Lol. I'm getting less than 8mpg that converter is slipping so much. I cant wait to get a different one, wish I coulda reused mine but it was toast. Ill just use the old v6 tc as the core.

 

Hybrid question.

Is the head gasket compressed thickness added to the measured pushrod length? I'm thinking it doesnt matter because of the valvetrain, but just want to make sure.

 

The best way to do it I feel is just to measure your 2 pushrod sizes after you tq the head down with the gasket already installed. It leaves less error IMO. Then add in what your cam likes for preload and thats your number.


As for your tq converter. Save up the 100 bucks and go get one of the HD61 converters like I have for a late 1980s 700r4. Its not failed me yet and i've pushed it. It will hold up with your HP level very well and will keep you happy. There should be a link i added a few pages back on this thread.

 

I memorized the part number, lol. Talked to 2 different trans builders for 700/4l60 transmissions and they both said a non pwm trans will lock this converter. I haven't even tried the switch, but even if it does lock I am probably going to get the autozone converter anyway. Just a matter of getting the cash for it.

I told one of the builders what you have put the autozone converter through and he said you should play the lottery, lol.

 

Yea. I know ive gotten lucky. Sad thing is I wounder how fast it would have really went with a good converter.

 

Probably quite a bit faster but you are already running pretty effin fast Mark. I was thinking about going with a lower stall, but as long as its a locking converter it doesnt matter anyway cause lockup evens the ratio to 1:1 whether your under the stall or over. So I'll stick with the ~2500 stall, cause launches are damn fun and I love how it slingshots the car.

Just hope this converter locks, if I wanted v8 mileage I woulda just put a v8 in it haha. If it does lock itll hold me over for a bit. Thinking about just getting the 4th gear auto lockup solenoid so I don't have to worry about forgetting to unlock it.

 

Yea i hope you get it down pat. That car should still get good MPGs even when you're romping on it. Mine still gets a solid 20Mpg+ even with track times on the same tank.

 

Not exactly. Because the pushrods are not perpendicular to the head surface you can't just add that thickness to the pushrod length. You need to actually measure the length with a checker.

 

I think you meant can't. And this is another case of overthinking things on my part. The head gasket thickness doesn't need to be added when measuring for pushrods because its already included in the measurement.

Yes I will be getting a checker for it. But I just got the 3.4 on the engine stand, so the hybrid is still a ways off. I'm not even going to start tearing it down yet.

Tomorrow I need to fix that shifter linkage, use the metal egr tube for the oil drain from the turbo where its right next to the flange, do a little more startup tuning(starting without any throttle input is getting closer and closer), and I will try to lock that converter with the switch. Worse case it just doesn't lock, either way I am still going to get that other converter.

Maybe I will also log another 0-100 to see where the car is at. Tuning isn't finished, but I am not going to waste my time tuning with this converter because it would be pointless.

 

Well no 0-100 today cause I cant get traction in the rain.

However, the EC3 converter locks when I hit the switch. Its a solid lock with no chatter or shudder, so itll hold me for a little bit.

The lock feels much better than the stock v6 converter too, works great.

 

So I hear this sound, sounds like the exhaust rattling against the frame. However, if I manhandle the exhaust, it doesnt hit the frame.

I backed off timing in that area(its rich there anyway), and the rattle doesn't stop. Its loud in the car but barely audible outside the car.

The xover pipe is like a 1/16th of an inch away from the starter, but I cant exactly look there while driving. The only reason I remotely think of detonation was the description of marbles being dumped in the motor, kinda sounds like that.

I have the same SA table as posted a page or so back, but when it rattles, its not lean at all, its rich. And I have no more than 30° timing in the table. It also doesn't make the noise under boost.

Kinda stumped. About to drive it so I will grab a log. Highly doubt it will come up in the log though.

Any ideas?

 

Ok. I now know what detonation sounds like. I have it 90% gone by reducing the spark timing. Another 5% gone by adding fuel here and there.

Apparently it was really bad, as in really loud.

Now I cant get the rest of it to disappear. No matter how much I back the timing off, or how much fuel I add.

IE, 1300 rpm, 50-60 kpa. 12° timing and 12.5 AFR and it still detonates. Is it wounded?

 

I take it you don't have a Knock sensor? Why didnt 2.8Ls come with Kr sensors...lol

Do you think your could pick up the sound in the car with a video? To help us hear it.

If you can hear detonation its pretty severe knock. I personally have never had that in My V6 camaro but sure did in past cars i had, one being a 1989 camaro 305. It was terrible thankfully i fixed it at the time to stop it but I had no idea what it was for a while(only under WOT conditions)

 

Its just idling and it is knocking? That is weird that your getting spark knock at a idle...... got me puzzled there unless its something else rattling arround.

What caused the sudden knocking? Did you do something or change something to make this problem arise?

 

It doesn't do it under boost at all, or at WOT, just cruise. I would try to pick up the sound but as I said, its virtually gone now. Just can't get the rest of it gone and I am thinking I may have cracked a ring but not sure as it runs the same as before. It was just about exactly as Dave described it to me, marbles in the engine.

Not really while idling, but while in park I was bringing the idle up till I heard what was left of it, then I would try to add fuel and/or retard timing and it has no effect on it.

I can't really tell, I guess I thought it was the exhaust knocking this whole time but IIRC it didnt do it at all when I started tuning. I think I need to bring the whole SA table down to 10* and start from scratch. Cause that was less timing than the table you gave me and it still knocked. Also going to make it at least 13 AFR everywhere but under boost in the VE table and start from there.

Everytime I drove it it would do it under cruise and pretty much nowhere else, but I guess it just gradually got worse.

Guess I need to do a compression test again....

 

Here are a couple logs.

Can you see detonation in the logs? I see where AFR goes lean, rpm drops, and MAP rises, all within virtually the same frame.

FWIW I ONLY use plus gas. Never have I put 87 in my car.

 

Plug 6 is on the right, 4 is on the left. 6 is cleaner cause that was the cylinder I had the valves too tight on and fixed.

No specs anywhere that I can see.

 

I hate this phone...

EDIT. There is not a SINGLE SPECK on ANY PLUG???? All electrodes completely intact. What the hell?

 

Not bad gas, disconnected the timing connector for 0* across the board and it still knocks when I bring the rpms up in park....

I am completely clueless at this point. I think its already wounded.

 

When trying to run aggressive timing tables on my 305 when it was stock it would knock during cruise / medium to heavy load conditions at less than 3k rpm ,... after the rebuild and getting my quench perfect higher CR and alum. Heads never detonated at all ... ever ... didn't matter what timing I was running or even shifty gas

 

that number 6 plug is way to clean,
it can and will ping if its to rich make sure the wideband is reading right , ill look thrrew the dl in the morning its already 120 am here

 

Plug 6 was clean cause that cylinder was dead till september when I fixed the valve lash.

 

Happy Thanksgiving guys!

 

So typically I run 165-170°, and it was a cool day the other day, ambient was running around 65°.

I figured I would see what she had catching a new mustang. Up to around 110 in 3rd, mustang didnt want any so I passed.

Noticed temp was up around 195° when I let off. 195 isn't really danger zone I know.

Was it the converter slipping, intake charge heat or what? CHTs rising fast?

Any guesses? Since I'm not getting any other input on this detonation. I figure I will kill it eventually and just swap the 3.4 in.

 

Its wounded, im pulling it. I cant warm it up without it knocking and progressively getting louder and louder. Its done. It knocks at idle.

End of thread.

 

 

 

before u pull it check the flexplate to converter bolts

 

Post a video?

 

I totally forgot about this. That's extactly why I went from 2.8 to 3.4 I thought I blew the motor.

 

So in ragequit fashion I though the motor was about to go. Figured I would add some drama to the thread.

Thanks for the obligatory meme Six, lol.

Oil drain fixed for the final time. Heater core hooked back up and supplying heat again. TC to flexplate bolts loctited.

This car likes way less timing at idle than it had before. Way happier at 11° compared to 20°.

 

Called it.

 

Ok, still rattles so loctite and impact. If it makes a sound now its a cracked flexplate. If thats the case monday I will get a new TC and put this other flexplate on.

 

So your running 11 total degrees of timing at idle? Is it just me or is that low as crap. I know every cars different but dang 11 degrees is down there. Sure the timing is true?

So you found it was a lose flex plate? Or at least believe that may be the issue? And not a rattle in the engine somewhere or KR?

 

11-13. Its the flexplate. It still rattles and it would have blown by now if it was KR. If I put my foot in it, no sound. But part throttle it makes that horrible racket.

 

Man, if i had kept my 2.8 stuff, Id give ya my old flywheel.

 

He's got the one off my old 3.4, 20k miles on that think before the V6 said nope, I'm done with freeze plugs.

 

Its alright, Rubbermaid gave me hers.

 

I had a tc right outta the box before that made all kinds of racket. But you would have figured that one out by now. If it was that its only loud when in certain gears or rpm relating to line pressure. Just things to keep in mind..down the road.

 

Well i am almost positive its either cracked, or the TC is going back and forth in the flexplate holes, even though I tightened them down with an impact and used loctite.

Im also thinking broken 1-2 accumulator spring, mushy 1-2 shift, 2-3 is good. Don't know why I didnt check.

This thing hates being shifted manually, as well as I cant launch for **** with this combo and bald tires, itll spin through 2nd launching at the 2500 stall, so 0-100 sucks. But any roll on pull is pretty quick.

I think I want a 2000~ stall.

 

What does it do when you manually shift it???

 

Idk, aside from not getting traction it just doesn't feel right. I need to get a pressure gauge on it.

Its fine shifting in Drive on its own.

I'm not doing much with it till I order a new TC and get the other flexplate on. So Monday the earliest.

 

So I noticed that the TC pulls the flexplate back when its being bolted down. So it confirms my suspicions that the TC is just a little different from the thirdgen TC and probably cracked the flexplate.

I am betting the flexplate is cracked around the crankshaft bolts, underneath the washer/spacer plate in between the bolts and flexplate.

So this probably wont catastrophically fail over the next 2 weeks, just make a whole lotta racket. Monday I will order the TC and hopefully the following weekend I will have RubberMaids help putting it and the new(er) flexplate in.

Not pulling this trans by myself again.

 

Want carnage? Here ya go! The 3-4 clutches are concave!

 

And these tabs were almost completely sheared off in places.

 

 

New TC is here, not doing anything with that till after Saturday though.

But....
Spark dropout is back. And cold is the only thing seemingly in common with both instances. When spring and summer came it stopped happening altogether.

If its resistance rising with the cold, it cant be in the engine bay. MS1 is mounted in the passenger compartment.

I need to check base timing again, pull plugs. I am going to go over the wiring again, which I won't find anything cause thats been gone through 10 times. But I will do it anyway.

Need to finish my spark plug wire holders, suppose I can knock that out first to rule out wires. Next pull plugs again. Compression test to check how the cylinders/rings/valves are holding up, wiring, ignition system, and MS1.

I save the MS for last as unless Dave swaps his ms1 cpu for an ms2 and his spark dropout goes away.

If it is, then its the cpu itself and not the ms as a whole. One thing at a time.

Runs great though, before the dropout had come back I had already doubled my gas mileage

 

From Project89's thead
What is the MSD coil part number. They vary from 10x worse than stock to 10x better than stock.
Are you using a stock small cap distributor with an external coil?
Have you used the MS reset feature to see if the MS is going into reset?

 

Not to hijack here but what is the best small cap dual connector external coil to use ? Can u use a multi spark set up ?

 

MS resets are no longer present as far as megalogviewer shows. MLV used to show red lines where the resets would occur. Not sure about the MS reset feature you mentioned.

Stock small cap, external coil. Coil is MSD Streetfire. Has worked fine so far.

Edit
It also doesnt reset audibly while cruising around with the laptop connected.