I recently purchased some Pontiac information on line and received something of a surprise when I received it. I have never heard of any GTA being used as a Pace Car during its day but when I got this latest stuff in, there was a Pontiac technical publication inside with this photo (albeit very small) on the cover: This car is obviously an '87 GTA (gold nose emblem, mirrors, etc.) and there are obviously some period NASCAR cars in the background. Can anybody place/date this photo for me....? I thought it was an interesting find nonetheless.

http://www.gtasourcepage.com/
History of the 1989 Turbo Trans Am

82 Iron Duke...Im sorry, do you know who runs the GTA source page?

Frankie a quick google of 87 Nascar pics didnt pull anything up.

It does not suprise me that a GTA was used as a pace car in 87. Ill keep looking for any other pics...

TA, I agree with you, but I've just never actually seen one on a track before with the light bar and everything like in this shot.... except for the afore-mentioned '89 20th T/A.

I'm tending to think it may be a more obscure race, as a highly visible race would be something that someone would be aware of.... and probably have a picture(s) of.

There were no "obscure" NASCAR races in 1987.

Look at the cars: the one that's in the lead I can't tell what it is for sure, might be Bill Elliott, but you can see Mark Martin in 2nd (Valvoline) and Dale Earnhardt in 3rd (Wrangler).

The track looks kind of like Rockingham.

That Valvoline car would likely be Neil Bonnett, Martin didnt race a Valvoline car until 1992.

The last car in the pic is Bill Elliott. I cant tell the lead car, either.

Excuse my poor word choice, there.... I only meant that the photo wasn't from Daytona or a big track like that. Info on those races would be easier to find out.

But I've received several good suggestions for starting points, so hopefully I'll be able to get the photo identified soon.

Right.... Neil Bonnett...

How time fades these things.

I have no idea, this is just what I found doing a quick search. I am a Camaro guy and I really have little knowledge about third gen Pontiacs.

The mirrors are..interesting. Wonder what's up with those?

Sorry Iron Duke, I was laughing because Frankie is the guy that made the GTA source page

yeah, now I see that in his sig

Those appear to be the Euro style mirrors. Frankie knows more about this, and he even had an official GM bulletin about their swap/end date where they moved from the Euro style mirrors to the standard ones that most GTA/TAs and Firebirds came with. I cannot locate that file on Frankie's website (where is it, Frankie??, I looked through all the menu links and still couldn't find that bulletin.).

Also, from my knowledge, all 89 TTAs were white, not red.

That's a neat picture, Frankie.

I thought they were euros at first too, but they look bigger/more rounded to me.. Maybe I'm just insane though.

those mirrors could be export mirrors

Those are the DD9 "Euro" mirrors that were standard on GTAs produced before 01/26/1987. They were also used on all export F-Bodies through 1992.

JT, I may have taken that link down... I'll have to go back and double-check.

Iron Duke... no harm, no foul.

The Paddle Mirrors were standard on the GTAs as they were first released to the public.
Until they were replaced by the standard ones due to problems. The Tech Bulletin stated the cutoff. I have mine somewhere too, and at the moment, can't find it either.
I guess they were made to give the car a more euro feel.
I myself like them, and have aquired a set, but of yet, haven't used them.
Later, they became the export mirror.
Nice shot of the car.
FYI, the 1989 20th Anniversary Turbo Trans Am did not use a lightbar.
There is not much info out there on Daytona Pace Cars thru the years, even though Pontiac has paced the races for quite a few years.
Pontiac kept changing the Grand Prix and the Firebirds back and forth.
I believe that Chevy Corvettes now pace NASCAR, along with the SSR.

Hope this helps,

George

Mr Trans Am,
Your correct they wanted to give a European feel... Those mirrors were were similar to the Exported from 1986 thru 1992, (RPO DD9) in some countries you needed breakaway mirrors if you were to hit a pedestrian, Germany is one of them IIRC. As a manufacturer you needed to have certain requrements to import a car into each country, but if someone was to buy a car here and import it to Germany than there are some things that are overlooked...

Not sure what was different, BUT the (DD9) GTA mirror in 1987 and the DD9 Mirror that was exported carry a different part number... I think it may be due to the GTA mirror being Electric, and the Export mirror was not... not sure tho.

I thought about trying to get a set, but I would never use them as I think they would not add anything to the car.

John

Yep,
You're right!
I meant to post that this style of mirrors were used as export.
This typing two fingers fast, makes me skip certain words. Doh!

George

There was a race at Talladega (1987?) In which a Red GTA was used as the pace car. I remember this because before the start of the race some knucklehead jumped in the car and took it for a hot lap around the track before the start of the race! The guy was caught and the pace car was brought back around to the pit area to start the pace laps. This was when ESPN was broadcasting the NASCAR races and Bob Jenkins was commentating. Hope this helps!

Looks like it could be the July 27, 1986 Talladega 500. Just a guess. That was the year the pace car was stolen. The car in front looks like Buddy Baker's 88 Crisco car. The second car would be Ron Bouchard 98 (if 86 is correct). Dale Earnhardt, and Bill Elliot.

The question is would GM have built a GTA before July 27, 1986 to be ready to pace the race. It would have been good way to introduce the GTA model to the public.

Great info everybody.... thanks a lot.

Hey Frankie, still have the 'other' chickens? I may need to harass you soon about some info on 'em.

Anyway, off the hijack... do you have anything else to put it into some context? What was the year of publication maybe?

I would say yes. I have seen very early production Camaros and Firebirds with the paddle style mirrors for sale on Ebay. There was also an article written about an early '86 or '87 IROC in the now defunct USCC publication "Camaro Corral". That IROC was a test mule and had the paddle style mirrors.

Since we are on the topic of Firebird's at Nascar races, here is a picture I took at Michigan International in either June or August of 81. A whole lot of 82 red Trans ams! I assume they were given away to VIPs, or prizes of some sort.

...I think, almost all Export mirrors are/were electric....

...all the 91/92 Export-Birds with paddle mirrors I've ever seen here in Germany were electric and had RPO "DD9".... I don't remember any manual paddle-version...

Red Devil, yes, I still have those "other" chickens. Right now I still have about 106,000 of six-week old ones....

To date the publication with the above photo.... it was a Winter 1988 Pontiac service technical publication.

Hrmmm... Any chance it was an oddball race like Australia 1988? Wonder if anyone has a list of sposors for that year to pick out that lead car. I thought QVC when I looked, but I don't know if they ever sponsored?? (Not a big Nascar fan.) Maybe pick out that first car as it's an easier thing to search for lap leaders. :shrug:

What breed you have? I'm trying to decide between RI Reds, Barred Rocks and White Rocks. I only really want to keep about a half dozen. You put pics back up on your site of the operation?

I'm pretty certain that the first car is Buddy Baker. He drove No. 88 sponsored by Crisco. If you look very close it looks like Crisco on the hood. The colors of the car are correct, with blue numbers on the roof.

I think it's Talladega in 86, could also be 87.