Hey, everyone. I've been lurking on this board for a few days, but I've decided to make an account and actually ask some questions.

So, some background. I'm currently a relatively poor student preparing for transfer to a 4-year university. I've been driving for a few years, but the fact that I've been doing it in my father's rickety old '89 Dodge van is inconvenient and somewhat humiliating, on multiple levels.

I had been planning to just buy a beater Civic or Accord like every other student, and quietly drive it into the ground commuting, but I've wanted an old car ever since I was a kid - I just never really bothered looking into it, since I assumed older cars would be prohibitively expensive.

I've noticed a few third-generation Firebirds on craigslist that are competitively priced and allegedly operational. Repair costs for the Firebird, apparently, are not far off from a Civic's, I'm told they're easier to work on, and the difference in mileage is frankly not terribly important to me.

There are two potential issues here:

One is that I don't yet know how to work on or repair cars myself. I can build, rebuild, repair, and maintain a computer in my sleep, but I've never had a car of my own to work on, so mechanics is just a skill I've never acquired. I've always wanted to learn, though, and I've heard vehicles like the Firebird are great for learning.

The other is that I'm on a tight budget. Currently, the money I am able to spend on a car is in the $3000 range. That said, I'm living with my family probably until early 2016, so I have no real bills to worry about and bankrupting myself is only a serious problem if I become unable to drive.

What advice might the contributors of this board have for me? Is purchasing a third-gen Firebird a good idea for someone in my situation? How much would I need to spend?

Also, I know everyone says to avoid salvage titles at all costs with newer cars - is that true of older vehicles, like these? I'm aware that one should always avoid cars with potential structural damage, like those involved in head-on or high-speed collisions, but is it worth checking with the owner to see what the nature of the salvage title is?

(For clarity's sake, I'm in the Los Angeles area, specifically located in the Antelope Valley/Lancaster.)

 

I bought an old '82 Firebird when I was 16 as my first real car, got a v6 from an '86 Camaro for it and put the Firebird intake on it (I had the Firebird engine, it was just blown).

The fact you don't know how to work on cars is kind of a big deal. I think you should get something as a beater to drive and the Firebird as a project. Otherwise you are going to be up **** creek without a car to drive when your Firebird breaks and you can't fix it.

Question; do you want to learn cars or just drive something cooler than the old truck? If so, buy a Firebird on the cheap, no engine or trans, then buy those separate and put it together yourself. I did that the summer between my freshman and sophomore year. Learned ALLOT.

If you aren't serious or just don't care to learn how to work on cars, then buy the absolute best Firebird you can afford so you only need to learn how to do the most basic routine maintenance stuff on it.

 

Honestly? Not really. Yes, they can be reliable and they are easy to work on. If you get a V8 version, the SBC will pretty much run forever with regular oil changes and maintenance.

However, even at its newest, you are talking about a 23 year old car. After 23 years, if things aren't kept up on, you are going to need some items. The diff fluid is probably sludge, the automatic transmission is nearing its last shift and the fluid is probably black and burnt. The valve seals on the heads are likely worn and it will consume oil a bit. The steering box is likely worn out with a ton of play.

About 10 years ago, they made sense. Now, you have death traps and future collector cars. The cars in decent condition are out there, but depending on where you live are likely far away. For a younger guy with not a lot of money in need of a daily driver they don't make sense.

Not to say that it isn't a blast to own one if you are into these types of cars, but they can get expensive.

 

If you're moving away to an out-of-town school and living on campus, you do NOT need to be buying a car like one of these, or ANY OTHER antique, for that matter.

It's simply the wrong life stage to be taking on that particular challenge.

Most colleges won't even let you CHANGE THE OIL in the dorm parking lot, let alone do any kind of significant repair work.

Your priority at this point in your life, your ONLY priority I might add, is your education. There'll be plenty of time after that's done to take on other things, and THEN, one of these cars could be a TERRIFIC thing to do.

Right now though, I'd classify it as a whole-life-FOREVER-ruining mistake to make. Don't do it.

 

I got one as my first car August of last year. My advice would be to really check out the condition of the car and don't get caught up with the first one you see. Don't get me wrong, I love my 'bird, but I could have saved a LOT of money if I had gotten one that didn't require so much work. I'd definitely suggest having the option of driving someone else's car for a few days in case one of the more major repairs comes up. Also don't forget to factor in cost of tools for repairs. A good jack and jackstands especially are invaluable, along with a host of other tools (harbor freight is a homebrew college mechanic's friend). If you really check out the car before buying, these cars are a blast.

PS. If your state requires emissions, it would be good to get proof that the car passes before buying. I didn't and it involved 5 or 6 trips to the testing facility and eventually an engine swap before I passed; old engine got rod knock in the middle of trying to get it fixed .

EDIT: And I forgot to mention, as a college student also, you MUST have somewhere that you are allowed to work on the car for it to be economically feasible. Although my apartment allows for some work to be done, for a lot of the repairs I've been driving down about 100 miles to my parents place to use their indoor garage. Having to take it to shops to fix it will eat up your cash right quick.

 

Good Christ sofa

He is right tho if you are going to be living on campus. I hadn't thought of that.

 

 

In CA the seller is required to smog the vehicle and it must pass to be registered, period. Unless he buys something that's non-op'd.

 

Yeah I'm serious... we're talking about the potential for a difference between success and failure of an EXPENSIVE education. If you think student-loan payback is going to be a b¡tch, just wait until you're trying to do it without having completed your degree, because futzing with some car got in the way... or worse, because it kept you from even getting to class at all. What a kick in the nuts.

Yes I have adult children and went through some of the same crap with them.

 

I was in the same boat as you. I had an old volvo with a good amount of miles. Before my second year I bought my 86 trans am with 124k very well maintained by a car guy for 2 grand. Mind you, a month later I replaced the entire cooling system, ac components, tires, brakes, starter and other misc items. Even well maintained thirdgens need work somewhere. I go to a relatively inexpensive school. About 3k a semester. And my upd allows oil changes and other repairs.

I use mine for responding to the FD as well. And I make the 300 mile treck when the dorms close. Is it practical? Not really. A hell of a lot of fun though and you get great at replacing things. You need to be comfortable with fixing it and understanding of its age!

 

I have 2 cars now. One is a Suzuki. Its been reliable, and its great on gas. Then I have the firebird lol. I love the car to death but it is not practical as your only car. I have 2 cars because I can't count on the firebird to always be good to go. So unless you can afford a good car to get you around when the next thing breaks on your firebird(and it will, its an old car) I would recommend waiting.

 

Listen to sofa.
My daughter's first car was/is the 86 in my sig. When we got it, it was perfectly maintained. She drove it throughout high school, and I maintained it.
When it came time for her to go 175 miles away to college.......no way! Even with it as good as it could be, still too much gamble without me being close.
She took the 2009 Cobalt to college and never had any worries about a car. Now that she's on her own with her own house, she has the car again, 500 miles away from me, and understanding WHY I didn't let her take it to college with her! But it's all good; she now has the financial resources and flexibility to fix issues as they arise

 

^^^^^What they all said!

Get a good running Honda or something. A 3rd gen for your purposes does NOT make sense at your stage. Get one down the road and build and learn from it. School is more important than worrying about you car breaking down on the 14 coming back from LA.

These cars need to be in tip top shape in the cooling department.

PS: I lived there for 23 years and it gets REALLY FREAK'N HOT in the summer in Lancaster/Palmdale/High Desert area.

 

Believe me, I know. A used car with no A/C is a dealbreaker here. I broke down on the 14 in the summer as a kid; I don't care to repeat that experience.

I appreciate the advice, everyone. I'll continue looking into boring yet reliable cars, and leave the cars with character for later.

 

I have been a gm fan all my life, that said with your budget look at the mustangs 1999 and up, at least around here in Kansas a v-6 mustang can be had for under 3k with 100 to 130,000 miles. I bought my second daughter a 1999 mustang v6 with everything working and she was the 3rd owner about 4 years ago for $2700 in the last 4 years I have only replaced the battery and done oil changes for her.

A life long friend of mine bought his son a 1998 mustang v-6 for 2500 bucks and he has tore the hell out of the engine and it's still holding together at 200,000 miles, he just hot rods that little v-6 hard, he is also building a 302 for it to drop in this summer, it got him thru college as well with little money
put into it, he probably has had it for 4 years anyways.

A co-worker has had two of them them 99/00 gave one to his daughter
she didn't like it in the snow so he sold it for 3200 bucks and then bought another one on a good deal, did some work to it and flipped it for about a 500 dollar profit, I think he sold it for 3500.

So I myself have been impressed with the little mustang v-6 cars of this age
98-00, I think the body lines changed in 99- my daughter liked that year and newer better.

Save the bigger v-8 stuff for later, I had killer v-8 stuff in my teens but I never went to college, just forged my life thru welding and fab work and was self taught mechanic from 14 on.

My son sports a 3rd gen for a first car, but we put it together over 2 year period, then the car got faster and getting less streetable by the month, so he now has a jeep grand cherokee to drive straight 6, it get way better gas mileage, he has another year left in high school and with his part time job he can barely afford the 3 gen on fuel and speed parts. If it wasn't for my knowledge and shop and tools, he would be up --it creek on trying to build or maintain and healthy sports car.

 

Dude! Did you forget which forum you're on? ....lol!
.
.
Just kidding


IMO, the 4th Gen F-bodies from 1995 and up with the 3.8 V6 fall into that category too. If you find a well-maintained one like I did for my son a few years ago, they'll generally go trouble-free a lot longer than a beat-on and higher priced V8 version will. And they're cheap, even in nearly perfect condition!
Unlike the '86 3rd Gen, I'll have no issue with him taking this car away to college.

 

I hadn't considered newer Mustangs. I checked Craigslist, and they do seem competitively priced - the issue I've had with most Accords and Civics is that everyone knows they're reliable, so the prices are often inflated. I live in LA County; everyone needs a serviceable daily driver.

How are they on repair costs? According to Repairpal, most of the costs are about in line with other vehicles in my price range, save the clutch replacement and head gasket replacement, both of which can apparently be expensive. (I'm not looking for a manual, though. LA traffic has to be considered. Also, I've never had the chance to drive a stick.)

A neighbor of mine who flips auctioned cars for a living said he has a 2001 Infiniti with about 160k miles he's selling for about $2000 - I'm guessing he means an I30, but I'm still waiting on the photos and VIN. I'll consider it, though the miles are somewhat high. It's a rather boring car, but I hear they're reliable, comfortable, and quiet even at high speeds.

I'd like a daily driver that performs well and isn't incredibly boring, essentially. I can live with boring, but if I can work with a car that has some style without it costing more than I can afford, that's preferable.

About the most demanding thing I need a car to do is be able to accelerate to 75 mph in a few seconds - merging onto the 14 South can be brutal when a semi is speeding in the right lane. For me, performance is a quality of life and safety concern - driving a giant, slow van is rather terrifying in traffic, since it accelerates, brakes, and turns poorly, all while having poor visibility and taking up a large amount of space. I'm not planning on racing anyone!

I do see a few Mustangs on Craigslist that are in my range, but several are 5-speeds and I don't know how to drive stick. I'd like to learn, and it sounds relatively easy - if I can figure out aircraft prop pitch, I think maintaining the RPM of a car's engine can't be much different. Replacing the clutch is apparently astronomically expensive, though.

The 4th Gen Firebirds aren't nearly as pretty as the 3rd Gens, I'm afraid. If they are good vehicles overall, though, I'm willing to consider them. In my opinion, performance is more important than fuel efficiency - it's maintenance that I'm worried about. Fuel costs are predictable, and for all the complaining about pricing, gas is cheap. Having to do repairs that cost half as much as the car during, say, finals doesn't really excite me, for obvious reasons.

And, I do apologize if this is getting off-topic for this forum. I'm fairly short on car-savvy contacts.

 

"The 4th Gen Firebirds aren't nearly as pretty as the 3rd Gens"

Your right, they ain't pretty......they're MEAN!
I have 3rds and a 4th, best of both I guess

 

Get you something 4 cyl air conditioned and reliable for college. Then when you graduate you can probably buy a nice 3rd gen of your choice. That's what I done. Sold my Formula and bought a Nissan. As soon as school was over and I went to work I got a nice 82 Z28 Pace Car, and 3 more 3rd gens since then. Get that education man and all else will fall in place.

 

What are the maintenance costs on the 4th gen V6 Firebird like? I've heard that 4th gen Mustangs have very pricey parts and get costly to repair quickly, though I have also heard that they are otherwise reliable.

4 or 6 cylinders is fine, as long as it's reliable.

 

Get whatever car you really want, all cars need maintenance even the "reliable" Honda's I've had many cars and the only 2 cars I've had that ever had catastrophic failure was my Honda accord and my ford f100. So just because it's a Honda Toyota or whatever doesn't mean it's going to be trouble free. I havent driven my third gen as a daily driver yet but I have had an 80s gm product as a daily driver and it was one of my favorite and trouble free cars I have owned. Was a 87 blazer that thing was my college car and it wasn't over of my life's biggest "mistakes " as others on here may have you believing. If you can find a third gen in decent condition go for it. Don't be scared off by other people's opinions on here. Be smart get someone who knows a thing or two about cars and get yourself a third gen, peace

 

sgp, a tip for you:
Help yourself out by using some punctuation. More people will take you seriously and actually read what you're saying. You make a good point.

 

To be completly honest, the car does sometimes leave me with about $10 left for the rest of the month when something breaks lol.. But to be honest, this car is just as good as my gfs Honda accord. Besides amenities such as air bags and heated seats lol. Same mpg, same level of maitenece. Cheap HP and safety is def a fourth gen. Mean cars with more stock HP, and you still own a cool car and they're almost as cheap as these cars too

Edit: before I get destroyed, let me mention that it may just be my car that has a pretty good maintenance track. I know old muscle cars get beat on a lot and can need a ton of love