself.

Bottom line - My gas station Firebird expert - quotes me $700
to do job - (oucccchhhhHHH!)
Fix the Intake manifold gasket, put in new T-stat, replace Oil, replace A-freeze, Use goood aftermarket gasket etc.
It will be a good 8 hour job and ready TUesday afternoon.

So I says - GO - green lite.... I had no other option...

Still thinkin maybe BEST to sell it once get it back on feet.
Got 117,000 miles on it and it's tough in the Boston winters here - as this Example shows.

Oh yehhh - another reason - left in his hands.... He is a certified Gas station inspector-man - my Inspection sticker is UP at end of this month - few days.
I need him to gte me to PASS the Emissions & Safety stupid check - I think it helps to grease the skids little when those guys have SUCH power over either getting Pass or Fail (and much more $$$$ later )....

What a racket!

 

thermostat housing gasket?
lmao!!!!!!!!!!
replace the thermostat housing!
the guy used an air ratchet on it and warped the housing!
get a new cast iron or billet aluminum one.$30 tops new gasket,$2
driving instead of crying,priceless!
hope i'm not too late!
Eric B

 

Are they quoting you for a HEAD GASKET job??? And your suuure its the intake manifold? I don't mean to question, but this sounds SO much like my car when the thermostat gasket blew (Anti freeze covered the intake manifold and the ground, and stream was puffing all over). I locked my keys in car and I calld AAA just to unlock the car, the gasket blew while it was sitting waiting for AAA. The tow guy came and saw the smoke and immediately began calling to get it to a service station and scheduling an engine service blah blah blah. I told him its just the thermostat gasket, I've got it!

I feel terrible to hear about such an expsensive problem, and I just want to make sure its not just the thermostat gasket.

 

If they're pulling fuel rails then it sounds like the intake manifold gasket. That's too bad, there are alot of mechanics around here that would do it cheaper for sure. $700 isn't awful but it's not rocket science to remove an intake.

 

Just to clear it up... It aint the T-stat or housing - someone else here speculated about using a pwr-wrentch on the housing.... It was so long ago (+10 yrs) I can't remember...

But the T-stat works(ed) aok and even the heater works ok (even with the heater core slightly leaking - I'll miss that nice sweet smell and nice fogging of the windshield) ... when car blew out the other day --- I personally saw and touched and felt the exact spot on front side edge of where gasket material or (just gunk) that had been there just before I took off for work AND now it wasn't - can just feel about 1inch wide bare metal to metal and lots of green stuff warm liquid and ...

The spraying like garden hose I spoke about was right on this spot and not coming anyhows from the T-stat housing... it was a nice mess... and underhood insulation soaking and smelling crappy like used A-freeze.

Two separate experienced mechanics BOTH said - Intake Mani gasket... so I believe it.

-----
Yehhh $700 is alot - But when you got no other options and mechanic knows you knows you can't do it etc... But better than the Dealer... like I said - Dealer ain't even interested.

At least this guy has a personal "love" for TA's - he recently re-did his brother's GTA gaskets - I saw it today - an '88 and in nice shape - almost mint. At least I can trust this mechanic and know he takes Pride in doing a great job (or at least tries tooo).

We'll see... (TBC)

 

Ok. Good luck with everything you have to do.
And let us know how it goes.