GTATransAM

Hey guys i finally took my car out today, even though the roads were still bit hazy salty looking, but not to bad if u didnt drive on the lane by the curb.

Anyways first the wierd thing. I said before how my car when i started it for the first time it would start, then right away die. But a second attempt on starting the car, it would turn on great, no problems.

Well today the same thing happened, i start the car, it turns on, kinda chokes, then dies. So i turn the key again, and then it turns on great, no problems, strong idle. I wonder why it does that, and why it would turn on ok at the second attempt? But this doesnt happen again when u turn on the car, like if u go to a gas station, turn off the car, pump gas, then turn on the car again, no problem there.

After that i took the car out, and it runs great, feels more responsive and can easily tell the difference when taking off, cause the car can breathe now.

These are the mods:

Castrol GTX 10x30 Oil
Prestone Anti-Freeze
Puralator Fuel Filter
K&N Filter Oil Filter
K&N Air Filter
PCV Valve
180 Thermostat
AC Delco Rapidfire Plugs
Taylor 8mm Pro Wire Set
MSD Cap
MSD Rotor
MSD GM Blaster Coil
SLP Flow Booster
SLP Cold Air Induction Package
MAF Sensor modified (screens out)
Repaired air damn (4 screws were missing)

After the drive i went around the car and cleaned all the hazy look to it, damn roads are SO SALTY!
Guys i have pics im gonna take today, so i'll post some before and after pics of the engine bay

Air_Adam

I dunno whats up with that... my car does the same sorta thing when starting cold. You turn the key and it sounds like it fires, turns one time on its own power and dies while you are cranking. Keep in mind, this is the very first time it turns over when you attempt to start it. Then you just keep turning it a little longer, then it will fire and run. It weird... have never seen a car do this. Its like this:

-Get in car, put in key
-(turning motor) "click - turn - fire - turn - turn - turn - fire"
-now its running normally.

GTATransAM

Ya u have the same problem, thats wierd. Ive only done it twice, but if it goes 5/5 then theres something wrong. But ya, mine will start on the first attempt, stay on, then after like 3 seconds begin to struggle and eventually die. Then i attempt again, turn the key, and it starts out great! The only thing thats crossing my mind is either the MAF, or maybe i put one of the wrong vacume lines on the charcoal canister in the wrong hole, i dont know.

DH1987TA

Just a thought, but...could it be that the check valve in the fuel pump is going bad? I've seen a couple of vehicles do this, and it allows the fuel pressure to bleed back into the tank after it sits for a while. Then when you try to start it, it (sometimes) will start off of the fuel left in the intake/cylinders, then die,because the fuel hasn't made it from the tank to the fuel rail. Something you may want to look at...easily diagnosed by hooking up a fuel gauge and seeing if the pressure drops considerably when the car is turned off.

GTATransAM

Oh that could be something to consider. U know i did change the fuel filter too, i hope i didnt do anything there to screw it up. Im 99% sure i put it in right, and its facing the right way for correct fuel flow. But honestly i think it has to do with the fuel, even though i was thinking MAF, but why would the air intake affect the car that bad to let it die, then on the second try it works? Sounds like something isnt going to the engine in time, and a second attempt it gets it there.

Im gonna get a fuel pressure guage. How long of wait until i read the pressure after i shut off the engine? Basically the fuel pressure should not go down at all, but if it does, then like u say its probably check valve. Thats wierd, its a brand new filter, it shouldnt be doing that crap.

DartByU

I bet your fuel pressure is bleeding down, more than likely from leaky injectors, I think the first few years of TPI had an extra injector that just added extra fuel when the engine is started when cold, it acted like a choke, that may be acting up. And since when were
Castrol GTX 10x30 Oil
Prestone Anti-Freeze
Puralator Fuel Filter
K&N Filter Oil Filter
PCV Valve

Considered mods?

GTATransAM

Ok so some of the stuff are not "mods", there tune-up, my bad, but basically after tune-up/mods would of been better.

Injector u think could be the problem, damn i hope its not, but if its bleeding them im looking at either a check valve or a injector problem, oh crap.

Well at least u guys narrowed the problem down, so thanks.

dunerida82

Its nice to see someone actually praising their Mods, instead of asking for help. Good luck! :rockon:

bes217

I have the same exact problem. I can't figure out why it does this. It's like the first time you tutrn it over it is not getting any gas or something, then the second time it fires right up. It's like the fuel is draining out of the lines or something back into the tank and the pump has to feed it back up to the engine. I don't know if this is it but its my guess whats happening.

KC10Chief

My 88 GTA does the exact same thing when cold! It's comforting to know that it's not just my car! I figured it was the fuel pump myself. My car has that extra injector that somebody was talking about. How can you tell if you have a bad injector anyways? How much do those things cost? Matt

Damon

I have found that when the fual pump gets weak (or isn't getting full voltage) that startup is difficult. Cranking the engine over brings voltage way down- only about 9-10 volts available and this seems to be just enough to keep a weak pump from producing sufficient fuel pressure. Once running, with full 14V it seems to keep up much better.

I have also seen where having the pressure bleed down can cause similar problems. My 94 Formula does this and has similar startup problems. I have not had the time or inclination to fix it at this point, though. I have found that turning the key to the RUN position lets the fuel pump run for about 2 seconds and reprime the system. So turn it to RUN, wait for the fuel pump to complete it's cyle and then turn all the way to start- fires right up and runs clean.

The MAF sensor won't ever be the cause for problems firing while cranking. The ECM doesn't look at the MAF while starting. However, if you have a problem where it stalls immediately after starting then that's classic bad MAF symptoms.

IROC57TPI

My car does that thing too. Heres why:

The ECM monitors oil pressure, and when you first start the car cold it has none so the ECM shuts off the fuel until the car sees oil pressure. If they cranked just a little longer to build pressure before the spark then they wouldn't have that problem. If you notice they don't do it when its hot out because the oil is thinner and flows better making pressure real quickly.

Hope this helps.

GTATransAM

Hey guys, thought this topic was dead, but it just suddenly resurfaced! So u guys know what im talking about then. Ok first off, all the tune-up/mod cost about $400-500, not too sure exactly.

Ok im assuming that all this problem is directly related to the fuel filter, i mean before this everything was fine, but i changed the fuel filter and now i get this problem. And since we've wired it down to being a fuel related problem, it narrows it down to fuel filter, fuel pump, or cold start injector.

Bes i think we are getting the EXACT same problem, it starts, dies right away, start it up again, and its fine. I sure do not hope its the fuel pump though, then again i have no idea how long fuel pumps last. But i dont think it can be the fuel pump, cause i have no problems with fuel once the car is up and running.

And let me get this straight, if i just turn the key to RUN, and not turn the engine ON for a few seconds, wait....then turn the engine ON, it will fire up the first time, no problem?

Oh and just one more thing, lets say this problem stays, and either im to lazy or whatever cant fix it now, it aint gonna cause any problems is it?

Thanks guys

wasp

ditch the castrol, put mobil-1 synthetic in it, youll feel that as well