Fear the evo, not the wrx sti!
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Fear the evo, not the wrx sti!
I went to Englishtown today and saw evo's eating up the track with VERY impressive times. The sti's were aweful, lucky if the ones using nitrous could even trap faster than 108, the evo's on the other hand... well let's just say that there were more trapping over 111mph than under. The average was mid 12's at 111mph, some with slicks cutting 1.6 60's and getting into the 11's. There was even an evo that ran a 10.7 but has had a best of high 9's. That was an exception but seriously, those evo's SCOOT from just increased boost! I'm amazed at how they were putting so much power to the ground with only 2.0L (wrx sti's had 2.5 flat 4).
So if you see a WRX, eat it, Sti, be sure you run in the 13's, and the evo, be in the 12's or you could be in for a big suprise.
So if you see a WRX, eat it, Sti, be sure you run in the 13's, and the evo, be in the 12's or you could be in for a big suprise.
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EVOs are significantly slower than STis when stock. Most Evos I've seen at the track aren't all that fast. The reason there are more fast Evos than STis is because the 4G63 motor has been around for the past 10 years or so, while the STi is relatively new. Its a lot more expensive to make an STi fast, but they've got more potential.
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You're giving the Camaro guys out there bad information. The stock STi will eat a stock L98 like that 7 yr old Tiger "Montecore" ate Roy!!! Either one of these cars, the Mitsu EVO or Subaru STi will put at least a car length on you out of the hole with Turbocharged All Wheel Drive. The '05 WRX Sti has 300 hp, 300 lb. ft. of torque, turbocharged 2.5 DOHC boxer engine, 6-spd and AWD. What does an L98 F-Body have? I don't know exactly what the 0 to 60 ft numbers are, but GM guys are going to need slicks to stay with it. I think a good running L98, LT1 or LS1 on drag radials or slicks with a 75-125 hp shot of nitrous on the top end would beat these 2Fast2Furious wannabes. If you do have a street race with one of these Imports, try to get him to do a few dry hops. Hopefully he'll break a U-joint, axle or something just like the old Mitsubishi AWD cars would do with too much grip.
Last edited by Nitrous Al; Sep 12, 2004 at 05:35 AM.
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Originally posted by Nitrous Al
You're giving the Camaro guys out there bad information. The stock STi will eat a stock L98 like that 7 yr old Tiger "Montecore" ate Roy!!! Either one of these cars, the Mitsu EVO or Subaru STi will put at least a car length on you out of the hole with Turbocharged All Wheel Drive. The '05 WRX Sti has 300 hp, 300 lb. ft. of torque, turbocharged 2.5 DOHC boxer engine, 6-spd and AWD. What does an L98 F-Body have? I don't know exactly what the 0 to 60 ft numbers are, but GM guys are going to need slicks to stay with it. I think a good running L98, LT1 or LS1 on drag radials or slicks with a 75-125 hp shot of nitrous on the top end would beat these 2Fast2Furious wannabes. If you do have a street race with one of these Imports, try to get him to do a few dry hops. Hopefully he'll break a U-joint, axle or something just like the old Mitsubishi AWD cars would do with too much grip.
You're giving the Camaro guys out there bad information. The stock STi will eat a stock L98 like that 7 yr old Tiger "Montecore" ate Roy!!! Either one of these cars, the Mitsu EVO or Subaru STi will put at least a car length on you out of the hole with Turbocharged All Wheel Drive. The '05 WRX Sti has 300 hp, 300 lb. ft. of torque, turbocharged 2.5 DOHC boxer engine, 6-spd and AWD. What does an L98 F-Body have? I don't know exactly what the 0 to 60 ft numbers are, but GM guys are going to need slicks to stay with it. I think a good running L98, LT1 or LS1 on drag radials or slicks with a 75-125 hp shot of nitrous on the top end would beat these 2Fast2Furious wannabes. If you do have a street race with one of these Imports, try to get him to do a few dry hops. Hopefully he'll break a U-joint, axle or something just like the old Mitsubishi AWD cars would do with too much grip.
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Originally posted by carlover01
evos are overrated IMO, ive never seen an STI around here break 13s
evos are overrated IMO, ive never seen an STI around here break 13s
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It's really simple... evo's with more psi = ganna hand you your *** if you aren't in the 12's.
What are people talking about LS1's and stock vs stock... I just said in my first post that the evo's are increasing boost and getting well into the 12's. If that doesn't put a little doubt into a thirdgen owners mind then you need a reality check because that's fast no matter how you chew it.
Another thing, only 1 car broke down and it was an Sti, evo's were doing very well.
The evo's saving grace is it's all wheel drive, perfect gear ratio's, good weight transfer, and inline 4 that's SO easy to modify.
Stock you would see that the evo's are still beating the Sti's in everything (1/4, 0-60, 60-0, skidpad, slalam, gas milage).
The Sti's motor's do have more potential but the intake manifolds are complicated like the old 300z's and the tuning of a flat 4 is much harder (emissions wise).
What are people talking about LS1's and stock vs stock... I just said in my first post that the evo's are increasing boost and getting well into the 12's. If that doesn't put a little doubt into a thirdgen owners mind then you need a reality check because that's fast no matter how you chew it.
Another thing, only 1 car broke down and it was an Sti, evo's were doing very well.
The evo's saving grace is it's all wheel drive, perfect gear ratio's, good weight transfer, and inline 4 that's SO easy to modify.
Stock you would see that the evo's are still beating the Sti's in everything (1/4, 0-60, 60-0, skidpad, slalam, gas milage).
The Sti's motor's do have more potential but the intake manifolds are complicated like the old 300z's and the tuning of a flat 4 is much harder (emissions wise).
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Don't worry about the STi's, they're slow. Even when modded, they're still slow: Modded Sti vs 03 Viper on DR's
And to the original poster: Combine V8 torque with a nice stall and sticky tires and the EVO and WRX just lost any advantage they ever had.
I've watched "12 second" EVO and WRX's get molested by minor bolt-on LS1 cars. Don't let the ETs fool you. Street racing is different.
EDIT: And how is this Thirdgen related?
And to the original poster: Combine V8 torque with a nice stall and sticky tires and the EVO and WRX just lost any advantage they ever had.
I've watched "12 second" EVO and WRX's get molested by minor bolt-on LS1 cars. Don't let the ETs fool you. Street racing is different.
EDIT: And how is this Thirdgen related?
Last edited by Marc 85Z28; Sep 12, 2004 at 05:37 PM.
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Originally posted by Marc 85Z28
Don't worry about the STi's, they're slow. Even when modded, they're still slow: Modded Sti vs 03 Viper on DR's
And to the original poster: Combine V8 torque with a nice stall and sticky tires and the EVO and WRX just lost any advantage they ever had.
I've watched "12 second" EVO and WRX's get molested by minor bolt-on LS1 cars. Don't let the ETs fool you. Street racing is different.
EDIT: And how is this Thirdgen related?
Don't worry about the STi's, they're slow. Even when modded, they're still slow: Modded Sti vs 03 Viper on DR's
And to the original poster: Combine V8 torque with a nice stall and sticky tires and the EVO and WRX just lost any advantage they ever had.
I've watched "12 second" EVO and WRX's get molested by minor bolt-on LS1 cars. Don't let the ETs fool you. Street racing is different.
EDIT: And how is this Thirdgen related?
LS1 cars... ummm I'm talking thirdgens here, not rare engine transplants into thirdgens
.Modded LS1 cars... yes, again, THIRDGEN.ORG, hello, anybody home.
This is thirdgen related, I just said that these cars are fast and will hand a thirdgen it's *** if you aren't careful.
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Originally posted by JPrevost
I'll reframe from calling you names but will you PLEASE read my posts before you reply with said blabber.
LS1 cars... ummm I'm talking thirdgens here, not rare engine transplants into thirdgens .
Modded LS1 cars... yes, again, THIRDGEN.ORG, hello, anybody home.
This is thirdgen related, I just said that these cars are fast and will hand a thirdgen it's *** if you aren't careful.
I'll reframe from calling you names but will you PLEASE read my posts before you reply with said blabber.
LS1 cars... ummm I'm talking thirdgens here, not rare engine transplants into thirdgens
.Modded LS1 cars... yes, again, THIRDGEN.ORG, hello, anybody home.
This is thirdgen related, I just said that these cars are fast and will hand a thirdgen it's *** if you aren't careful.
definatly no slouch of a car..
I'd say they run 13.5's in our elevation
it will definatly take more than sticky tired thirdgen to beat a 300hp 2800lbs AWD car
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Originally posted by Jer82Z28
I agree, my 13sec thirdgen has been beat by two STIs and I consistantly beat LS1's
definatly no slouch of a car..
I'd say they run 13.5's in our elevation
it will definatly take more than sticky tired thirdgen to beat a 300hp 2800lbs AWD car
I agree, my 13sec thirdgen has been beat by two STIs and I consistantly beat LS1's
definatly no slouch of a car..
I'd say they run 13.5's in our elevation
it will definatly take more than sticky tired thirdgen to beat a 300hp 2800lbs AWD car
http://www.disorderlydriving.com/vid...SHOW%20195.mov
Take a look at that Evo and tell me a sticky tired LS1's going to give him trouble, lol. BTW, that was yesterday at e-town.
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Re: Fear the evo, not the wrx sti!
Originally posted by JPrevost I went to Englishtown today and saw evo's eating up the track with VERY impressive times. The sti's were aweful, lucky if the ones using nitrous could even trap faster than 108, the evo's on the other hand... well let's just say that there were more trapping over 111mph than under. The average was mid 12's at 111mph, some with slicks cutting 1.6 60's and getting into the 11's. There was even an evo that ran a 10.7 but has had a best of high 9's.
Last edited by 406-IROC; Sep 12, 2004 at 08:03 PM.
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Re: Re: Fear the evo, not the wrx sti!
Originally posted by 406-IROC
We drove out to Raceway Park too, however... I must have went to grab a burger and fries when those 11, 10 and 9 second EVO's made their run. The only EVO's we seen today were running low-mid 13's.
We drove out to Raceway Park too, however... I must have went to grab a burger and fries when those 11, 10 and 9 second EVO's made their run. The only EVO's we seen today were running low-mid 13's.
The stock evo's are probably 13's but like I said, just increase the boost and that's all it takes to get into the 12's, the rest is driver and alky injection.
What was pathetic was how slow the rest of the day was. The bikes came out in the evening which was cool. Nothing like turbo bikes dipping into the 8's to make you feel slow.
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Originally posted by f-crazy
Stock Vs xtock an LS1 s peed will eat up any stock STi or evo...sure itll get pulled out of the hole, but watch them come rolling by...STi trap at 101-102 LS1 trap at 106-107...That AWD is there ONLY saving grace
Stock Vs xtock an LS1 s peed will eat up any stock STi or evo...sure itll get pulled out of the hole, but watch them come rolling by...STi trap at 101-102 LS1 trap at 106-107...That AWD is there ONLY saving grace
cause while the ls1 might trap higher the ET's are about the same for each stock vs stock
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Originally posted by JPrevost
Stock you would see that the evo's are still beating the Sti's in everything (1/4, 0-60, 60-0, skidpad, slalam, gas milage).
The Sti's motor's do have more potential but the intake manifolds are complicated like the old 300z's and the tuning of a flat 4 is much harder (emissions wise).
Stock you would see that the evo's are still beating the Sti's in everything (1/4, 0-60, 60-0, skidpad, slalam, gas milage).
The Sti's motor's do have more potential but the intake manifolds are complicated like the old 300z's and the tuning of a flat 4 is much harder (emissions wise).
edit: The censor is there for a reason, dont try and avoid it.
Last edited by iroc22; Sep 15, 2004 at 01:21 AM.
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Originally posted by stu
What kind of bull s hit are you spewing here? You really have NO IDEA what you are talking about. The STi is faster in EVERY form of acceleration, the Evo handles better. How can a flat four be harder to tune "emissions wise," what the hell does that even mean? No wonder there is so much bad info on the internet.
What kind of bull s hit are you spewing here? You really have NO IDEA what you are talking about. The STi is faster in EVERY form of acceleration, the Evo handles better. How can a flat four be harder to tune "emissions wise," what the hell does that even mean? No wonder there is so much bad info on the internet.
If I have no idea what I'm taking about then tell the SAE that they're all wrong about cars and tuning
.http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....age_number=6#4
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=607558
Read and you shall be converted... or not, I don't care.
Now onto the tuning of a flat four being harder.... yeah, it's called having 2 cats right next to the exhaust ports pre-turbo. In the world of SAE cats NEED to be lit quickly to get the cars emissions below federal mandate, the Sti had a big problem with this. The inline 4 has all the exhaust ports going into a single manifold into a turbo and then into a cat. This makes more power because the cat doesn't use up any of the heat energy that would otherwise go to the turbo. This has the ability to heat up the cat very fast. Ask any calibartions engineer that knows a thing or two about flat engines and he'll tell you exactly what I'm telling you... they're harder to tune for horsepower because it's harder to pass federal and cali standards.
Want some phone numbers of calibrations engineers, I'll e-mail you their numbers. Last edited by JPrevost; Sep 13, 2004 at 03:22 AM.
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I did not know that about cars where the cat is before the turbo, what does that have to do with it being a flat four again?
Did you even read the article you posted? They are comparing the Japanese versions of the cars you fool! The JDM Evo has more horsepower, and the JDM STi has less horsepower, and a 2.0 motor, not the USDM 2.5.
Here it is for everyone else.
Edit: You clown, I just read the second link. The dispute was about stock for stock, not modified. I already clearly stated that it was easier to make an Evo faster than the STi. The STi doesn't have the market for parts just yet. Also, did you happen to catch this post? I bet you didn't.
One guy said they had to add 150lbs to their Evo just so people didn't complain about it.
Did you even read the article you posted? They are comparing the Japanese versions of the cars you fool! The JDM Evo has more horsepower, and the JDM STi has less horsepower, and a 2.0 motor, not the USDM 2.5.
Here it is for everyone else.
The Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution VIII and Subaru Impreza WRX STi have already hit the market in Japan. So I went there to sample these versions and found that they are quite different from the cars represented here. The Evo felt just as fast from the driver's seat, but exhibited crisper turn-in response. This is the result of Active Yaw Control (AYC) that automatically adjusts torque between the front and rear wheels when it senses tire slippage. Also, the Japanese Evo has a bit more power than our Evo, with 280 bhp and 289 lb.-ft. of torque. The engine comes mated to a 6-speed gearbox. Mitsubishi says that although the U.S-spec Evo and Japanese Evo are very similar now, they will evolve differently from this point on. And in a few years' time, they may become totally different cars.
In Subaru's case, the U.S.-spec WRX STi starts life quite differently from its Japanese counterpart. The Japanese version continues on with a 2.0-liter turbocharged flat-4 that produces 280 bhp and 291 lb.-ft. of torque. Why not the 2.5? Because in Japan, Subaru needs to maintain the identity the production WRX STi has with the WRC race car, whose engine displacement is regulated to 2.0 liters. Although our WRX STi is faster than the Japan car, the handling of theirs felt a bit more crisp. I suspect that the Japan car had fresher tires, and the car's suspension, which is identical to the U.S.-spec WRX STi's, is suited more for the 2.0-liter powerplant than our 2.5.
While I may give the nod to the WRX STi in the States, between the two Japanese versions, I would opt for the Mitsubishi Evo. — SM
In Subaru's case, the U.S.-spec WRX STi starts life quite differently from its Japanese counterpart. The Japanese version continues on with a 2.0-liter turbocharged flat-4 that produces 280 bhp and 291 lb.-ft. of torque. Why not the 2.5? Because in Japan, Subaru needs to maintain the identity the production WRX STi has with the WRC race car, whose engine displacement is regulated to 2.0 liters. Although our WRX STi is faster than the Japan car, the handling of theirs felt a bit more crisp. I suspect that the Japan car had fresher tires, and the car's suspension, which is identical to the U.S.-spec WRX STi's, is suited more for the 2.0-liter powerplant than our 2.5.
While I may give the nod to the WRX STi in the States, between the two Japanese versions, I would opt for the Mitsubishi Evo. — SM
Edit: You clown, I just read the second link. The dispute was about stock for stock, not modified. I already clearly stated that it was easier to make an Evo faster than the STi. The STi doesn't have the market for parts just yet. Also, did you happen to catch this post? I bet you didn't.
So no "normal" evos ran 10's?? I know a white evo from NY with the AMS GT35R kit that's supposed to be 10's full interior.
Originally posted by JPrevost
I'll reframe from calling you names but will you PLEASE read my posts before you reply with said blabber.
LS1 cars... ummm I'm talking thirdgens here, not rare engine transplants into thirdgens .
Modded LS1 cars... yes, again, THIRDGEN.ORG, hello, anybody home.
This is thirdgen related, I just said that these cars are fast and will hand a thirdgen it's *** if you aren't careful.
I'll reframe from calling you names but will you PLEASE read my posts before you reply with said blabber.
LS1 cars... ummm I'm talking thirdgens here, not rare engine transplants into thirdgens
.Modded LS1 cars... yes, again, THIRDGEN.ORG, hello, anybody home.
This is thirdgen related, I just said that these cars are fast and will hand a thirdgen it's *** if you aren't careful.
And if you meant stock thirdgen, why bother posting? Most here can barely hang with a N/A four banger, much less a boosted AWD street legal race car... This is not some profound news you've broken here.
If you were to make a post about every new car that could hand a thirdgen its a$$ you'd be making posts about Neons, truck of all sorts, even family sedan like the new Accord, Maxima, Altima, Lincolns, Caddys, etc etc.
Last edited by Marc 85Z28; Sep 13, 2004 at 05:10 PM.
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Definition of an STI/EVO a$$ whipping:
Moded LS1 - 12.7 at 112mph
Moded EVO - 12.7 at 106mph
Race from a 50mph roll and witness a beating.
Moded LS1 - 12.7 at 112mph
Moded EVO - 12.7 at 106mph
Race from a 50mph roll and witness a beating.
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