I am putting a T-56 into a 350 IROC, how much can I expect to spend if I want ALL NEW PARTS... (brand new T-56, new master & slaves, pedals, flywheel, etc etc) oh, and I cant do it myself so factor in the labor too... I know, used is cheaper, but I like new parts. Thanks in advance

 

Arm + leg. Seriously, not worth getting brand new parts just to "have new things." I've heard figures thrown around as much as $2500 for just the tranny itself. Nothing concrete though. Just call up your local GM parts department.

 

theres
ALL NEW PARTS thats around 4,000.00

TOTALLY REBUILT STRONGER THEN STOCK.... 3000ish and up

REBUILT/Exchange GOOD... 1800 (just trans)+core+however much pedals, belhousing, clutch, ect...is

REBUILT LOCALLY (whatever you pay used), + ($800 to $1200)

REBUILT Cheap... (whatever you pay used), + ($250 to $800)

just toss it in from donor roughly $700 - $2000.

 

Okay well whats anybody's guess as to what I SHOULD pay for it to be done, used parts then? Also I'd like to hear from some people who've done it if possible...

 

if you buy from a place that sells them specificly for the swap, $1800.... some have the crossmember included in that too.. everything you need except the ATF.


if you're getting EVERYTHING (except the crossmember) from a donor car, they're around $1200-1500. but you have to find one. if they want more, i reccomend never going back there.(laughing in his face is optional)


if you're getting it from a person like i did, expect $700 to $1800 it depends on demand and the person... if you're on the cheap like i am, you can do what i did.
email everyone with a low ball price... and wait.
if you have the time, you can get the entire swap in the car running for under $1000.

thats what i did.

 

Mr dude, youve actually done this? So you have a 350 and a 6-speed? Thats fawking awesome! What problems did you encounter? Any negative side effects? Did you have to do anything to the ECU? Gas mileage is better now correct? What kinda MPG? Anything I should be forewarned about?

And finally, If I found some F-body shop around me that has done it and will do it for me, what would be a reasonable price to pay if I hand them the car and my credit card and told them to source some good used parts? Just take a guess...

 

one step further..... i have the 400 and a 6spd. i first put it behind the stock 305, then the 400...

no real problems.. with a one piece rear main 350 or 305, you can reuse the LT1 flywheel... so other then the pedals and holes, its a bolt in.

only problem i can think of is the rear gears... the T56 has a tall first gear, so with the wimpy 305 and 2.73 rear, it was like starting in 2nd gear... putting some 4.11s in fixed that.... athough i blew up the 4.11s with slicks... so now it has 3.42 rear... couldnt be happier.

gas miliage is great. better then the auto by about 5mpg..


heres my post https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=229205 (its also the sticky at the top of this forum)

i tried to only tell the stuff that isnt in all of the "how to" articals.

if you can change a clutch, you can swap to the T56... its easy.


as to what a shop would charge? the only shops i know of willing to do this would be a local SMALL shop or a speed shop... i have no idea what the small shop would charge (call around) but i would expect the speed shop to be pricy.

seriously though, if you can change a clutch, you can do the T56 swap... only tools you might need other then the usual wrenches:

a drill -- corded POWER drill not a battery operated one.
a 1.25" hole saw... i got mine from lowes.
a pair of tin snips.. aka sheetmetal cutters... cheap.. get all 3 (left cut, right cut and straight) for about $12

 

hey i am about to do the conversion myself and i had no idea where to start or if it was even possible till i DID A SEARCH.

try this http://www.skulte.com/techcenter.html then click on T56 swap. this guy has done the swap before and listed everything you need along with the instructions....very informative
also if you're doing an auto to manual swap read the sticky above and check out the tech articles on the main page thirdgen.org

everyone tells me "you wont regret it and its the best mod you can do to a 3rd gen"

 

heres another one

http://sethirdgen.org/t56.htm

 

Thanks, that is some useful info...
it sounds like this project will not be cheap.

 

all in all, counting everything from crimp connectors, wire, ATF, the holesaw, ect.... i spent $950 - $1000 on the swap.


and i am a cheap..errr.. thrifty person.. short of having the complete assembly given to you, you will NOT get it any lower then that.. trust me.


expect $1500 to $2000 for the swap... this is the reason that everyone doesnt have one... even though alot of people want them.






i kinda wish everyone was a bargin hunter like me though... it would drive the price down.

 

oh well everywhere i went people wanted 1,500-1,800 for the tranny with 80,000miles on it complete set up or just the tranny..... i ended up fining a guy complete rebuilt tranny with a 1 year warranty unlimited mileage warranty got the gear ratio i wanted....ill give you guys his number if you want... he cahrged 1,325 pus $500 core charge

i still need master/slave cylinder cheap at kragen...but the fly wheel is what pisses me offf they only charge $60 for the fly wheel but $120 for core charge wtf???? and i need a clutch pack
and cross member i called every junk yard and place on the net...

 

i just got a flywheel from a LT1 car and had it resurfaced.


if you order the clutch thru advance/kragen/partsamerica its somthing around $250 and its a Zoom clutch, LT4 pressure plate, install alignment tool, and both roller and bushing pilots...

cheapest i found at least..

 

guys, I'm discouraged.

Since when it comes to F-bodies I have no experience and I dont know what Im doing, I think the cost of this project could easily spiral out of control. When you add up $2200 for a new T-56 (since a used one might run $1500 anyway and have a ish-load of miles on it, might as well go new) and then thousands of dollars for a clutch kit and every little thing you'll need, and then I gotta pay someone to do the work (I sure as hell cant) well this sounds like a huge investment just to correct something that GM didnt do right in the first place. It sounds like a decent IROC-Z will cost no less than $3K anyway, and then I'll have to dump the thousands into the trans swap, suspension, rims, interior, not to mention paint & body, stereo & subwoofers etc. to get it the way I want it... it could easily end up being $10,000 dollars before I have it the way I want it. And when you look at it like that, there are other fast cars I would have to consider for $10K, so... I dunno we shall see.

 

Check this out. For 10K one of these starts to look really good

 

(yea, if youre into sausage), but seriously,......say 10 years from now, sell the 10k camaro an see what you get (itll hold a value, long as its not ghetto), an try to sell the twinkmobile.....see which one will be worth more.for 10k, get a used 4th gen,got all the stuff u require. if you wanna shift gears, get a 3rd gen an put a full manual body in an auto, or get one with a standard trans......a 305 isnt a bad motor and the trans will be alrite unless you get really sick....(theres plenty runnin around rite now)....then, if you decide you want the 6 spd you can drive it till you can afford the swap, or hookup with someone thatll help you out...................................................not trying to hate on ur alternate choice, im just 10 minutes away from REHOMO-BEACH, DE.an i see these cutesie type cars allatime parked outside the packer clubs & bars.

 

Hey Mr Dude, can you recommend any companies in the "TOTALLY REBUILT STRONGER THEN STOCK.... 3000ish and up" group? I need something that will be able to handle that TT motor I was talking about in my other thread. I've also been looking into the Richmond Rod, but if I can get a stronger T56 in that price range, then I'd rather go that route. I'm just afraid of using a used transmission with higher power levels.

 

i cant really recommend any because i never did go that route... i could poke around on google, and get numbers of places from car magazines... but theres several companys that rebuild T56s for severe race duty and heavy street use..

i dont have first hand experiance with anyof them though, so i cant really say one guy is better then another.

 

a car is NOT a investment, and you WONT get your money back out of it.

and the 305 is a poorly designed (if you can even call it designed) smog motor that isnt even suitable for a low power daily driven cruiser... its inefficent..

 

its not a investment... its a hobby.
if you want to learn about cars, and work on them yourself, and work your way into it... this is the way to do that.

if you're not intrested in learning about cars, working on them yourself, and you just want the results now, i suggest you buy a 4thgen. atleast then you can get a loan... mid miliage 98LS1s are close to and under 10k now.


as far as the DSMs go, while i think they're ugly (like the 4thgens) the power levels they can make and 4wd is just plain cool. 450-500 hp at all four wheels isnt anythign to sneeze at.

but once more, you'll never be able to hit thoes levels unless you are working on your car yourself.




3rdgens are easy to learn and work on.. parts are cheap.
if you are intrested in learning to work on them yourself, they are a great place to start.

if you dont want to learn about them, either keep your car looking nice, do what you can, and dont worry about speed, or just find another car.

 

i never sais it WAS an investment..............just stating it'll hold a resale value.................i mean, please, people are paying 4500, 5500 for 3rd gens now ..............theres plenty of em with over 150k pulling 14s and some with 13s (with mods, of course)........yea, a 350, 400, etc. is better, power wise but if were going the efficiency and better engineering route, why not put a rotary engine in it? how bout a lambo motor?...........all i was saying was that it sounded like he didnt want to go over board on his budget.if moneys no object, put an ls1 and 6 spd in there an get 'er done

 

and im saying it wont.
try selling a modded thirdgen and you'll find out.

theres a reason why that guy in autotrader has his 12k thirdgen with mods in the magazine for 8 months.....


show me one running 13s NA (aka, no boost or nitrous).


because the other once are extremely cheap, and bolt right in. long story short, its not the displacement that makes the 305 a POS.. its the way it gets it... the bore shrouds the valves. because of this, you cant run any good big valve heads, and when you stuff large valves in there, the cylender wall blocks half of it anyway. if you want to be diffrent with a small displacement motor, get a 283 or a 302chevy.

302s,327s,350s,400s, ect ARE more efficent.. to put it in the ***** power per displacment perspective, a 305 would have to be making 305hp to match my 400. at that level of 1hp per cubic inch. and that would be a pretty radical lil 305, while my 400 is a daily driver. plus the 400 was cheaper to get that fast, plus its going to be faster then the 305 just because it makes 100hp more.

i shouldnt have to post about how the 305 is NOT a performance motor, but really just a quick smog solution GM went thru until they discovered how to make a engine burn more efficently.... and a byproduct of that was more power......

heh, btw, did you notice what GM did to make the LS2 faster for the C6 vette? they made it bigger. :lala:




in anycase, this is the Transmissions and Drivetrain forum.. not engines... so if you want to talk 305 vs the world, do a search... theres enough threads to spend the day reading.

 

i say hell no its not poorly designed...my old 305 has 386,000 on it and STILL RUNNING STRONG after alot of work NOT REBUILT and also after being seized 20,000 miles ago when the oil was boiling and radiator blew what do you think of that its putting full power to the ground right now????


anyway i got a guy heres his number i just got my transmission from him he builds your tranny the way you like it shipping is only $80 and ive seen his customers reviews on ebay he sometimes puts t-56's on there.

the name of the compnay is reman express 1-800-262-9557

 

Well, heres the deal:

When it comes to F-bodies I dont know squat. All I know is that the aftermarket is cheap and plentiful, and if I ever need an engine I can just buy a brand new 330 horsepower crate 350 from summit. I also know that a big-as$ V8 is gonna be a lot of fun, and sound like a dream too. Then, there is the (LOL) sausage factor like that guy said. I do admit the DSMs are, oh, just a tad girly-lookin but hey chicks dig them so thats not the worst thing in the world. I actually think the 97-99 Eclipse looks like it was styled by Ferrari or something. Then, on the other hand, if I drove an IROC-Z, no body would be able to say my car is too girly. I'm sure the VTEC crowd would get annoying at stoplights but I could always just show em my tail lights.

But heres the thing: Ive owned two eclipses now, a 97 GS-T, and a 99 GSX (thats my black GSX above), and I already know everything there is to know about DSMs. I can even work on them a little when small things need to be done. Both my Eclipses were stock when I bought them and I sunk thousands of dollars into their engines & suspensions, only to have them nowhere near as fast as I'd like them. So then I sold them at a loss, and Ive learned its better to buy them pre-modded with every mod you would ever want already on it for a couple grand more than book value, than to slowly mod a stock one until youre so in debt you have to sell it. If you catch some one with a 12 second DSM in a time when they NEED to sell the car, well then you can basically steal it from them, and I already know what to look for, what parts are good, and I know where to look. Might have to fly somewhere to get it, but still, theres always a fast DSM for sale somewhere.

Then theres the IROC:
I dont know much about it, other than they look cool, theyre low, theyre wide, and theyre basically a de-tuned Corvette. I havent heard the term "crankwalk" mentioned once on this forum, so thats a good thing. Of, course if something did happen to an IROC motor, I wouldnt know what to do, other than drop in a new 350. (Whereas if I blew up a DSM motor, I know exactly who to go to, and exactly what to tell him to do) The V8's sure do sound nice, but a whistling turbocharger with a loud blow-off-valve is music to my ears, too. And gas prices are on the rise. But Ive already done the DSM thing twice, isnt it time for something new? Of course my third one would be my best one, seeing as I know more now than I ever have before.
So you can see how my mind works- back and forth, every week Ive decided on something different. I do have to take care of $5500 worth of credit card debt before I do anything, though. So we shall see what I end up in this summer.

 

Oh, and about the 4th-gen Camaro, Im just not into how they are styled. My friends got a teal 94 Z28 6-speed with a few mods, and it is a bad ****, especially when he gets sideways LOL, but I just dont like how they tried to make them rounder after 92, just not my thing.

 

10 years from now I better be in a C5 Vette or I will die tryin.

 

WASNT saying he could sell it for 12 k...........was just saying down the road the cam will hold a better value than the r**ce(put an 87 iroc for 4500 and an 87 honda for the same price and see who gets laughed at more).to make a lonfg story short, i never said the 305 was this great, super duper, magical motor.i was just saying its a decent enough motor to START on. your the one getting a bug up there assuming i meant this and that.i never said it was this great performance motor.(thats what i love about TGO, youve got good people that try to help, then youve got people who beleive their opinion is the only one that matters and wanna argue about stupid things everyone already knows. gotta love diversity)so whatever, dude. i was just trying to give the kid some options. he sounded like he was getting scared of the money it was gonna take.so have a coke and a smile and quit taking offense at everthing. if its any consolation, im sorry i gave my opinion.i wont do it again, but i thought that was one of the things TGO is about.

 

well, think of it from the flip side.


some dude walks in and says the same thing you said... he knows alot about thirdgens, but is looking at a DSM.... he knows tons of thirdgen stuff, but minimal DSM stuff.

what would you say to him?



on one hand, theres the, ya man, ive been doing this for years, its easy, kickass, cheap, ect... ive been avoiding saying that because frankly, you have to know somthing about them first before its easy and cheap. like you learned with your DSM mistakes cost money, and when you dont know alot and are just starting out, mistakes happen.


i guess i should say, hang out here and read... but the problem is, we only post when stuff breaks. heh.. noone posts, yea, ive put 40k on my car in the past year, and didnt have a single problem that caused anything longer then a 15min setback.. (true my car for the past year)

then again, i know what to do for the most part... and if i dont, i know where to find the answer. you cant know everything, but if you know where to look, you can always find the answer.
so my 15min headache (coolent temp sensor for fan turnon failed) could have been a pain for a noob ( these cars have 3 sensors.. one for gauge, one for fans, and one for the ECM)

if you're willing to learn though... go for it.

 

its not.

this is a tech only site.

 

I will say the community here seems to be more helpful and mature than the DSM forums. The DSM forums have a lot of mother jokes and questions about which body kit to buy and what wing...

 

oooooh no, you're just at the wrong 3rdgen site.

99% of them are like that too. this one isnt only because its TECH ONLY.. if its not tech related, the thread is locked or deleted.

www.3rdgen.org is the BS site..

then theres

www.NEthirdgen.org for the northeast
www.SEthirdgen.org for the southeast
ect...

most of thoes are local boards that are half tech and half BS.

 

What about the Richmond 6 speed?
Better gearing in my opinion.
Anyone here with one?

 

quote originally posted by CrazyHawaiian: Hey Mr Dude, can you recommend any companies in the "TOTALLY REBUILT STRONGER THEN STOCK.... 3000ish and up" group? I need something that will be able to handle that TT motor I was talking about in my other thread. I've also been looking into the Richmond Rod, but if I can get a stronger T56 in that price range, then I'd rather go that route. I'm just afraid of using a used transmission with higher power levels

If you can get your hands on a copy of the May 2004 issue of Chevy High Performance there's an article in there on beefing up the T56. 650 horse capable sound good to you? That's what Rockland Standard Gear does for the T56 for 3,500 retail. Call them at 877.774.4327 or check out their site at www.rsgear.com. If you do talk to them find out if they'll sell you the hard parts you need to do up the super tuff trans. If so, let me know so I can do the same thing when I'm ready.

 

I don't know about anyone else but I was told that I wouldn't be happy with the Richmond ROC in a daily driver car, but that's just what I heard, so take it for what it's worth

 

That's a dumb comment by whomever told you that. The Richmond 6 is an awesome transmission. The only bitch I have about it is the shifter position. T56 is right where I want it & works w/ a factory console.

 

Yeah I hear ya. I have a T56 I'm puttin in my 92Z28. I think it'll be just fine for a used tranny with only 55,000mi on it.

 

Ok i dunno but maybe you have found one by now errr maybe not...but i personally would not settle. i paid 500 for the trans and bell then x amount of dollars for everything else( do the math if you want too(sig)). i sit around now and look at the prices that people are paying for a 6 speed and pretty much **** myself, there is no way in hell that i would have payed anymore than i did 3 yrs ago for a 6 spd.and i got mine for a damn good price. nowadays your lucky to find one for 1k and its probably got like 90k at least on its clock...finally my age is justified. anyways it pretty much depends an patience just as Mr.Dude sort of defined, i looked for mine for about 6 months, then found someone in a bind and waaallaaa 500 bones and i had a trans with less than 50k. of course un-like some of you i had a 2 pc rear and got stuck in the *** for my flywheel.....but hey what ya gonna do :lala:

 

I got lucky and picked up my T56 change-over conversion for $800. I got everything except for the slave cylinder bracket, I didn't know about the bracket at the time I was picking up the trans.

 

What braket are you talking about to be exact??? Doesn't the slave cylinder just bolt into the bellhousing???

 

yup, **** is definately not something we need to be showing on this site, there are young children around!!!

 

Yeah Im just reporting back to this old thread cause I went with a cheap 95 Talon Tsi with 6 bolt motor and 14B turbo and other things... I got it maybe a month ago and since then I put 4 new kyb shocks, plugs, wires, had no cat I got one for it, had no t-stat so I put one in, had no radio, got sony cd & 4 good speakers and basically did a bunch of work to it, its almost roadworthy now. Needs paint though goin to Maaco. Just though I'd share that, I couldve gone either way, Sometimes I think of what wouldve been had I gone with the bad black IROC-Z with red decals I was considering... *sigh* alas, it wasnt to be

 

You better start looking for spare trannies now. We have a saying around here when it comes to cars.

If you want economy... you're gonna have to pay for it. '

 

I dont understand, the 5 speed tranny shifts great and it has an ACT 2100-lb. clutch just installed with the motor 1500 miles ago. Its a front wheel driver, which dont destroy trannies nearly as frequently as the AWD's