right out of the box, are TA's or Camaros faster? like a firebird 305 TBI auto, and a Camaro 305 TBI auto, which of the two are faster right out of the box?

 

im sure someone will correct me if im wrong , but im almost positive the camaro has the edge because the ta is heavier , but dont quote me on that

 

the firebirds are actually fast and allways had the edge on the camaro sence the first ones came out in 67' the 4rd gen birds were a little lighter and more aerodynamic

 

should be actually faster and 4th gen should be 3rd gen

 

I remember hearing the complete opposite. But don't quote me on that either because my memory is a little shady (Blunts, 40's, and Bitches will do that to ya )

 

I don't know where u get your information from T68, LOL. The Camaros were faster in the 60's for sure. I think the Firebirds were in the 70's. I don't know about their weight then.

THIRD GEN Camaros are lighter and were usually faster. Especially, the Camaros with TPI were faster because of a better air induction setup.

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89 RS
STILL Looking For:
An 87 IROC-Z28 350 TPI

Yeah I have an RS, but I want an IROC-Z!!



[This message has been edited by IROCZTWENTYGR8 (edited October 31, 2001).]

 

the firebird was allways out there to outdo the camaro, in 67' biggest engine in the camaro was a 396 and the bird a 400 (lighter and more powerfull engine) and could get the ram air engines that killed any of the SS car's, in the 70's in 73-74 pontiac had a SD-455 trans ams and formulas making low 13's stock out of these cars, and dont forget this was 73-74 right in the middle of the smogged era and oil crisis, the camaro could only dream of this power, also the late 70's trans am's could have the WS-6 package, not avalible on the camaro at all. also the firebird got the 400 engine, biggest was the 350 for camaro, also in the 3rd gens better aero dynaimics, and just better looking overall, and the 4th gens the WS-6 cars are about 2-3 tenths faster then the SS cars (better ram air setup and aerodynamics.)

 

It is true that the 4th gen TAs are faster. Everything being equal (engine, trans, rear, etc.) I would think that the Firebird Formula would be the fastest because it doesnt have ground effects. Im not sure how much lighter it actually is but T68 is right about Pontiacs offering the fastest cars (TTA, Firehawk).
peace

 

this is something I heard maybe its true I dont know. But didn't pontiac make the TTA because people were buying more camaros then firebirds ?

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1988 Sport Coupe 305 TBI
K&N
Flowmaster 80


Daily driver:
1988 K1500 5.7 4x4 shortbed flowmaster cat-back gutted cat.
AIM: RyanNH84

[This message has been edited by NHcamaro (edited October 31, 2001).]

 

That is very possible, but the Firehawk ran 13.2, and the TTA ran 13.4. You dont see any stock thirdgen Chevys doing that, but they had very small production numbers. I love Chevy vs. Pontiac talk . But I as far as the posted question, Im sticking with the Firebird Formula as the winner.
peace

 

T68, from 67-69 there was no F-Body faster than the Z-L1 Camaro.

"also the late 70's trans am's could have the WS-6 package, not avalible on the camaro at all."

The Camaros had Z28 suspension.

Actually transamtpi, the IROC-Z is lighter than a Formula by about 40lbs even when optioned, about 130lbs. lighter when base.



[This message has been edited by IROCZTWENTYGR8 (edited November 01, 2001).]

 

the the ram air IV 400 bird's were spanking the camaros left and right then, they were also mass produced, not just a 1 of 5 car, i could get into the limited production ones but that would take alot of space

 

actually to add more a little while back if anyone remebers the mag high performace pontiac and super chevy wanted to have a showdown, it was a 67'camaro VS a 67' firebird, the bird got the 400 like stock and the camaro got the big block 396, they both got the same mods, basically identical except one chevy, one pontiac, the pontiac won 4 of the 5 races they did, the only one they lost was from tire spin off the line, really if you look to it, the camaro may have sold more, but the firebird was allways a better car and had an edge over the camaro./

 

How better?? U say some stupid things and always try to make your opinion sound like fact. Do u know what a Z-L1 Camaro is?? There was no 60's Firebird regular or limited production that was faster. Better, correct?? Not only were Third Gen Camaros (not including special editions since the Camaro didn't have any) lighter, faster (the TPI induction advantage), but the IROC's were the best handlers. That would make them better to me. IROC's are Camaros. Or are u going to tell me they are not?? LOL

U can also compare tests of both cars right here: http://corvettegold.com/musclecars.htm see which they found faster from 67-69 or whatever.



[This message has been edited by IROCZTWENTYGR8 (edited November 01, 2001).]

 

i just dont see many birds around here, cept rusted out 6 bangers...

 

I don't think one of you anwsered the question asked. He's asking about TBI auto cars(base model cars usually). Not 60's, 70's, 4th gens, or IROCs, GTAs any of that.

My answer is that being mass produced, both the cars in question will be pretty close as far as who's faster and that differences in maintence/tune will probably change a car's speed considerably. Take any two cars exact same model/options/driver/etc from the factory. They'll probably have up to .2-.3 sec 1/4 mile differnce in times. Final answer, neither, they're the same speed. Go race those two specific cars in quesion and you'll have your answer.

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14.62@96mph headers, muffler, chip, ghetto stuff, duct tape
89 GTA 305 TPI 5 speed 3.42 gears

 

thanks for getting to the question at hand, but its nice to read about other stuff also

 

The 3rd gen camaros are lighter..faster...better looking.
I'd love a TTA of firehawk or a GTA well I'd take any free 3rdgen.

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You have walked onto the biggest baddest dog porch and you will be dealt with accordingly.

I'd rather be historically accurate than politically correct!

 

"I don't think one of you anwsered the question asked. He's asking about TBI auto cars(base model cars usually). Not 60's, 70's, 4th gens, or IROCs, GTAs any of that."

OK. Camaros are lighter, so u have to figure. If we are talking TPI, Camaros have the advantage again, and in other ways too which I probably mentioned already.

[This message has been edited by IROCZTWENTYGR8 (edited October 31, 2001).]

 

iroc, you know what a bobcat firebird was? how about a Ram Air V? didnt think so, you should know this one, know what cars had the baldwin motion setups? seriously look what was the fastest 3rd gen,...hmm thats right the TTA (yep not an iroc) the formulas were the lightest also, your telling my that big hulk of a nose on a 3rd gen camaro is lighter then the firebirds?

 

oh, also the trans am came out in 69' the z-28 wasnt till' a year later to compete with it

 

and dont forget the TTA was the lightest, it had a V-6, not an 8 so theres the hands down winner, it was the LIGHTEST and FASTEST thrid gen was a PONTIAC

 

id still take my Maro

 

LOL, u are entertaining. U never state fact and still don't know what your talking about. Of course I know those cars, do u, LOL?? Not 1 of them were faster than the COPO Camaro Z-L1. Also, u can also check out the fastest musclecars of each gen in the link I posted before in this topic if u want, see for yourself. Here we go:

"look what was the fastest 3rd gen,...hmm thats right the TTA"

Who was talking fastest special edition?? Not me, before and after the ThirdGen I was, but I was talking regular production for them because of what the dude asked. I know the Firebirds were the fastest because of their special editions in the Third Gen, but not regular production. Those were the TPI Camaros.

"the formulas were the lightest also, your telling my that big hulk of a nose on a 3rd gen camaro is lighter then the firebirds?"

Yes I am. U can't judge something by its looks. Want me to give u the actual factory specs?? Fine.

87 IROC-Z 5.0 5-Speed/base(not optioned): 3,250lbs.

87 Formula 5.0 5-Speed/base(not optioned): 3,383lbs.

There you go.

"oh, also the trans am came out in 69' the z-28 wasnt till' a year later to compete with it"

ROFL, WHERE do u come up with this stuff!?!? The Z28 came out in 67. U have ALOT to learn.

"and dont forget the TTA was the lightest, it had a V-6, not an 8 so theres the hands down winner, it was the LIGHTEST and FASTEST thrid gen was a PONTIAC"

Really, the TTA was the lightest?? LOL, I don't think so.

89 TTA 3.8 Auto.: 3,346lbs.

Does that look like the lightest base Third Gen to u?? LOL, thats what I thought, it isn't even as light as a base IROC 5.0. Also, I like both cars and companies incase u were wondering by the way u typed that last sentence, I just like Camaros and Chevrolet better. Nice try though, really, thanks for playing.



[This message has been edited by IROCZTWENTYGR8 (edited November 01, 2001).]

 

boy you really know nothing and its quite enjoyable reading your posts, i allways need a good laugh! your telling me the z-28 came out on 67? how stupid are you? i think you need to go back and read your history kid,

 

another thing you have to consider with this, is that if you're going to say base camaro, lets go ahead and say base firebird, not TA...

 

and i do have to give it to iroc, the z28 was produced from the first year, 67, and on top of that, the z28 beat any firebird from the same year by more than a second in 1/4 times.....tempest, i think you might want to cite some sources for your info before you go making your outrageous claims....

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86 Sport Coupe
V6 2.8L 173 CID LB8
no mods...not yet
www.geocities.com/tommyscamaro/index.html

 

Didn't the original '67 Z28 have a short-stroke 302 high performance roadracing engine? I seem to remember seeing some times for that being in the 15's in the 1/4 mile. I can't imagine that beating any 400 firebird by more than a second, if at all.

 

ditto thenewguy

 

right, the 302 was a revv engine for road raceing, where its poweband started at like 4,500 and redlined at about 8,000 this is good for oval track and road racing, but horrible on the street and dragstrip, the ram air IV 400 firebirds were low 13 second cars, the 15-16's in the 1/4 with the 302 was about what they did.

 

I have to say this is getting interesting, but turning into a brand war. I think it is important to note that all thirdgens are at least 8 years old. Every car is going to perform slightly different (a few tenths) even from the factory, so time, miles, and maintance can make some "equal" cars perform much differently.

"Factory Freak"- by D.D.M.
(Sorry, inside joke)

peace

 

factory freak

 

actually 85 makes a good point, that most cars really can be faster then the other by things like how the temp. was out that day, what gears the car had, and most importantly who was driving, but from a 3rd gen standpoint givin camaro 305 tpi and trans am tpi, the edge would have to go to the firebird from the aerodynamics, dont forget this was as or i think better aerodynamic then a corvette of the years, and that there is worth a few tenths over the camaro.

 

the z28 for 67 ran 13.75 with a 302, as tested by many car mags...while the firebird 400, with the 400 engine, ran a quick time of 14.02...not quite a second, sorry for misstating that, but still a good 3 tenths....check out iroc's link, its got some good info....

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86 Sport Coupe
V6 2.8L 173 CID LB8
no mods...not yet
www.geocities.com/tommyscamaro/index.html

 

Thanks thenewguy, I'm glad some1 else that actually knows something found this post, there'd probably be many more to tell this guy hes always incorrect too if it was on the H/R board. I'm also glad u guys are liking this, but this guy is either crazy or really annoying. He doesn't know whats what and proves that with each post. I don't know if he's joking or really means the ubsurd claims he makes.

"and i do have to give it to iroc, the z28 was produced from the first year, 67, and on top of that, the z28 beat any firebird from the same year by more than a second in 1/4 times.....tempest, i think you might want to cite some sources for your info before you go making your outrageous claims...."

Thanks, Exactly.

"actually 85 makes a good point, that most cars really can be faster then the other by things like how the temp. was out that day, what gears the car had, and most importantly who was driving,"

I do agree here.

"but from a 3rd gen standpoint givin camaro 305 tpi and trans am tpi, the edge would have to go to the firebird from the aerodynamics, dont forget this was as or i think better aerodynamic then a corvette of the years, and that there is worth a few tenths over the camaro."

Yes, the Firebird is more aerodynamic than the Camaro, but that doesn't make it faster than the Camaro. The Camaro IS lighter base by about 130lbs and has a MUCH better designed intake on TPI cars good for 5-10HP or better. When tested, an optioned out IROC-Z was STILL lighter than a completely base Formula by 40lbs. in 87. The aerodynamic advantage of the Firebird MIGHT be good for 1/2 or 1HP more or less, how fast do u think its going, 200MPH?? ROFLMAO!!!! Thanks for playing again!!



[This message has been edited by IROCZTWENTYGR8 (edited November 01, 2001).]

 

so, sticking to thirdgens, the Camaro was just a SLIGHT bit faster than Firebirds?

 

Yes.

 

sticking to thirdgens, yep, i'd have to agree that the BASE camaro was slightly faster than the BASE firebird, but theyre all fbodies, and theyre so close in every category BASE, bone stock from the factory...it just gets a little more complicated when you start throwing on performance packages, cuz some 'birds are faster, and some camaros are faster, and it varies by year.....

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86 Sport Coupe
V6 2.8L 173 CID LB8
no mods...not yet
www.geocities.com/tommyscamaro/index.html

 

4th gen firebird=3900 pounds 4th gen camaro =3600. you figure that one out

 

Sorry, buddy, but you're wrong on both counts. They are both right around 3400lbs with options. Check out motor trend or car n driver and the new motor trend actually did a SS vs Cobra article so check the camaro weight there.

I know there are subtle differences, but I really don't have a favorite between camaro and firebird. The firebirds have always been a little nicer and have cost more, but ever since chevy engines have powered both cars, THEY HAVE BEEN AND ARE THE SAME CAR. They even look nearly identical in profile through every generation.

Off subject, but I'm getting sick of motor trend--they're incredibly fickle. They did an under $25,000 convertible comparison last year in which they said that the Z-28 was great and the best value you could get. They said that the although the GT outsold f-bodies 4-1, they had no idea why it was so popular because the camaro was so much better. Now they say the SS is only good at straight lines and that the mustang is way better--also check the historical comparison in which the special mustangs like the shelbys are compared to 350 camaros, not the COPO, not even the 396.

 

Thats all BS. If theres 1 thing, Camaros (and Firebirds) are better than M*****gs.