fbird89

A while back I posted about a cracked radiator and how to fix it-

https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=197412

I had a problem with a crack in the radiator and had coolant spraying out after a little bit of driving. I put in two bottles of radiator sealant (I know now that was a bad idea), and they didnt do anything to fix the leak. My car was shooting up past 240 degrees when you start It up and let it sit for a couple minutes, so I had a friend put in a new waterpump and thermostat because we thought that would fix it.

After we put those in the car, it still overheated the same as before, so we went and put in a new radiator. After we put that in, the leaking did stop, but the car still overheats the same as before.

So far this is all I know

- the two bottles of sealant I put in a while back to try and fix the radiator crack could be clogging up the system?

-I have been driving the car a for a 2 mile trips while I was having the problem- Im not quite sure if my driving it could have cause any other problems

-After we put the new radiator in and the car overheated again the same as before, we check the radiator cap and it was cold- we took that off and coolant sprayed out, and all the coolant was also cold- the only part that was hot was the waterpump. We took the hose off the pump and air rushed out, and noticed that there was no coolant flowing through it.

-The cooling system has never been flushed. (Im not quite familiar with working on cars, and I was quoted at $80 for a cooling system flush at a local garage so I opted not to get one

-All the work on the car has been done by a friend, who is not a mechanic, so I cant say that the installation of any parts has been right or not

Im going to take it to a garage tomorrow afternoon, but Im afraid I am going to get way over charged- I can only drive the car for a short distance and all the local garages arent so great.


Any ideas on what the problem might be? Im kinda bummed out I put all the money and labor into the car to have the same problem as before-

Thanks for any help!!!

spartyon

you might have a air pocket somewhere in the cooling system. that is when air gets trapped in their. that will cause it to overheat. may you have gotten a wrong pump or something like a marine one that flows backwards? if so that might do it as well.

bigals87z28

other then an air pocket, did you make sure you left the spring in the lower hose? The lower rad hose will colapse if you dont have it in there. You could just have someone flush it all out for you... enigne and all. Was the new radiator a new one or one you got from a junk yard? You have all your fans etc hooked up right?

fbird89

The waterpump I got was a rebuilt one for $30 that also came with a warranty- Im not quite sure how to check which one it is though. My car has the 2.8L V6 and its an 89. I still have the original waterpump with me if that helps any.

The radiator was purchased at a junkyard for $60, it was from an 88 Camaro with a 2.8L V6 and was taken out of the car not too long after it was put in because the guy had the car in a rearend accident I was told. From a visual standpoint, it looked in good shape.

Im picking up a flush kit from an autoparts store for $5, and have a bottle of radiator flush- With the kit will it just be able to flush out the radiator, or the whole cooling system?

I wont be able to get the car looked at until Friday so Im going to try a few things until then

rezinn

Even if you had an air pocket or the hose was collapsing, something would still flow. And there definitely shouldn't be air coming out of the radiator hose.

That flush might be a good idea as well, but you can do it yourself for about $10. There's probably a clog somewhere, and you didn't fill the cooling system completely, which makes things worse. You can fill through the thermostat housing to make sure it's full, and top off whatever is left in the radiator, then add the flush and hope for the best. Maybe change the thermostat while you're in there just so you know it's good.

fbird89

Two more things I remembered-

-while the car is running, either moving or not, no hot air will come out of the heater vents when I turn the heater on, even though the temp gauge is close to redlining.

-when we put the new radiator in, the person who installed it for me only put in 1 bottle of 50/50 coolant. I didnt think it was enough at the time, but he assured me it was, as the coolant level was all the way to the top when you took the radiator cap off. I checked the car again this afternoon and saw that the level of coolant in the radiator was no longer visible, which made me sure that we didnt put enough coolant in to begin with, which may have had an effect of the car overheating?

Im going to try the flush soon and see what happens- Ill be buying a flush kit tomorrow, but Ive read a bit about a backflusher too. Are these the same things?

rezinn

Coolant isn't getting to the heater core, make sense. That's why there is no heat. Could be because there is a lack of coolant or a clog.

When you fill the radiator, you're just filling about half of the cooling system. You have to top off the coolant while it's circulating. If the level dropped, that means that there is at least some circulation. This also means: don't let that guy touch your car again, he could have blown your engine.

If I were you I'd first make sure the cooling system is topped off (fill through the radiator, AND fill through the thermostat housing while replacing the thermostat). With full coolant it should not get hot that quickly, even if it isn't circulating. The reason it does is that you're low on coolant and there's probably nothing in the heads/intake to absorb the heat. With the radiator cap off and the car running, and the cooling system full, you will see a turbulent flow of coolant if it is circulating sufficiently.

Not sure on the difference between flushes, only ones I've used have just been added in and circulated before replacing the coolant.

MrDude_1

with the car cool, open the radaitor cap...

fill the radiator to the top.

with the cap still off, start the car...

when the thermostat opens, you should see the level drop some... refill back to the top with it still running....

carefully replace the cap, and dont remove it now that the system is hot.

if your prob was just low coolent... its solved, you shouldnt run too hot..

if thats not your prob and she starts to creep up, look and make sure the fan is kicking on. if it is and thats not your prob


check your timing... this is very important.... if the timing is off it can make the engine run real hot, real quick.

Z06

I had similar problems with my 91 Z28. I replaced the thermostat, waterpump, flushed the radiator, changed the hoses and my car was still running at 240F - 250f. I then replaced the radiator with an all aluminum dual 1" core radiator and my problems were solved. My car now runs around 180f ,even in traffic. So junk the radiator you purchased from the junkyard and try a aluminum radiator.

bigals87z28

I didnt see if you had the radiator pressure tested at the junk yard or by someone. It really sounds like you have a glog somewhere and your not getting fluid circulating. Did you test the T-stat to see if it would open?

fbird89

I just got back from the autoparts store and bought a 5/8 " (I think that is the right size?) coolant flush kit made by NAPA- I also picked up a bottle of radiator flush, and a bottle of radiator cleaner that is sort of like sand I have to mix with water.

Im going to try filling the rest of the radiator up with water and see if that helps in the morning, if not then Ill do the flush.

Also, about the fan- its the big black one thats right behind the radiator right? When the car is running, its definately moving, but Im not quite sure if its doing its job or not. On a side note however, I noticed that when I turned the key into the on position, there was a sound I never noticed before that did sound like a fan turning on an running. Before when it ran good, you would just hear the fuel pump (I think) sending for a couple seconds, then there would be silence.

fbird89

I never had the new one pressure tested, but the guy at the junkyard said that it was the best one he had and almost new- it was sitting on a shelf in the shop rather than in a car. I dont think the radiator is the problem, because I first replaced the thermostat and waterpump, and I still had the problem. Next came the new radiator and the problem was still the same.

Way back, when my only problem was a crack in the radiator, the only thing that was really wrong with the car was that coolant was leaking out of a crack near the top of the radiator, with smaller holes possibly at the bottom leaking out coolant as well- it never really overheated. I then mistakenly put in a bottle of radiator sealant thinking it would be a quick fix, and also because I couldnt afford to buy and install a new radiator. It didnt fix the crack, so I bought another bottle of sealant, this time a black liquid with big pellets inside, and tried that. That also did not fix the crack, but after this is when I started to notice the car overheating, so Im guessing that I succeeded in clogging up the system with both bottles of coolant.

Unfortunately I cant really afford to buy all new parts and get them professionally installed because Im out of work due to a back injury and they refused to pay for my medical bills, so I had to get a lawyer and am currently going through court to try and get workers comp. To make a long story short, I have very little money and very many bills.

fbird89

I filled the radiator up to the top with water- took about one coolant sized bottle of water to fill it up. I started the car with the radiator cap off, and let it run for a couple mins. Instead of the level dropping, it actually rose and started overflowing out of the radiator, so I put the cap back on and let it run. Its still overheating the same as before though.

Another thing I notice is that while the car was idling (I think thats what its called when the car is running, but parked) it was running at 1500 rpms which seemed kind of high to me- what should the car be idling at normally?

MrDude_1

once its warmed up. it should be around 400-800 according to your stock tach.... honestly i donno since i dont look at a scan tool to see the true idle speed too often...

its stock, so if it sounds high, it probly is.


did you check your timing?

Thirtybird

I'm going to guess that the $30 rebuilt water pump you bought is a clockwise flow pump, but your engine requires a counter-clockwise flow pump.

To know for certain what type of pump you require answer the following questions:
Does your car have a serpentine belt? (likely answer : yes - I have an 87 w/ 2.8 - it's serpentine).
When the engine is running, what direction is it spinning? (please, don't run it anymore - the answer is counterclockwise)

check with the guy you bought it from what direction its designed to run...

bigals87z28

Changing my whole outlook on this... why cant GM just make stuff consistant. sorry for the misshap.

fbird89

Im at school right now, but I know that my car has the serpentine belt which is this right here correct?

http://autorepair.about.com/library/...bldef-728a.htm

A single belt which is flat on one side, and ribbed on the other and used to turn everything on the engine. So, when the engine is running, the pully on the waterpump should be moving in a counterclockwise motion- if it moves clockwise that means I have the wrong water pump?

breathment

where did u get the pump?

Thirtybird

that's the one.

Actually, if you have the wrong water pump, the pulley will still turn counterclockwise (because that's determined by the belt), but the internals wont be working properly. I don't know if the differences in the CW and CCW pumps for the V6 are only in the vaning or if the inlets and outlets are altered to keep the direction through the pump the same.

MrDude_1

with a V belt, the pump is made to turn the same direction as the crank.

with a serpentine belt system, the pump is made to turn the oppisate direction of the crank.


that said, if you put the wrong one on, it moves water, but not nearly enough to keep the engine cool.

before you pull off anything else though... check your timing.

fbird89

I called up CAP (Consumer Auto Parts- not sure if thats a national chain, but its a pretty popular store where I live). I asked what year waterpump was sold to me given I had an 89 Firebird with a 2.8L V6, and he said it would have been from an 87-89, with 90 they moved up to a 3.1L.

Im not quite sure how to check the timing, but I will be able to finally get it looked at friday morning when I take it over to the garage. I only have enough for 2 1/2 hours of them looking at it- $35 an hour, which isnt too bad. If its a clog in the system like Im thinking it is, I have another friend (not the same one who put all the other parts in my car- I dont think it would be a good idea for him to work on my car anymore) which will help me do the cooling system flush. After I get back from the garage Ill report back what the results were.

fbird89

Great news! No more overheating!!!


I dropped it off early in the morning at the garage, and a few hours later I called back and asked on the status. He said he didnt have too much time to look at it yet, but he did take it for a drive and noticed that the temp gauge shot up to 240 within a minute of driving, but when he took a turn, it dropped down to 120 or so. He said to call back in a few more hours, and when I did, they said my car was ready to be picked up. He mentioned something about putting in a new coolant sensor or sending unit, and also noticed that when he took off the radiator cap, the coolant level wasnt visible, so he filled it right back up again, as well as putting a bunch more into the overflow resevoir. So, I guess the problem all along was just a lack of coolant running through the cooling system, and also air pockets that developed. To top it off, I only got charged $10. And, to make a great day even better, the weather was beautiful outside and hot enough to take my t-tops off.

I really appreciate all the help everyone has given me- Im glad I finally got my Firebird up and running again like normal

Thanks again everyone!

fbird89

Ran into a bit of trouble earlier today.I was driving home from school and noticed smoke comming out of the hood, so I pulled the car over and popped the hood- there was about an inch long crack in the upper radiator hose spraying out coolant.

The only question I have is whether the crack is due to a problem with the cooling system, or just a coincidence because the hose is old?

breathment

you mean you didn't replace the hose when you replaced the radiator!?

rezinn

Probably coincidence if its the stock hose. The cooling system is actually building up pressure now since it's full, so the hose burst.

fbird89

No because I didnt have too much money, and only had enough to pick up the radiator at the time. Good news is thats its an easy fix and the hose is being order and should come in Friday. I guess its just a coincidence then

Thirtybird

having just done work on my cooling system I can tell you - after you fix the weakest link in your chain, the second weakest link shows itself and demands replacement...

breathment

that is true. i guess working in autoparts is just seem second nature for me. people come in buy a new radiator or pump. recomend the upper\lower hoses. they decline, and come back in a couple hours later needing the hoses.. ask them if they need clamps, they decline using the stock crappy clamps.. and then they coem back in later with a broken clamp or something like that. doesn't always happen, but when it does its funny.

9D1BURD

I was laughing the whole time i was reading this. This is why:

I have a 1995 GMC Jimmy, at the time it had about 96,000 on it. I am the second owner, truck is in almost mint condition.

About 3 weeks before i was going to drive to florida, i noticed an orange streak forming on my pasenger side carpet.

I was like damn, heater core, and for those of you that dont know, the whole dash has to be removed on the 95 and up blazers and jimmys.

Finished that job, next day i noticed a drip under the truck. Damn water pump had quit. Changed the pump, also changed the thermo stat at that time cause it failed the test.

All is well for like a week, and the i started to over heat. Rad was clogged, replaced that.

One more week goes by, overheating again. This time it is the fan clutch.

Once one thing goes, watch out, everything else is sure to follow.

Just had to add my funny cooling story,.

86BirdSE

well, next thing to go is the heater core

Believe me, I did the whole tinhg you did and it turned out to be a pinhole in the heater core.

Kamalhussain

If you've replaced the radiator, thermostat, and water pump but your car is still overheating, it could be due to several reasons:

1. Air pockets: Air trapped in the cooling system can prevent proper circulation of coolant, leading to overheating.
   
2. Cooling fan: A malfunctioning cooling fan may not be cooling the radiator efficiently, especially at low speeds or when idling.
   
3. Radiator cap: A faulty radiator cap can cause the coolant to boil and create air pockets in the system, leading to overheating.
   
4. Clogged radiator: Even with a new radiator, debris or sediment buildup can restrict coolant flow, causing overheating.
   
5. Head gasket: A blown head gasket can allow combustion gases to enter the cooling system, causing overheating and other issues.
   
6. Water pump belt: If the water pump belt is slipping or broken, the water pump may not circulate coolant effectively, leading to overheating.
   
7. Thermostat installation: Incorrect installation of the thermostat can cause it to not open/close properly, affecting coolant flow and temperature regulation.
   

To troubleshoot further and pinpoint the exact issue, consider consulting a professional mechanic or referring to comprehensive troubleshooting guides like this one.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Congratulations you bumped a thread over 20 years old

Tom 400 CFI

First post, too!

I think Hussain is a spammer/bot.