Hey everyone

I am building myself a CarPuter to run a GPS module, Mp3 and other features that will be added at a later date. I was wondering. What is behind the dash on the passenger side. I have this sort of pouch thing however I was wondering if I can remove that and put my carputer behind it?


My carputer is using a EPIA MiniITX board with a 1000mhz esp cpu. I was told this cpu runs cool and is still gives decent performance. As for a CDROM I plan on using a CDROM for a laptop. HDD will be a 40GB Maxtor. RAM will be 512 PC133 which I had laying on my desk for a while now looking for a board to sit on. As for a screen, I have purchased one of those 7.2" TFT's with VGA input and a USB input for the touch screen interface.

I have the aux input cable for my headunit which allows me to plug my computer directly into my Pioneer Premiers head unit so thats my plan for the sound.

only problem...I want the install to be clean and wires hidden however no clue where to put this box so its out of site and definately out of mind from petty thieves...which is why behind that pouch thingy is looking like the plan.

Any input would be greatly apreciated.

 

im not sure about whats behind the dash, my best gess would be the heater box ducting etc, i place i am thinking of putting mine would be in the lockable rear storage compartment, or spare tire well

 

Behind the pouch is air ducting, your ECM, and a host of wires. It is quite cramped back there which is one of the reasons I am sure, that we do not see our cars with glove boxes.

 

I was thinking of using that lockable storage place in the trunk area too however I am not sure how I would run a VGA cable to the front of the car without losing signal quality.

 

are u talking about the standard monitor connection? or is it RCA?
usally rca can go quite a ways without losing quality, and u can buy extensions for monitor cables, shouldnt have to have it that much longer than stock

 

Well I bought a 7.2" Lilliput TFT monitor which has a VGA monitor hookup and 2 RCA hookups for AV1 and AV2. I have never really extended a monitor hookup before so I don't quite know the limitations to the wire length before issues will arise. I think before I consider that I should seriously decide on where I plan on putting the LCD. Not much room on the dash as there are so many instruments there already Any help on that one as well as monitor wire lengths would be greatly apreciated.

 

If you stick to standard gauge. twisted 21aug I think, shielded, and they have the noise dampner lump (can't remember the name but you see them on the SVGA end of all good monitors.) You can go a good 30ft so long as you don't run it next to the power cable and as far from your power inverter as possible. I've had a miniITX with the via 800mhz C3 on it. CRAP!!!. thing was buggy as hell. My recommendations would be to just grab a shuttle with the (dare I say) P4 533/800FSB mini mobo in it. Then just run a P4 2.0 or something. Should be just fine with cooling so long as you stay away from the new p4's with the prescott core. Those things could be block heaters lol. I can't believe I just recommended Intel over AMD

 

because of price, right? because as far as I can remember, Intel has always had a faster, more reliable chip out... Just more costly.

Ever used an Athlon 1.4? That jokester is basically an overclocked 1.2 or something... Runs at 65 degrees celcius at IDLE! could never work in a car... however, Intel chips automatically reduce their speed as to not overheat. Any p4 will do this, so you will never have to worry about damaging the chip.

You could always go liquid cooling! It's easier than you think.

 

oops, I forgot to mention.... you should put an xbox in your car... Everyone,,, should... put... an... xbox... in... their... car...

the possibilites are endless... plus it has rca output for your screen.... I personally have to modify the xbox to output VGA for my 12.1", but its no big deal. I also have to format my 200gig drive that i need to put in there.

The thing I need to do is port a copy of MS Streets to the xbox (no linux here) or some other gps proggy, and get one of those 50 dollar receivers so I can have directions for my delivery job.

 

Bah it's a proven fact the intels are slower. An intel rep even said they were lowering instructions persec so they could ramp up clocks speeds. In engine speak a 500hp motor with 200ft-lbs. I'm not sure what co0ling you were using but that's 150* F at idle most mobos send overheating warnings at that lvl. Average running temp for ANY athlon is 114* F (47 C) I've never had an athlon, (started with an 800MHz) run over 45*C. On top of this The new intels run signifcantly hotter than AMD's. My A64 only runs at 35* C. But enough of that because it will go on for ever on who is right. Just like the import vs domestics.

As for compatability and reliability never had a problem. They wouldn't even be an option for consumers if they had these kinds of problems. WAY too much money to lose. That is why you don't see Alienwares (YUCK) selling VIA CPU's in anything. They ARE buggy and have reliability problems. But on another note yes that is why I recommend the intel chip for in car use but not over say 2.6 and NO Prescott cores unless you want to mount it somewhere that is outta the sun and gets lost of air flow. Like I said 2.0 p4 in a car would be great. Not like you are gonna worry terribly about getting 300FPS on UT2K4 in the RIGHT? Save that for the house PC. Check into this one. I know they a bit more expensive but you get a much better PC.

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduc...101-422&depa=0

 

Heres the deal

Intel does make a better chip for multitasking...well they did until AMD Brought forth the Athlon 64.

AMD due to their high processes per cycle count were far better at single tasking (Playing games, designing multimedia, stuff that requires 1 app open) where Intel with their high front side bus and low process per cycle count made it far more efficient to multitask and perform in server applications.

The way it works is this. Say you have a chip that is putting out 11 processes per cycle and a task requires only 2 processes to function...the other 9 are wasted. Thats why AMD's seem to clog up when you throw a whack load of apps at them where intel will just bulldoze through it.

I am an AMD guy. I always ran AMD in every build except for one. My linux server is running a Quad P3 1000 setup with 2.5GB RAM and 4 raid0 40GB Maxtor HDDs.

Does AMD run hotter then Intel...sure it does. Is this easy to get around...Hell yeah. You take the proper precautions with the setup and you can get around any heat issue. I use Artic Silver 3 with the stock heatsink and fan and I can get that chip running at 43 celcius at full load and this is a reading that is taken after a 30 minute burnin.

As for my build...I am going with the EPIA MiniITX V Series board. It has a 800mhz C3 Eden CPU. It runs awesome for what I need it to do. Checked it after a 1 hour burnin with my laser thermometer and it recorded a temp of 32 celcius and my room temp was 25 celcius so thats not bad at all. System is running stable with Windows XP (however I plan on putting Windows 98 on there for a quicker boot and faster app switching.

 

Since we are talking computers, I have an Athlon Barton XP2500
and it will eat up a P4 2.8Gig any day. And my athlon is only 1.8 Gigs.

 

that's funny... I have that same chip, and it only comes close to beating the intel at 2.2ghz or something (3200+) otherwise its a slow (but cheap) chip. For under 100 bucks you cannot go wrong with the 2500+... Anyways the reason most people like AMD is because they are the "UnderDog" in the cpu market... I hate it when people like something just because they are the underdog... I can understand that people like it because they are a better deal... but I've never heard of the best intel chip getting beaten by the best AMD chip... ever... Intel has always been the leader at floating point processing, and as they came out with hyperthreading they now kick the snot out of amd in encoding and other high-demand scenarios...

But enough on this, what we should really be talking about is buying an xbox and putting a fly screen in your car...

I looked into putting PC in my car and it just seemed un-economical.... To properly impliment a pc into your car you need the following:
1. PC with VGA/RCA output
2. DC Power Supply$$$$$ / or a power inverter (get ready for loud-*** whining)
3. some place to hide that damned-ugly thing.
4. 3-d accelerator card$$$$
5. good sound card
6. VGA or RCA screen (RCA will most likely not work perfectly)
7. Hard disk
8. ir remote
and more...

or for the Xbox...
1. Xbox
2. Inverter (or replace the internal pwr supply... but bad idea)
3. RCA screen (cheap) / VGA screen (way better to look at)---but at least the rca will work Flawlessly
4. hard disk
5. mod chip
6. remote kit

pc setup will cost around $700 to get the same results as a $300 setup with the Xbox.

Me and my brother are thinking about making/porting a GPS program to the xbox... Which in my opinion would make thousands of people put them in their cars... Because a gps unit that runs on a pc is literally only like 30 bucks... Prolly a ms map program or something.

 

but seriously Tom's Hardware, IMO, has always been somewhat intel bias but fair to AMD. This just being on Top review of the "under dog" as you so put it chip.

http://www20.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040322/index.html

If you check that out you will see that it is really neck and neck with the A64 3200+ (2.0GHZ) 3400+ (2.2GHz) and Intel 3.2GHz and 3.4GHz. If you look at many respect sites, Anandtech to name one, you will see that AMD is infact beating intel in almost all aspect of "General" home use (games, encoding, decoding, movies) Although the FX-53 does come at a steep price. But the P4 3.2 smoking A64 3200+ comes in at around $250 last time I checked. So ARE correct in saying that AMD is a less expensive product. I certainly do not stick with any underdog as I jump on the ATI bandwagon as soon as they started stomping Nvidia. Not saying Intel is a bad chip it's just that AMD has the crown for the gamers for now. I'm hoping these new intels with A64 instructions kick butt cause I'm cetainly planning on getting that if they do.

An Xbox is a good Idea IMO since you won't have a problem playing games at the track or listening to music lol. BUT having a complete PC has it's up side too. Perhaps realtime diags?!?! Ok enough of this we seem to be a little off topic now and kinda hijacked the tread.

 

Its simple Athlon can handle more cache. It can take a wayyyy higher load. Not only is it cheaper than Intel, but just the fact it can take a higher workload is great for me

 

you can easily write a program for realtime diagnostics for the xbox, there is even a free SDK for writing programs. That's how I plan on writing my gps program.

But yes, the upgradeability of a real pc is a big plus... but the cost is a major down

 

Cost isnt too bad. I bought all my stuff from www.koonline.net. Heres what I bought

Morex 3677 (Black)
VIA EPIA VE5000 (Fanless)
150watt Power inverter
Slimline CDROM

The total was definately more then the cost of an Xbox however I like the fact that I can write addon programs for the operating system. Also the ability to build hardware to run off of the computer to interact with the car is a definate bonus.

A modded Xbox would make an awesome Mp3/Entertainment system however thats not what I want. But thats not my battle plan

 

bah.. disregard this post.

 

how much did all that cost you?

and how fast is that via processor? my friend bought a miniITX board with a fanless cpu and it sucked... BAD... could not even play a simple divx movie, and it was rated at 800mhz, even a 500 pentium could run a divx just fine.

 

if you buy all the **** off ebay, you can do it for $800.

Do it inside the dash above the foot pedals. There is way enough room under there for that.




Shane

 

Have you looked at the dash above the foot petals? There isn't any room there man. THere is a steering column, the fuse block, plastic supports for the dash, and a bunch of wires. Where is this room you are talkin about? I couldn't find a flat piece to mount my alarm to, let alone a miniATX board.

 

i saw mini ITX board mentioned above. Those boards are 6in x 6in big. They can fit up under my dash with absolutely no problem. Maybe you got a camaro and they have less room but my wires are nice an organized so i got lots of avalible room.



Shane

 

Sure, the board is 6" x 6" but you gotta put a fan on it and have good cooling, plus the space for the power supply and a CD drive plus the HD. I have a '92 Camaro and a '87 GTA, I doubt I could cleanly get it all under there. I am sure there is room if you stuff **** everywhere, but I would want it contained in a box, not just a motherboard sitting in the car.

 

why do you gotta be so picky, if you mount the stuff to the car its like a box.

 

Seriously who cares? What can you possibly do in your car that requires high cpu speeds? IMO you're just wasting your money at a certain point (tho I guess it depends on what you plan to do). You dont need the top of the line stuff to play DVD's, connect to GPS, or any of that stuff. The only thing that I would worry about is having an unstable setup, like some claim VIA to be. But you also have to keep your operating system in mind when dealing with those types of problems (unstable, buggy, etc). You'd be supprised how often Windows is the culprit when whacky stuff starts to happen.

I'm gonna be running a CPU in my car too, though I'm not really interested in DVD's, or GPS. Here's the setup I'm gonna be going with:

Mini-Box M-100

Its small enough to mount under a seat (or in the dash), runs off 12v power supply, has loads on expansion possibility, loads of multimedia possibility, and costs $400 for everything.

Yeah its a VIA chip but I plan to run Linux on my Mini-Box. Heck, windows isnt even stable on my home CPU with an Intel chip. Since all the applications I want to run are Windows based, I'm going to use Wine. I will be using the Mini-Box in conjunction with a 7" flip out LCD CD/DVD deck (with Mp3 capability) , 1 remote mounted camera, and an ALDL connection to my cars ECM. Since I will be swapping in a 4th gen dashbord, I'm going to do a custom install in the glovebox. I'm going to have my local sound place build me a fiberglass piece that will allow me to mount the Mini-Box flush in the glovebox (with all the I/O ports facing outward for easy access). The Mini-Box video out (S-Video, composite, or RCA) will be hooked up to my flip out deck for display. The ALDL connection to the cars ECM will be permanent, and I will be using the PROMinator. When I tune the car, I will be using the Mini-Box running Wine and Tunercat R_T making tuning changes in real time with the video output piped to an external laptop (since the flip out screen is so small). When the ECM is not being tuned (everything is hidden away in the glove box, laptops at home), I will be setting up some scan tools that will display real time engine / tuning stats in graphical form on the flip out LCD screen. This is the main reason I want to run a CPU in my car. I'm also hooking up a remote mounted camera where my 3rd brake light used to be, and this will be my rearview mirror (camera hooked directly to the flip out LCD unit, not the Mini-Box).

 

Someone else mentioned the X-Box. You could also use this as a CPU for your car if you wiped out the X-Box code and installed Linux. Would be a good alternative if you wanted a compact form and an Intel chip for a cheap price. Unfortunately the X-Box does not have the ports I need to connect to my cars ECM so it wasnt a good choice for me. But for someone who wants to perform regular CPU functions (MP3's, DVD's, Etc), it would work out great. Check out http://xbox-linux.sourceforge.net/ for the How-To and Specs of the X-Box. I'm sure you could fit one of those under your seat, and it would hook up to your VGA monitor connection.

 

Sorry for being a post *****, but I had another idea. If you wanted to stick with the homemade ITX type of setup and you are strapped for space, you could gut the back of the front seats. I've seen some people do this to hide sound components (mostly amps) and you couldnt even tell while sitting in the seat. Although if you looked at the back of the seat you could tell something was done. Still, if a thief dosn't see the CPU in plain sight, he probably wont know its there.

Just another note, a friend of mine has been running Linux on his VIA powered Mini-Box for over a year now as a server and he is having no stability issues. I think his uptime is like 7 months by now ...He even uses it to watch DVD's (but this is all at home).

 

Hi all,
Just thought I would chime in about the xbox. I've been considering one for some time. It would be cool because it can play just about any format of video/audio, you can pull 5.1 surround sound through optical, and they're 150 bucks now and can be modded for nothing. I'd get one of those wireless game hubs too to transfer files while parked out front. I have not seen a free sdk yet though, they are working on open xdk the microsoft one is definitely not legal unless you are licensed through them. As far as I/O the controller ports are pretty standard USB with a different connector. Could do something crazy with a microcontroller, and tcip on the lan but thats out of my capabilities, and I hate microcontrollers after the class I'm taking this semester. There is one group that has CE up and running (proof of concept at this point) so gps isnt too far off possibly (I could see through a serial to usb running a CE derivative or definitely Linux). One would have to go in the trunk I'd imagine, they do make a lot of heat, and I'm still leary about how a hard drive would turn out in a car. They may sing like anything, if you take them out of the metal can inside the plastic case.

Personally, I'm a AMD guy, there is always arguments going back and forth, saw one rumor that Intel's 64 Bit stuffs reverse engineered AMD's, could be bs, or Intel just getting AMD back. By the way I like my AMD 1.4GHZ keeps my feet warm on those cold winter nights.

There is some space (89' Chevy IROC) if you take off the dashpad theres a metal bracket that comes out. I crammed the alarm down in there that was maybe 8"x8" by 2" wide.

Best of luck with the CarPuter
Martin

 

I don't plan on having my carputer play DVD's or DIVX's. The main purpose is to have it as a GPS and if they have an engine managemnt system for our cars I would like to get it piped through the system.

As for gutting out the seats and putting the computer in there. Well if they were manual carseats then I would consider that but I just recently found out that my car seats are powered. 4 buttons, one set causes the outter flaps to close in on the driver and the other 2 cause the lumbar support to come out or retract. I think instead I will be putting the computer underneath the passenger side seat. Should fit there...the computer isn't really that big

 

What about the console? Just a thought.