Saar

i have a 8F wideband patch text document laying around if you want it... uses the A/C pressure sensor A/D channel.

8F is actually built off of 6D. i discovered this when i was hacking "backwards" starting with DF and A1 and going back to 8F, 88, 6D. i was considering doing 55 and 46 as well, but i don't see much use to them.

the launch mode can be used for both spark addition and subtraction, just have to play with the bias value.

stall torque uses a calculated trans input to output RPM ratio to estimate how much power is being sent through. the tables are used as a spark advance "limit", as they are added together and then if the commanded spark advance is above it, it gets clipped down to the stall torque combined value.

if you want more clarification on it, let me know.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

What pin did you use for the WB patch? Id definitly could use that patch doc. so that I can set it up.

I use to play with the launch mode on $88 but im not sure when does the launch mode enable? What parameters have to me met for it to be active?

Thanks man. One good thing about $59 was the support and how many hacks were out there. But im curious to see how much more stable my fueling will be with 8f just because of the much better resolution.

Saar

C21 on a 7727, so F14 on a 7730.

the 8F XDF i have has 16 scalars under the Launch Mode heading.... a couple of them shouldn't be there though.

the bias, attack rate multiplier, MPH limit, D-TPS and D-MAP thresholds, max time and EGR multiplier are what actually apply to the launch mode stuff. everything else looks to be for the stall torque management. this is in addition to the adder table.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

IIRC I do have it wired into the F14 pin already.

Thanks for the help again man!!

fasteddi

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Went through the scaller on my fresh bin. Ill get to the flags and the tables later tonight/tommorow on my spare time. I just wanted to get a headstart on a fresh bin before the 2bar gets here.

Disabled the EGR, CCP, AIR system, and the TCC(untill I repin it and drive it)

I set the reference at 9.8* of timing. It was 59*!! Thats high as helll. Is that because its was a DIS ignition bin? I evened out the max advance and retard to 30* a piece.

I added in the 48lbs inject flow rate but one table that i didnt change was the (injector fuel rate: Idle fuel) Im not sure if im suppose to play with that or just disable the idle fuel. The values are in sec/gm

I played with the rev soft spark limit. The fuel cut off and stuff like that. Along with the Vss palse per mile. Im not sure if thats going to be correct. Was the 8F for a magnetic vss??

On this xdf i got off gearheadefi, it has some stuff for a wideband patch. Its says: Patch-wideband addition 1 Then the value in the box is 0064.

There is another scaler below it that is the same but the value in the box is EP94?

Any idea on what those patches are? Thanks for any help again.

Saar

60* is normal reference for DIS.

8F is normally magnetic VSS, though should be able to be setup for optical if necessary.

also, sounds like my patches, i can make a lot simpler version.... i'll upload in a minute.

Saar

here's the XDF, only works in TP V5.

if you want the dizzy settings to match what they did in $88, then:

ref angle should be 9.88*
max advance relative to ref should be 60.35*
max retard relative to ref should be -10.24*

note: have BAWX(F-body, so dizzy) loaded with ATSN(W-body, so DIS) for a compare.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

That is the same xdf file I had.

Any Ideas on the idle fueing sec/gm values. I know my injectors are about 2 1/2 the size of the original 8f's

Theres nothing in the flags to check for which WB patch is being used. Is this just something i can add into my adx readout. I have alot of work to do to the adx as its pretty basic as of now.

Saar

the XDF is tweaked... now i have the wideband patch as an actual patch item, instead of using scalars.

the idle fuel injector stuff(mistakenly called single-fire fuel or something like it) is for if/when you drop into alpha-n fueling, that's the only time it's ever used.

project89

iTrader: (1)

fast i do not belive the launch control works like u want it to ( 2 step / antilag ) so i would worry about that later after u get the car up and running

besdies u have the msd now so u can use that as ur 2 step

now if launch control can pull timming ( ecm) what u can do is set it to the same rpms as the 2 step and u will have a full on antilag system

the stock ecm will retard the timing and the msd will drop spark

basically for antilag system u need 3 things to happen

#1 random spark drop
#2 timming retared
#3 added fuel

#3 is the least important though it really helps when u are running a super large turbo or turbine for top end power

but with as fast as a 61mm or in ur case gt3582 turbo spools on a 3.1 u can get away with only #1 and #2

project89

iTrader: (1)

this is pilsburys car only with spark retard and spark drop @ 2,000 rpms
0-12psi in a split second
thats what urs will sound like if u get it right

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Great job Saar...

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Thanks guys so much. Ill work on the files a tad more tonight. Very grateful for your help.

saar that patch is great on the xdf. Just apply patch and were good to go?

Saar

apply the patch and then you only have the ADX to modify and it's ready to read a wideband.

i could have put in stuff to "unapply" the patch as well, but no TGP ever had a pressure sensor(only switch combos), so i don't see it interfering with normal operation for anybody. i don't remember if there is even an a/c pressure option in 6D/8F either... i know 88 has the option to use one.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Im editing the definition file i have. Do you guys have any pointers on how to get the ac/Wideband data logged on there?

Also from what im seeing the MAP is in Vts... any ideas on how to change it to KPA?

Also im sorta lost on the Main VE table for fueling. No sence in my setting up history tables untill i know the values to put in there.. rpms vs kpa and or boost.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Heres the adx if anyone can look at it. Or if someone has a datalogg of a 8f that would be awsome to link up so i can see if its working correct. I still have the WB and boost wrong on the dash and the tables but at least its getting there. I was spolied with those premade $59 adx files.

Also I loaded the $88 last night and gave it a shot again. It ran like a champ. Idled great for a significant amount of idle time. This makes me a happy fellow. I probly did somthing to $59 to mess it up along the line but if I have to start over then im going a different route this time. Ill learn more anyways. Or mabey the ecm just is sparatic and hates me. But my buddies 7730 should be here this week and then well just go from there.

Saar

here's the 8F ADX i have... should be setup for the wideband patch already. you'll have to match the conversion to whatever your wideband controller put out, but otherwise it should be good to go.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Thanks again saar

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Played with the $59 for a bit today since I got the day off.

Good news. It idles fine. Did some weird IAC stuff when I reset the ecm and started it up(it was pegged at about 180 for 2 minuets then fell and smoothed idle at 80) but after a good 3-4 minuets the idle smoothed out and no hicups after that.

I would start changing things but im afraid that i messed up the tune in the first place. I also did take that wired in boost guage off the ecm fuse so that may of helped as well.

project89

iTrader: (1)

fast i would install the msd and 2 step with the 59 and test it if it dosent help improve spool i would try the 2 bar code and use the launch setings alongside the msd to setup and antilag

if u can get the antilag working the car will be considerably faster with much less boost

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Im going to attempt to dial in the boost fueling again as this tune is off of the old turbo. But as long as that goes well and its dry out this weekend I want to play arround with the 2 step and at least install it. Ill keep ya up to date as Ill probly have a few questiions about the anti lag set up.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

So nice of a day I decided to take the car out with the street slicks on it. I feel that it was tuned well. Not 100% alky but boost juice hense why the afrs went from 11.5 before to 12 now.

Car is amazingly fast and finally I got to see what a launch is like without doing a burn out. I got those slicks nice and hot...lol Sorry dave no videos I was just going to take one till I had the issue youll read about below. But I could only launch them from 0-100% throttle launch. Anymore and it would flash the boost and sit me sideways.

One problem I had though which scares me. I launched it once and spun the tires, all of the sudden i see smoke coming in the car ever so slighly. I find out that the hose from my trans cooler blew off. I was pouring out tranny fluid. Massivly. It got all over the exhaust. Also i think some made its way into the turbo. Being that I was about 2 miles from home in the stick and my only life line for help was in the car with me, I slowly made my way home. I put the line back on and putted home. About 15 mph as the trans as you can imagin would slip badly if I accelerated much.

I hope that I didnt trash the tranny. If so I do have another but thats something I dont want to do ATM if I didnt ruin it. Do you guys think its trashed? I dont wana spend 30 bucks on tranny fluid only to have put it into a wiped out tranny.

Heres a log fellas of the one launch before the mishap where I didnt spin the tires.

Boost was fast for beeing 0-100%tps. Car felt fast for being on the streets IMO. Intake temps were not as good as before but the engine bay was heat sunk and boost juice just isnt the same as alky. But no KR and only a small rise in IAT for the 6 seconds of WOT.

Saar

not that i've had it happen with a 700R4, but i had a leaky cooler line on a 4T60E for a long time... it eventually let go and dumped the entire capacity in the driveway to the point of no movement whatsoever. fixed the lines and did a pan drop/filter change pretty shortly after. that was ~50K miles ago and it's still kicking along.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

It still moved but it just suxs because I was having some real fun today with those slicks on there. No I have got to clean up the mess in the engine bay area.

Thanks man. I hope its ok too, dont really feel like tossing in my back up trans just yet.

Gumby

Been told before that to much fluid does more harm, to little and it just stops working. course this was before the 700r4 and the likes came out.

which also makes me wonder, does the 700s have high psi cooler line pressure to blow that off, or is it another problem. Cause on the older GMs ones the cooler lines are low PSI, brass hose barb fitting and clamp is all you need.

Less somehow you were "boosting" the trans internals too and beyond normal cooler line psi blew it off.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

The trans is stock. But 700r4's do depend on some massive line pressure.

It was reving about 4-5k in a burn/launch out when I let off and then got back on it and no power. So I then let off and putted slowly to think of what just happend. To be honest Im not sure how much fluid was coming out. As after I did a burn out creeping down the road a bit I then relized it was smoking from the front of the car and wasent going away. I stoped and looked below to see the hose with tranny fluid coming out. And my fan was on so it was drawing some of the fluid to my exhaust. It wasent a terrible amount of flow coming out of the line to be honest but as for pressure Im not sure.

To be honest I was laughing when this first happend thinking i just rosted the tranny. I was like, finally put some slicks on and really grip the road and she tosted her self. But then the smoke made me relize that it wasent a burned up 1st/2nd gear.

I guess Ill just pick some trans fluid up and hope for the best. If not this is a good time for me to tinker with the spare I suppose. But then I have no spare left!!

Gumby

Slicks will find weak links in the chain every time, then once you stop breaking parts you gotta focus on not just having a smoke show or seeing nothing but sky wheels high [< looks neat, breaks parts and spines upon landing]

All auto trans have high "line" pressure inside but cooler lines are more then often low psi, it iwll flow out like a garden hose, but its not under allot of psi.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Yea for all I know I might of only loss 2 qts or so. It was only running for about 1 minuet before I cut the line and pushed it back on putted on home. Ill find out tommorow if i killed it or not.

project89

iTrader: (1)

just refill it , as long as u werent going wot long enough for it to start sliiping under full power u didnt hurt a thing.
my dodge trans has a pretty decent leak i know i need to add fluid when it stops going into gear or starts slipping when i go around a corner . i just top off the fluid its been fine for 2 years lol. one of these days ill put a new pan gasket on it and fix the leak

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Dave did you see the log? How does the lag look? Considering it was from 0tps to 100%

project89

iTrader: (1)

didnt even look atit yet had just goten out of work when i posted and its just about time to head back to work now , when i get home ill take a look

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Transmission seems to be ok. Added 5 qts in it.

I added a little fueling to make the AFRs 11.5-11.8 And after we were all good I went for a drive with the GF. My 0-60 times werent as good but I was only generating 9.5 psi insted of 10.5 so im not sure if theres something wrong or if its just my funky WasteGate. But anyways it did well on slicks. I even recorded a light burn out on the slicks. I should have got them rosting more but oh well I was just feathering it once the tires broke loose. Im still not use to the fact that its violent when the turbo really kicks in and likes to push me 180* off the road.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZlFp...ature=youtu.be

Enjoy.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Was that burnout before the turbo was installed....?

project89

iTrader: (1)

man u should have went wot for that,

anyways get that 2 step hooked up and lets see a launch even if the tires do go up in smoke as im sure witht he 2 step on slicks its not going to hook on the street

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

I cant hook even if I dont have the 2 step on..lol But I wana get it hooked up the rest of the way this week. I started to do it but then just wanted to drive it this weekend. You know how that can go.

I know I dont like seeing higher intake temps but i guess if im seeing 130-140 and not a drop of KR and afrs of 11.6 im ok. I need to turn that boost up a tad dont you think dave?? That turbo probly isnt as efficient at 9psi as it would be at 10-11psi i would think.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Meh, I think you made a big mistake with the 3.73's in the rear, especially running a 700R4 first gear with that stall. A two-step is meaningless because any turbo V6 should be able to fry the tires and pull a good sixty foot with the right setup even without the two-step, and it seems like your grasping at straws just to get Dave's ideas to work for your particular setup because something seems wrong. Gonna be interesting to see how far you go though with said advice, and I'm definitely looking forward in seeing the results either way. Best of luck...

- Rob

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Well it does fry off the slicks tires regardless after there hot. I got the 3.73's for one reason only. The rear end I got was loaded with them, axles and a lsd for 150 bucks.

Rob I got the 2 step because it was part of the package deal. I got a 6al for pretty cheep because we all know the stock ignition wont hold up too much more. So either way it works out the 2 step is more of a toy then anything as I can have the 2 step module in at sportsmans races.

I do understand that the ratio with the 700rs isnt the best but it is much faster out of the hole then before thats a fact. Its a difference you can definitly feel but that may be the turbo not the gears. The 2 step is just to spool that turbo up faster if it works out well, if not then im not out any cash as that item was tossed in with the deal. You have no idea how badly id like to rip into this trannys gears or get the TH350 behind it and play with that trans to get the ratio in line. But when it comes to mods, I just do with what I can afford at the time.

I hope it works out too rob. Im tired of those 2.00 60 ft times. Id like a 1.80-1.90 if at all possibe. But in time well see what happends I suppose. Regardless its a funner car with the posi and much easier to drive arround the streets with the taller gears. I should have done that when it was a stock engine. Im sure it would have been funner.

project89

iTrader: (1)

hmmm launching at 3 psi off without the 2 step at part throttle cause it pushes threw the brakes

or launching at wot with 10 psi on the 2 step to keep the car in the beams

which do u think is going to go faster

its all about leaving the line at max boost if he had a transbrake he wouldnt need the 2 step to do that but since he has a 700r4 thats not an option


2step/antilag and i know that thing will pull 1.7 or better 60's if it hooks on those old slick

alls im going to say on the gears is 3:73's should be just about perfect

61mm turbo,260 cam is going to want rpm

project89

iTrader: (1)

car would have been faster out of the hole with just the gear swap even witht he old turbo much more mechanical advantage though on a turbo car higher gears will result in lower hp/tq numbers at the tires

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

I got hos. 26.0x15x9 inch real slicks for this season. They have one season on them.

That would be why i dont car if i burn off some rubber on these old ones....

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Not much more done on the car... I did get the front rotors and pads finally changed out. Amazing that the bearings still looked spot on.

I had in total 3 cracks in my rotors. I didnt realize it was that bad. This is the main reason I havent went very fast in it in some time now. I was scared to and was slacking on changing out the brakes. I know shame on me....

I got some more alky finally. 2 gal of it. I also got the 6al wired up the other day. I didnt mess with the 2 step but it runs normal and works fine with the 6al.

I still need to bleed the brakes when I get a helper. I need to put the good driveshaft loop on. And then thats about it. Play with the 2 step and see how that helps on the ant lag. About 1 1/2 months till I can hit the track up here. I will say that Im just leaving the boost controler off if I can hold 10psi. Thats more then enough I feel to push me into the 12's as long as the tranny holds, which surprisingly it has been when I got beat on it with the slicks.



Still got those sloppy struts in front but they actaully work great at the track IMO


Cant wait to see what it will do. Anything less then last year and ill be severly dissapointed.

project89

iTrader: (1)

deff try out that 2 step and let us know how it does, it will take som eplaying with to get it to work right but once u get it fine tuned that thing will be a rocket out the hole on the slicks if it hooks

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

What Rpms would you sugest to start out with on the low step? 2,500-3?

Gumby

Problem I have found with bleeding, is the corse threads leak to much for a crack and pump bleed job even with good help, youll never stop seeing air. Went nuts with mine.

crack n bleed with help for only the initial bleed to get ride of the big air, then gravity bleed each wheel 10min. [crack open and let the fluid drain out, keep master full]

speed bleeders can be helpful, but last set I had one would not stop "bleeding" so I pitched em.

What id like is a rev bleeding kit

project89

iTrader: (1)

at what rpm do ur brakes stop holding the car ? i would go about 350-500 rpm lower then to start the testing but i wouldnt set the 2 step below around 2,200 rpms ideally if ur brakes will hold 2,500 will be a good starting point


if the 2 step is to low the car may bog , if its to high it prolly wont hookup on the launch


btw expect loud bangnig and poping when ur on the 2 step it will sound like m80's going off in the passenger seat

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Didnt get time to play with the car since my GF's car is a constant working mess.

I did finally order a shift kit. Might help out the tranny a tad. I had a nice gift cert. from summit so i got the trans go 2-3 for 30 bucks. Cant go wrong there.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Got the shift kit today. Sure hope I dont screw it up. Also have a 4inch velosity stack coming. Not sure if that will help at all for HP but will look good I guess.

project89

iTrader: (1)

it will help mount it directly on the end of the turbo at the track, they have been shown to decrease spool time by 2-400 rpms , and they smooth the incoming air to the compressor wheel ehelping with eff

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

ahh ok. I wasnt sure how much they helped but I though it would help the flow. Exspecially at higher rpms.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

Heres my educated guess at what the car will run after a few times out at the track. I still havent got to play with the anti lag. Damm snow still is here.

I just finally added a nice over flow for the coolent. The stickers for my class and #. And started it up for a few minutes.