Demon355

iTrader: (1)

Recently found out my old LB9's piston rings are toast. So I've decided to throw some money at this motor. The block is still good and I figure, why not? Everyone does 350s or 383s around here, time to be one of the 305 badass's. Before I found out about the rings, I already had ported 081 heads being put on, LT1 cam, 1.6 rockers/matching springs, matched TPI base, Ported plenum, stock runners, AFPR, L98 injectors, CAI w/air foil, full exhaust, MSD ignition etc. Would have been quite the simple runner. But thats over with now. Now, I want something meaner. It will be using those 081 heads but they will get more porting done, along with backcut on the valves. What cam should I run with these heads and TPI? Like I said before the base has been matched and the plenum siamesed. I might be getting Edelbrock runners but I don't know yet so lets just say I'll be using the stock runners for now. I'll be using the 1.6 rockers so keep that in mind in the suggestions for a cam. The trans will get a shift kit and probably a 2800 stall for now as I don't have the cash to do the engine and tranny just yet. The motor already has a double roller timing set. What pistons should I get? I don't want anything fancy or expensive, simple stuff will do. The motor "might" get nitrous at some point but nothing crazy. 150 at the most. On CCFBG, Bastard runs an ALL STOCK 305 to 11.64 with a 150 and it's still going strong so I'm pretty sure my setup would handle it. But for now, it will be N/A. Maybe a piston that works with both? Throw me some ideas and we'll go from there. Btw, this build is happening ASAP as I want to get the ball rolling...

gmgod

For about $100 a zz4 would'nt be bad for a lb9, if you want to spend more I'd get a comp xr264hr

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Steve, since you're throwing money at an anemic small block, and you're expecting power to match that of Matt's carbureted setup, there's no way around it, you'll need a custom tailored camshaft (especially with today's lobes that are available). In my opinion, it's definitely worth the extra money. Either that, or simply go with the "usual" cam selection that's out there, while spending money other ways trying to get it to perform the way a custom one would have initially...

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i've subscribed to the thread and will put in my .02 when i have a bit more time to do some research...but my honest opinion is that it's gonna need more intake...mini ram styel or something...

purpleZ-28

ive got 2 305's and i want to build them also, but money isnt there right now. just go online and make a wish list of parts, then search them up here on the aftermarket product review board, see what people have to say for em.
i think a fast 305 with the stock tpi plenum (ported of course) would be something id love to see.

Brisk

iTrader: (25)

well I'll tag onto this thread too.. since I've got a low milage 305 I decided I'm going to stick with it for a while before building a monster.

at this point in time I wouldn't recommend a LT4 hotcam like I have (.525 lift with 1.6 rr) however I havn't done any tuning yet.. soo far it is a PITA to drive normally, but screams as a race car.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

plane jane hyper pistons should work fine with up to a 150HP shot. Open up your ring gaps to .020" or so. Polish your piston tops, polish your chambers.

upgrading to 1.94" intake valves? I'd recommend it. But yea, hand backcut all your valves for sure.

tenpin842

I'm messing around with my 305 right now. I bought Edelbrocks high flow intake and Edelbrocks high flow runners, Ported and polished Plenum, Holley Adjustable fuel pressure reg. New roller timing chain, New crane roller cam, and matching springs. I'll have it done in a couple days. I have to set the fuel pressure and the timing. I hope it will be a little more peppy. I say build the 305, you have it you might as well build it. Have fun!

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Brisk, what kind of driveability problems are you having, and who burned you're chip for you?

I personally wish someone would follow through with John Millican's concept of replacing the stock TPI system on an LB9 engine... with an L99 intake.

Demon355

iTrader: (1)

L99 intake? Is that a T-Ram setup or something or the smaller LT1?

I kinda want to keep the TPI just cause everyone always swaps it out for something else. I like the look of it and when people see it they think heh, it's only got a TPI, than I pull a 13.2 @ 101 and they go

I do have an LT1 intake but I think I'll save that for the upcoming 383 in a few years. For now it's all about this 305. Hyper pistons you say eh? I'll look into those. I was asked/told to use the LT4 hot cam, isn't that too much for the TPI though? Thats more cam than my buddy has in his iroc and he's running an HSR 355. That 264hr and ZZ4, what are the specs on those? Like I said, I might have the hi flo runners but how much of a restriction are the stock runners on a 305? Wouldn't I need to bore the block if I wanted to use bigger valves? This motor dones't have to be exactly like Matt's motor but I mean a mid to low 13 would be cool. Anything faster is just sick, lol! Mid 13's N/A and I'm happy. What should my fuel pressure be set at? Timing? I'll be going to the engine shop today to get some details worked out. Thanks for the replies...

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Yes, the L99 is considered as the "Baby LT1". Doesn't quite flow as well as the LT1 (although it can be ported)... but that's the beauty of it. The concept, is that it will not hinder the 305's low end torque much, if any.

The very fact that you'll be retaining the stock TPI system (port matched, of course), only pushes the idea further that you'll need a custom camshaft (stay away from the Hot cam). I would strongly consider having Thunder Racing grind you up something (218/222) on a newer style lobe....

flaming-ford

iTrader: (7)

you can fit 1.94/1.6 valves with the stock bore from what i've seen, you may have some real slight valve shrouding but, that's nothing that a little more porting can't take care of.

Hypereuetectic pistons are mid grade pistons material wise, they are a silicone aluminum alloy of sort. I think i read somewhere that they are 85% as strong as forged (in some ways mind you, i won't get in to that whole speil) the good thing is you don't have to worry about the huge expansion of forged and as long as you're not going with more than 150 in the nitrus compartment theirs no use on getting a better piston.

For iron heads i'd shoot for a close to 10 to 1 compression ratio.

As for cams i'd agree zz4 or custom cam..... Probably would want 500 lift or close to it with the 1.6 rockers. A wider lsa helps for the tuning so 112-114 lsa would be a plus.

imo the stock runners would be a pretty good restriction with the power you are expecting to put out with that beast.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

yeah, just 305 flattop four valve relief replacement pistons will be fine, and they are cheap too

Speed-Pro Hypereutectic Pistons: STL-H534CP30 - summitracing.com

here is my combo if anyone wants to hijack ideas....

motor specs are a little more wild than your average 305:
310ci small block chevy(305 .030" over)
10.4:1 c/r
113 casting aluminum vette heads with mild bowl blend
holley street dominator intake
650 double pumper
Crane Powermax solid cam: 238*/248* @.050 .480"/.500" lift 114lsa
Comp Pro-Magnum roller rockers 1.52:1
Hedman longtubes with 2.5" duals with h-pipe and flowmaster knock-offs
10" ati 4000rpm stall converter
700r4 built-to-the-hilt
3.73's with eaton posi unit, aluminum girdle cover
275/60/15 Mickey Thompson ET Street Radials putting it to the ground.

and here's a link to my page:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/437351

Brisk

iTrader: (25)

the lt4 hotcam is a great cam, don't get me wrong.. its listed as its powerband rating from 1500-5500 rpm however on a 305 bump up that rpm 500-1000... completely untuned at the moment I'm finding the power band starts at about 2200-2300 and then really starts to pull hard after 3000 to about 5000. then it falls flat because of the restrictive stock tpi I have.. theroietically it should still pull till about 6200.

however at the moment the car doesn't idle worth crap, I've got to clutch brake and gas at stop lights, etc else it will stall.. and it is completely undrivable under 1500rpm.. it is soo lopey it surges and hesitates. my wife wouldn't make it across town.

don't get me wrong, I just drive it at a higher rpm and keep it in low gear.. its fun around town scaring ricers at stop lights because I have no troubles chirping the tires in second gear and again shifting to thrid without revving too high. thankfully it is not my daily driver.

I've got a programmer now (just today,yay!) and I've got a friend who is going to help me out with making a good custom chip. after that we'll see how street friendly it is.. but for the mean time I'll suggest staying away from it. hopefully it'll tune itself out and be much more friendly. stay tuned

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

This is the very reason why I believe Steve should stay away from it. The Hot Cam's 218/228 525"/525" can be a bear to tune on some 350 applications, let alone the 305. If a custom cam is a little too much though, why not compromise, and go with a CompCams 218/224 495"/503" commercial grind.

Demon355

iTrader: (1)

Meh, I don't know anymore about the 305. I just found out I can get a brand new shortblock 350 for next to nothing. Might just do that instead and keep the 305 for a chevette or something, lol! I'll keep you posted after I find out more details tomorrow...

Thanks for all the input guys

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

do you wanna go fast or be different? that is the decision you need to make right now...

vincode8

iTrader: (8)

If anybody cares and is now disappointed the thread starter changed his mind, I'm gonna liven things up and tell all who care that I just put a Factory 400 crank and rods in my 85 305 HO motor. Had the block bored .030 over and prepped and picked up the freshly machined crank and Rods from a friend who lost interest. Using the Hyper pistons H534CP030.....these have the coated skirt. I got the pistons from a seller on ebay (I know don't say it) for $149 shipped. They came with Moly rings and Main and Rod bearings. That was a great deal I think. So my little 335 stroker is getting a Compcams XE262H-10 because more isn't always better. Compression is 10:1.Going with the 416 heads with mild porting and bigger valves. I'll be running an Edelbrock w/4bbl. I may put a shot of nitrous on it for finishing touches. Looking to get 1 hp per cubic inch without the N2O. Wish me luck, I'm gonna have it dyno tested when its done. I WANT TO BE DIFFERENT !!!!!!!!!

vincode8

iTrader: (8)

I read you can take the crank and rods from an L99, put them in a late model one piece 350 block and build one hell of a high winding 302 like the days of old ! No special piston required. FYI......Now that's DIFFERENT !!!!!!!!

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

vincode, i believe you could get away with more cam...and what carb are you planning to run, i hope not an edelbrock...not for performance anyhow.

oh, and i'm making ~1.33hp/ci

CKirocZ

Glad to see I'm not the only one! I'm planning to build a 302 (4" bore,3" stroke).

vincode8

iTrader: (8)

Matt...I thought the same thing and am on the fence with a bigger cam. I didn't want to push my luck.....Do you think the XE268H-10 would be a better choice? I've consulted a few friends and I called the CompCam hotline for Choosing a cam....they suggested the XE262....which after some reasearch I had chosen before I called them. They only confirmed my choice. My brother had the bigger 268 in his 350 and that thing was a power maker for sure. I would certainly like your advice if you could offer any. Not many guys fool with the 305 so there isn't much to go on as far as reasearch. Oh and haven't decided on a carb yet. Most likely a Holley though.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

what intake manifold are you going to be running? the xe268 would probably work really well, it'd be a good one for an n/a motor since it's ground on a 110lsa. if you wanted to build a nitrous motor that still ran decently on motor, i'd suggest my cam. a Crane Powermax Solid cam. 238*/248* .480"/.500" 114lsa...i'm still sitting at 310 cubes and based on my ET and weight, i'm making somewhere around 400hp.

i'm gonna suggest the holley street dominator intake manifold p/n 300-36 (same one i'm running) and a 650 double pumper a(agian, sameone i'm running)

make sure you do some blending in the valve bowls to help smooth things out. this is actually more important that porting. i've done no porting on my heads, but did a mild bowl blend and polished the combustion chambers. i also put a backcut on the 1.94/1.5 valves.

vincode8

iTrader: (8)

Gonna run a dual plane Edelbrock Performer RPM & the Holley 650 is a good choice. You suggested more cam, are you looking at the duration or lift? With the Longer stroke it make sense to run more degrees in duration. The xe262 is 218/224 @ .050 and the xe268 is 224/230 @ .050.......If we are only talking lift then some 1.6 rockers may help (actually that would be extreme)with the xe262.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i'm looking at duration. i'd like to see 230/240ish honestly...but with a cam ground on a 110lsa, pulling vacuum at idle will be very hard....but if you went with a nitrous cam ground on like a 113/114 lsa, it'd have plenty of vacuum at idle...which is why i suggested my cam, but you'll need to set valve lash about every 6K cause it's a solid lifter cam...no biggie, just kinda annoying to those who like to set it and forget it(personally, i like crackin' the valve covers off every now and then just to make sure thing are going good.)

IROCZ4BD3

iTrader: (4)

I've been following this thread with interest since I'm debating rebuilding the 305 or going 350.Got 70,000 miles on the 2nd 305.

89Iroc-ZTPI

engine kits .com has a stroker kit and cam try a 530/550 lift thats what i got in my 305

Brisk

iTrader: (25)

^^ thats going to be a beast to tame

vincode8

iTrader: (8)

Would you believe the first car I ever bought was a 66 nova. I saw the ad in the paper, $300 bucks....rode my bike to the guys house(it was local) and handed him $300 bucks, put my bike in the trunk and drove it home on a rainy day with no papers or insurance and no license !!! . That was 25 years ago and I was 15 years old at the time. I've had the smallblock buzz eversince. More duration, got it !

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i wished i had a 66nova...it's my absolute favorite car in the whole world and i made up my name when i was like 14 when i thought that i could actually afford one ...hehe, yeah right! even then, $300 wouldn't get you the remains of a rusted out straight 6 nova.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i don't know of a set of heads that will flow that kinda lift available for the 305 without serious modifications...what have you done to your 305 and how does it run?

Brisk

iTrader: (25)

wouldn't a set of 195 AFR's flow well enough?

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

yeah, but the massive combustion chamber would create detonation prone hotspots on the small 3.736" bore. i've thought about it already...

tpivette89

doesnt trickflow make a set of "small bore" aluminum heads? if i remember correctly, they flow 240cfm at .500 lift and have small 50cc chambers. valve sizes are 1.94/1.5

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

yeah...and i was the one that brought those heads the the attention of this board, for some reason, i just forgot about them...i suppose they would get the job done, but i don't know of anyone useing them.

tpivette89

i dont know of anyone using them either. perhaps its their $1000 - $1200 (depending on spring setup) price tag that scares everyone away. id like to get a set, but the moneys just not there right now

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

well, i'm doing pretty good with my 113 heads. faster than any other n/a 305 on the boards. i know guys running 11's and whatnot, but they are either spraying or blowing. i'm gonna get the car to run 11.99 before i do either....considering i did the 12.5 pass in the hot hot georgia heat, i think that with good air, lighter weight front wheels and some more tuning, i can get it into the 11's n/a.

1MeanZ

iTrader: (9)

well my combination is pretty mild compared to Matt's, but I will second the endorsement for the 113 casting heads. They perform well even on my very mild 305. Comparing my car to matts is not exactly fair, he has tons of cam and a carb and intake, my combo is much milder in a heavier car with less gear. None the less, see the times in my sig. If Steve383 wanted mid 13s that is easy, I am already there. The rest of you 305 builders can check my sig, it is pretty simple to make a healthy LB9.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

yeah, and see with that mph, your already in 13.5 range with a good 60'.

IROCZ4BD3

iTrader: (4)

Not to hijack this thread but you got me wondering how much of an improvement I would see with the 113's over the stock ported heads that I'm running.

tpivette89

theres actually a fresh set of 113 heads w LT4 springs for sale in the classifieds forum right now. seller wants $650 + shipping

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

they work really well, but just make sure you do some bowl blending and look at porting the exhaust side.

tpivette89

from the flow #s ive seen, the exhaust side of those heads are pretty good. they actually outflow the trickflow 305 heads until .400" on the exhaust side, and after that the difference is marginal. on the intake side, however, the trickflow heads significantly outflow the 113s at all areas of valve lift

so if i remember the #s correctly, its the intake side that needs the work

tpivette89

got the flow #s on the 113 heads as well as the trickflow heads for a comparison

TRICKFLOW
.200 - 126/102
.300 - 175/128
.400 - 213/153
.500 - 240/170
.600 - 240/178

113 CASTING
.200 - 117/94
.300 - 158/126
.400 - 185/145
.500 - 193/160
.600 - 193/162

the difference in flow numbers on the exhaust side is much smaller than on the intake side. up to .500", the exhaust #s only vary by 10cfm at the max, but on the intake side its a whopping 47cfm!

of course flow numbers arent everything, but its a good place to start

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

put a back cut on the valves and some bowl blending and you'll be right there...which is what i did.

1MeanZ

iTrader: (9)

well considering you have pulleys, injectors, a custom chip, and a roller cam, none of the above I have. (big emphasis on the chip and roller cam) Otherwise we have similar mods with the exception of my stick shift trans and the heads. all i did to my heads was port match and polish them, they dont even have a 3 angle valve job. The trap speeds tell the tale. But to confuse things there is also guys like TunedPort335 that have run as fast as 99.7mph with stock heads, not sure how he is doing that unless his extra cubes are buying it for him. Overall however I am sold on the aluminum L98 heads for a 305, i think they are a good choice.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i've been 103mph with stock heads...and Rich Aman, who is the H/stock record holder, has been 10.98 @120mph with stock 416 heads....they can do anything to the back of the valve, but the valve has to remain stock size and you cannot touch the ports or bowls. the rules are super strict and it's amazing what they do with those cars. the cam has to have factory lift, but duration and lsa are totally up to you, which is what builds power in the smaller motors anyhow. lift is not as important as duration when building big power with small cubes.

Brisk

iTrader: (25)

heres the trickflow heads in the aftermarket product review page; HERE

cutlass80

have an old cutlass 80 305 .30 over pistons vortec rockers and edelbrock mani holley 650 duals 350 turbo tranny the only thing is i have 2.29 gears !! but good news as i write they are installing 3.23 gears in it hopefully evrything goes well! my question is can i get good mileage on those gears?and how much of a difference in power will i feel also if anyone knows an estimated horsepower range on my car??