Im buying a 92 bird with a 5 speed, so this would mean its a world class t-5 right, stronger than the older t-5's. I am just curious, if any of you out there know anything or have any info that would be great.

 

absolutely not....there was never a worldclass t5 installed in any car stock. all the t5's in f-bodys are just regular old sh*tty t5's

 

WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?! All 88-92 F-bodies got WC T5's...including the one i just put in my car.

 

:BS:


no they really didnt though... they are all the same....like the sh*t bag one that was in my 91.....thats a myth. the worldclass t5 is an aftermarket transmission and was never installed in any car as an OE part.

check out the RPO codes and spec sheets for the camaros from that time period if you dont believe me....the transmission is made by borg warner. Its not and never was a worldclass t5. those transmissions were never installed in a stock f-body, and if someone told you it was, they either put it in themselves, or they're lying to you.

 

Oh ok I was talking to Crusader he is on here and is a member of the cascade crew and he said it thats why I asked.

 

What are you talking about "aftermarket transmission"???? The WC T5 is made by borg warner just like the NWC T5. It's the same box.

I OWN both a NWC T5 (from 85 bird)and a WC T5 (from 89 Camaro).
I've looked inside of both. They're different. The WC T5 even has the improved countershaft seal making ID easy. My WC T5 ID tag reads 1352-177. www.5speeds.com 's T5 Identifier lists 1352-177 as GM 1988 F-Car LB8 2.8 V6 WC. Plus they have a brief article of the T5 history.

 

So whos right, I'm confused.

 

The link was put right there in front of your face, but to save you from having to search of the needed info, click on this:
http://www.5speeds.com/t5/index.html

It tells you the difference, and tells you when, and in what vehicles they were used in.

 

CaliCamaroRS is correct



if your not sure (383backinblack) please dont give out false information

 

i am sure actually. why dont you ask GM

 

is a GM mechanic good enough?

 

actually i'm just an apprentice right now

but, not trying to be mean, your wrong, either that or your horribly confused

 

Err wrong. Those guys are right. Borg Warner did make a World Class T5 that was installed in many different high performance cars as OE. 88-92 Camaro's with T5's were W/C. My 85 Mustang SVO has one as well.

 

thanx crazy

 

383backinblack , you really need to do some homework before u come on here telling people false information, do some research and u will see that you are very wrong, and dont make any sense either (IE. calling the WCT5 an aftermarket transmission)

guys i actually think that he is getting the WC t-5 and the tremec confused.

 

nope not confusing the tremec and t5 at all...i have a tremec.

I think that maybe we are talking about 2 different things though. the new world class t5's you can get aftermarket are much different than the older ones i believe. The world class specs im talking about are the ones that have carbon fiber synchros and what not. my friend has one of those in his mustang, i blew it up its cool though cause now hes getting a tremec

 

pre 88 are non WC and 88-92 ARE WC

 

Does anyone know what kind of HP rating a "WC" T-5 will support? I will be building a 450hp 400sb and need something that can handle it. Thanks!

 

You don't want to use a T-5 then.
I have a stock 84 Z-28 with the L69 and i managed to blow three T-5's.
I'm no expert but I have heard alot of good things about the T-56 from the fourth gen camaros. You might want to try one of thoses.

 

how can everyone and their mother blow up t5s so easy?

i beat mine all day long, its from a 4 cyl car, i ain't got much traction either

i saw an s-10 with a t5 get 20k miles (not easy miles mind you the tach said 6000rpm+ a few times, good old iron duke )put on it with no oil in it before it finally locked up going down the road, all that had to be done was clean out the remains of the thrustbearing behind the input shaft cleaned out of it put another in its place and down the road we went, its been pretty noisy ever since then but hey its a beater so who cares

 

Thanks racerx004.

That seems to be the consensus of opinion. Any idea where I could find one at a "reasonable" price? EG $1000?

Also, I have heard and read about the Richmond T-5 but have heard good and bad. I think it would be up to the torque requirements or close but does anyone here ever seen any used Richmonds? If so, drop me a line. Sounds like I could use one or the other.

Thanks

 

Simple. Get some traction.
There's why you don't have any trouble with yours.

I tore up my original 83 one several times with the L69, then about 6 or 8 more times after I put a 400 in it. Then, after all these decades of driving stick-shift cars, I stumbled across a revelation! I discovered that it is possble to remove my foot from the gas pedal in between gears!!!! Wow! The car doesn't go quite as fast anymore, but transmissions sure last a heck of alot longer. In fact, I haven't torn one up since that moment of enlightenment, with about 30,000 more miles with the 400, and 20,000 more after that behind a much stronger 305 than a stock L69.

2 things will murder T-5s: high-RPM clutch dumps into some tires with traction, and speed-shifting. It isn't a 4-speed. Learn to be gentle to it, it will last much longer.

I've been reading this thread, and just ROTFLMAO..... some people here obviously don't know what they're talking about. The "World Class" T-5 has been in F cars since 87. I have a 91 one in my 83. Personally I've been on too many PIT teams and in too many Total Quality seminars to be able to tolerate anything called "World Class", I prefer to refer to the 2nd design T-5 as .... 2nd design, and leave it at that. The 1st design used straight roller bearings on the countergear, the rear one in fact is the same part # as the axle bearing for the 10-bolt in these cars, and it used brass synchro rings. The 2nd design aka "Workd Class" used tapered rollers on the countergear, composition synchros on 1st (!) and 2nd, and has the 1st, 2nd & 3rd gears riding on rollers on the mainshaft rather than on bushings.

There's no such thing as a "new aftermarket 'World Class' T-5" that I know of. The company that actually built the T-5, Doug Nash Engineering, is out of business and has been for nearly a decade now. The 87-up F car T-5s have the composition (same material as auto trans clutches) synchros just like the F*rd ones do.

Richmond doesn't make a T-5. They do make a 5-speed transmission, but it's their own model.

People who don't know what they're talking about need to keep their mouths shut and not pollute the environment with a bunch of BS. It does no one any good to spew a bunch of made up phony crap and dress it up as truth.

You can find V8 T-5s at the junkyard all the time, and in the classifieds on this site.

 

I have an 87 driveline in my 84 Z28 so if I take it easy after I put the 400 in then I should be ok for awhile then. May be hard to keep my foot out of it but if I do as you suggest I could at least get by until I can upgrade. I have heard the Richmond trannys are a little balky shifting. Just wondered if anyone had tried one lately. Supposed to be a bolt in on a 3rd gen.

I have been through a lot of the ISO9000, TQM, PQP, and host of others so I agree world class is little pretentious. I must admit however that I would like to have something that I could take to the drag strip once in a while and still be able to drive home and not have to worry about it.

 

a WC or "2nd design" t5 will last....ive seen them in cars that dip in the 12s...its hooked up to my 450hp 357 (only 75 miles on the motor).....just take it ez on it....no high rpm dumps...no fast shifting...no powershifting...and you should be fine....there are a few people on this board with 12second cars with Stock WC t5s....also...an aftermarket shifter can help improve the life of a trans...they are more precise than the stocker....

 

It's not really the hp that kills the T5, it's the torque.

Most "World Class" T5 ratings were at 330 ft-lbs.

 

well the trans part number from pre 88 and post 88 are the same.....but whatever. the one that came out of my 91 broke with just the tbi 305 pushing on it. i never really beat that car with that engine in it either.

 

Those transmissions are not the same. I've built entirely too many of them that were different to be told otherwise.

The 1st design has straight rollers and thrust on the countergear; the 2nd design has tapered rollers with preload. The 1st design has the intermediate gears riding on the mainshaft with bushings; the 2nd design uses needle bearings, for lower friction, for gas mileage.

I have no idea where you're looking up stuff that says they're the same, BUT IT'S WRONG!!!! Either that, or your interpretation of what's on the page is wrong. Please stop quoting something that's blatantly, obviously, defective. Here's a web page you can look at that has its facts straight. www.gearzone.net Look at the 5-speed page, most of it is devoted to this exact topic.

The thing that kills these isn't HP, and not even torque, really. It's shock loading. They'll stand up to quite a bit of torque as long as the driver doesn't do big RPM clutch dumps on slicks, and avoids speed-shifting entirely. The trans cannot withstand that kind of abuse, it is nowhere near the amount of machinery that an old 4-speed is, or a T-56.

 

thats the same thing with all transmissions and driveline components.

shockloading is about the torque that the parts are actually seeing. If the car is jacked up off the ground and hammered on, there is still say 400 ft/lbs of torque there, but its not gonna break the trans because theres no load on it. when there is resistance to the rotation of the wheels stress will start to build on everything, especially the internals in the rear and the trans. of course anything will handle gobs of torque as long as there isnt too much resistance (i.e. beating on it) to wheel rotation. But thats not usually the case. and the t5 is a much weaker design than just about every other viable manual trans on the market.

 

The gentleman I work with runs 4.10s on a REBUILT WC T5 from his stock 90 mustang. I believe it is the same tranny as the post 87 3rd gens (guys?). Anyway, he runs his built up 302, supercharged, with the 4.10s at 450hp. Its a screamer, and hit a 7.88 in the 8th mile (no quarter around here). Anyway, if hes throwin that much HP at his T5, is it because he had it rebuilt? Had he kept it bone stock, Im sure he woulda busted it now. Wutcha think fellas? I mean, he ran slicks last week at the track, with his T5. He has an aluminum driveshaft, not sure if thats relevant or not. Anyway, seems like a lotta power for a T5 eh?

 

LUCK

 

yup thats what im sayin.

everyone who knows anything about trannies understands the inherent weakness in the overall design of the t5 and its case. I dont understand why some of these same people keep trying to prove that they are good transmissions. If it lasts its luck pure and simple....we need more engineers around here

 

Its been rebuilt. Does that make a difference though?

 

well ya it makes a difference, but not when your talking about alot more power