Just exactly what i said. I changed the timing chain on my 91 3.1 v6 Firebird. And everything else from the top end and two fuel injectors under the intake manifold.
Even changed the ECM... But i heard something that just wasn't right. So i pulled a plug wire from the spark plug..no change in the engine idle..I pulled the second..Again no change in idle then the third plug wire..And still NO CHANGE IN IDLE.
750 rpms steady..
What the heck is going on ..This is impossible! !
Anyone ever have this problem..If so i couldnt find it posted.
I hope the answer is out there because the car is falling flat on its face after second gear kicks in.

Gosh i sure need an answer timing has been set TDC.
nothing is clogging the exhaust. new platinum plugs new everything practically...?????help.

all cylinders are hitting btwn 150 and175 lbs of compression. whats going on???!!

 

I assume you mean 750 RPMs?

 

YES i mean 750 rpm's!.
So do you know the answer or are you just correcting my wording today?

I need a real answer not some wise crackin know nothing .....

 

Wow, 3rd post on the bord and putting down a mod for your mistake. Classy

 

i dont know what you mean would you clarify that for me? seriously i am not being a witch i just dont understand what you mean.

 

I hope you can understand that i know i made a mistake. sorry if i seem witchy. I am just so frazzled with this and i am so desperate for some real feedback on this. If there are anymore errors in my spelling or wording please let me know all about it..
But i do hope that somehow i can get an answer to my question.

 

I hope you can understand that i know i made a mistake. sorry if i seem witchy. I am just so frazzled with this and i am so desperate for some real feedback on this. If there are anymore errors in my spelling or wording please let me know all about it..
But i do hope that somehow i can get an answer to my question.

 

never mind i see what your talking about...so besides your spiffy observation ..lol do you have an answer or just some more observations?

 

Members are going to dump you if you keep that up. Time for an apology, then we can move on.

Oops, sorry. I didn't read down far enough and didn't see you'd already taken care of that. So now we can move on.

Jake

 

I'm trying to get a handle on exactly what you think is the problem.

Is it just that you can pull a plug wire and not get the expected drop in RPMs, or is there some other idle/drivability issue?

Jake

 

Yes . The cars also falling flat on its face..
But to go along with that.
The plug wires that were pulled away one by one. All of those wires had spark.
And the engine didn't change at all.
The new ECM corrected a few problems like idle and some of the falling flat on it's face was corrected.
The engine shouldn't even run with this condition. So what do you think it is .
Remember all the things that have already been done in the initial post.
Theres nothing clogging the exhaust the compression has been checked.
By all measures it should be running properly but its not..
especially if its not running on all 6 cylinders.
Thanks for taking a sec to think about this and tell me what you think.

 

All 3 plug wires that have spark. were pulled away and the engine didn't change a bit. Thats just weird.And its not right.

 

I take it to mean (car's falling flat on its face) that the engine is not accelerating car as it use to or should; acceleration seems flat.

Are there any accompanying symptoms?

Is the system throwing any error (Check Engine Soon) code(s)?

Has there been any other recent work done on the engine? If so, what was the reason?

Did you change JUST the chain or the complete timing chain set?

Any back-firing or popping in the exhaust?

Does the engine run now or is it dead in the water?

You wrote of changing the timing chain. Did the problem you're now having exist BEFORE the chain change or begin AFTER? Often, when something goes wrong after making a change, if you go back to the last thing changed you'll find the cause.

I'm now wondering if the camshaft gear and the crankshaft gear weren't correctly matched when the chain was changed. Being one-tooth off would account for dramatic loss in power if the new chain was installed in a way that put the cam in the retarded position.

Another thought is to check the Throttle Position Sensor voltage readings. To check that all you'll need is a digital volt meter.

I haven't worked on V6 engines, been a V8 guy all my life, so the procedures and specs for a V6 are foreign to me. What I'm doing is extrapolating what I know about L98/LT V8s to your engine. Some of it will apply but other things won't.

I haven't checked but is there a separate board here on 3rdGen for V6 engines? If so, I'll bet you'd get more/better info there. If not, we'll keep plugging away at this.

Jake

 

I just wanted to make sure you really mean 750 RPM and not some high RPM idle, or the tach being stuck at 7500 RPM.

Also, you did not really give enough info for me to make any judgements. Im not a mind reader, so for future reference, be specific in your posts and dont leave out details. It makes it harder for the rest of us to help if we have to drag all the details out of you. It also makes it less likely that you will get help with your problems.

Make sense?

 

magnetic pick up is bad in the dizzy, they don't often faill 100%, they will just lose half. Had it happen before on my V8.

 

Yes it does make a whole lot of sense to me. Thanks and once again Sorry.

 

Yes thats right the car is not accelerating properly. Its falls down on its face going into Drive. After the second gear.

There are no codes coming from the car now.The ECM has been replaced. So maybe the new ECM (car) needs a drive to get any of the newest issues in code.
All the codes that were coming up prior to this.

All parts related to those codes have been replaced.

The complete timing chain set has been changed. Meaning the chain and two gears. That was changed because the chain was almost stretched beyond its limit. ..By that i mean that the chain didnt break down enough to blow the engine.

A little backfiring now as opposed to the whole lot of backfiring it was doing before the chain was changed.

The engine is running and all cylinders are running at almost perfect compression. Between 150 and 175 lbs.

The engine like i said is running and holding what sounds like an almost perfect idle. Give it gas rev it up a little and you may hear a
little back fire but like i said earlier on . Its not like it was before the chain set was replaced.

you should have seen the chain..lol the gears had embedding marks from the old chain. The old chain was so loose it was amazing i made it as far as i did.I was definitely living on borrowed time then. Thanks to the tension guides i made it without blowing up a perfectly good engine.

Before the chain change it was a labor to get the car up to the speed of 40mph.
Before the chain. Giving it gas sometimes made it seem like it was gonna konk out on the spot and die.
so i would have to pull off the accelerator and give it a sec for the car to catch up. now its not doing that.

I used the old paper clip trick . But i had a 10,000.00 dollar scan tool looking at my codes and that didn't give me any better info than the flash codes my dash gave with the paper clip.
Food for the thought of ever buying one. Only makes sense if your in the business.
I could never afford it anyway..lol

Any how thats all i have to answer your questions.


And i must say ..I would be proud too.
West Point is for the BEST not too many make the grade.

My father was the only Canadian ever allowed inside West Point at that time.
He's since passed and is buried at Bushnell in Florida.
God Rest His Soul he passed the day before Memorial day 2007.
I miss him so.

I hope to have my car running again in a way that i can drive it normally..lol THANKS.
I hope to get this straightened away. And again THANKS.

 

Nope there isn't a board that deals with the V6 model.
If there is i cant find it anywhere. I honest to godly looked.lol

 

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/v6/

 

 

Thanks I looked too. But i guess i was looking in the wrong spot.
That could be a big help too me so i want to give you a big THANKS!

 

Do a quick check of the fuses for the injectors and the fuel pump if one fuse blows the other will still run the 3 injectors that are working and the fuel pump . If both fuses are good I would trace the wires for the injectors on the side that isn't running and see if you have a bad spot in the wires or a break in the circuit .

 

Thanks But I am not having troubles with my fuel injectors. I think its a little too much to retype so if you read the first post you would know that i am talking about the car running on only three cylinders
blah blah blah..Its all in the initial post.. so if you get a sec read it.

Thanks for trying to help me out with my 3.1 v6 .I am not trying to race the thing i just want it running properly. lol If that will happen in the near future i will be ever so greatful.
I miss my ride. More than anything you can think of. Amd i am sure we can all think of some pretty cool stuff .

 

You said that you only replaced two of the injectors. Why not the rest? Its hard to say if it was a problem before as the TC was totally shot. But, it sounds like a fuel issue. It could also be spark. Does the engine misfire under load? Or is it more of a severe hesitation? If you suddenly mash the gas down, does it backfire out the intake when it tries to crap out? Have you checked the fuel pressure?

The MAF is also a possible suspect (if it has not been replaced yet). Bosch MAFs where not known for their reliability. You may want to try cleaning the wires in the MAF if its original. severe deposits will cause the engine to run lean as they insulate the wires, and cause false readings. You can buy MAF sensor cleaner from most autoparts stores.

 

You say you have spark on the three that aren't running then check your wires to the injectors on that side or the fuse for that set . If you have spark at those three and compression then your not getting fuel . I say again check the wires and the fuse for that side .

 

I'm betting you'll get better results on the V6 board since someone there has probably experienced what you're going through.

My timing chain question was prompted by my concern that the dots weren't properly aligned when you made the timing chain repair. Since there's so much involved to verify they're correct I'd first check the more obvious and easier to check things before diving back into the engine again.

Injector fuse? LT1 Vettes have two, but I don't know about V6s.

I also don't know about the noid light injector test we run on the V8s as to how they're run on the V6. 'Are the injectors firing and are all the cylinders getting spark to the plugs' are two basic questions in need of an answer.

As I wrote before, I'm in uncharted waters here, not ever having worked on V6s.

You can use copy and paste of your previous posts and place them on the V6 board. If you don't get the help you need there, try other Forums for the help you need. A GOOGLE, EXCITE, BING, etc search will turn them up for you. I'm a member on about 10 different Forums but, to be honest about it, I've never checked to see if any of them have V6 boards.

When you finally get this solved, be sure to drop back by and tell us what the cause was.

Best of Luck and Thank You for your kind comments Re: West Point.

Jake

 

All TPI V8 and MPFI V6 Camaros and Firebirds have two fuses for the injectors and the fuel pump if one blows the car will run on one side because the fuelpump is still getting power but one side of the engine is not fireing the injectors .

 

To make a long story short It winds up being the FPR and
That fuel pump i hooked up to it
(see newest revised thread https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/v6/5...ml#post4657446)
swirled around some junk in my tank so i need new injectors too.

Good thing for SouthBay injectors and the current %10 discount. I can get 5 injectors for 90 bux.with a 3 year warranty on all reman injectors.
5 because thats all i will need. The 6th was a different brand.
NO I AM NOT AN ADVERTISER..Just someone who knows
that's a darn good deal. And i found it here. Even better.
Spreading the word.. .
Because that's the deal of the century as far as i am concerned...!

Anyway I wanted to thank everyone for their input.
THANK YOU!

 

this what happened to my car after it sat for 6-7 years
let the car warm up
get somebody to hold the gas around 2500 rpms and take a spary bottle with water and spray the water in the engine while its running
run the car a while after doing this

 

You could use a screw driver (Long) and put the tip on each injector one at a time and put the handle to your ear and you could aleast hear if they are firing. Try it on the ones that are working then the others you should here a clicking sound if they are firing.Hope this helps.

 

Thanks for the suggestion.
I didnt think i was clear enough and the typo of 7,500rpm's ..
That was meant to say 750 rpm's.
Thankfully it isnt running 7,500 RPM's that would be just a whole new can of worms. LOL!
I appreciate the thought.

 

I wanted to thank you for your suggestion ..But i think you missed the part that said i am getting spark from all of the wires.
The end result was the FPR.
If you want .You can visit the revised newest thread that gave a much better idea of exactly what i was going through.
And no typo's LOL!
Here's the link
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/v6/5...ml#post4657446