Alright well Im still doing debating on a few things with my budget engine buildup here. My engine was in need of a rebuild because of blowby, blown gaskets, and a badly blown piston ring. When tearing the engine apart, I noticed it was rebuilt once before, BUT badly it seems. I come to find there are 3 different pistons in the block. It was already bored over .030 and had a XE262 cam in it. So now im in the process of the rebuild. The rod bearings and crank bearings look like they need replaced so Im replacing them. The pistons I already got are cast and for 10:1 CR in 64cc chamber head.

Ok now here is what I want from the engine. I want this car to have great street driveability while being able to haul *** some on the highway too, ie hang with some topend cars. So I think what Im saying is MOSTLY the low and midrange power but still have that little extra up top too. I may take it to the track every once in a while too. I'd like to shoot somewhere around low 13's but any faster is always good too. I also hope for some lope too cuz it sounds good, but it isnt necessary I guess. I want at least 350 hp as well but any better is also welcomed.

Now onto the things that probably need to stay for awhile due to lack of money. I will be keeping the stock TC and 3.27 posi gears. The stock chip will need to stay too until I get the money. I will also be keeping the TPI, but just ported as much as possible. I plan on getting a HSR when my budget allows so whatever I do now has to coincide with the eventual presence of that intake.

Still in question about: Ive been set on getting a ZZ4 cam for a while now because of alot of praise it gets on here. Im also debating on whether to port the stock iron L98 heads, get 180cc 64cc Dart Iron Eagles, or the 180/200cc 64cc Pro Action Iron Lightnings. Im really leaning toward the Pro Actions as of right now.

QUESTION TIME!

Ok... 1. Which heads will give me the best power for what I want to do without being overkill or underkill I guess you could say?
2. If I go with the Pro Actions, will the 180cc or 200cc be better for a moderate 350?
3. Will the CR change at all with different things done to the engine or will the 10:1 pistons keep the CR at that with the right 64cc chambers?
4. Will the ZZ4 cam be a good choice for this type of setup or should I go with something different? Cost is a factor in cam choice too.
5. With what you guys recommend, will the HSR prove to do good when I bolt that on?
6. What can I do to make my bottom end stronger for cheap? Im worried with too good of a heads and cam combo, that too much HP may hurt the mostly stock bottom end. I know better bolts and studs help but is there anything else? It shouldnt spin past 6k RPM either so I hope Im fine with cast pistons and stock crank.
7. Will a stock chip be fine for now with this type of setup until I get the money to have one burnt?

Any critizism (sp?) and questions are welcomed as well. I'd like to get this all underway ASAP so hopefully I can get some good and informative responses pretty quick here. Well I think that is all the questions I have for now. Budget on this project is about 1800 to get it back in the car excluding the HSR. I know spending more money for the insurance of a really strong bottom end is always the smartest idea but this just needs back on the road since it was my daily driver. Thanks for the help and sorry so many questions. Hopefully they can all be answered. 5am and time for bed. Im done cramming my mind with car info for the night. :lala:

 

howdy i d say the pro actions ought to do the job for u 180 cc would be alot of streetablitly and then 200s would get more airflow and be a bit quicker. why not get trickflow alum head just for a tad bit more...... the cr wouldnt change all that much if u kept it a the same chamber size 64 cc but however i would have to strongly recommend u get better pistons than cast if u want it to last a long time maybe kieth black pistons would be nice or a set of speed pro pistons. if u had extra... go forged but thats not the case here. zz4 cam should be good if u got the heads and hsr. cams to me determine how much air goes in the heads when the intake opens up. so if u get too much air for the stock tpi system u wouldnt get all that much power out of it. and it should run with a stock chip but u would have lost a lot of potential until u burn a chip when is say lost potential up to anywhere from.5 to one full second. as far as the bottom end... if u want to stay with the stock one id take it to the machine shop get it cleaned and rebalanced with the rods and pistons. but i say save a litte bit more get a cheap crank from summit would do better than stock. i doubt u can reach low 13s the way u want to do it with stock tc and stock chip. hope this helped i doubt it if ya want i ll help ya out i got some parts for sale cheap hughes 2000 stall and cam chip and more email me at daxnutt@hotmail.com later man good luck

 

Great response man. That is what I was looking for. You didnt put me down for not having enough money like some people do and didnt complain to me that Im going to screw myself over in the long run if I dont go with forged this and forged that etc. I have a deal on the 200cc Pro Actions for $725 complete and shipped. The guy said there is PBM products in them that his Pro Speed shop put in themselves. Good deal? That 725 is the absolute highest I will go which is why Im not considering anymore heads at this point. Problem with the pistons is that I already bought them. Ive heard they last long as long as you dont throw over 6k revs at them all day long and dont do too much more than 400 hp or so. So I hope Im fine for at least a year or so when I got alot more money to build a 383. How much would the normal shop charge for a clean and rebalance job? Im going to email you as well dax and see what you got.

Anyone else for suggestions and comments to the questions above I would appreciate it. I need as much input as I can get here. Dont get me wrong, one person's opinion counts, but I'd like to get more to see what others think. Thanks.

 

hey go for those heads sounds good to me. didnt know how long u wanted it to last yeah u can make it last with cast pistons as long u dont go over 6000 rpms shouldnt be a problem having the stock tpi they can only go up to maybe maybe 5500 but the power dies after maybe 5000 rpms so u shouldnt have that problem..... if u went with hsr they can go to 6500. even 7000.... about the rebalance job for my crank and rods and pistons if i remember correctly it costed me 175 dollars at the local machine shop call around and see what they charge.

 

ttt

 

If I were you I would get the 180cc intake runner with the 72 cc chamber if you must get iron heads. The smallish cam and 10:1 static ratio could be a detonation monster with iron heads but just about right with aluminum.

 

""was rebuilt once before, BUT badly it seems. I come to find there are 3 different pistons in the block. It was already bored over .030 and had a XE262 cam in it. So now im in the process of the rebuild. The rod bearings and crank bearings look like they need replaced so Im replacing them"""

Suggest you do a few things, regardless of your budget, prior to assembling your parts.

Any ring groove? If so, you'll need it removed and the cylinders bored most likely. At the minimum, remove the ridge, or you'll be back in it soon.

You mention th bearings don't look good...suggest you have the crank checked, it may need to be turned.

You should have the rods checked too, they may need to be resized.

I think you get a picture of where I'm heading with this, if you just put new parts in a used block, you'll be back where you started sooner than you'd like.

I only mention this because from your post it seems as you're just tearing it down, and installing fresh parts...if you already have machine work in mind, sorry for wasting time.

 

Well Im most likely getting the 180cc runners and 64cc chamber. I already bought the pistons so I'd like to keep it that way. Why do you say I would have alot of detonation? Would the CR be too high or what? The crank to me and my dad looks perfect. I guess I basically am buying a few of the new parts and putting them in. The rods were put in as well with the last rebuild. I could tell because some of them were stamped different numbers. I'd actually just at least like the engine to last me till next year till I go to a 383 and have alot more money. I know it is kind of bad to think of an engine build that way, but if it will last ok for at least that long then Im happy with it. I hope you can answer my question though mainly on the detonation thing though because that doesnt sound too good. Should I resell the new pistons I got and just buy lower CR ones or what will help with the detonation? Is there anything I can do to get rid of that with the plans now? Still looking for more opinions on the questions from the first post. THanks.

 

Just to let you guys no there is NO Pro Action, they are now called Pro Topline. The former company Pro Action is crap, well compared to the new brand it is. And I would go with the Pro Toplines if you're on a budget and for sure get the 180's for mid range. Actually the GM Vortecs might be the better choice, if you don't mind spending money on the intake, but heck you can get the Vortecs with all the upgrades and still have enough money for the intake for the price of the Pro Toplines. Plus the Vortecs have small 170cc intake runners for awesome low mid range tq. I'd still fork out the dough for the Pro Toplines, they're probably worth 20hp over the Vortecs.

 

Thanks for the info but I have already eliminated Vortecs as an option because I eventually want to get an HSR. Maybe Im wrong but I thought there was only a base for the TPI system. Yes I know the Pro Toplines are different but I found a decent deal I would say on the the Pro Actions. By doing a search, it sounds like alot of people like their Pro Actions on this board so Im deciding to go with them I think. Yeah I'd fork out the dough too if I had it, but Im sorry that I dont. I dont even like spending 700 bucks on heads but I figure get good ones now rather than later. To spend half my current budget or more for other heads right now just isnt a good idea if I want to get this running soon. Summer doesnt last too long.

 

i am running an XE262 cam with my performer RPM heads (170CC) and stock ported TPI. its not a bad cam for TPI at all....

 

I agree with 8mike9

 

whoever said to put a HSR on a 305, get ur **** straight before u confuse people on here.

 

slpirocz where did that remark come from? i dont see anything on this thread saying to put hsr on a 305. boy smoking something.

 

Are these iron heads? If so thats a great deal. I paid $850 for my P.T. 200cc aluminum unassembled heads.


The flyer that came with my ProToplines called them "ProAction heads manufactured by Topline Limited" or something to that effect.

 

Dude, there is no more Pro Action, they merged with Topline AE and formed Pro Topline, so if anyone says Pro Action they mean the old heads you can't get anymore. Maybe you can get them still, but who the hell wants them over Pro Topline heads which are new and improved versions of the Pro Actions.

And if you don't want to spend more than $700 on heads then why the heck would you modify anything on your car?

 

Ouch CamaroJoe. Maybe I cant spend much more than that because I do not have a good job. Im sorry I cant spend a ton of money on my car like you can. Please dont look down on me because of that. People with less money than you dont deserve that. I mean honestly. I already stated I know there is no more Pro Action. The person I am getting the heads from said that they are Pro Action heads. Yes I know Pro Toplines are better. Yes I know AFR's are better. Fact is I dont have the 3-4 grand to put into an engine. My plan was to just run my car as it was leaking oil and burning oil, and gradually spend the money on a 406. Unfortunately the engine took a crap before I planned it to and now Im in the situation Im now in.
So now let me get this straight CamaroJoe...are you going to look down on the people that buy Vortec heads for 300 and tell them they are stupid for buying heads like that because they arent a $1300 pair??? And before you tell me you cant get Vortec heads for that cheap assembled...a guy emailed me yesterday stating that he would sell me his for that price. I wish this post wouldnt have turned out this way because I need HELP rather than someone telling me Im stupid for not having enough money to build the ultimate engine. I guess it was my fault for saying that critisizm was welcome. I got what I asked for.

Anyone else besides CamaroJoe with some good critizism to give me or help? I guess you could start with telling me that I dont know how to spell critizism right because I think Im wrong.

 

I think that is a pretty decent deal for those heads. Just the fact that they flow close to the same numbers as AFRs and are 100's cheaper, that means a good deal to me. Plus my heads are assembled and all. I can get 200cc for the same price. I'd rather have the iron heads anyway. If it really isnt a decent price then show me some prices on the same heads assembled with something to compare. Correct me if Im wrong.

 

Why?

 

Well son if you do a search, you will see why. Cost is big with me so I choose iron heads. Iron heads are also capable of making more hp with less timing and compression. Yes the aluminum ones would save a good amount of weight but for someone who is on a budget, I'd definately go with iron heads. Each has there own pros and cons but my choice is the iron heads, but mainly for the price.

 

Sanitariumtour0,

First of all, I didn't mean to insult you by saying "why should you mod your car if you don't want to spend money on heads". If you took this as an insult then I'm sorry. You did say any criticism (correct spelling) was welcome though, so if you're unhappy with what I said, then it's your own fault. I guess I could have said it differently buy my point is sill the same. If there's one place you don't want to skimp on, that's cylinder heads that's all I meant. If you can afford $700 heads, why not save up a little longer for a set that are around $1050 like Trickflows? That's the point I'm trying to make.

Another thing I'd like to say, is don't put words in my mouth. I never said anything about looking down on people that run vortecs as you went on in your rant. I love the vortec heads. I was going to recommend them, but you said you plan on going to the HSR so they won't work. I've been modding my car for 4 yrs, too, It's not that I can just go out an blow my wad on engine parts. I don't by any means have a good-paying job. I plan on that soon, though, as I will have my degree in a year. But as most know, that may or may not mean jack on finding a job.

As far as advice, if you don't want mine then great. But I'm going to give it anyway. If you have to get the engine together asap, and you want it to run good, get the vortecs anyway and forget the HSR for now. That's if you can't spend more than $700. Get the hotcam and upgrade the runners, enough said. Or get the HSR later and some junk heads now and have your car run like $hit. Your choice.

 

Ok bud. Well Im sorry I went on that rant and all. You are entitled to your opinions and suggestions. By no means are the Pro Action heads junk. If you would kindly do a search on here, you will see that alot of people are very happy with them. I based alot of my descision on that. Plus I dont know where you got that the new Pro Toplines are better. They should be the same as someone else already posted in this post. When doing a search, you will find that the Pro Actions were the ones that a year or two ago, people were saying they flow just as good as AFR's. I did my research. Being a guy that is new to getting into performance cars and engines, it is all I have to base my knowledge from. I do research on this website every night so I dont speak out of ignorance at all when I make my points. Pro Actions are good heads so if you think my 700 now is a waste of money then I feel bad for you because you just spent over 1000 on Trick Flows that flow less out of the box than the Pro Actions do. And if I wanted to save up the extra 300 bucks it would take me at least a week and a half more with my job to come up with that and that is before a few small bills I have. So as you can see, my job sucks worse than one may think. I personally think Im being very smart with buying these heads. If you dont think so, then too bad. I'll take all the people on here that are happy with them and all the machine shops that are changing over to only Pro Action stuff now. I'll take those claims any day. That's enough to point me in the right direction. And before you go telling me that there arent Pro Actions anymore, well I have seen a new box that says they are Pro Action heads manufactured by Pro Topline. Sorry if this seems mean but Im only stating my educated point. Thanks

Edit: Sorry I see you dont have Trickflows but I think I stated my point well enough that they arent worth the extra money. AFR's are PROVEN heads but I'd rather go with something that flows just as good out of the box than spend another 500 or so on AFR's. With that extra 500 I could buy the HSR I've been wanting to get. And hey if I had a job that paid more than my 7.50 an hour job then sure I'd probably buy the AFR's but fact is I dont so Im staying cheap while still going fast and getting some kickass heads. Ok guys, I think everyone gets the point about not having enough money and all that good stuff already. hehe sorry.

 

...no one on this board owes you anything. If we help you, its because we do so out of good will - I'm sure none of us have time to waste. Drop the attitude, or people will quit offering you advice. Also, I'm sure no one wants to wade though tales of your personal life to uncover what little tech your post may posess.

That said, the Pro Toplines seem like an excellent head for the money. You can make decent power with them and a small cam (ie Hotcam). I do, however recommend you listen to the others and make sure the shortblock is in order before you even think about touching the heads or cam. Patience is a virtue (translation: save your money and do it right)

Kyle

 

Hey sorry to you too. I guess since we cant really talk face to face, people assume I have a big attitude. I agree that no one owes me anything. It is just that I have seen way too many posts where people offer advice, but the advice they give is to always go bigger, faster, and more costlier. That is not my goal. I appreciate everyones advice, but I dont understand why so many people act that way. Maybe you can help me out??? Giving advice is one thing but if people have to be ignorant about what they post then Im sorry it just isnt welcomed. Ive seen it mainly with the people with 305's and V6's on here. They ask a simple question about wanting to know what they can do to improve performance and someone with a bigger V8 tells them to throw their engine off a cliff. Some people may see that kind of talk as advice but I see it as ignorant. People just have to realize that there are other things in some peoples lives besides building mega buck engines and being as fast as possible. Some people are just looking for a little more performance is all. Personally Im trying to build a fast car with the little money I have. I did state that it is my daily driver as well so I cant have this thing be down for months and months or year after year. It isnt just my weekend driver to the track. Once again Im going to apologize if it seemed rude. I am not trying to be at all so if you take it that way then that is your perogative.

BTW thanks for agreeing with me that the Pro Actions are great heads for the money spent.

 

I would skip the Pro Action heads all together. You said you want to build a 383 in a year or so...Save the $700 you were going to put into those heads, port your stock heads and get a good valve job done. you will see some good performance gains from this and save several hundred $$$ in the process. Then you apply that $700 to the 383 and get some good alum heads for it.

Just my 2 cents worth.

 

Hmmm that may be a good idea Morley. I saw a post from ctandc that stated that with this setup it could be easy to put a third gen into the very high 12's with alot of traction. Considering that, I may not even bother with the thought of a 383 now. I think 12's will be fast enough dont you think? But yeah that is a good idea as far as saving money for the longrun goes. A few people I have talked to suggest to stay with the 180cc runners still for even a 383. Because they flow so well already, they would still be great heads for a 383 still. Plus they still have some porting left in them too right? Do you think it would be just as good to port the Pro Actions at a later date if I ever decide to go with a 383? That was a smart 2 cents worth though Morley. Thanks for the reply. That's what Im looking for.

 

This isnt an attitude? If I do a search on 'How iron heads are better than aluminum', Im not likely to get any results. Im not saying ProTopline irons arent good heads, if thats what you want, then go for it, the only one that has to live with your decision is you.

 

I can see where this thread is going after reading the last few posts by the original poster. Oh well, I gess kindergarten is officially back in session.:lala: :lala:

 

ok childern now back to the project since you got every thing out you might as well Build Your Own Ram Air for very cheep
Here are the supplies and tools I used:
*A few feet of flexible 8" airconditioning duct
*Dremel tool w/ cut off disc
*diagonal cutters
*7 mm socket wrench (I think)
*chalk / thick pen
*rough grit sandpaper or file
and low temp spray paint
Procedure:
*Remove stock airboxes and with a hacksaw, cut off the bottom half. I cut just above the stock intake holes. Make sure to leave enough material on the the airboxes so the A/C hose will stay on
*Take the A/C hose out of its insulation (not necessary)
*Determine where on the air dam the A/C hoses will pass through. The air dam is the plastic piece that originally separated the front of the engine bay and airboxes from the incoming air from the fog lights. You will see it when the air boxes are removed. Just lay the airboxes in their proper location and notice where the ducts will have to go through the plastic.
*Chalk the outline of where the air dam will be cut out so the ducts can pass through.
*With Dremel tool and cut off disc, cut along the chalked outline on the air dam and pop out the pieces just cut out
*Take sandpaper or file and smooth the freshly cut, sharp edges. You don't want the ducts to get cut.
*Install airboxes
*spray the A/C ducts if you want unless you like silver, if you find the right paint it will lower the air temp slightly.
*Take A/C duct and stretch it from the back of the fog light tubes to the bottom of the airbox. Cut off exess. You do not want exess, as that will decrease the ram air effect. The 8" duct stretched right over the airbox. I bought some clamps to hole it on, but they were unnecessary since it stayed on w/o a problem. The duct sometimes blows off the bottom fog light tubes, so it might be a good idea to clamp that down w/ a large zip tie, or metal hose clamp, or a make a hole and put a nut and bolt on there.
* it will pull harder at extreme speeds

 

o ya the overall cost shoud be no more than $30. The air box is around 6' 2/8ths by 6' 2/8ths , from the top of the airbox to the top of the fog tubs is about 6 inches. Fog tubs are 6' 4/8ths wide by 3' 2/8ths tall ... :hail: wish I had time to rebuild my engine:hail:

 

Hey thanks phaledax. You can only do that with a speed density car right? Im not sure if it will work for MAF cars. If you could clear that up for me I'd appreciate it.

WOW...you guys intent really is to make me look like an *** isnt it? I ask simple questions and state why I can spend more money than I am right now and I get shot down. I've stated already that I was never trying to be rude. If I sounded like it, I was sorry for being that way. If you took it that way, then go ahead. I guess I shouldnt even bother apologizing because I bet I'll get ripped on for that too. Im just trying to remain a decent person on the message boards who can give and receive help. Like I said in my last post, I was just fed up seeing it all over this message board that if money isnt being spent the way others want you to or you arent spending enough then you get reamed for it. That's not right now is it? formularpm and camarojoe if you cant contribute to the post at hand please do not turn this into a bad thread. This message board is here for people to learn...not for people to do a search and find that a post that sounds like a good one for their purposes was only a post about people fighting back and forth. formularpm I did a search on "iron aluminum heads" and I got a few pretty good results back. I guess no matter what I do I cant take a few opinions of me away so I'll stop arguing for now since it doesnt get any of us anywhere. And if you notice the posts Ive gotten from the nice people, you'll see I wasnt rude at all because I appreciate their comments and help which is what I need.

 

Sorry to come off as a pr*ck, to answer your original questions...

1. The Iron Eagles and ProToplines flow roughly the same until .500", where the Darts drop off, youll make good power with either head
2. Depending on your power goals, 180cc and 200cc heads will both make good power, if your power goal is under ~400hp Id go with the 180cc Pros, they flow about the same as the 200s until .500
3. Iron L98 heads are 64cc, the static CR should stay about the same, but the dynamic will probably go down with the bigger cam, you may want to consider milling the heads to retain your dynamic CR
4. Call a cam grinder, they can more accurately recommend a cam than anyone on this board
5. The HSR is a top-end producing intake, if you want power from ~2500-6000, get an HSR, if you want power from idle-4500, stick with the TPI
6. Youll likely be good to 6K with the stock bottom end, to be totally honest, any worthwhile improvements to the bottom end arent likely to be too cheap, forged costs $$$
7. I doubt the stock chip will work well, itll likely run very lean with the stock chip, I got my custom EPROM from PCM for less for $150

 

Hey thanks man. You really redeemed yourself there. I appreciate that. I may be wrong but I saw a webpage that showed the Dart Iron Eagles to flow only 218 cfm at .500 and the ProToplines flowed around 260 cfm. Maybe Im wrong on that but I guess I'll do some mroe research on that one. I was really thinking about going 200cc as well, but Ive been told by a few people that 180cc will just give me alot more streetability which is what Im looking for. So formularpm if I dont mill the heads at all will my CR be higher than 10:1? If so is milling something that my dad and I can do in our garage with a die grinder or something? That's all great information you gave there and I will definately use it. Hopefully the post is back on track. I was considering have a mod delete it cuz it was getting way off track.

Anyone else with opinions with how well it will perform with those mods? Ive basically all but ordered these parts so Im going with the 180cc ProToplines, ZZ4 cam and ported TPI for now until I get the money for the HSR. Sound good?

 

Yes I am wrong. I found that the Dart's flow at .400 was 218 and not at .500 so I bet they are still great heads. Ive just heard way more good things about the ProToplines and how good they flow out of the box compared to alot of other heads. So I think my choice will still stand. I dont think I will be disappointed. As long as Im somewhere in the high 12 - mid 13 range, I'll be very happy. Cant you see it already? hehe

AHA...just found some more flow numbers. The ProToplines flow at 249cfm at .400 lift so I think that is a pretty nice gain over the Dart's. That's good to see.

 

Last I heard, Dart was redesigning their heads (at least their iron heads, anyway) because their out-of the box flow was poor and uncompetitive. Darts are made to be ported - you can see that in all the extra meat on those heads. If you want out of the box, go with the Pro Toplines.

 

sounds good to me.... about what sani wants to go with now.

 

Although that may be true in this case (since the 180/200 flow numbers are so alike) it isnt always. Although a smaller port may flow more per cc, often a 200cc will flow enough over a 180cc head to allow you to use a milder cam, make up the streetability, and still make more average power. Something to consider is what gear ratio youve got and if youre willing to dish out some cash for a stall converter...

No, milling has to be done at a machine shop. The machinist simply takes material off the mounting face of the head, which effectivly shrinks the chambers.

Your static compression should stay at stock (~9.5:1) if you get a 64cc chamber.

 

Cool thanks for the replies. I just ordered the 180cc heads so that is what I'll have to go with. I have a 3.27 posi rear and I plan on getting a 2000-2200 stall from daxfas26. Will that be good with the ZZ4 cam? I know the ZZ4 cam's powerband is good for low and midrange so Im guessing a stall of this size wont be too bad of a choice. He is giving me a good deal on it so I cant complain. I just want the driveability to be better and have the engine be more in its power band I guess. I know most of you will say go at least 2400 or so but will this TC be a good one? I know what daxfas26 will say since his opinion will be a little biased. But does anyone else have any input on it?

 

sorry for not replying sooner ive been working, and Im new to the camaro jargon. so i don't know what "MAF cars" are and don't have time to research your question on the ram air right now. but see if this helps. my car is a 1987 iroc-z,automatic and it works on my car. If you find out you still want to do this. E-mail me the questions so i can get around to them a bit latter. E-mail is phaledax@ikillclowns.com (ya it's wird )

 

This all comes down to different people, different opinions, different experiences etc.

As for the Pro Lightning heads ( made by Pro Topline...they still list some heads as Pro Action heads.. )

The 180cc intake runner heads will work very well with the type of combo you are intending to build.

The TPI's strong point is the abundance of torque it makes in the low to mid range...say 2000-4200 RPM...and for arguments sake, with a ported stock intake, ported plenum, let's make it 2000-4800 RPM.

The ZZ4 cam makes it's best power / torque in the same range.

The 180cc heads will support alot of flow in the low to mid range without sacrificing driveability at all.

The 3.27 gears you have will work great, as you do not need any more torque multiplication at low RPM, you'll have plenty on your hands as it is.

The only issue you might have is the fact the heads are 64cc, and the pistons are advertised to give 10:1 w/ 64cc. You might want to try using a tad thicker head gasket to get that compression ratio down a bit.

10:1 IS do able with iron heads on pump gas...but to really make it work well without worrying about detonation, or running premium all the time, you REALLY need to concentrate on getting the quench area on the TIGHT side...this will help greatly with detonation. I learned this the hard way years ago, when I ended up with a mismatched 350 w/ 8.8:1 compression ratio that had spark knock!!! A thin head gasket solved the problem, as the quench area was too big....


WITH some custom chip tuning, I see no reasons why you couldn't see low 13's high 12's out of this combo.

The limiting factor is going to be traction....


Do your best to match the cam, heads, induction and keep them all making their best power in the same basic RPM range, whether it's low to mid or mid to high RPM's, and you will NOT be disappointed when it's all said and done.

Again, there are plenty of people that will disagree with me...that's great. This is just my 2 cents.

HTH

 

:hail: Thanks man. I was waiting for a while for you to post on my topic. So it looks like I picked a pretty decent combo then right? I figured the heads, intake and cam make the most power in the RPM range so they should all match up well. So that is perfect. I also decided to go with a 2000-2200 stall as well from daxfas26 which will work perfect then since my powerband will start around 2000 or so like you say. Yeah the only thing Im afraid of now is traction and not having the money to do it now. Some kid in a Suzuki Esteem thinks he can take me no problem. Im not worried at with my combo whether he put a turbo on there or NOS as the ricers say. Im just worried Im not gonna be able to hook. RIght now I have 245/50ZR16 Dunlop Super Sport 5000's. To me they are a very nice tire but Im looking to get some Drag Radials at least to help with the traction. So what size head gasket is a good one to use to get the CR down some. I want around 10:1 but probably not below 9.7:1 or so. I have a new head gasket now but not sure of the size. I can ask my dad about that. Well with that info you gave there ctandc Im pretty happy about what I picked to go with. Alot of it had to do with your previous posts throughout the past years where you liked this cam and heads alot. Within a few months I will probably be putting on the HSR to get some more topend which I'll need if the more topend effecient cars decide to play with me on the highway. Do you think I'll be running alot better with that on there or do you think my cam is mainly just for lowend and not for top? Thanks.

 

hey guys, i should probably post a new topic since i'm coming out of nowhere, but you guys seem to know what you're talking about and i'd like some input. i have a 89 gta originally a 350 tpi, i'm in the middle of building a 383 with cast scat crank, forged rods, keith black 10:1 hyper pistons. I think i'm going to buy the pro action iron lightning 180cc heads, i already bought the xe274h cam with 1.5 roller rockers (490 lift). i'm going to port/semi siamese the tpi intake (SLP runners, stock base for now). get bigger injectors (also which do you guys think, i was thinking 26lb injectors?), 58 mm throttle body. also i'm going to buy a built 700r4 not sure where yet probably pro-built.net with a 2400 stall would that be high enough with keeping stock 3.23 gearing? i'm looking to keep this car street/strip with more emphasis on the strip part. but i won't be able to trailer the car to the track and that is 2 hours away. i'll end up getting custom tuning at some point and also i don't mind putting premium gas in all the time i used to do it anyways. anyone have any idea what kinda power i should expect and track times with this setup? thanks alot for your help

Jason

 

Jason, Sounds like you have some time to do the car right. Always remember, that you get what you pay for. If I were building a 383 stroker, (which I will be in about 3 years) First I'd get a splayed block for strength. Then my bottom rotating assembly. What kind would depend on the question, NO2??? Anyway, you put a TPIS ZZ409 cam, AFR 200cc heads with 1.6 rockers, and a TPIS miniram intake. You'd also want to beef up your rear end, tranny, and put a 3400 to 3600 stall on it, and you are looking at about 480 crank HP. Same engine but with the TPIS ZZ9X cam and 1.5 rockers and you will have roughly 515 crank HP. Either way the 480 should put 385 hp to the wheels, and the 515 should put 415 hp to the wheels. Yes TPIS components cost a little more, but your performance never suffers, hence, you get what you pay for! Either set up should have you in the mid to low 12's. That is where I'll be once I do my engine swap. Right now I'm stuck paying for the wifes 2001 tahoe. But when it's done LOOK OUT!!! :hail: Here is my car. She is a 1992 Formula WS6. Currently running 13.90 @ 101.3 in the quarter with some bolt ons and 3:73 gears

 

Yeah bud...you would be better off posting that as a new topic. It probably wont get many looks in here. Besides....most people on here know what they are talking about so yeah I'd do your own post. My post is pretty much done with no one responding anymore. It's ok though cuz I got all my parts and building the engine now so in a few weeks I'll just let everyone know how she runs.