Lean pops on sudden TPS increase.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 12,088
Likes: 125
From: SALEM, NH
Car: '88 Formula
Engine: LC9
Transmission: 4L60E
Axle/Gears: 3.89 9"
Lean pops on sudden TPS increase.
Normally I'd fix this with a little AE, or ramp spark. I tried both. AE didn't make a difference. Spark made it worse. Any ideas?
even if I'm standing over the engine with the car in park, and I snap the throttle a little it will pop a nice fireball through the intake.
This car has a cc-306 cam and is 10.1:1 with a miniram, and 58mm tb, Super-8d version3 with VE mods to get BLM as close as possible, some inj constant changes, and I have the fans set so the coolant should never go over 200f or so. (185 thermostat).
It idles between like 75-79kpa, which seems a little bit much to me (would think it would be in the 60s). I adjusted valves like 5 times. They are not tight.
Anyway, heres a screen shot of an example. Pretty much, the second the TPS goes from 0 to something higher than say 10%, I get a POP, then the car pulls.
Any ideas?
-- Joe
even if I'm standing over the engine with the car in park, and I snap the throttle a little it will pop a nice fireball through the intake.
This car has a cc-306 cam and is 10.1:1 with a miniram, and 58mm tb, Super-8d version3 with VE mods to get BLM as close as possible, some inj constant changes, and I have the fans set so the coolant should never go over 200f or so. (185 thermostat).
It idles between like 75-79kpa, which seems a little bit much to me (would think it would be in the 60s). I adjusted valves like 5 times. They are not tight.
Anyway, heres a screen shot of an example. Pretty much, the second the TPS goes from 0 to something higher than say 10%, I get a POP, then the car pulls.
Any ideas?
-- Joe
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,692
Likes: 1
From: Corona
Car: 92 Form, 91 Z28, 89 GTA, 86 Z28
Engine: BP383 vortech, BP383, 5.7 TPI, LG4
Transmission: 4L60e, 700R4, 700R4..
Axle/Gears: 3.27, 2.73
That's definitely AE, in my book. But you probably have a super free flowing intake duct/filter, right? It's a very difficult problem to overcome. If I were you, I'd really fudge (increase dramatically) the VE in the lower RPM, high loads, to see if it gets better. And get as much dTPS AE in as quickly as possible without screwing it up too much elsewhere. Also decrease the AE decay, to make it last a little longer.
Last edited by RednGold86Z; Aug 19, 2006 at 11:31 PM.
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,692
Likes: 1
From: Corona
Car: 92 Form, 91 Z28, 89 GTA, 86 Z28
Engine: BP383 vortech, BP383, 5.7 TPI, LG4
Transmission: 4L60e, 700R4, 700R4..
Axle/Gears: 3.27, 2.73
You might also want to decrease the AE decay.
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,180
Likes: 3
From: Browns Town
Car: 86 Monte SS (730,$8D,G3,AP,4K,S_V4)
Engine: 406 Hyd Roller 236/242
Transmission: 700R4 HomeBrew, 2.4K stall
Axle/Gears: 3:73 Posi, 7.5 Soon to break
How far is your MAP from the plenum?
Is it a soft line or a hard material hose?
Could be some delay in there.
Is it a soft line or a hard material hose?
Could be some delay in there.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 12,088
Likes: 125
From: SALEM, NH
Car: '88 Formula
Engine: LC9
Transmission: 4L60E
Axle/Gears: 3.89 9"
Map is connected with like a 2" hard line to the center of the manifold. It shares a 3/8" vac port with the FPR, which is also connected with hard line.
-- Joe
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 12,088
Likes: 125
From: SALEM, NH
Car: '88 Formula
Engine: LC9
Transmission: 4L60E
Axle/Gears: 3.89 9"
That's definitely AE, in my book. But you probably have a super free flowing intake duct/filter, right? It's a very difficult problem to overcome. If I were you, I'd really fudge (increase dramatically) the VE in the lower RPM, high loads, to see if it gets better. And get as much dTPS AE in as quickly as possible without screwing it up too much elsewhere. Also decrease the AE decay, to make it last a little longer.
See attached image, which tables would you try editing with?
On $58 (what i've been using for 5 years now) there is only 4 AE tables, and the one two that have the biggest impact were "accel enrich vs tps" and "accel enrich vs map".
-- Joe
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,180
Likes: 3
From: Browns Town
Car: 86 Monte SS (730,$8D,G3,AP,4K,S_V4)
Engine: 406 Hyd Roller 236/242
Transmission: 700R4 HomeBrew, 2.4K stall
Axle/Gears: 3:73 Posi, 7.5 Soon to break
Hate to do this to you..
But in the sticky...
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...e-thing-i.html
Might try the AE map multiplier tables. There are several ways to cover the transition in $8D.
Here is a nice post on the different ways to play with it. Specifically on TBI but the theories apply.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...=accell+enrich
But in the sticky...
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...e-thing-i.html
Might try the AE map multiplier tables. There are several ways to cover the transition in $8D.
Here is a nice post on the different ways to play with it. Specifically on TBI but the theories apply.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...=accell+enrich
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 12,088
Likes: 125
From: SALEM, NH
Car: '88 Formula
Engine: LC9
Transmission: 4L60E
Axle/Gears: 3.89 9"
A little more not enough? Okie. I'll double it.
This is a brand new motor, so I dont have a baseline tune i'm starting fresh with super-aujp, which I picked since a lot of folks raved about it. --Joe
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 12,088
Likes: 125
From: SALEM, NH
Car: '88 Formula
Engine: LC9
Transmission: 4L60E
Axle/Gears: 3.89 9"
Hate to do this to you..
But in the sticky...
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...e-thing-i.html
Might try the AE map multiplier tables. There are several ways to cover the transition in $8D.
Here is a nice post on the different ways to play with it. Specifically on TBI but the theories apply.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...=accell+enrich
But in the sticky...
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...e-thing-i.html
Might try the AE map multiplier tables. There are several ways to cover the transition in $8D.
Here is a nice post on the different ways to play with it. Specifically on TBI but the theories apply.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...=accell+enrich
I was reading that. I'm not sure if the map table is going to help, because the map change isn't really that great. Maybe 10kpa swing either way, But I'll try it along with the delta tps table. What do you think? I guess if as Funstick says, the delta tps table makes the biggest "global change" i'll try that first.
The AE is a little less comprex on the $58 masks I'm used to. Oh well.
-- Joe
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,180
Likes: 3
From: Browns Town
Car: 86 Monte SS (730,$8D,G3,AP,4K,S_V4)
Engine: 406 Hyd Roller 236/242
Transmission: 700R4 HomeBrew, 2.4K stall
Axle/Gears: 3:73 Posi, 7.5 Soon to break
That's where I think the multipliers will help.
Can make a small change look bigger in the range you want it.
Can make a small change look bigger in the range you want it.
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,692
Likes: 1
From: Corona
Car: 92 Form, 91 Z28, 89 GTA, 86 Z28
Engine: BP383 vortech, BP383, 5.7 TPI, LG4
Transmission: 4L60e, 700R4, 700R4..
Axle/Gears: 3.27, 2.73
Do you have a way to give the MAP signal its own port? Aftermarket regulators are usually not air tight at all and can mess with your tuning a lot. You could test it by disconnecting and plugging the regulator, and reducing the fuel pressure down to whatever runs smoothest, and see what your MAP reads.
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