My wife has a 1990 Formula 350. Our problem is the car will sometimes refuse to start. Accessories come on, gages move, but the car will not turn over. The previous owner had an aftermarket security system installed on the car that had one of those keys you unplug to bypass the starter. I accidentally knocked it out after we got the car because I didn't know it was there. After bypassing the box the car fired right up. Problem solved...so I think. We also have a brand new battery in the car. When the car is running it holds steady at 14 on the volt meter also.

For the past two years it does this act where it'll just not start. It generally only happens after the car has been running for extended periods of time (i.e. like today after we'd been out cruising for a couple of hours) or it is really hot outside, again like it is today. I've checked my connections where I spliced the bypass for the security system and they're tight. After the car sits for a few minutes it's good to go and starts like a champ.

So, looking for ideas of why it does this. It's not left my wife completely stranded, but it has caused her to hang out someplace longer than she would like a few times. Appreciate the help...

 

It sounds vats related. I have the same problem ( I still haven't fixed because I'm taking a week or two off from working with her to keep my wife happy) and I find that if I keep the windows cracked on a hot day I have no problem. The reason that it'll start after a couple of minutes of leaving it be is the vats has to wait to reset itself. No one has actually confirmed this idea with me, but I'm pretty confident about what it could be...haha I hope that helped.

 

We had brand new keys cut for it already. Would it be in the ignition cylinder?

 

I've got a fairly new key on mine too, but from what I've read after all these years the little reader has a tendency to fail.

 

Is that in the cylinder and if so, how hard are they to replace?

 

Let me ask this:

Does the car crank but no ignition, or does it not crank at all?

If the car cranks with no ignition, I'd be willing to lean toward your ignition module is starting to go south, judging by the symptoms you've mentioned.
The problem with the module is more than likely "heat soak". You say on hot days, after cruising, it just doesn't want to go. After sitting for a while, it fires right up. This, to me, is a classic symptom of a module that's succumbed to too much heat.
The problem with the module is, if you remove it and take it to a parts store for testing, it will test good, simply because there's not enough heat to replicate the conditions that cause it to fail. Try replacing the module and see what happens.

If the car does not crank at all:

You could have two issues here. First issue is heat soak on the starter, but usually the symptoms will be fairly obvious, sluggish cranking, solenoid will click but motor won't engage, stuff like that. I'm doubting this is your issue.

The other issue, as was mentioned, is your VATS is malfunctioning. Does the Security light turn on and stay on when attempting to start?

One of the more common issues with VATS is the lock cylinder can't get a good "read" on the key any more. This will cause VATS to disable the starter. Once VATS has caused a security No-start, the module will not allow another read for about four minutes. This means that if you try to start the car again before four to five minutes have passed, VATS will still stop the car from starting, and it will reset the No-start timer, meaning you'll have to wait another four to five minutes before attempting to start it again.

Now, there are two ways the VATS module is not getting a good read on the key:

Edit: I see after the fact that you had new keys cut, so disregard the part about getting new keys.

One, the key is worn. Years and years of using that key to start the car will wear it down, and eventually it cannot create good contact in the lock cylinder to get a reading, causing a "sometimes yes, sometimes no" issue with it starting, because sometimes it's getting a good read, sometimes it's not due to a bad connection.

If this is the case, take your key to a GM dealership and have them "read" the key. There are several different VATS keys available, each have their own number assigned to them. You have to have the correct number key to replace it, or else the VATS in the car will cause the car not to start on a full-time basis.

The other (and I believe more common) issue is that the wires inside the lock cylinder break down after years and years of turning on, turning off, turning on again, turning off again.
What happens here is you now have a wire with an internal break. Sometimes when the wire is aligned correctly inside the cylinder and making contact, it will get a good read and allow the car to start.
Other times, when the wire is not aligned and the break opens the circuit, it will get a bad read on your key and the car will enter security mode.

The fix for this issue is to replace the lock cylinder. I believe they are pricey ($125+ range if memory serves). There should be a plug at the base of your steering column, with an orange and white wire on both sides of the plug, disconnect this plug, and go through the procedure of removing your lock cylinder. The orange and white wires go in to the lock cylinder, so the replacement cylinder will have to have its wires fed through the column and reconnected.

 

I got to thinking about it on Saturday when this happened and thought about starter or ignition module because my wife said it only seems to happen when it's hot. It was really hot under her hood that day combined with a triple digit temperature.

I've not paid much attention to the security light, but I will have to watch for that next time. When it does this, there is no cranking. You turn the key and there is nothing. No noises like it's attempting to turn over that would lead you to think of a starter issue or a no park problem. Like I said, gages move and lights light up. That's about it.

If it's the VATS issue in the lock cylinder how hard are they to replace? Will I have to disassemble the entire steering column?

Thanks for the info.

 

To change the lock cylinder you will need to remove your steering wheel, and the security plate that sits behind it.

It's been a couple years since I've had to remove one *promptly knocks on wood*. If you have the stock steering wheel on the car I'm assuming it's got an air bag on it. I believe there's a fuse that can be removed to disable accidental discharging of the air bag.
When I did mine, I didn't disable it, I just carefully removed the four screws on the back of the steering wheel that secure the bag to the wheel. With the bag loose, there is a connector underneath you will have to unplug to completely remove it.

After this, there should be a large nut in the center of the wheel. Remove this nut and with a puller tool you can remove the steering wheel.

Underneath the steering wheel there should be a steel security plate. You will need another tool for this. I forget what it's called (something like steering lock plate removal tool, or something to that effect, most parts stores like Auto Zone should know what you're talking about).

Using the tool, you can press the plate downwards in to the column to reveal a snap ring that secures the plate to the column. Removal of this ring can be a pain, unless you have some good snap ring pliers.

Once the snap ring is removed you will be able to remove the plate and you should be looking at your turn signal cam. Remove the cam and you should at this point be able to see your lock cylinder.

Edit: Since my memory is hazy, I cannot recall if the turn signal cam is above or below the security plate. The cam may be above it, in which case you can remove the cam and then go about the plate removal procedure. Sorry, I just can't recall exactly.

There is one screw with either an allen head or torx head on it. Remove this screw and the cylinder will be able to slide out freely of the ignition column, provided that you unplugged the orange and white wires down at the base of the column.

If your security light functions as normal when the engine is having this no-start condition, you may have a starter with a dead spot on it, or suffering from heat soak, or a bad starter enable relay so keep those in mind as well. Hope you get it figured out.

 

Wow.

I'm going to wait until it happens again and check the security light to see if it stays on or goes out when the key is turned. I'd hate to go to all of that trouble if it isn't the problem. If it does end up being the problem then I'll probably figure out how to bypass the VATS until I get a new steering wheel for the car. The stock one in my wife's car looks bad and the airbag cover is starting to curl at the edges so I want to replace it with a nice Grant spoke style.

I appreciate the input and I'll post up again with the results of the security light when it happens next time. Thanks.

 

Bypassing the VATS is fairly straightforward. The only drawback to this, is the fact that any crook that has an eye on the car would be able to steal it much more easily.

To bypass your VATS you will need a voltmeter that can measure resistance (most, if not all, can do this procedure).

Set the voltmeter to read resistance. Place the test leads on the chip on the key, one lead on each contact point on the chip. Make certain you have a good solid contact on the chip with your leads and write down the resistance value.

Go to Radio Shack, or any other electronic parts supplier, and get a resistor or resistors that will add up to the same value of the key (example: say you need 10,000 ohm resistance, but the highest they sell is 5000, then get two 5000 resistors and wire them in series).

The resistors you purchase don't have to be exact, but they DO have to be close.

Go to the bottom of your steering column and locate the plug with the small orange and white wire. Cut these wires (I cut mine on the lock cylinder side, leaving a few inches before the plug).

Now, you should have the plug, with a few inches of wire there that would normally go to the lock cylinder. Take one end of the resistor(s) and connect it to the orange wire. Take the other end and connect it to the white wire. What you're doing here is simulating the key being in the lock cylinder at all times, with a constant good reading to the VATS module.

Once you have it taped up, turn the key to ON, note the security light. If it comes on, then goes out after a couple seconds, start the car. If the car starts, you have successfully bypassed the key read for the VATS.

 

strc09, I have had the same symptoms you've described for the past 2-3 years now. It will only behave like this in the hotter months of the year and never in winter. EXTREMELY frustrating. I haven't really tried a lot to fix it but this is what I have done and it is better, but still not fixed. Also when I purchased the car, the dealer said the VATS had been disabled already. New keys that have the correct resistance, ignition module(helped for like a month or so), disabled VATS within the ECM, and removed aftermarket alarm system. I too haven't looked at what the security light does, i'll have to watch it as well.

Quick_Trans_Am, the ecm just stops the fuel injectors from working when vats is triggered correct? It has nothing to do with the starter?

I guess the next thing to try is the resistor bypass followed by new ignition cylinder if that doens't work.
EDIT: I just tried to start my again to move it into it's parking space and it refused to start again. The security light stays on solid while in the start position and when releasing it and letting it sit in the "on" position.

 

I have the vats problem and when it kills, it's everything. no crank, nada. I have the ford solenoid hack on mine so I can actually bump the starter with ease. With key, no crank. Jumping wires, crank but no start. Wait four or five minutes. key, start yay. I also have found that if I leave the windows cracked and a towel over the steering column it seems to keep this issue from coming. I don't know, maybe it's just me getting lucky and attributing it to some false idol.

 

The VATS on my vehicle disabled the starter, and I believe all 90-92 systems had a starter disable on them. I believe the injectors were disabled as well, in case a crook was smart enough to trigger the starter manually. Again, my memory is hazy, I'll have to look at my diagrams.

 

I know it's been a little while but it just did it again. I don't believe it's the VATS issue because when the key was turned the Security light did go out. Not immediately, but it didn't stay lit. The next thing is something is getting heat soaked. A friend suggested the possible something to do with the starter. Any thoughts?

 

Anyone else have any input?

 

You made sure all your connections were good right? Could be a bad wire somewhere along the way to the starter is causing it to get excessive resistance from the exhaust heat maybe? Sometimes those things are pretty messed up on the inside even though they look good on the outside.

 

Replaced the starter in the car. So far, so good. Talk about what a PITA that was. Getting the old starter out wasn't so bad. Trying to put the new starter back in the SAME way I pulled the old one out...not so much.