Has anyone been able to replace the Oil pan on a early 3rd gen (84') without taking the complete engine out?.. how far does it need to be lifted and can it be done with the trans still attached (T5) ?

while jacking up the car.. the jack slipped and the car fell on the center link, benting it and pushing it into the oil pan.

I guess taking it out and servicing a few other thing and changing the clutch woun't be a bad idea anyway..

Thank..

 

I haven't done it myself, but I have read that it can be done with a 305. The crank has to be positioned just right and the engine lifted on the old, and probably sagging, mounts. It is my understanding that this can't be done with a 350. The larger counterweights are just a tad too big and won't clear the oil pan no matter what position the crank is in.

 

I believe there's a tech article about changing your oil pan on this site, you may want to check it out.

 

305's and 350's have the same crank. The only difference is the cylinder bore.

 

I had to jack the engine up to the point it was lifting the car......trans against the tunnel....just enough room with the crank in the right spot.

 

Another way to do it is to remove the front crossmember/suspension.

 

1. Remove air cleaner and distributor cap. Disconnect the ground cable from the battery.

2. Put front of car up on jack stands or ramps.

3. Drain the oil from the engine.

4. Remove the engine mount bolts - the long one on each side.

5. Remove the oil pan bolts. May have to remove the starter first.

6. Jack up the engine until the pan will clear the crank. I put a 2x4 under the damper and jacked it up from there. Keep your hands out of any spaces between the engine and chassis.

7. Installation is the reverse of disassembly.

I've done it twice with my 350.

 

may i ask why you are attempting this?

 

The Cross Link pushed a grove into the front of the pan and the front seal where the timing cover now has a big gap in it now. Now the crank and rod contact the pan. Stupid move on my part..!

Oh well..

 

If I remember right, you'll get the most clearance on the crank counterweights if you position the mark on the balancer at 6 o'clock. That's where I positioned mine the last time I changed the gasket, and the pan came off without too much of a fight. Also, I highly recommend getting the one piece gasket they have available now. They're worth every penny since they're vastly easier to get to seal up nice. The old 4 piece cork/rubber gaskets are a joke.

 

Thanks for all of the input..
I'll start sometime after the next week if I don't get lazy LOL.. I am ordering a Summit Oil pan for $30.00 or something like that and yes, I pan on using the one piece gasket.

 

Did you get it done yet? An alternate way of jacking the engine up is by putting a board (a piece of 2x10" or something -- just make sure it covers the whole bottom of the low part of the pan) between the oil pan and jack, and jacking it up by the oil pan. Seems to be a more centered location than under the damper, to me. Then when the engine is up, cut some blocks out of 2x4 (I believe I nailed two pieces together to make 4x4 blocks, but I can double check on those dimensions) and put them in the engine mounts, then lower the engine onto them so you can pull the jack out and take the oil pan off.

It's how I've done it in the past, and I'll actually be doing it again tomorrow to change the oil pan seal.

P.S. I did the exact same thing as you when installing headers on my old Z28 many years back. I used the above method to put a new pan on. In the end the pan replacement was the easiest part. Getting the bent center-link off was a pain in the ***. Hope you had an easier time.

 

Thanks for the info and suggestions.. No, I have not worked on it yet.. Luck I have other cars to drive and work on.. I just picked up a '88 Corvette Friday and have been trying to get it tuned up and fix the code that the ECM was throwing due to the MAF Relays and other dirty parts..

Yeah.. I thought I had the tab on the Jack hooked on the Cross member.. but it wasn't.. it was cold and wet out side and I was in a bit of a rush.. stupid me.. I should have known better.. oh well..

 

Any of you guys that have changed the Oil Pan have a T5 car?..

As I finally got around to start changing th Oil Pan.. I have a problem i that after I jacked up the engine as far as it will go.. I still can not get the oil pan off!... I have a T5 trans so the Bell housing is 360 deg around and I am about 1/2"-3/4" from the pan clearing and dropping off !.. With the Pan mid section hitting the x-member.. that last edge of the pans flange just will not clear..!?

What have you do to get around this.. ???

I think I am just going to have to pull the engine out !?, since it is time for a new clutch and some upper gaskets, but I was hoping to keep it running in time to re-new my Calif registration, which will require a smog test this year.. look like it is going no-op this year and sit for a while if I have to yank the engine and trans out. Just didn't want to go through the problem of bring in it out of no-op and temp reg and smog before they will allow it back on the streets..

 

Maybe Im missing something obvious here (I probably am), but if you need to replace the clutch, why not remove the transmission and then the bellhousing to do the clutch, and you'll have plenty of room to move the motor then, right?

 

It come down to that I don't have time, I need to get the car to the smog tester to get it to pass.. I am a bit short of spending the money for another clutch right now.. Yeah.. I know I shouldn't have waited..

 

The first car I did it in was an A4, with the tranny in, but the most recent one was a T5... but the tranny was out.

What's stopping you from jacking the engine up more? Is it the transmission bottoming out in the tranny tunnel already, or is it something else? e.g. removing the distributor cap could get you some more clearance, if you haven't done that yet.

 

Engine is as far up when jacking up at the Balancer.. Head/valve cover come into contact witht he firewall/AC Heater box.. and Trans tunnel.

I already removed the Distributor Cap.. the distributor itself is not hitting the firewall.. I am going to remove the trans/bell housing I just need to get some more jack and/or a engine host so that the engine will not fall down as I remove the trans/bellhousing. Its been nice cruising weather so.. been out driving the Chevelle and Vette.. while the Z sits... Just too many projects and maintance of other cars.. I don't need one that doesn't want to co-operate

All, Thanks for the suggestion but it could be a case of aftermarket oil pan not being the correct shape as the original one.. I had replace the tired L69/305 about 10 years ago with a Crate built 350 that was blue printed and balanced.. so the oil pan is most likely not the same shape and causing the contact at the mid pan and x-member and will not allow it to clear the bell housing.. Summit oil pan is almost the same shape.

 

It takes longer to go to the yard and rent the crane, than it does to pull the motor OUT. Then, it takes no more than 2 hours to put the motor back in. What's stopping you?

Why would ANYBODY want to try to attempt this, laying on the ground in a pool of fluids, and then trying to get a gasket to seal up under those conditions, when it's SO EASY and SO QUICK to just pull the motor and be done with it?

People seem to always want to dodge pulling the motor to do this, for some reason. Honestly though, it's BY FAR the easiest way. Even if you don't COMPLETELY pull it OUT - even if all you do is pull it up and forward from above, enough to clear everything - it's still about 10,000 times easier, quicker, safer, and just all-around better than doing it with a jack. The cherry picker is the EASY way. I'd be willing to bet that you could cherry-pick it up out of there and it would take less than half as long as the other. You end up doing MORE work trying to get out of doing the work, than the work you're trying to get out of doing. Not real smart. Not to mention, the difficulty of getting the new gasket on there perfectly, and getting a good seal; if you're not having much fun this time, you won't have any more fun when you put it back together and it leaks and you have to do it ALL OVER AGAIN, you can believe that.

 

As I stated in my last post. I am pulling it out now, just going to have spend some extra cash to refresh a few things, gaskets for the pan, intake, valve cover, new clutch, resureface flywheel and might end up refreshing the Trans (shifting fork on 4th was getting bad)... was only going to spend $70 for the pan & gasket.. now I am about $400-$600 give or take some now.... and going to miss passing the smog inspection and getting the car re-registered in time... Was going to be a simple gasket and pan replacement..

As far as putting it back together for the quick gasket/pan replacement.. It has been sitting for some time now. draining the oil.. it was almost oil free and it maybe dripped about 10 drop the whole time I was under there.. and still no more as of now.. If I had been able to just simple replace the gasket and pan.. I would have been done in 2 hours total.. with some mirror clean up.

The last time I removed the engine and trans.. took about 2-3 hours. that is the quick part.. putting it back together. .is much more invovled as you don't want to make a mistake.. so.. 8-10 hours total work.. Plus a few more hours of extra time that I will spend cleaning everything from top to bottom..

So.. you can see It now has tuned into a major refresh project.. ! That I will not rush doing..! and spending 10x the amount..

 

Many, many more bolts, wires, and lines to disconnect and fluids to drain pulling the engine than lifting it up off the mounts a little bit.

Greater chance of dropping something or hooking something back up incorrectly.

One-piece oil pan gasket and those nifty plastic alignment bolts make it a whole lot easier as well.

 

The 1-piece gaskets are a godsend. If you get the type that doesn't have the stiff pieces of steel in each side rail, you don't even have to completely move the pan out of the way. Just ball up the gasket, put it inside the pan, and then pull it up and into position. You only need the pan to drop a couple of inches to get one of those installed. The hardest part is just working it around the pump pickup. I've done that on a couple of different vehicles now, and they both sealed up nice. The steel reinforced ones are nicer though, if you have the room to work with them. While I MUCH prefer to put a new pan gasket on a motor when it's sitting on an engine stand, I just can't justify all the work of pulling the entire motor to do one if that's the only repair you're doing. They should outlaw the sale of the old, 4 piece cork and rubber pan gaskets. Those things are pathetic. I never could get those to seal good on my 69 Camaro's motor. Having a chrome pan makes it even harder to seal. I put the 1 piece gasket in there about a year ago, and the garage floor has been perfectly clean and dry since!

 

Will I was finially got the oil pan swapped out.. I wetn with not pulling the engine and just pulled the Trans. Once the Bell Housing was off, the Pan had enough room to be removed and reinstalled. So.. $275.00 for a Clutch, $35.00 to resurface the flywheel, new pilot bearing.. Fuilds, oil filter, gaskets.. And many hours on my back cleaning the underside and removing the Pilot Bearing, that was a PITA..
The process to remove the pilot bearing, I broke two of my adapter on my slide hammer, it just didn't want come out !..
Ended up grinding one side of the bearing (pulled out all of the inner rollers) and then used a center punch to break the rest of the bearing case apart. did a good job of not damaging the crank at all...maybe a few small nicks.. but working on the trans next and then back together.. getting close on my registration renewal date. may or may not make it, no time to work on it...!

 

I use the same technique you described to remove the axle bearings on 10 bolt rears. Works great as long as you're real careful with the grinder once you get close to the axle tube, or the crankshaft pilot hole in your case. An actual pilot bearing puller like the ones you can "rent" from the parts stores isn't the slide hammer type though. Here's a link to the right tool that's used. http://www.partsamerica.com/productd...egoryCode=3497. That's the tool I used the last time I had to pull one, and it came right out. Just figured I'd post that up in case you ever need to remove another one in the future. Sounds like you're making good progress now though!

 

Pat

Yeah.. I know about that, The local Kragen stores didn't have it on hand or stock. I even went to the HarborFrieght store but they didn't have that type either.. so.. I had to make do with the slide hammer, which should have and has worked in the past !

 

Yeah, that's understandable. Nobody seems to have the tool you're looking for when you need it. Sounds like you've had better luck than me in the past with those damn slide hammer pullers. Of course that's usually because the hooks on them are totally trashed when you "rent" one from the parts store. They're great for getting 9 bolt style axles out, but on bearing races, I usually end up doing the grinder/cold chisel method. It also works good for getting differential carrier bearings off.

 

Well.. the oil pan is replaced. I didn't pull the engine after all.. I figure I'd bit the bullet and replace the clutch. So I pulled the trans and bell housing off and was able to remove and replace the pan without any problems. So.. after many hours of cleaning, dealing with the Pilot bearing that didn't want to come out, spending $$$ on a new Centerforce Duel Fiction Clutch and ThrowOut Bearing, machining the flywheel.. The Z is now running and I got one day before the registration expires and hope it will pass the smog test.

Thanks everyone for the suggestion, information and support.

 

just dropped my car on the centerlink, detroyed the oil pan... wish i woulda seen this post earlier i wont be jacking from the center ever again. did u guys just have to replace the centerlink or other parts too?

 

Yeah I replaced the centerlink with one from the junker. As stated in my earlier (years earlier!) post, it was a bigger pain getting the centerlink off than the oil pan. I blame it on a having a cheap "pickle fork" though.

 

bought a new one,.... i was looking at it, how do u avoid damage to the machined stud/rod surfaces inside the joints..