camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

I know how there are many threads about how to swap engines, but i really need 1 on 1 help due to the friend that was going to help me has left for awhile. Im stuck with getting this engine out and doing it right, i have taken the complete tuned port off, the whole belt drive, and i took the front motor mount bolts out. If someone can help me step by step i would appreciate it, its the first engine swap im doing and of course i have no idea what im doing so getting explained what to do and how to do it will make my life a lot more relieved of stress, and if pictures can be uploaded to explain as well i will appreciate that. Thanks...also i do have a question, ive heard since my engine im removing is a 5.0 tpi engine that since im dropping a 350 carb'd engine in i will need to rewire the engine, etc. I didnt think it was a big deal until someone told me "whats going to tell your fuel pump to work, etc" then i thought about it. What will i need to rewire on the engine? Thanks

89fbrestor

if youre going carbed there wont be to much to rewire. the fuel pump can stay electric with a pressure regulator or you could switch it to a mechanical pump. either way its not that hard and i would worry about that a little more down the road. pull that motor and get all the cosmetic stuff you want done and post some pics. is your new motor ready to go in?

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Sorry it took so long, no my motor is not 100% complete yet but the reason why i need the engine and tranny out is because im going to paint the the engine bay and also im sending the car to have the front end welded and fixed. Heres what i did so far: i have the front engine mounts out, all the accessories off the engine including the tuned port, and i have the radiator, fans, and all that out. All my hoses are disconnected and most of the wires are disconnected except for the starter which i will get to. What would be the next step from there? I got under the car but had no idea what to unbolt and look for, so if someone can assist me ill appreciate it. Heres some pics of what i have done so far

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

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89fbrestor

did you unbolt the fly wheel and trans/motor bolts? once those are unbolted start pulling. sounds like everything else is disconnected. you will have to shimmy the motor forward as you lift the engine unless you unbolt the drive shaft and cross member and back the trans off. hope your taking notes on paper, pictures, or have a photographic memory for putting it back together. i put everything in baggies and labeled it when i pulled mine so i didnt have to try and remember what bolt went where.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

What i have been doing is once i take a part off i assemble it on my newer engine thats getting dropped it. So let me ask if im removing the transmission and engine together wont i need to unbolt the drive shaft?

89fbrestor

yes if youre pulling them together. i assumed you were not pulling the trans. if thats the case then ya just onbolt the torque arm and cross member put out the drive shaft and lift it all out as one. be careful easy to get hurt.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

I would leave the transmission bolted to the engine. Much easier pulling them together than separately.

The next steps if it was me:

Remove the crank pulley
Get under the car and remove the torque arm, driveshaft, transmission mount(NOT the crossmember, just the rubber mount)
Unhook the transmission cables and speedo cable from the transmission
Gently pull on every hose, wire, cable, etc in the engine bay to make sure its not still connected to the engine.
Hook up the hoist and pull the engine

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

When taking the driveshaft out i remember there being a ton of bolts. What would i need to do inorder to get the drive shaft out? Like what do i need to unbolt?

89fbrestor

you just unbolt the drive shaft at the rear axel and it slides out of the trans.

Gibson27

iTrader: (1)

there are 4 bolts holding the driveshaft to the rear end yoke. 2 on eack side holding the u-joints in place. There are 10mm bolts iirc. when the bolts are all out be careful that the driveshaft doesn't fall suddenly and hit you on the head. You may have to gently pry the rear of the driveshaft down to get it free and then pull it out of the transmission.

Note: there may be a fair bit of fluid coming out of the tranny tailshaft so get some rags and a oil pan ready.

89fbrestor

ya what he said lol way better then my description

Gregs_GSXR

or to make things lighter and easier, drain the trans fluid first. Cleaner to drain it then to have it drip all over the place.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

I forgot that step in my post. Even if you do drain it, you will spill some. But its a LOT less than what will run out if you don't drain it. Alternatively, you purchase a cap that slips over the end of the output shaft and will seal the end so no fluid runs out.

I would also remove the fill/dipstick tube from the transmission before you pull it out.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Yea just got done taking the driveshaft out. LOL there was dripping but i just washed it away. Alright let me ask in order to take the motor and transmission out together do i NEED to have the torque arm out? Or was the torque arm in the way of getting the driveshaft screws out and it needed to be removed? I ran into an issue, i did get the driveshaft out but for some reason by the back of the rear where there are 2 large bolts holding the torque up. Well i got one out but the other one was in the opposite way, so i couldnt get it out. It was hitting the top of the undercarrage. Is it fine the way it is, like do i need to remove the torque arm completely to get my engine and tranny out? Also is it made that way or did someone screw with the car and put it the opposite way? heres an example http://image.shutterstock.com/displa...s-27155065.jpg The blue one is the one i got out, since the lug nut was on top i removes the lug nut and the bolt fell right down. My issues with the red one, the lug nuts off but the bolts to long and when i pulled it up it was hitting the top of the car. Is there a special way to remove that or is that a problem? I mean if i dont need to remove the torque arm the get the tranny and engine out then problem solved but if i do then thats a problem.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

The torque arm bolts to the rear of the transmission so you at least need to disconnect it from there. I'm not entirely sure how it bolts to the 700r4 since I have a manual trans. On mine I only have to remove 1 bolt to open up the mount enough to slide the torque arm out.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

To the end of the transmission theres a rubber piece that the tip of the torque arm is in. I need to remove that? The problem is that the torque arm is still bolted up to the rear because that stupid bolts in upside down. So i cant get that side out unless i cut the bolt. But all i need to do is get the side where is closest to the end of the tranny out?

LS4GXP

iTrader: (2)

Do this....

Put the car on jack stands, All 4 corners, this is a must. Theres 1 bolt above the mount that you can barely see that hold the torque arm mount closed ( like a clamshell). I believe they are 10m bolts. They suck to get out, but once its out, take a flathead screwdriver and seperate the bracket, its either the top of the bracket or the bottom that comes loose. Then pull the torque arm to the driver side to remove it from the bracket. Then gently lift it up to the floorboard and it will rest there, dont let it go when it comes off the mont as there will be tension there. Take the cossmember off, now the trans is free to come out with the motor if you removed all the lines.

No need to disconnect it from the rear unless...
1) your changing the rear
2) Your replacing the torque arm

Why everyone is telling you to completely remove it, i have no clue.....

i also didnt need to remove the bolts for the driveshaft on the rear, it will fall out of the trans when pulling the motor out

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

So basically i unbolt that one bolt thats keeping it snugged than take it out of that rubber circle holding it in? Also what hoses on the tranny should i be looking for? And on what side?

LS4GXP

iTrader: (2)

Yes, make sure the rear is free standing tho. Think few lines on the driver side, one or 2

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

By free standing you mean on jacks?

LS4GXP

iTrader: (2)

Yes sir. Will not work if you have just the front up, probably break your arm or put a hole in the floorboard when u take it off. When its on jacks and the rear is just hanging there's not alot of pressure on it

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Will i have a problem if just the rears up? I only have 2 jack stands. Let me ask, if it were you where would you have the jack stands in the rear?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

You don't need to completely remove the torque arm, just unbolt it from the transmission. There is a small bolt and large nut at the top, and a large bolt at the bottom, that hold the torque arm mount clamshell together. The Haynes 1982 thru 1992 Camaro repair manual shows this very clearly, by the way. (It is a pretty good resource for this type of job.)

If you don't have the rear end hanging from the shocks (as in, the car supported on the frame), the springs load the torque arm, and you can get a nasty surprise if you unbolt the torque arm from the tranny with the weight on the axle or tires. It's usually easier to have the whole car jacked up and supported while doing this - either another pair of jack stands or ramps under the front tires would be nice. But, if your only choice is one pair of jack stands, put them under the rear frame to support the car while disconnecting the torque arm from the transmission (the area you need to have your face will be pretty close to the ground, but you don't have much choice - the rear needs to be unloaded).

You can leave the cooler lines on the transmission while you pull the engine/trans, just keep an eye on them so they don't get snagged on anything in front. I don't bother taking the front pulley off, it doesn't save that much.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Where on the frame should i put my jacks to have all the weight off the wheels and springs?

LS4GXP

iTrader: (2)

There's only 1 place to put them on the frame.....front of the rear tire, on the frame, not floorboard! Its kinda like a little square with a hole in it. Best bet is to go get a book like five said

LS4GXP

iTrader: (2)

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tech...ck-stands.html

Sparkytfl

Didnt even have to unbolt the rubber torque-arm-holder from the transmission. The arm just slipped out of it as i pulled the transmission, and it was easy to align to get back in.

The big problem for me was the driveshaft. I pulled the trans without removing the driveshaft at the back, hoping i could align it again while putting the trans back in, gave up. Had to take the driveshaft off, which because of the arm in the way of half the u joint bolts, involved getting the wheels off the ground and turning the shaft to get to all the bolts.

I used ramps in the front (stacks of 4x4 wood blocks actually), stands in the back under the axle.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Well im done for the day after cutting my hand. I could not find any tool that can fit to get that bolt out. I was looking around for alittle and saw 3 bolts forming in the shape of a triangle. 2 were on the bottom and one was on top, and then there was a bolt inside, im guessing its the "hidden one"? that was impossible to get out. I tried getting the bolt on top and just stripped it, that things on there pretty good. Just to make sure, by what im saying did i locate the right bolts to take out?

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Sounds like you've got the right bolts there. That top one is a real PITA to get out. Putting it back in is even worse, at least for me.

I always pull the torque arm off the rear so I can get the driveshaft out without having to raise the rear wheels. It's only 2 extra bolts and when they are installed correctly, are very easy to remove. I only have 1 pair of jackstands as well. I only ever jack the front of my Camaro up when doing this kind of work because my garage is so small that once the front is up in the air, I can't get to the rear to raise it up. I have never had a problem with tension on the torque arm, but that may be because I unbolt it from the axle first, I dunno.

If you do leave the driveshaft in the rear of the trans as you pull it out, just make sure you don't nick up the end of it when it hits the ground. A nick there could damage the seal in the tailshaft when you go to reinstall everything and you'll end up dripping transmission fluid everywhere you go.

I only recommended removing the pulley based on my experience. I had to tilt my engine and trans at a pretty steep angle to get them in the car, and even the balancer got hung up on the radiator support. If the pulley was on there, I'm not sure I would have been able to get the engine and trans back in.

On the transmission, there will be 2 cooler lines. I believe they are on the passenger side. There is the dipstick/fill tube as well, I'm not sure which side that is on though. If you do leave the cooler lines attached to the transmission as 5-7 suggested, make sure you remove them from the radiator up front

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

I have basically everything done. I have the whole radiator removed with fans, driveshafts out, tranny cable and speedo wire unconnected, front engine mounts bolts are out, all wires up top the engine are disconnected with all the accessories, y pipe disconnected, etc. What im waiting on now is the crossmember rubber mount, the tranny mount which those i think are very simple...i already have one of the bolts loose. My problems that torque arm, i have the back basically disconnected but the fronts giving me a problem. What im trying to determine is if im even at the right bolt that im "TRYING" to remove, i keep stripping the bolt because that things on there so tight. Front the passenger door to the drivers door going horizontal theres 3 large bolts, the one i was trying to remove is the top bolt. Does that sound like the right bolt? And the other one i was working at that i was completely destroying was the one kind of covered by the end of the transmission. There really wasnt any room for a socket to fit in there i had to use a adjustable crescent wrench which was stripping the bolt like crazy, but that was literally the only thing that would fit. No where in my haynes manual did i fit how to remove a torque arm. Ill re look again, do they actually show or tell you how to get the thing off?

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Yes i now see the removal in the HAYNES book. It says remove the torque arm rear mounting bolts and nuts... Which im assuming i semi did since i couldnt get that other bolt out with it being the opposite way in as the other. Then it says remove the torque arm front outer bracket bracket bolts and remove the torque arm. So by what im understanding is those 3 bolts i saw i remove? 2 of the bolts were on the bottom side by side and the there was one bolt on top right above the 2 bolts side by side. Now is the way you all are telling me to do it just loosening the bolt that clamps the torque arm together and moving the torque arm out of the clampshell? If so is that the ONLY way it can be removed or can i do it the way i think by removeing those 3 bolts? I did loosen one of the 3 bolts, and tranny fluid started to drip, i didnt take it out because it was probably going to leak everywhere on my head but can i just remove those three bolts and that will take the entire bracket off? Or those bolts go need to stay in?

Sparkytfl

Maybe its a case of different years, but the only bolt I had to remove anywhere near the transmission was just the one in the middle of the crossmember. The front tip of the torque arm just slides into the rubber mount thats bolted to the tailhousing of the trans, and i didnt have to unbolt anything there. Torque arm and trans just slid apart when i pulled the engine/trans forward and out. Also removing the crossmember turned out to be helpful too but not necessary. I put a jack with wheels under the trans to help as it was pulled.

I couldnt even remove my torque arm at the rear. The bolts that go through the rear end to hold it on are really long and were obviously put in before the rear was installed into the body, since I'd pull them halfway out and theyd hit the floorpan.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

You have the same issue as me, except one bolt was on the side to slide right out. I didnt get that but i was looking in there and i think you are right, the tip was loose enough for me to move it. I dont think thats a good thing because its supposed to be lock tight. Ill see if i can get this engine out saturday. As for now ill do what you did. Il check back on with updates in a few days

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

The front of the torque arm is supposed to be able to slide back and forth in the mount on the transmission tailshaft. It allows for the change in the torque arms length as the axle swings up and down over bumps and dips. You should be able to slide the torque arm out of the transmission mount when you pull the engine forward as was suggested above. That way you can remove the clamp while the transmission is out of the car. Just loosely bolt the mount back onto the transmission with new hardware and you should be able to slip the end of the torque arm back into the mount as you are reinstalling the transmission and engine. Might as well replace the bushing too while everything is out and apart. It probably needs it anyhow.

As for the torque arm bolts, they are supposed to go in from the top. It takes some wiggling, but they will come out with the rear on the ground and the front in the air. Unless they are not the original bolts and are longer than stock. I've never had a problem getting mine out or back in.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Thanks you've explained a lot that im clueless about. Alright last question before i start the removel tomorrow, when taking the tranny mount off and what evers on the cross member do i need to put a jack under it and jack it up? Then do i jack it down or whats the deal with that? my jack doesnt have wheels to guide it out.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Just remove the bolt holding it the mount to the crossmember. It should be a single bolt going up through the crossmember into the bottom of the mount. Once that bolt is removed, that is all you need to do. The jack is not needed.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

Great news, i got the engine and tranny out yesterday. It took about 2 hours but that was preping it, i jacked up the tranny and for some reason i couldnt get it out. Then i just took the cross member out and can out very easy...only thing i might of messed up is the cooler lines going to the radiator, i forgot to keep an eye on them and they bent but no biggy ill go to the junk yard and pick up more. No just to ask about a carb'd engine, when i lifted the engine in my car half way i noticed all the engine grounds etc going to the harness. With a carb'd engine i wont have any of that right?

Sparkytfl

You'll still have the braided one that screws to the firewall.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

You'll have the braided ground strap going to the subframe or firewall as Sparky mentioned. I also connected the ground wire from my battery to the block.

Only other wires that are necessary are the power and tach wires to the distributor, the wires for the coolant temp and oil pressure senders, the battery and crank wires for the starter, and the wire(s) for the alternator. Assuming you're removing the smog pump and A/C compressor.

camaro1122

iTrader: (1)

nope im leaving the a/c there but the smog pump is gone. So as of right now i can tuck the tpi harness in the fender, but i need the braided wire conected to the back of the block to the firewall, and then maybe just the negative wire to the black as well. For some reason my tack never worked, but where would the wires for the coolant temp and oil pressure senders be located?

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

The coolant temp wire should be green and went to a sensor screwed into one of the cylinder heads. Usually the passenger-side head.

The oil pressure sender should be a 3-wire plug IIRC. The sender will either be located on the side of the block, right above the oil filter or it will be on the rear of the block right behind the distributor.