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My T56 Swap Thread....

Old 01-08-2008, 06:54 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

it just kinda slid in
It's amazing how that is.... you futz with it endlessly and get nowhere, then all of a sudden for no apparent reason, it decides it's done fighting and is ready to cooperate.

You have your special "you're welcome". In fact, I just emptied it, I think I'll go to the fridge and get another in your honor.

Looks like it'll be rolling again in the next day or 2? I'm sure you're pumped enough to get after it HARD for a little while now! Achieving a major milestone always seems to do that.
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Old 01-08-2008, 09:07 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by //<86TA>\\ View Post
Funny how after all the aggravation, it just slid right in.
Funny is one way of putting it, not my first choice though. Although i may learn to laugh at it in the near future....

Originally Posted by sofakingdom View Post
Looks like it'll be rolling again in the next day or 2? I'm sure you're pumped enough to get after it HARD for a little while now! Achieving a major milestone always seems to do that.
Well im not sure if ill go for an actual test drive, its a little salty outside, but because of the mild weather were getting, i just might. Next day or 2 is definately correct, i need some washers, and ill be firing it up tommorow. (i just hope i got the wiring right for the starter). If not, its a standard now! I could always push start it .

Heres some more updates. I kind of did alot of stuff at once, after this, so the order doesnt really matter. I just know my driveshaft is going in last, because i have a loop on the spohn x-member.

Anyway, heres the torque arm mounted. Notice the configuration of the bolts is not in the same place as the T56 bracket. The T56 bracket has that annoying top bolt, that you have to squeeze the bracket together for to assemble. (I know im holdin it upside down, its easier to see the bolt holes that way).
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Next up, most people dread the assembling torque arm bracket, so here what i did.
STEP 1: Get some vice grips, and clench the top part together, it goes together very easily.
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STEP 2: Raise of lower the torque arm with your foot till the hole lines up. The torque arm is pretty light, so it was very easy.
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Heres the hard part though. The axle rotates when the torque arm is removed, which is why the car MUST be supported by the frame (like i have done). Also, when the axle is rotated, and is sitting at an angle, the "straight" torque arm, will not mount on it. You will have to jack up, at the differential housing, to get it to "un-rotate". At this time, you may also notice the torque arm is either too far forward or backward. No problem, go back to STEP 2, and before you tighten the upper bolt, just tap the bushing along the torque arm, so the holes at the back will line up. Go to the back and finish assembling.
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In all torque arm cases, im just gonna tighten as much as i can, it probably has a torque spec, but its definately a big number, something over 70 ft/lb i bet.


At the back, the axle may still want to twist a little, you can untwist it by pulling down. It did this with me, and so i worked on getting one bolt in. You may have to pry a little to get everything to line up. Second bolt is easy.
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Heres the shifter in place. I just sorta bent the metal out of the way for now, ill cut it off later .
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Finally the spohn x-member. I cant tell if its lining up, because the bolts i have are too small for the openings. I need to pick up some washers tommorow so i can actually hold the thing in place. Only bad thing about the spohn x-member, is that it makes the rest of the car look like **** .
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Just gotta put the driveshaft on, and check the starter and ign. wiring, and im ready to start it for a test run. Oh and ofcourse fluid. I will probably just test it up in the air, that way i can go through all 6 gears, where as a test drive, i will probably only use the first 3 maybe 4. The car isnt insured for winter, so i wouldnt take it very far.
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Old 01-08-2008, 09:28 PM
  #103  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Probably not a big deal but you put the torque arm bolts in backward. They are supposed to go in from the top down. That way if the nut happens to fall off the bolts won't fall out.
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Old 01-08-2008, 09:30 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by vbMike View Post
Probably not a big deal but you put the torque arm bolts in backward. They are supposed to go in from the top down. That way if the nut happens to fall off the bolts won't fall out.
I was wondering if i did that right. I still havent tightened them, they are just in there, so ill switch em around tommorow. Thanks for pointing that out.
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Old 01-09-2008, 06:44 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Ok i finished it today. I went to start the car, and ........nothing. CRAP! I think my starter isnt working. Hopefully i can get it goin with a couple taps of a hammer, will let you know how that turns out.

EDIT: I just tried something, i completed the starter circuit manually, and it spins. SO its a bad solenoid, however, the starter is spinning FREE! It sounded like a fuel pump. WHat does that mean? How do i fix it???? I REALLY WANNA START THE CAR!!!!

Heres the extra clip i was talking about. NAPA didnt have it, so i dont know if many parts stores would. Maybe the NAPA guy was just an idiot, he was very quick to say no. I got it from the dealer for $3....
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Heres my completed pedals and carpet put back. Looks so good!
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Meanwhile. If anyone has bought a DS loop SPOHN x-member, please chime in. I think mine is hitting.

Passenger side:
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Driver Side:
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DS Loop, touching on top passenger side of tunnel.
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Last edited by online170; 01-09-2008 at 06:54 PM.
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Old 01-09-2008, 07:49 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

What do you mean by completed starting circuit manually?

Usually that means you just shorted across the two big terminals and the motor just spins, making that fuel pump type sound you described. You have to energize the little wire to pull in the solenoid winding that throws the starter drive pinion into the flywheel.

If you did that, did you check your purple wire? Do you have 12 volts when someone turns it to start?
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Old 01-09-2008, 07:53 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Yea i just connected the two big terminals with a ratchet. The ignition was off, (the key was off), i just touched the two.

So how do i energize it? I would assume the purple wire has power, it worked before with the old starter, i just have a new starter, and all my other electrical stuff is working as per normal.
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Old 01-09-2008, 08:14 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

For that clip I just went to the local hardware store and bought an e-clip for 0.03 cents.

Try to loosen the bolts on the crossmember and try twisting it toward the driver side and retighten. The holes in the crossmember are slotted to give it a small amount of adjustability.

I have a question for you. Did you reuse the torque arm that you had on the 700r4 or did you have to get a different one to fit the T56?
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Old 01-09-2008, 08:17 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Yea i would recommend the e-clip definately. I had to wrestle with THAT clip, i dont think it was meant to fit.

Steve from Spohn, recommended the same thing, ill try and adjust it later. I think i got the sequence for tightening backwards.

Also, i reused the torque arm, but the bracket and bushing are from the 95 trans am. I beleive you can even reuse the bushing.
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Old 01-09-2008, 08:37 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by online170 View Post
Yea i just connected the two big terminals with a ratchet. The ignition was off, (the key was off), i just touched the two.

So how do i energize it? I would assume the purple wire has power, it worked before with the old starter, i just have a new starter, and all my other electrical stuff is working as per normal.
You just need to jump between the one big terminal with the battery cable hooked to it and the one small wire. That will run the starter properly.

Most likely you are having a neutral start switch issue. You remember that goofy cable hanging out near your shifter hole that used to hook to your shifter? The one that has the other end going around the the steering lock? Look around there...
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Old 01-09-2008, 08:44 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Look around there for what?

The neutral safety switch isnt hooked up, actually none of the tranny wiring or the brake wiring is done. But i made sure the cable is in a position, that will let me engage the steering lock.

DO you think the car thinks its in gear? So it wont let me start?

EDIT: I just tried jumping the positive terminal, to the purple wire terminal, and i think it worked. But it didnt crank. I heard a noise, like the starter was getting stuck. Or the gear teeth were hitting. I thought it was aligned, its an LT1 starter, and an proper flywheel, and i think its pretty well aligned. Hard to describe the noise, but it sounds like gear teeth hitting i guess.

EDIT EDIT: I got it to turn over, but im not gonna start it now, i just realized its 1030. I live in a condo, and the garage is under the kitchen in my house. When the car runs, the house actually shakes a bit, and the stuff on the counter vibrates. Id imagine the same happens at the neighbour's. SO ill tell you how it runs tommorow.

Last edited by online170; 01-09-2008 at 09:07 PM.
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Old 01-09-2008, 08:59 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by online170
You just have to pull the big nut in the middle, and use a puller to get it off.
Yep, been telling her that for quite sometime time, myself....

Online70, excellent progress bro! Will definitely be using this as a reference...

Thanks!

-Rob
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Old 01-09-2008, 10:02 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by online170 View Post
DO you think the car thinks its in gear? So it wont let me start?
That's what I think.
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Old 01-09-2008, 10:07 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Crap, ok well i ddont wanna bother with all the splicing right now, i guess ill just plug everything back into the AUTO system tommorow, so it THINKS im safe to start, and maybe that will remedy the situation.
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Old 01-10-2008, 09:43 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Ok thanks for bringing that up Kris. You were correct, it was just not detecting the car as being in a safe position to start. All i did was plug the wiring back into the autoshifter that i pulled off, and voila, the car cranked beautifully.

However, i still couldnt get it to start, because i think i broke my coil. I lowered the engine too far i think, and it was resting on the superaccel coil, atop the distributor cap at one point. It had already been in a crash before, so it wasnt fairing too well as is.

A little hot-wiring did the trick, and heres what happened. I didnt go through all six for the vid, but i did on my own, and i also checked reverse. In the vid, you hear a very loud chattering/clanking noise. Its only there as the clutch is engaging, and once the tranny speeds up, its smooth as butter and the noise goes away. I didnt have a helper today, so i couldnt check underneath, but im 99.9% sure its the spohn x-member. (i still havent moved it, so the DS loop is still hitting, MY FAULT, not spohn's). Anyway, i finally got her goin, no complaints, i guess i got a quality peice from the junk yard. I cant get over how smooth the tranny and the clutch are.!!!

KEEP READING UP, theres still a bit more left to do. I wont be posting replies every day from here on in, i might post some progress on the weekends. But i still need to tackle the wiring, the VSS, and console.

Thanks everyone, and special thanks to sofakingdom, VBmike, and 92camaroZ28, for pointing me in the right direction, more than once. Those mistakes that were prevented definately count, and made a huge difference.

I still maintain that this swap is really easy, hardest part was probably wrestling with the tranny, but its about as hard as pulling the auto.


Last edited by online170; 02-27-2011 at 10:48 PM.
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Old 01-10-2008, 11:20 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Good job man, I'm jealous!!
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Old 01-12-2008, 01:43 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

ATTENTION SPOHN CROSSMEMBER USERS

I took Steve's advice from spohn, and clearanced the driveshaft loop. It was hitting on the top passenger side of the TRANNY TUNNEL before. Im gonna have to wrestle with the tranny mount a bit for it to line up, but the rest seems ok for now.

Is that enough clearance to not hit the tranny tunnel when the engine vibrates? Do you guys have more clearance than this? I wasnt able to push my finger through, i had to take a pic to be sure it wasnt touching.

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Old 01-12-2008, 01:50 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

That should be plenty. I have less than that on my car and it never hits.
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Old 01-12-2008, 01:56 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by vbMike View Post
That should be plenty. I have less than that on my car and it never hits.
Please study the video a bit. You can hear the loud clanking the best at 6 seconds remaining. And as you can see, i released the clutch pedal kinda quickly, so the tranny vibrated a bit.

My freind presented an interesting point. He said, are you sure its the loop making the noise? Isnt it attached to the body? But i dont think it sounds internal. So do our cars have enough flex to make the loop vibrate?

Anyway, ill bolt up the tranny again as it sits now, and fire it up again. Hopefully its the loop and not the tranny .

Will let you know what i find.
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Old 01-12-2008, 02:08 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

My guess is that it will do the same thing. Sounds like it might be the ring & pinion in the rear end. If so I'd say its normal. Those gears are supposed to have a little play in them. Since there is no load on them the the teath are probably just making noise and bang from the coast to the drive side.

Try this with the wheels off the ground. Start the car and put it in first and let the clutch out and rev the engine. With the engine reved you shouldn't hear and noise. Then let off the gas without pushing in the clutch and you'll probably hear the noise. If yes, then I'd say that's normal.
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Old 01-12-2008, 08:53 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by vbMike View Post
My guess is that it will do the same thing. Sounds like it might be the ring & pinion in the rear end. If so I'd say its normal. Those gears are supposed to have a little play in them. Since there is no load on them the the teath are probably just making noise and bang from the coast to the drive side.

Try this with the wheels off the ground. Start the car and put it in first and let the clutch out and rev the engine. With the engine reved you shouldn't hear and noise. Then let off the gas without pushing in the clutch and you'll probably hear the noise. If yes, then I'd say that's normal.

The clanking noise was much quieter this time, but it happened, just like you said. We pushed the gas in and out rapidly, and the clanking happened every time it was let off.

The syncros are very smooth, the tires spin consistently, and the rpms are constant in gear. SO i think its just the rear. Thanks for the tip Mike.
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Old 01-12-2008, 09:19 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

If you suspect that your hoop is hitting, as a test you can drive a wood block behind the hoop and wedge it between the hoop and body. If it stops making noise, you know what's clanking.

On the other hand, I have had our rear ends clank on me on my previous 5 speed cars. It was because the pinion nut was loosening up, allowing the front seal to leak, and letting the pinion move in and out and knick the differential and make noise.

Good luck!
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Old 01-12-2008, 09:35 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

My car made the same noise and I believe that its normal unless the gears are setup on the tight side. You shouldn't notice it when you are driving.
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Old 01-12-2008, 11:21 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by vbMike View Post
My car made the same noise and I believe that its normal unless the gears are setup on the tight side. You shouldn't notice it when you are driving.
Well im confident its not the tranny. I doubt id hear a clanking if it was internal. It would probably be a short lived grinding, followed by a seizing noise, or something exploding.

Im probably gonna leave the car alone until a long weekend, or mid february when i have reading week. Ill probably tackle the wiring then. The drive will have to wait until spring, the noise wasnt there before, which is why is suspected the tranny, but ive never driven it with the rears off the ground, so i cant be sure.

We'll stick with the noisy rear end story i guess, i like that one .
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Old 01-13-2008, 12:27 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

with the rear off the ground, and tires moving you will get a banging from the spidergears/gears in the rear, i think thats just it.
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:29 PM
  #126  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Hey folks, im back!!! And behind schedule!

Just wanted to revive the thread, as i finish this baby up, and get ready for cruising.

1) Ive got my dakota digital SGI-5, so thats ready to wire up to solve the speedometer issue.
2) I found that the torque arm will hit the driveshaft loop, so i have to move it BACK the other way.
3) I need to know the bolt sizes for the trans x-member mounting. I think i mixed them up, and the ones i used, and bought other bolts matching, are very "loose" in there. But the threads seem to be the right pitch. Ill check the size in a couple days and let you know what I have.
4) Also have to wire up the various lights, and safety switch stuff. I dont have the plugs for the pedals, so ill probably just splice in some wires myself.

5) Im running into some interesting stuff with the console right now, and thats what this post is on.

The rest will have to wait for 3 weeks, when i finish school. I just dont have the time to tinker with the car right now.

SO anyway, i mocked up my console, and shift plate with the B&M shifter, and im horrified by how short the thing is!!! Are the rest of your cars like that??? Its about 11" from the base of the shifter to the top of the ****. I thought it was pretty comfortable, but im rethinking that, now that the console is in. I think i wouldnt be happy unless it was atleast 13" tall. Maybe i can get a hurst shifter, and buy the stick sepereately.

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However, i was pleased to find out, that my auto shift plate will work just fine, with very very minimal modification. Also, im working on making the shifter work, WITHOUT a boot!! If anybody has any interesting ideas on how i could do this, let me know. meanwhile, you can see what ive come up with on this thread.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/fabr...tml?highlight=
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:40 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

The shifter height is about right; a bit tall maybe, but not too bad. Mine is a Camaro, so it has the little black leather sort of baseball-looking ****, and the shifter is a Hurst, so it's ... short. Much better than being taller. I could stand for it to be shorter, actually, I'd be perfectly good with that. Yours looks to be a bit taller than mine, I wouldn't like that as much. You'll see when you start driving it, it'll be fine like it is.

I used the stock 83 T-5 boot on mine. I'd recommend you do the same. Mine fits like it was meant to be there. In fact, to look at the whole thing, you'd never know it isn't stock; it fits, blends, and is harmonious with the whole car. I got the black handle instead of the chrome or aluminum or whatever else, precisely for that reason.

The bolts in your Q #3 are metric; 10mm "std" thread, whatever that is, not "fine" thread. I think it's about 1.5mm pitch but I could EASILY be wrong.
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:47 PM
  #128  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by sofakingdom View Post
The shifter height is about right; a bit tall maybe, but not too bad. Mine is a Camaro, so it has the little black leather sort of baseball-looking ****, and the shifter is a Hurst, so it's ... short. Much better than being taller. I could stand for it to be shorter, actually, I'd be perfectly good with that. Yours looks to be a bit taller than mine, I wouldn't like that as much. You'll see when you start driving it, it'll be fine like it is.

I used the stock 83 T-5 boot on mine. I'd recommend you do the same. Mine fits like it was meant to be there. In fact, to look at the whole thing, you'd never know it isn't stock; it fits, blends, and is harmonious with the whole car. I got the black handle instead of the chrome or aluminum or whatever else, precisely for that reason.

The bolts in your Q #3 are metric; 10mm "std" thread, whatever that is, not "fine" thread. I think it's about 1.5mm pitch but I could EASILY be wrong.
If i cant figure out a "bootless" solution in a reasonable amount of time, i am actually just gonna use the automatic shifter boot i have now. Instead of PRNDD21 in there, ill probably get a "FIREBIRD" acetate made and put in instead of the gear selector section.

As for the bolts, damn! remember 10mm metric, cuz i had to go to 3 places before i found what i needed. I ended up getting them from Surgenor (its a chevrolet dealer, this one was a commercial truck branch).

But with about half the threads screwed in, i can still "wiggle" it around, it definately has play. Once tightened up, its fine though. I hope thats normal. even the new gr. 9 bolts do that.

As for the shifter, this ones gotta go for sure, that **** looks like a *******. I just thought it was really short. Hopefully its still comfortable while driving.
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Old 03-31-2008, 11:23 AM
  #129  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

There's nothing wrong with it being short. Some people actually prefer that for quicker shifts. I have a Hurst shifter and mine is taller than that, or at least more of it is sticking out from the console. I have a camaro so it's hard to say for sure.
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Old 04-23-2008, 06:39 PM
  #130  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Ok, so finally exams are over, and im back. I forget where i left off, so im starting with wiring. Hopefully the car will be out by the end of the week, or Monday at the latest.

First off, im using the "questions that arent normally covered in a T56 Swap" thread as a reference. Ill provide a hyperlink in a second. POST #1
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/faq-...ally+questions

But in that thread i noticed, it said right off the bat, that the driveshaft loop from steve spohn is a waste of $40, because it requires alot of grinding to not hit the torque arm. This is why i said, i need to move the cross member over. BUT i went under and had a closer look, and there about an inch between the two. I movedd the torque arm to its full travel, and it wasnt even close to hitting. So either every car is slightly different, or maybe steve took care of the problem, but IT WILL NOT HIT.

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Ok, now as for wiring, ive been using the same thread. POST #1
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/faq-...ally+questions

So far, i have the autoshifter wiring done up. Where the two thick wires, go to the starter safety switch on the clutch, the next two go to the back up lights, and the next two stay seperated and unconnected. I will be wiring the reverse lockout to the brake, and an auxialiary switch. I think VBmike did it that way. That way the thing doesnt start buzzing everytime you hit the brake.

The next part is the wiring at the switches on the pedals themselves. Heres a pic of the switches.
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However, im missing the various connectors that plug into all of these, so instead of paying for them, im going to use female connectors that i have laying around . Works pretty well, only problem is, i dont know what wires into them.
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Heres the wires that plugged into the auto pedals before.

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Any help with what goes where?

Last edited by online170; 04-23-2008 at 06:43 PM.
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Old 04-23-2008, 07:26 PM
  #131  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

I just wired the reverse lock out to the brake switch. I didnít use a manual button or anything else. There is no need, nothing will buze and it wonít hurt anything. The 4th gens are setup to disable the reverse lock out when the car is going less than 10mph I believe. When I wired mine up I didnít want to cut the factory wiring so I removed the wire from the factory plug and soldered the new wire onto the factory terminal and then installed in back into the plug.

I wouldnít bother doing all that rewiring for the switches. Why donít you just use the switches that were on your factory pedals and install them on the new pedal setup. Then all of the factory wire will just plug right in. Thatís what I did.
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Old 04-23-2008, 07:49 PM
  #132  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by vbMike View Post

I wouldnít bother doing all that rewiring for the switches. Why donít you just use the switches that were on your factory pedals and install them on the new pedal setup. Then all of the factory wire will just plug right in. Thatís what I did.

I tried doing that wheni pulled my original auto pedal out, but i couldnt get the auto switches to fit into the 4th gen pedals. Am i missing something?
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Old 04-23-2008, 08:02 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Humm. I replaced my 3rd gen auto pedals with 3rd gen manual pedal. I also had a set of 4th gen manual pedal in the car for a while until I switch to the 3rd gen set but I though the switches fit either set. Can't remember for sure so maybe someone else can comment. Are your factory switches to big or to small?
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Old 04-23-2008, 08:04 PM
  #134  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

The third gen auto pedals have a "metal" retaining clip, that the plastic switches screw into. The 4th gen have plastic ones.

Theres two switches on both the auto and manual brake pedal.

So i have the plastic insert/ratainers in the 4th gen pedal right now, and if i try to plug in the auto switches, on is JUST to small, and the other is too big.


EDIT:

Ok false alarm. Note to self, if theres only two options, and one is too small, and the other too big, try switching them around..... Problem solved, now im done that part. Ill update with pix tommorow.

Last edited by online170; 04-23-2008 at 08:16 PM.
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Old 04-23-2008, 08:16 PM
  #135  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Strange. On my auto pedals it had two switch. One switch, I believe it was for the brake light, had a smaller shaft that screwed into the pedals. It was about the size of your smallest finger. The other switch was for the cruse control and had a larger shaft, about the size of your thumb. I assume your switches are the same. Not to sound stupid but are you stilling the smaller switch in the smaller hole and bigger switch in the bigger hole?
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Old 04-23-2008, 08:19 PM
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Originally Posted by vbMike View Post
Not to sound stupid but are you stilling the smaller switch in the smaller hole and bigger switch in the bigger hole?
Yea thats exactly what i did. Except 3 months ago, i actually tried switching the metal inserts into the manual pedals, and when they didnt fit, i concluded it wouldnt work. But i hadnt tried the switches themselves. So when i tried screwing them into the plastic it worked.

ANd i have the exact two switches you mentioned, one for cruise, and the other for the brake light.
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Old 04-25-2008, 09:02 PM
  #137  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Ok, so the wiring is mostly done. Right not im trying to just get the car out! so ive done the essentials. ie: Starter safety, brakes, reverse. The SGI box will have to wait, but i will get to it in a few days. I will bunch up the wiring pix into one post.

Meanwhile, heres my progress with the console.

I checked and rechecked, and the auto shift plate works just fine. I ran into 2 minor issues, that i resolved very quickly. Reverse seems to go forward the furthest, so all pix were taken in reverse. In addition to this, i powershifted the tranny into 1, 3, and 5, and even with play, it didnt touch the shift plate.

Heres the console and shift plate BOLTED down, so i know what i am working with. Selector in Reverse.

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Close up of same:
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This was the only modification i had to do. This part sticks out the furthest, and although the shifter wasnt hitting it normally, it did touch when powershifted into 1,3,5. So i took some tin snips, made some snips, and folded the metal back.
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This accomodated for any touching, including the extra thickness of the leather shift boot.
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Finished Product (almost). Hows that for stealth??? As for the PRNDD21 insert, (incase your wondering), i sent it to an engraver, and he is going to cut an exact sized insert, but it will say FIREBIRD. Cost $10, should be ready in about a week. It will light up and everything. Cost would have been less, but he didnt have the "sheet" in stock, and i ended up paying for most of it.
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Old 05-02-2008, 07:55 PM
  #138  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

looks good, , i have read this thread a couple of times now, it has motivated me to get mine finished. hopefully i will be able to drop the motor and tranny back in the car next weekend, if i can get the last 2 parts i need
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Old 05-16-2008, 03:08 PM
  #139  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Ok, so i must admit, im being INCREDIBLY lazy about doing the wiring, but i will get to it, (maybe this weekend?). I have a couple of urgent issues i need to deal with, like subframe connectors, bumstop removal, and cat installation, so i can drive around EVERYWHERE, rather than treating the car like a princess.

In the mean time, whoever said you cant use a T56 (all 6 gears) with a 3.42 rear gear, is DEAD WRONG! You just dont have enough power...... Conversely, if you DO have enough power, you DO NOT need 6th until youre on the freeway (min 60mph), which i didnt know at the time.

Also.... if you decide to do a little spirited driving, stay in 3rd, because past that gear, you are definately speeding like crazy..... ahem......

In any case, i now created a little sheet to tell me which RPM = which mph, so i can gauge it without a speedometer.

Meanwhile, heres what ive accomplished. Ive finished putting the interior back, and as you can see, because it was so easy just to use the auto shift plate, i kept it like that. Heres the neat part.

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Also ill try and score a video of me grabbing gears, and hopefully i can do that wiring this weekend (long weekend). Sorry its takin so long.

Also heres the rest of the interior. Im going for the "stealthy" factory appearing look. I think its working, even though i have 6 extra gauges, and a T56.
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Last edited by online170; 05-16-2008 at 03:12 PM.
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Old 05-16-2008, 04:11 PM
  #140  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

I have read this thread all the way through and it has helped me decide to swap to a T56. The information you have posted will be very helpful i'm sure.

Since my car is already stripped and I happen to have a set of third gen manual pedals I thought I would mount them up. WRONG. When my car was converted to right hand drive the fire wall was completely changed. The steering column now goes through where the master cylinder should mount.
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Old 05-17-2008, 01:43 AM
  #141  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Heres grabbin all 6 gears, and a lil drifting fun.





More videos at the photobucket site....
http://s111.photobucket.com/albums/n...rebird%20Vids/

Enjoy...
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Old 05-18-2008, 02:53 AM
  #142  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

very nice! im still debating on which of my thirdgens i want to do this swap on lol both will ultimately have it done but one with a gen 1 sbc and the other with a ls1 if that project ever gets started
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Old 05-18-2008, 11:28 AM
  #143  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

if you already have the tranny, thats an easy one. If you have the LS1 version, put it in the LS1, and if you have the LT1 version, put it on the gen1 SBC.
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Old 05-19-2008, 10:45 PM
  #144  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

I will do a whole write up step by step tommorow, because its a little late right now. But i wanted to mention, that i noticed, people on this board are just ordering the "SGI-5" box, as i did. However, Dakota Digital put out a few versions.

MOST people are using the SGI-5-A. However since i got mine used i realized i had the SGI-5-C. I didnt know there were different versions until today.

If you have the choice, i would HIGHLY recommend getting the SGI-5-C version. It is much much much easier to dial in. Stay tuned, i will do a full write up on it, and the pedal wires and connectors tommorow.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:04 AM
  #145  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Ok here we go, this is what everyones been waiting for..... A LOT of pix and references. Excuse me if i dont use the most technical language, but everything im going over has been overed, ill provide a link to the reference if youd like more "exact" answers. This post is more of a "visual" interpretation.

Ok lets start off with the easy stuff.

Pedal Wiring:
Just like vbMike suggested, save the hassle, and put the old auto brake pedal wiring back onto the 4th gen pedals. I had broken my plastic insert, so the connector wasnt staying, i used "automotive goop" to adhere it into place. Has worked well so far. Plug everything back into the connector bulkhead. Check to make sure it is "adjusted" right, so when the pedal is depressed the light will come on. If the connector is too close to the pedal, the light will take some time to come on (not good).
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Notice, my wiring is a little cluttered in that particular location. I wasnt able to get the "cruise vacuum signal" onto its connection, so i plugged it for now.
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I had already put the clutch pedal bulkhead connector in there, so i left it there. Its absolutely useless for this swap though, unless you need it for the ECM or something.
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Next up, lets do the Auto Shifter Wiring:

First off, everything for this part as mentioned in one of my earlier posts, is taken from this thread. Refer to it for specific references.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/faq-...ally+questions

Ok, so now we all know what an auto shifter looks like. Heres the passenger side of it. Lets concentrate on that little wiring module thing.
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Working from the top to the bottom.

1) the two top wires (Yellow and Purple) are the starter safety switch. It'll ensure you dont start your car in gear. It will also prevent you from starting your car, if you have them unplugged, and not wired up (like what happened to me earlier).
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Splice these wires into atleast 12 gauge wire, as they will have power going through them and route them under the radio pod, under the fuse panel cover, all the way to the top of the clutch pedal.
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Splice in some female spade connectors (the blue ones worked best for me), and put them into the black switch at the top of the clutch pedal. You will notice the switch has a button, that is pressed when the clutch pedal is depressed fully. This activates the switch. Plug in the wires you just spliced into this switch. If it doesnt work, try switching them around.

Also, the blue spade connectors fit best onto the "spades" but you will have to be creative getting 12 gauge wire into the other end. I opened mine up with pliers and slide the wire in. Then crimped and taped them up.
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Last edited by online170; 05-21-2008 at 12:08 AM.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:18 AM
  #146  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Next up is the Reverse Light wiring:

Its the next two wires in line at the shifter, but lets start at the tranny side.

Here is the 2 wire connector on the tranny. It is a Green and Purple wire on the tranny, and the ONLY connector you will use on the PASSENGER side of the T56. ALL the connectors, can only go in/on one way.
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Next, we take the next two wires on the shifter, Green and Blue, and hook them up to this connector. Green to Green and BLue to Purple(whihc looks like brown in the pix).

GREEN TO GREEN:
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BLUE TO PURPLE:
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Next two wires in line, i forget what they do, but we just leave them alone.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:44 AM
  #147  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Finally, we get to the Dakota Digital SGI-5 box. For those of you who dont know, this is what makes your speedo read correctly. You cannot just hook up the T56 VSS to the factory speedo (they give off different pulse signals) and the SGI 5 converts them to read on the factory spoeedo.

As mentioned before, there are a few different versions kicking around out there. Stick to the SGI-5-B or SGI-5-C. For those that have neither of these, you can refer to this thread for now. Im still searching for the other one, that tells you how to calibrate the SGI-5-A. It had something to do with, taking the incorrect speed, and dividing by actual speed, coming up with a ratio, then dialing in a code.
For example:
#1---->ON
#2---->OFF
#3---->OFF
#4---->ON
#5---->OFF, etc
#10---->ON

Also, heres a pic for SGI-5-A.
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https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tran...digital+dakota

HOWEVER,

I used the SGI-5-C, so heres how i did it. Referenced from this thread.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tran...al-sgi-5c.html

First off, find the 2 wire connector that attached to your auto VSS. It should be a Pink/Black and Black wire.
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Cut it off, (leave a bit of wire on the connector) and put it somewhere, incase you ever need it again.

Next, feed the other end of the wires (which are attached to the speedo) up through the little grommet hole. We will call these the Output.

PAY CLOSE ATTETION NOW, because my colour coding is about to get much worse.
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Next, attach the connector to the VSS on the T56. Its a two wire connector, with Yellow and Purple wire. The VSS is the ONLY connector on the DRIVER side of the trans, that is pointing straight DOWN.
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Again, feed these two wires up through the gromet hole. We will call these the INPUT. It doesnt matter which is which for this specific connector, because the signal is a sin wave. (see SGI-5-C thread).
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Next, we need a 12V power source. Some people take it from anywhere, but i HIGHLY recommend you take it from a SWITCHED source that only comes on when the key is on.

I fed a wire to the top side of the fuse block, and soldered into there. Then ran the wire down. Im pointing to it in this pic.
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Ofcourse, its a good idea to run a fuse on it just incase.
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Also, thinking ahead, keep fuses in a location where they can easily be reached, if you need to swap them out. All i have to do, is open my FUSES cover, and there it is.
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Splice/Extend this wire, to where your SGI-5-C box is going to be. We will call this wire POWER. Ignore colours at this point..... I have two wires spliced into this fuse, one is for gauge lighting (red), the other is for SGI box(blue).
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Finally, we need a ground. I bolted up a wire to where the console lighting was being used for ground. We will call this one GROUND.
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Last edited by online170; 05-21-2008 at 04:30 PM.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:54 AM
  #148  
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Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

This is what its supposed to look like.
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Heres my interpretation, as i noticed one change from the SGI-5-C thread.

First, we take the POWER wire, and plug it into the POWER terminal at the SGI box.
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Next, we take the GROUND wire, and plug it into the GROUND terminal on the box.
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Next we take the two "INPUT" wires (yellow and purple) from the T56 VSS (pointing straight down), and plug them into the INPUT and SENSOR GRD at the box.
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Thats the way i did, you can also switch the two INPUTS around, it doesnt matter.
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Old 05-21-2008, 01:00 AM
  #149  
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ottawa, ONT
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Car: 1987 Firebird
Engine: 355
Transmission: T56
Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Now this is where the "change" occurs, from the other thread.

Take the two OUTPUT wires Pink/Black is now RED. and Black is still Black.

Plug the Pink/Black or red in my case into OUT #3. (not #4 like the manual says).
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AND plug the Black wire into OUT #4. (the other thread doesnt mention this, and stevo had a different way of doing it). This is what worked for me, and was the easiest.
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Old 05-21-2008, 01:07 AM
  #150  
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Car: 1987 Firebird
Engine: 355
Transmission: T56
Re: My T56 Swap Thread....

Switch the #1,#2,#3,#4 to OFF OFF ON ON respectively.

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NOTE: This version has an UP and a DOWN button.
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They are incredibly easy to tune. You just go for a drive, and if the speedo is reading too fast, you press DOWN until it reads right, and press UP for the opposite effect. Get a freind to help you, because you dont have enough eyes or hands to do it yourself.

Also, note, there is an LED that will light up if its wired correctly.
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Last couple of things. CUt the grommet like this, to be able to feed wires through it. This is the one off the auto shifter linkage.
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My wiring is a bit of mess at the moment but ill be cleaning it up. Thats it thats all!!
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