Fastbird

iTrader: (5)

Got the 3.4 in the car and running this weekend. Still have to adjust a few things but overall she runs good.

Fastbird

iTrader: (5)

pic of motor

Fastbird

iTrader: (5)

pic of engine bay

85berlinetta2.8

pretty damn cool

camaro350man

Anymore?

theratdude64

sweeeeet I Got's ta do that! I'm goanna do a 3.4 T61 turbo swap down the road

FirebirdNYC

how much in total is the swap costing you? i want to do a 3.4 swap

Fastbird

iTrader: (5)

Sorry that is all the pics I have. The swap is not very expensive to do. I happen to find a guy who was getting rid of the entire drivetrain of a 95 camaro to put in a carbed 406. I scored the motor, trans, all accesories, full exhaust, wiring harness and all computers for $500. The setup had 90K miles on it though.

So i purchased a full gasket set, injector O-rings and a timing chain.

If you are thinking about doing this swap, KED85 is a great guy to talk to and is very knowledgable in this swap. He has a tech article written on it. Overall, it was very easy. One of the easiest swaps I have done yet.

camaro350man

Did you havr to change that oil pan or the timing cover or did everything just bolt on? And how hard was it to take that plug out of the head for the temp sensor? I heard they a B**** to get out. Run into any troubles? Did you use the 2.8 engine mounts? Thanks

85berlinetta2.8

is that a 700r4 attached to it? did it come with the motor?

is that just rubberiser or some heat paint you got in the bay?

FirebirdNYC

well i never EVER attempted a swap before, but i am willing to get my hands dirty (of course i would get some help) , but 500 bucks isnt bad . KED! where are you i want to read his article

KED85

Here is 3.4 in the end of the swap process.
Boring isn't it?
Cleaver, it is!
Easy to pass smog, YEP! as it is a "2.8", right?
Here's some costs
Gasket set is about $65-$100
Parts is about $50-$150
I've discovered that ON SOME versions of LATER 2.8/3.1, some parts (T cover/oil pan) need not be swapped
BUT you should remove them anyway to check, readjust, install "new this & that".
My swap, my version of the 2.8->3.4 Long Block Swap Boogie is based on a 1985 V6 MPFI platform (& also carb'd 2.8's, too!).
Everyone's swap is "different" or similar.
It is a very low engineered swap, requiring ONLY 100% attention to the details.
Once engines laid side by side, "they are the same.
One mearly redresses the 3.4 long block, to look exactly like what was pulled out of engine bay, to begin with".
That is the goal, to look like what ya started with!
Cleaner, stronger, better, but the same!
And serious atleast 80% of the 2.8-3. stuff swaps right over with only a clean up!
I guees my thread is in the Tech section.
YES IF NECESSARY that fan sensor switch located inback of passenger side cylinder block is one botch to remove. The recessed square headed plug in 3.4 is worse!
Your swap MAY be lucky to not need remove it.
But of let's say 101 swappers, 99.9% report much pleasure in the new ride they've created.
Buy the lowest milage 3.4 engine, COMPLETE, you can.
That save ya having to rebuild and also spend those costs.
I've paid most for 3.4's. $800 & $900. To me worth it! I got great running low milage rides on the cheap. I can't wait to add headers to my ride!
Do a burn out for me infront of the Hospital, just don't get caught
Glad I could pass that smile cross county. You enjoy! Expect some teething pains, in hoses and stuff to close and may cause a problem. That's normal stuff!
Average cost for the 3.4 is $500 range.
Lowest has been $210!
The 2.8->3.4 Long Block Swap Boogie really is a Win Win swap.

FirebirdNYC

thats amazing its nearly the same, so what car did you pull the 3.4 out of? . Time to save up some money.

GreyFox

has anyone doen a 3.1 -> 3.4 swap?

KED85

I believe that has been done several times, too.
In the end, it's virtually "identical" to the 2.8->3.4 idea.
Again one uses original vehicle induction/ignition/exhaust system, added to the 3.4 long block.
The 3.4 ya keep the 3.4 balancer, flexplate, injectors.
Add 3.4 injectors to the current vehicle FI rails (they just pop right back in).
Pretty much ya then done!
As always GET NEW SENSORS!
I cheated on that last call & now it's haunting me.
My ride needs some new sensors & wish I changed several years back, but.....
AND
Get the rear cam seal and rear main seal, NEW! Change these while engine is out & your rear by bellhousing will remain nearly guaranteed leak free.
Ask for 2.8/3.1/3.4 application as it'll be same part.
Yeah it is a sneaky package, that's the beauty.
I did NOT do my swap for racing or speed, really to escape emission problems & also it was cheaper than rebuilding a 2.8 engine!

Dale

iTrader: (12)

*cough*

FirebirdNYC

im assuming there is a slight difference in power, correct?

KED85

If you are lucky and score a low milage engine, yes you will feel mucho more solid power.
IF you score a well beaten 3.4 Insert it, you may feel like ya wasted time.
The key is finding very good low milage used engine, complete.
Pay up front & avoid beaten up by little costs in long run.

camaro350man

Whats low miles?

KED85

My Firebird 3.4 had 50,000 miles on it when I bought it.
My Blazer 3.4 had 40,000 miles onit when I bought it.

FirebirdNYC

would you say its enough to beat a v8?

Dale

iTrader: (12)

what, going to the 3.4? um, NO

Now maybe with dowards turbo you can.

KED85

No a 3.4 is not gonna beat a V8
IF ya wanna go racing like that go buy a V8
The 3.4 upgrade is a great way to enjoy a 6 cylinder car.
But serious a 3.4 is not gonna make you a racing king on teh back street of Brooklyn!

Pillsbry10

iTrader: (1)

now it may beat a v8 if you bore it out some, forged pistons, headers, upgraded ported heads....nitrous =) or somethign along those lines....guess we will find out when i get mine done

drdave88

iTrader: (3)

a 3.4 w/ a few mods on it will beat some 3rd gen stock 305s. but they were only rated at 170hp. that was the TBI i believe. im too lazy to look right now though, lol. but i have beaten 2 at the drag strip. some friends' friends were out there cause they heard i had a v6 that would beat them, they heard correctly. i dont know if they had anything done or what shape they were in so im not sure of any details. but it is possible.

theratdude64

I'm goanna eventually do a 3.4 and Doward's Turbo, should run like a raped ape

KED85

Here's where I laugh & kinda bitch
Forgive me
One spends like $500-ish on your 3.4
Let's add rebuild PARTS at $750
Let's add LABOR at $750
Add purchasing the turbo kit (forive me IF I offer a wrong price) of $1,000
Don't forget headers/exhaust work $600
ALOT OF THESE NUMBERS I MAY EVEN BE GENEROUS!
I added up $3600 for those efforts to beat a V8
NOW AGAIN I'M JUST TOSSING THIS OUT.....
People bitched about a $3500 Supercharger kit.
Think of the nice V8 you can build for $3500!
And still have change left over.
I know this is an old debate, so ain't it fun to dream!
The 3.4 in "stock form" all systems working right is a mighty stout little package.
I can't wait to see how mine scoots just by adding the exhaust headers.
I believe at the "Power Level", header addition will be my breaking point. Anymore performance expense after that and I feel not true return on investments. Except a racing slick!

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

I did the 3.1 to 3.4 swap on my sisters car. Finished it recently.

$300 for motor
$200 for misc gaskets, o rings, oil, incidentals
Lots of labor messing with stupid stuff
Lots of running around for parts and misc things

Lot of labor swapping things around.

Was it worth it? nah, not really. The theory was, replace a v6 with a v6 and get the car up and running. In reality, i've done V8 swaps in much less time, that were less of a PITA to do..

1) Some of the brackets are bolted to the exhaust manifold. Naturally they tend to snap.

2) The wanter pump, housing, timing cover are different. You can run the 3.4 stuff with minimal modifications, but you have to fab a timing mark. Most people recommend changing them over, and replacing the pump and timing gear set. Which adds to the cost.

3) The 3.1 and 3.4 lower baseplate are similar, but the 3.4 doesn't have an additional port for the PVC. You can change intakes, but since the stock gaskets for the valve covers are baked on expect to spend an hour or so scraping gasket material.

4) The 3.4 and 3.1 oil pan are similar, but the 3.4 oil pan rubbed my exhaust. You can pry it a little, or change to the 3.1 oil pan. Which requires a gasket. more money

5) The o-ring for one of the coolant lines on mine was shot. More money. ($13)

6) The knock sensor on the 3.4 needs to be swapped around with the plug. However, it now rubs the starter solenoid. so make sure its plugged in BEFORE bolting up the starter.

7) generally everything is tighter, smaller, and harder to get to than on a V8.



So my feedback is simple. If your considering this swap, don't. If you just wanna swap your v6 out because its blown, go ahead. But if your looking to improve your car, look elsewhere.

-- Joe

drdave88

iTrader: (3)

how can swapping a V8 be easier? ive never done an easier swap than this one. w/ a V8 youd have to swap the suspension, transmission, fuel pump, etc. swapping a 3.4 is just like doing another 3.1. theyre the same (essentially) block. most of us will agree and recommend doing the swap.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Swapping to a 3.4 is not like swapping another 3.1. If you were swapping another 3.1, you wouldn't have to tear the motor down to the long block, and re-assemble.

I'm trying to help here. For the folks happy with the 3.4 swap, good for you. My opinions are not based on "some v8 guy that thinks your all silly", its from a guy who did the 3.4 swap and regrets it.

And its really a matter of what you want to do with the car. I think I made the point earlier that if the desire is to stay v6 and close to stock, than sure do the 3.4 thing. But I think some people here are misguided and think the 3.4 swap is a performance related swap, and thats just plain silly.

What I *should* have done, was take the motor and tranny outta the '83 I just stripped, and put that in her '91. Would have taken me about the same time, even considering the hour to change motor mounts and springs.
Only difference is the end result would have been a 350hp car, not a 150-160ish.

In closing, to each their own. But I think some of you guys are making this swap sound better than it actually is. If anyone has any specific questions, I'll give you realistic answers.

-- Joe

KED85

And its really a matter of what you want to do with the car. I think I made the point earlier that if the desire is to stay v6 and close to stock, than sure do the 3.4 thing. But I think some people here are misguided and think the 3.4 swap is a performance related swap, and thats just plain silly.

That's nearly exactly as I say.
Ya think you will win every race by swapping in a 3.4? No.
Will you have more fun trying, sure!
I did my swap for smog purposes & on that end I scored big time.
The other factors of more power, better performing vehicle because of the swap, sure that's also correct.
The 3.4 swap is detailed. No other simple way to say it.

AdmAnt13

I agree, thats why I didn't let anyone convince me into swapping a 3.4L. I have my rebuilt 350TPI in the garage instead waiting to come alive this summer.
Of course I want performance (engine rated a 330HP 408 torque), not just a better V6.

AdmAnt13

double post

Project: 85 2.8 bird

That depends on what they do to the 3.4 in mid swap.