after my 90 camaro 3.1 has been running very sluggish for sometime now i finally decided to pull the trouble codes.

i got: 32, 33, and 34

i know the definitions of these codes but they all say it could be more than one thing wrong. is there one thing in particular that could affect all three of these?

 

dont really think maf and egr could mess up in the same places? since exhaust gas recirculation should have nothing to do with the maf? not sure but 34 could be because of running your car with it unplugged, clear codes and see what comes up again...

 

he doesn't have a MAF, one of those krazzy MAP style engines

 

way out of my league...

 

I agree w/Slow2.8; clear the codes out (disconnect negative battery cable), then go for a 1/2 hour drive away from your house at 55mph or higher, and 1/2 hour drive back home- total drive time=1 hour, enough for the computer to re-learn itself. Then next time you see the SES light, pull the codes as soon as possible, and see what comes out. You might just have old codes stored.

When your car was acting sluggish, did the SES light ever come on? Or did you just check the codes for the heck of it?

 

my car is pretty much always sluggish. i checked the codes because on my way home from school (i take the freeway) my SES light flashed on while going approx 75mph. when i got off the exit ramp i came to a red light and when i came to a complete stop the light turned off.

im so damn tired of this stupid car running sh**ty. i just want a month straight were it runs right.

im about to just throw a new MAP sensor and see if that helps. ill worry about EGR later....

 

MAP sensors cain be tested free ya' know

 

So it probably makes darn good sense to clear all the codes out and the first time you see the SES light come on, pull over, and check the codes again. I doubt you wouldve thrown all 3 at once.

And the last time you did the major tuneup was when...?

 

There seems to be a lot of people out there with 6s who have bad driveability. I know my car isn't running near where it should. If stock is 135, mine's probably running at 110. There's got to be some common problem or solution. I love my car, but sometimes I just get so pissed off that it has so many problems.

 

will advance auto parts test it for me or do i have to take it to a garage? (i have no diagnostic equipment besides my paper clip)

 

the i did a partial minor tune-up about 2 or 3 weeks ago. i did a new cap & rotor with new wires...didnt do plugs cause the "new" engine came with them

im pretty sure that they werent all thrown at the same time. thinking back my MAP vacuum was loose and i put it back on tight but that was a while ago and it is still running like ****. that may account for the codes 33 and 34. which have been flashing for a while since i havent cleared the codes in a long time. however i know for a fact that code 32 is new.

 

anyone?

 

I think you'll have to ask the people who have the same engine as you, or else tell us what the codes are. Apparently your codes are different from a lot of others.

 

well seeing as though this is a v6 board i figured that everyone would know that i was refering to a v6...with that said it is a 1990 Camaro RS 3.1

i cleared my codes today and the only one that was thrown again was code 32 (fault in EGR valve)

project said that MAP sensors can be tested for free and i was wondering who would do this for me and i was also wondering if there was a way that i could check my EGR (digital) and see if it is still good or not

 

Well since you have a MAP and others have a MAF, you can't be sure what codes have been changed between the two.

Also, if you mean that your EGR is computer controlled by saying it's digital, then I can scan in the instructions for testing if you want.

 

i would appreciate if you could do that for me

btw 90-92 have MAP sensor & 82-89 have MAF
not sure but i think digital EGR came on all 3.1 and vacuum EGR came on all 2.8

 

The 2.8 EGR is computer controlled, but the actual valve is moved by vacuum. Maybe the valve on your car is moved by a solenoid?

 

i have a 3.1 (digital egr)
the whole thing is controlled by the ecm meaning that there is no diaphram for me to grab or push or pull
i dont believe that my EGR is vaccum control and i dont beleive that it has a solenoid

 

At just about the end of every code, it say it could also be a bad ECM. Or try cleaning your IAC, could be crudy and sticking open.

try n see if a junk yard will let ya try a computer for 5 bucks.


Matt

 

none of the codes that i have ever pulled have indicated a bad ECM. the IAC is brand new and was even cleaned already even though it didnt need it

 

With the year of your car being the first for the f-body MAP system I would update the MEMCAL in the ECM. If you have an auto trans the BCC will be AZTY. Not sure for a 5-spd.

If you are getting MAP codes then forget about the EGR codes. The ECM uses the MAP to test the EGR.

Make sure that the MAP line from the back of the plenum to the sensor (on the firewall) is in good condition. No cracks, twisted melted areas, fits snugly on port connectors. Make sure the wiring harness/connector to the MAP is in good condition.

The digital EGR consists of three soleniods that are actuated by the ECM. Has four wires to it, one for power (B+ from ignition) and three others to the ECM. The ECM will ground the wire to a soleniod to activate it.

Each EGR soleniod orfice is a different size. This allows the ECM to select 1 of 8 different EGR flows. Once the MAP is fixed and if the EGR still gives codes then also check for carbon build up in the EGR tube going to the plenum.

RBob.

 

In the book as the end of every code it says "or bad ECM"

YOur asking for help but not taking any of it, Id say its time to try the strange and unusual if the straight forward approach isnt working. When you fail, try try again.

 

believe me i am grateful for every bit of advice that i get from you guys...without you all i wouldnt even know what direction to be looking. i didnt look in the haynes for the codes i looked in the tech article.

the thing is i think that the MAP codes may have been thrown due to me messing with the wires and vacuum on it.

the EGR code was thrown way long after the MAP codes. i checked the vacuum and wires going to MAP and they appear to be good and snug. however my car continues to run like crap. i keep leaning towards the EGR because the code was thrown and there was no way possible that it was my fault

 

Well then change the EGR and cros your fingers???

Also I would check under the hood at night for spark leak around the coil and other parts.

Your running out of option but t o start throwing money at it.

Matt

 

Put some money and some love and time into your car...... it will run good if you pay attention to the little things and fix the things that are wrong with it.... have you checked your O2 sensor??? check your distributor... u might need a new cap, plugs,and wires for it, oh yea and dont forget to change your oil every 3000 miles or 3 months..... even if you dont travel alot.... my bf has an 88 2.8 v6 RS..... he says your EGR is definately why your car is running like ****.... his did the same thing...every 75,000 MILES you need to change your o2 sensor.... your car is probably running rich.... so if ya need anything else email me at tyrantsbabygurl@hotmail.com ok ??? later

amelia

 

i just replaced the cap, rotor, and wires not too long ago. im due for an oil change in 600 miles. havent checked the o2 sensors. btw my car doesnt even have 75000 miles on it yet. as a matter of fact i have 69xxx. dont believe im running rich but ill check.

 

1) i have recently noticed that when i started my car i hear a kinda 'bonk' (best description i could think of) from somewhere under the middle of my dash

2) a seperate observation that i recently made was that at approx 2500-3000 rpms there is a sound coming from the back of my car that kinda sounds like 'woo woo woo woo'? ....kinda like something might be rubbing

any ideas?

im trying to get my car in perfect running condition if you cant already tell

 

Check your differential.

 

lol when i had swapped the EGR i later realized that all that i did was take off the old one and put it back on. i didnt have time to take it off again and swap the good one yesterday so i did it this morning. i havent run the car yet but as soon as i do ill let you guys know.

 

ok its definately not the EGR valve that is causing my problems. at first it ran fine like it always does but after warmed up my idle got crazy...like always. is there any part that you can think of that is engaged at a certain temperature or after a certain amount of time that could be causing this?

 

Does this vehicle have an automatic trans by any chance?

RBob.

 

ok, I know AZ has the wells testor kit that can do the MAP ssensor. I've done it myself. Can even do non-digital (sorry) egrs, & TPS. Take yours in & have them test it. AS fara s teh egr, call a dealer & see if they cain do it. Tha's about as much as I cn give you for now.

Also pull teh ig module & have tested while there.

 

yep it does....what might that have to do with my problem?

 

The 3.1l auto equip'd engines require an idle learn procedure to be done whenever battery power is lost or the IAC has been changed/played with. The symptoms of not having done the idle learn are: surging idle, stalling, hesitation and bucking, in general a lousy running engine at low speeds.

Here is a link to the procedure:

https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=158052

Just need to change 'chuck tires' to 'chock tires', <g>.

I also recommend that the MEMCAL be upgraded. The early years were not that good. Should have AZTY on a silver sticker on the MEMCAL inside of the ECM.

Another recommendation, if not already done, is to clean the inside of the throttle body. A lot of build up occurs from the EGR being dumped in right behind it. Use some cleaner on a rag and swab out the inside of the TB. Also get the edges of the butterfly. I wear gloves whenever I do this, it's that bad.

RBob.

 

Not picking on anyone here, just trying show how much I agree w/TyrantsBabyGurl- obviously, you've all seen my major tuneup messages. Doing just cap/rotor and wires gives you a lot more stuff to test. You gotta do it all, and then if the car's still exibiting driveability problems, you start your diagnosis. 90v6rs, did you ever pull the plugs to make sure they're okay (no missing electrode chunks, correct gap, clean, color indicated proper a/f mix)?

Just think of how many questions we answer here that are just major-tuneup related!

 

couple questions: what exactly does it mean to chuck tires or chock tires and how exactly would i go about upgrading the MEMCAL? i just cleaned my throttle body and the no help...wasnt too messy. is there supposed to be any liquid substance in the tube that connects the snorkle to the passenger side of the engine (looks like pcv only on other side)?

plugs are new and have no electrode chunks with blue spark. how do i check the gap? is there any possiblity that the problem that im having is distributor related? is replacing the coil part of the tune-up?

 

Well, to chuck the tires you'd unbolt them from the car and throw them. Not quite what I intended. To chock the tires you put a 4x4 piece of wood or such in front of the tire to keep the car from going anywhere while in gear.

To update the MEMCAL you should be able to purchase it from GM. Depending upon where the price will be in the $45 to $65 dollar range. You may also place a want ad in the classifieds and get one that way.

The MEMCAL is located inside of the ECM. ECM is located on pass side under dash. Silver box about 2 x 9 x 12 inches. Push bottom of ECM forward (velcro) and then pull down. Open cover on ECM (two hex headed screws) and under that is the MEMCAL (w/blue plastic cover). At each end is a clip, push them down and the MEMCAL pops out. Install by pushing new MEMCAL in. Which end for end alignment is by some slots/tabs in the socket.

They may be some oil in the PCV vent tube. More mile son engine the more oil in tube.

RBob.

 

take the SES light bulb out!!! That's wut i did!!!

 

take the SES light bulb out!!! That's wut i did!!!

 

thats what i thought it was but is it okay for the engine to have oil in that tube?

 

It would be better if there wasn't any oil in the tube. It just means that the engine is getting tired. Crankcase pressure from blowby is starting to push oil out of the valve cover and into the tube. This is happening during heavy(er) throttle usage.

Missed this earlier. If it wasn't like cleaning out the inside of an exhaust pipe then I'd believe that your EGR truely isn't operational. The corregated tube that runs from the EGR valve to the intake neck (right behind the TB) dumps exhaust gases into the plenum.

This is what causes the build up inside of the throttle body.

RBob.

 

the thing is i already replaced the EGR valve and it didnt change a thing...and about the oil in the tube...my engine better not be getting tired it doesnt even have 5000 miles on it.

my next guess would be o2 sensor

 

and another thing does anyone have any idea what would make a clunk sound from the middle of the dash when i start my car?

 

A sleeping cat.

 

Hm, I know this dosn't have anything to do with the codes your getting, but I would check and see if your cat-converter is plugged up. My 89 RS had around 88k on it, and catalyst in the converter broke onto two pieces and got stuck in the pipe causing me to surge and slowly get up to 55mph's when I was flooring it. One big symptom I noticed was the temp was a lot higher than the norm.

Yet, just an idea. I also recommend what TomP said, check the spark plugs, and every other tunable object on the car.

-Dan

 

Air flow control door for the A/C heater system.

RBob.

 

would i be able to get to it by pulling the heater controls out...when i do this how would i fix the problem? i also belive that i have a vacuum leak that is causing heat to only come out of the defroster so ill check that out too

dont really think its my cat. i dont smell anything different and the temp is no higher than usual. plus i dont really have a problem accelerating. my problem is comming to a stop, idle, and starting off

 

i finally got around to changing my o2 sensor yesterday and am sad to report that it didnt fix my problem. i think i have a miss. with my car in park and my foot on the gas you can definately tell. even w/o my foot on gas it idles up and down. it still seems to fall on its face when i get on the gas.

in the haynes manual under trouble shooting...what do they mean "misses throughout driving range"?

i checked the spark on all of the wires from the distributor cap and i have a very nice bright blue spark. however i am planning to check the plugs. what is the easiest way to pull them out?

one more thing. are there different degrees to a miss (ie. does it always result in extremely rough idle or can it sometimes be subtle?)

 

anyone?

 

Tried to pull my spark plugs yesterday to inspect them and they wouldn't budge for the life of them. I used a 5/8" spark plug socket with a T-handle and ended up bending the handle. What am I doing wrong?