Im tired of the ol 305 keeping my car down. I've upgraded and polished everything up, except under the hood. It's time for a 350, and I don't want to make this a long drawn out project where i buy all the pieces and put em all together. So I found the 350 HO at 330hp should be a decent engine and give me what Im lookin for. Im having trouble finding a write up of what i will need to do EXACTLY to my car to make sure it all goes well. Id like to buy all the parts at once instead of making a couple trips to the parts store, but I know i'll have to at some point. I wanna make a build sheet, but I know there's things i cant calculate yet. I'm thinking of this engine. I know i'll need a starter, and something compact to fit in with the Hooker 2055s would be nice. I like the mini starter at summit. What other parts am i gonna need? Do i need fuel line? Will i have to relocate the fuel lines? If so, how far and what line is best? I dont want to drop the tank, and im pretty sure a regulator or something similar could be put inline to kick the fuel pressure down. If the pump dies, Ill drop the tank and take care of it then. What sensors should I junk, and what should I reuse? Anything anyone can tell me from personal experience with the engine would be nice, because I dont want to get a wrong part and have to wait to take it back. Thank you for reading this. I cant wait to order the engine and parts ASAP, cause I wanna get it goin!

 

Start here: https://www.thirdgen.org/carbswap

You don't really need a ministarter, as the 2055's are designed around a stock 3rd gen starter.

 

I run a huge starter with 2055's no problems.

SS braided fuel lines are great, however it is perfectly acceptable to use rubber hose for fuel lines in the engine bay. Make sure it is for fuel. I perfer the high psi stuff even though you do not need it because it is a bit tougher to compress.

 

Ok, got all the stuff on the carbswap page. I still need a flywheel. Not sure how many teeth it needs. 153 right? If it's the same as what I have now, I'll keep the same starter. I was looking at smaller starters because it looks like if my starter dies, I'll have to drop the collector on the exhaust to pull the starter. I already put a remote solenoid in place because the heat soak was a pain. For the torque converter lockup switch, i need to know if its a mechanical or electronic sending unit. Anyone have an idea for an 89 Formula Lo3? Anything else I might be forgetting?
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Oh, while I'm at it, should I get a different torque converter? This isn't gonna be raced at all, just my DD that i want to floor between stop lights.

 

Your current flexplate will fit the 330 HO. Both are one-piece rear main seal. It is 153 tooth, for what that's worth.

Dropping the y-pipe to get to the starter isn't that big of a deal. I've done it 4 or so times.

Mini starters and remote solenoids don't always play nice together. Check out my thread on that topic on the FAQ forum.

You'll need to provide a means of locking up the TCC, but I don't understand your question about the sending unit.

I would recommend a higher stall torque converter. 2000 RPMs minimum, 2500 would probably be better.

 

I was comparing automatic lockup switches (dont want a manual lockup) and when i compared the last two I was looking at, the only difference was the "speedometer sender style". One was mechanical, the other was electrical. Would you suggest one of these http://store.summitracing.com/partde...rsview=sku&Ns= http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku or would you suggest another?

 

Ok, this is my build sheet so far. If something should be changed, lemme know.

350 Carbed Crate Motor
Torque Converter
Flywheel
AFPR
Motor Mounts
SS Hose
Throttle Return Spring and Bracket
Fuel Feed Line and Guage
EGR Blockoff Plate

If I'm missing something, also let me know. This is my first engine swap, and I want to get all the parts ahead of time, instead of holding up the project by having to order another piece.

 

You don't need a flywheel. That's for manual transmissions. You need a flexplate, which is included with the HO Deluxe, and if it isn't 153 tooth, you can use the one on your engine now.

You don't need the EGR block-off plate. The intake manifold that comes with the Deluxe doesn't have provision for the EGR valve.

The water pump that comes with it is the standard rotation type. A serpentine system requires a reverse-rotation pump such as on your car now.

I believe you're going to need spark plug wires as well.

The engine is about $150 less here http://www.sdpc2000.com/catalog/120/...-Assembly-.htm . Although Summit would probably match it. Still have to pay freight, either way.

You should have electronic speedometer drive, so the electronic lock-up kit is the one you want.

 

Haha, ok. I thought it was a flexplate, but my dad thought it was a flywheel. Both of us were unsure, so when I looked at the engine, it said flexplate included, flywheel not. I figured I needed one. Anyway... How could I tell if it has the right amount of teeth without actually counting when I get the motor? My current flex took a kamikaze starter a few years back and has a soft spot on a few teeth, so every now and then the starter rubs em the wrong way to make an aweful noise.

The writeup may be wrong, but this is in the summary of the crate engine on summit "Aluminum dual plane with EGR capability". I thought it would have an egr port, so I figured id block it off.

New water pump, check.

I've got some Accell 8.5mm wires on the 305 now I thought I'd reuse (I know, way overkill for a 305 tbi).

TCI Electronic Lockup, check.

I'm gonna peruse the rest of the site for an answer, but I'll ask here anyway in case I can't find it. I've got 2055's with AIR and smog stuff on em. I heard that it would be a very max of 3hp gain if I dumped all the smog stuff. I'm not keeping the egr, but if the smog pump still stays on the system, will it affect it much?

 

I also wanted to reuse all the things on the serpentine belt. I'm gonna reuse the alternator and AC compressor. What else would I need to bolt onto the new engine? Would I need a new bracket or two for the new motor? Trying to think of everything, but it's tough for my first time

 

Looking at paceperformance.com, the pic does show the block-off plate, and their description says, "Intake Manifold-12496820 Dual plane with EGR capability- (extra parts required to connect EGR)...". You can also see it on the Summit picture if you click on the image to enlarge it. So, don't worry about the block-off plate. I didn't think the Deluxe used that particular manifold, and I don't recall anyone talking about it on this Board. The heads don't even have the exhaust cross-over ports the EGR valve uses for the exhaust gas supply. Hence my earlier statement.

The Pace Performance site indicates the flexplate is in fact 153-tooth (Flexplate -part # 14088765- 12 3/4" Automatic), as does the Summit description ("12 3/4 in. flexplate"). The 168-tooth flexplates are 14" diameter.

The A.I.R. equipment affects power to weight - via the weight. Taking the pump out of the system won't change the engine power output enough to even document. You'll need a smog pump delete pulley (or I believe you can get a different length belt and route it differently) if you take the pump out of the system. Otherwise, you don't need any different brackets or anything to mount your serp system to that engine (except the aforementioned reverse rotation water pump).

 

You may have to drop the ypipe on certain applications but you should be good to go with 2055 set ups. Funny you mention this because I just changed a small starter today for a huge one. Twist the starter at an angle and goes through the ypipe no problem at all. Took 10 minutes from start to finish.


Ministarters are great and all, but stock is perfectly okay (especially if you have a lifetime warranty) but unless you have a high compression motor minis are overkill.
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I am with five7kid on the TC 2500 would be great for street.
You plan on using a mechanical pump or your old TBI electric pump.
If you plan on using the Electric pump you will need to get a 3 port fuel pressure regulator.
If you plan on using mechanical you will need to drop the tank remove the pump and add a line in its place. Technically you can pull through the pump but you will eventually get vapor lock.

 

That's the return style reg he plans on using.

 

Coolio. I dont wanna remove the smog pump, cause my 2055's have the air attachment, and it wouldnt look cool just crimping them shut and ripping the tops off. Maybe in the future I'll get some new headers without smog equipment. So how is that intake manifold? Should I opt for something different? How can I tell if a water pump is reverse rotation or not? Is this a reverse rotation pump? Got a new piece for the build sheet...

Torque Converter Lockup Kit

The more I'm reading about the torque converter, the worse it's getting. I'm still looking, but any suggestions for a different torque converter are welcome. Apparently B&M aren't making the best TC's...

Still looking for comparable TC's. Edge has some nice ones apparently, but I haven't seen a price. Not looking for a $1000 TC, just one that will last a couple years.

 

Just curious, what octane do you think this new motor would like? With some timing in it, my guess would be 91, but I'm not too sure.

 

The 2055's are great headers. The A.I.R. tubes don't affect performance. It doesn't make sense to replace the headers just because you decide to remove A.I.R.

If you go with an electric water pump, rotation direction doesn't matter. The Deluxe water pump is "standard" rotation, meaning it pumps water to the engine by rotating in the same direction as the crankshaft because the drive belt goes over the pulley. In a serpentine belt set-up, the belt goes under the pulley, meaning the pump rotates in the opposite direction as the crankshaft to pump water into the engine. If you want to complicate your accessory belt routing, then an electric water pump is certainly a good way to do it.

I've been running an ACC "Boss Hog" torque converter in the TH400 in my '57 for 4 seasons. It's been putting up with 350+ real HP with no complaints. They also make TH700 converters, I've seen them available on Pep Boys website (although I haven't looked for awhile). I'm considering one for the Camaro, but haven't made it a priority yet. They are inexpensive converters, but seem to work well. To do better, you're going to have to spend $600+.

The engine should run well on 87 octane. More timing that would require 91 octane won't make it run any faster.

The intake in the Deluxe kit is basically an Edelbrock Performer. A Performer RPM would probably run a little better, but with the cam that comes in the engine, isn't necessary. Go ahead and run the intake unless/until you upgrade the cam. A better carb like a 650 double pumper is money better spent up front.

 

Well, my headers never got a lovely coating of anything, so I might decide to get that done in the future, and while I'm at it, get rid of the AIR system.

Looking at diagrams of accessory belt routings, couldn't I just forego the path where the belt loops around the water pump? I would just need a different length belt, and everything else would be normal, right?

When i get the new engine, I'm gonna need new gaskets from the headers to the heads. I don't know the port size, shape, or what the best material/brand is.

Is my stock driveshaft ok under the new powerplant?

These the TC's you're talking about? ACC Which one, and how much did you pay for one?

Won't I need a transmission kickdown bracket? Something like This?

 

maybe i missed it but I didn't see a fuel pressure regulator. You'll need one to drop the TBI pressure down to about 5psi or so for the carb. You'll need one that returns the ecess fuel (3 port).

I bought one from Mallory for about $80 from summit when I did my 350 swap.

 

That is the "AFPR" (adjustable fuel pressure regulator) he linked.

 

You can use the same driveshaft, If you have the extra cash changing the Ujoints would be a good idea.

You can buy a decent torque converter $125-$150 shipped on ebay. I bought one with 2400-2600 stall and it was a great investment. I even had a burr in the TC and he was ready to ship me another one. Let me know if you want this guys info.

I chopped the air system off my headers. They work and look fine.

As for the header gaskets. Hooker sends you a set of nice gaskets with the headers. They also give you bolts. However, if you do not want to use it, I would recommend dead soft copper. When copper heats up the metal expands and fills in the small imperfections. This is why they are used for high performance head gaskets.

They have aluminum ones and misc ones, but those never mated well with my 2055's. The hooker ones they sent me worked great, until I tried to reuse them then they sucked.

 

Still looking for a good TC...

I still need to find out the port width and height for the new header gaskets

Could I reuse the kickdown cable and TV cable bracket for the tranny on the new engine? Has anyone done this before?

 

not sure on the bracket I think so. TV cable yes. Just use the gaskets that come with the headers, they are great quality. If you don't then you are wasting your money. TV cable is a TV cable, I never found one that fit out of the box without adjusting it. No matter what you will have to adjust the cable anyways, but it will work fine.

 

I've had the gaskets on the headers for a year, and I don't think they'll be suitable to reuse on the new engine. Gaskets are a one-time only use thing to me, and mostly then never come off in one piece. If they do come off in one piece, they haven't bonded and done their job.

 

I myself have allways used Mr. Gasket copper gaskets, i think they sell a 1.68 diameter, I also discovered Percys in summit and jegs sells gaskets made from carbon fiber for 18.00$ or so, i am wanting to buy these next, my copper gaskets were 35.00$ or so. I have never had a problem with these.

 

it depends if ur going with roller rockers or not..because if u do you have to get taller valve covers...i hope that ur going to use the surpenten set up and if u do so u have to get an after market alt...because the one thats on the car wont fit with the taller valve covers...im going through the same thing..i pretty much know all u need to do and buy before the attemted...call me if you want the whole deal because i know it going throught it now lol..727-418-9798 this is my cell please feel free to call..and if not good luck to u my friend...

 

I'm trying to get a decent TC, and ACC seems to be an inexpensive solution that has some dependability. I'm trying to find where to order it. On their website, I fill out an order form that's just a description of my car and what I want. Then it goes back to the website. Do they custom build each one? I know it says they hand build each TC, but are they gonna contact me now? I can't find anything on Pep Boy's website. I'll have to call them and see if they have them in stock.

I tracked down the heads on the crate motor. I've narrowed the exhaust manifold header gaskets down to 2. Still can't find what the port height is.
These are the 2 gaskets 1 2
These are the heads

 

UPS freight called today. Apparently, the extra 10 bucks for "residential" shipping doesn't mean squat. The engine is "strapped down to a pallet", and I have to use my own engine hoist to get it off the truck. Does this sound right? I figured it would be in a box to protect it, but it's "strapped down to a pallet"... Anyway, any tips on installing an engine? This will be my first, so I'm trying to find all the advice I can get. I saw that when putting a torque converter in, put some tranny fluid in it. That right? Anything that would help me would be appreciated.

 

Love to hear how everthing turned out and if you could post the details. I'm doing all the same research you did. I've got a '92 camaro with a 305 TBI and I'll looing to put a 350 crate in. I'm coming up with the all the same questions and concerns.
Thanks,
Jerry

 

To repost to my previous postings...

Got an Edge TC, and it was custom built for me cheap, and got to my house very quickly. There is a seal for the torque converter. It sits in the transmission and the torque converter slides into it. My buddy says if you don't replace it while the TC is off, you're asking for a pain in the *** leak when you get it going. It only costs 7 dollars, but is only available from select GM dealers. I had one tell me it didn't exist, so bring it with you.

Finally got it in, and ready to go. The carb is for shxx though. Vacuum secondaries aren't opening up and I'm not a Holley type of guy. Got new spark plug wires and Edelbrock performer carb (750 cfm).

Got an underdrive pulley set to get some more power outta the beast.

I put the TC in dry and filled the car up with fluids. The tranny has to suck up the fluid as it's running.

Couldn't get the tranny dipstick to match up perfectly, so I got a Lokar dipstick to mount up to the firewall. Same problem with the oil dipstick and my Hooker Headers.

Make sure the spark plug wires are connected to the correct plugs. Don't know if I switched em somehow, but 2 were on the wrong plug and the catalytic converter was glowing from the dumped fuel. Took a while to figure out since I've never heard a carbed 350 growl.

Don't expect the tranny to hold out too long with the added power and no upgrades to it.

I'm getting gears next, since people say that the upgrade from 2.73 to 3.43/3.73 would be the same as the the 305 to 350 upgrade.

Getting the hood on and taking it out on the road for the first time tomorrow. Been making sure everything was happy before I wanted to burn my first set of tires. I remember everything from the swap, and I'm still going through troubles, so if you have any questions, holla.