Hi all,

I'm having trouble with my GTA (see sig) right now. For the last 2-3 months, I've been having cold start issues with my car. What happens is that when I start the car cold generally first thing in the morning, and sometimes in the afternoon when cold, I don't hear the fuel pump primering (that is, that "whoosh" or "hiss" sound coming from the back when you do a cold start) when I put the key into the Run position just before I start the engine. What happens after that is that when I go to start the engine, the car turns very quickly, and at this point, one of three things happen:

* The engine doesn't start,
* The engine starts, hovers at ~500 RPM, then dies, or
* The engine starts, hovers at ~500 RPM, then slowly starts to increase to 900-1000 RPM over the course of 10 seconds, after which the car will warm up normally.

Oftentimes, I find that the engine just doesn't start on the first try, and I have to keep trying to start it after waiting 10-15 seconds between starts, and then either the engine hovers at ~500 RPM, then dies, or the engine starts, hovers at ~500 RPM, then slowly makes its way to a warm-up idle (~900-1000 RPM).

The strange part is that once I get the engine started, things appear to be fine for a whole trip, although I'd rather not gamble for much longer than I already have.

My first guess is that something fuel-related is starting to go. I had the fuel filter replaced this past Saturday, ran Chevron's Intake Valve + Injector Cleaner and Fuel System Cleaner through the car, put in a new battery, and had the car tuned up back in April, where I switched from Bosch platinum plugs and went to ACDelco Resistor copper plugs. None of this has helped to solve the cold start problem, however top-end performance is up a bit! I've also attached my code scanner to the car and ran a test: it's not displaying any unusual codes. I did notice something strange: on the driver's side fuel rails, there appears to be some damage to it. The best way I could describe it without posting pictures is that it looks like part of it was the victim of a vice grip's wrath, although it was like this when I first purchased the car back in August of 1999.

Any ideas? I'm afraid to take this car into traffic; luckily for me I have an auxilary car to get me to work and back.

If needed for clarification, I can post a small video of the problem in action from the driver's seat point-of-view.

Thanks for any help you can provide!

Jason

 

I dont claim to be any kind of a V8 expert. i am very new to the whole v8 scene. However through checking out a lot of these sites i have come to find out the the mid to late 80s L98s had a ninth injector, also known as the cold start injector. I dont know how much you know about it, but what is primarily supposed to do is supply more fuel to the number 1 cylinder which allows it to fire more quickly. Being that they were having cold start problems with the early EFI motors. That was a synopsis of what i have read in other threads on other boards. I would say you may wanna check to make sure that the wires are not messed up if your motor does have the ninth injector. If it does have the ninth injector and everything seems to be ok with it from the outside, there is a real possibility that it does not get used enough for the injector cleaner to effectively clean it out, so you may want to find a different way of cleaning it... again i am no expert and may not even be making any sense, but that is what I think.

 

being your car is an 89, you will not have the ninth injector.

When you first turn the key to the run position, do you hear the fuel pump prime?
(you can test this easily, just turn the key to run, and listen. or have some one stick their ear to the gas filler, and then turn the key....) If you do NOT hear the pump prime, then chances are your fuel pump relay is having some issues, you could try and just replace it, but, if that does not help, you will have to find out WHY it does not work.....

Try it and see, you can do this test any time, but, if it does not work the first time, wait 10-15 seconds before you try again.

Good luck.

 

Hey ploegi,

When I turn the key to Run, I don't hear anything from the pump, just a real faint whirring sound, and then a click. This is the case during both a cold and warm start. However during a cold start, I'm used to hearing a "whoosh" sound in addition to the sound I just described. Does that help clarify things?

I'll post an audio clip of it tonight too.

Jason

 

Hi all, here's the video of the problem in action. I'm trying to get it so that the car dies after it tries to start, but maybe the problem is camera shy! I may try driving the car to work tomorrow to make sure that the reason it's not starting up fine for right now is leftover fuel in the fuel rails. You'll have to listen carefully for the fuel pump priming in the 4th second of the video. It's a faint whirr followed by a type of "click"ing sound.

Right-click, save as. You'll need QuickTime in order to view it.

http://home.earthlink.net/~z3r0/enginestart.mov

I hope someone out there has seen this problem before!

Jason

 

ooops. no quicktime here..... (work computer...)

check fuel pressure, if you don't already have a gauge, you can get one from advance auto, or the like for under 30 bucks. Hook it up when engine is cold, put it where you can see it, (or have a helper....) turn the key to "on" and see what happens. It sounds (reads?) to me like your FP relay is either not working, or the fuel pump is getting weak.

Let us know what happens.

Have fun.

 

Video's are a great way to describe the problem!

Now I know, mine has the same problem. I figured my problem was just that the injectors are in serious need of cleaning and new plugs. I was going to take them off the car and send them out for cleaning. That injector cleaning stuff is crap for injectors that have never been properly serviced over many years.

I drive the car everyday without any other problems. I have had to assist it with putting the petal to the floor a few times (shuts off the computer).

 

Hi all, I have an update.

After searching through the boards for the location of the Fuel Pump Relay (thanks to Vader for providing a picture of his engine bay with the location of the FPR), I bought a replacement Borg-Warner one at Pep Boys for $10.82 after tax. When I went to remove the old FPR, I noticed that all the electrical connectors was covered in some kind of oily sludge!

So, after spending almost an hour cleaning out the FPR connector using tiny flathead screwdrivers, the tip of a small paintbrush (to clean the nooks and crannies that the screwdrivers couldn't reach), and some Simple Green on a paper towel (I ended up using 5-6 paper towels to get it all off!) to wipe off the majority of the sludge around the connector and wires, and to make sure the electrical connectors were as clean as I could reasonably get them, I plugged in the new FPR. Much to my joy (for lack of a better word), the fuel pump engaged right away (whoosh!), and the car started up after only 1/2 second of cranking!

Did that ever save me $410.00 for replacing the fuel pump or what? And it wouldn't even have fixed the problem.

EDIT: Here's a video of the car now: http://home.earthlink.net/~z3r0/woot.mov

Thanks for all the great help guys! I (and probably the car) really appreciate it. :hail:

Jason

 

Sweet!!! Thanks - now I know what I will be doing tomorrow