RedStar

In the process of removing the waterpump from my 2.8 V6 I've come across a rusted/seized bolt - specifically the lowest and farthest to the right, closest to the lower radiator hose. The torx fitting has long been obliterated, and I've drilled the head of the bolt clean off so I could slide the waterpump out. What I have left is a headless bolt that is sticking out about a quarter inch.

So far I've used PB Blaster, vise grips, shocking the bolt with a hammer, an extractor bolt, and a portable propane torch. The bolt is too tight to twist out with an extractor, as it will either snap or the vise grips turning the extractor will slip. Propane heating hasn't affected anything other than making the bolt temporarily soft and bendable and creating a stress crack on the top.

I know others have had similar issues, so I'm wondering what else is a safe/feasible option? Is it possible to damage something important by drilling this particular bolt (i.e. water jacket)? Is there some other option I haven't tried?

t-top havoc

iTrader: (3)

Use a wire brush & scrub the piece sticking out.
SOAK it with PB over night.
Spray it again and **tap** it lightly with a brass hammer or a screwdriver handle.
VERY CAREFULLY see it it will turn using the vice grip.
DO NOT FORCE IT.
IDK what to try after that. I tend to have bad luck with old rusty bolts!! OH SNAP!!
I hope someone can give better tips!

GTA50

As said above, if using a penetrant, let it soak in overnight. I did that when I pulled the exhaust manifolds of my '89 2.8L Firebird when I rebuilt the motor and didn't break a stud.

If that doesn't work, you could try the O2/propane setup - runs hotter than just straight propane, or lastly oxy-acetylene.

Other suggestion, if you have a MIG handy (110 for example) you could weld a nut on the end of the stud, apply penetrating oil, wait (did I mention wait) and try that.

Final thing, cut off the stud flush, mark the centre, drill out, tap and heli-coil.

Removing broken studs is an exercise in creativity and patience.

Hope that helps.

RedStar

@t-top: Yeah I've tried plenty of oil and some vise grips. I've also hammered the stub very violently. The vise just doesn't grip it, the stub is too round and too seized to be turned...


@GTA50: Unfortunately welding is not an option, the car is in the parking lot of the apartment complex I live in. I basically have my two arms, a few battery operated tools (drill & dremel), and a handheld propane torch kit to work with.

Have you used a torch for this kind of application? I don't get why a normal torch hasn't had any effect on the threads. It's ridiculous how stubborn this thing is. I've also tried dremel-ing a slot into the stub and using a screwdriver; no go.

As far as drilling it completely out, I'd like to avoid that above all else, unless there's a way to do that without damaging the threads in the timing cover. Someone suggested drilling MOST of the bolt out and then trying to get it to collapse. Is that feasible?

I know that taking the timing cover off and accessing the newly exposed part of the bolt is an option, but if I do that then I might as well replace my possibly leaking timing cover gasket and most likely loose timing chain, which is a lot of potential time investment for a daily driver near the onset of winter...

GTA50

The challenge is that you are dealing with metal pieces that have been in contact with each other for possibly 23 years! Rust, overtorqueing by a previous owner, who knows. All contribute to your current problem, and I sympathize.

If you can't get the bolt out, then put everything back together, and limp it into a garage and have them extract it. It may cost a little bit, but the reduction in the aggravation factor and the consideration that your time is more valuable makes it worth it.

With your limited resources and time, that is what I would suggest.

RedStar

Hm... sucks but yeah, I might just have to slap that power steering pump and raggedy water pump with near non existent gasket back on... (cries)

But oh well, if I can get it going again I guess it's worth it. It's just so aggravating though, I've already torn it down and put it back together and limped it to a shop recently for a similar problem. I wasn't aware of this one. Also, it's just one bolt...

GTA50

I think we've all been there. The former mechanic I used to go to hated to see me - because he knew the job was going to be ugly and difficult.
My shop is much better equiped now and he doesn't see me any more.

As for your stud problem, you have the parts, so it's just the labor. Have them extract the stud and install your water pump. Probably will cost a couple hours shop time, but it you don't have the physical resources to do it yourself, it is the best way to go.

RedStar

Yeah, I may have to take it to a shop, and if I do I might see what it might cost for them to do the timing cover gasket/chain/gears while they're at it.

In my stubborn attempts to continue trying to get the bolt stub out, I snapped an extractor in it and was unable to drill it out, so I heated and bent and smashed the stub until the whole part of it sticking out snapped off, so it's flush now.

At this point my last option before attempting to drive it to a shop (no way in hell I'm towing it again), is to attempt to drill the remnants out or at least drill damn near all of it.

bestracing

For bolts that would not come loose with a propane torch you need to use an oxy-acetylene torch. Just plain propane doesn't get it hot enough to break it free. just heat the bolt up till it glows. This expands the bolt and reshapes it. When you remove the torch hit the bolt with a cold wet rag to cool it quickly. The bolt shrinks and loosens really easy. Done this many times getting pipe plugs out of motors.

GTA50

The real problem now is the extractor as they are typically much harder than standard drill bits. So you can't drill them out with the DYI store drill bits.

As above, oxy-acetelyne works (and I want a set in my home shop), but given your situation, this is getting very complicated.

So, is the car relatively driveable and can you get it into a local shop? Doing machining work on a DD in an apartment parking stall in late autumn/early winter is not what you want to do.

I changed the flexplate on my -75 Chev. Blazer in a February at 9:00 pm on a Sunday night, outside, with artic wind blowing up my coveralls, because I needed the truck for Monday. Will never do that again (yeah, I know, walking up hill both ways to school, but true).

Anyway, price versus aggravation.

Very long winded, but from many of the "mech programs", number one take-away.......why waste your life on a $0.10 Bolt.

I wish I could be there to help.

RedStar

Thanks, I appreciate all the help. The broken extractor is no longer a problem because it was in shallow enough to come out after I beat the crap out of the stub and made everything flush.

Honestly I'm not even that concerned about price anymore. It's just very aggravating that the only thing keeping me from slapping the new water pump on is this one bolt; plus if I'm going to take it to a shop I'm going to have to figure out how to keep it from bleeding to death. With the old gasket being basically non existent, I'd basically be performing the entire water pump job with new gasket and rtv anyway... and then pay for someone to undo it.

evilemokid94

iTrader: (6)

well this is a case of you've gotta do what you've gotta do, I would try to just get a new gasket at the least since they are cheap añd limping it to the closest shop

sailtexas186548

iTrader: (2)

you can try a 50/50 mix of ATF and acetone instead of PB Blaster, stuff works wonders