86FIREBIRDSBC

i wanted to build a nice freshened 383 for my 86 firebird but am on a tight budget. i just aquired a 305 tpi out of an 88 camaro Z28. is it possible to convert a 305 to a 383? if so what would i need? have to do? is it the same for a 350? Also is it hard to put a fuel injected motor into a carburated car?

82Five-O

First off, you cant make a 383 out of a 305, it has to be a 350. If you attempt to you will end up with a 337 or so....
To install the tpi you need the wiring harness and ecu with it.

KrisW

iTrader: (5)

Herein lies the problem. Fresh 383 and budget don't really go together. What exactly is your budget?

I am always on a shoestring budget, and I build big engines, but it takes a LONG, LONG time to do it!

Here's what you do:
-Sell the 305 you "acquired" and acquire either a 350 or 400 2 bolt main small block. Get a used one that was running okay. At this point it doesn't matter what year the engine is.
-Strip your engine and keep the block and the crank, get rid of the rest. If you can sell the stuff on eBay or a yard sale, great. If it's choice parts like cast iron intake manifolds, 70's smogger heads, and the like, then scrap them if they don't sell... put that money back in your budget build jar...
-Buy a used 383 crank for a 350 or keep your 400 crank (if you got a 400) and set it aside. You will have to pay money to the machine shop later, no getting around it...
-Junkyard or used PM rods from an LT1 or vortec small block, set aside with crank
-Have block cleaned and checked at machine shop, and then based on what they say, buy new flat top pistons with 4 valve reliefs in the smallest overbore size you can get away with..
-You could save serious bucks now by buying a complete kit from PAW or someone like that (northern auto is also good) and getting your oil pump, timing set, gaskets and such all together.

Now you have your short block. Next is heads, cam, and intake. You have to pick based on what power you want. If you want an LT4 hot cam, you need good flowing heads to match, If you want a performer "go to the grocery store and back" cam, then some stockers that are cleaned up will be fine. You can get cam/heads/intake all at different times as you are acquiring the other parts (used, of course) either at the junkyard or on eBay. Do lots of research to find out what works great together. You can get every part used and be really happy with all of it. I especially like used roller cams. With the money you save buying a used LT4 hot cam, you can afford to buy the retrofit roller lifters to make it work in an older block.

Last, splurge and buy some real headers. High power engines, I like 1 3/4" SLP headers (used) and low power get some good 1 5/8" units.

Good luck!

86FIREBIRDSBC

thanks for all the info KrisW. i'm only 15 and this is my first motor rebuild. My budget is pretty mush as small as it gets. i have the 305 i aquired and the 305 out of the car. i dont know much about what you can stroke motors to, everything else i do pretty good. is the wiring harness a hard thing to do?

KrisW

iTrader: (5)

Nothing, and I mean ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, is difficult on these cars. A lot of it is extremely time consuming, though. That's the reason I love these cars. They're cheap to get, mechanic friendly, and I always have more time to work on them than I have money!

If you're 15, you don't need to even think about swapping the wiring yet. Is yours burned up? Probably not. Worry about swapping to TPI later, just put all of your TPI parts in a box and keep them for later. First, learn what you are working with.

Does your car run? What do you have to work with so far?
----------
If you have 25 dollars plus shipping, buy this cam...

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/engi...-cam-25-a.html

It's a stock LT1 cam that you can run in your engine now. If you want to learn how to work on these cars, you need to learn how to tune.

You need a laptop, and then you need to go to the DIY PROM section and read a lot. You will need to buy the software and hardware for burning chips. You can get some of the stuff from eBay used. Then you need to put that LT1 cam in your 305 and tune it with your laptop. After you do that, you'll be ready to step up to a 350 and tune all over again. Then swap to TPI and tune all over again, you see where it's going?

If you have more time than money, and I know you do, then you need to do EVERYTHING FOR YOURSELF. It costs too much money to have others do it for you if you are young and on a budget.

It helps build confidence in what your abilities are, as well.

86FIREBIRDSBC

yeah, my car runs alright. the guy sold it to my dad after letting it sit for 2-3 years. when i got it all that was wrong with it was the battery was dead and the carb was gelled up. it has odd ball 14" wheels (if you know anybody that wants them). and an electric fan on the 305. i am putting a 3" exhaust on it.(dynomax). my dad works at a junkyard so i could probably get a stock Lt1 cam for free. they just dont want to loose money giving me a 350 or higher. so i got the 305 for free.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

It could be argued that you got ripped off.... Speaking strictly for myself, I would not accept one for free. If someone insisted on giving it to me, me being the jerk and a-hole that I am, I would probably shoot them for littering on my property. I've paid people to come and haul them off before, meaning, they have a NEGATIVE value to me. But that's just me. Other people may find them even more worthless than that.

It's actually very very easy to turn a 305 into a 383, just not "on a tight budget". It's done in 2 easy steps.

1. Throw 305 in trash
2. Buy 383
Done!!

In short, expect it to take about $2500 ABSOLUTE BARE MINIMUM, and about $1000 more to change to FI. Don't turn a bolt until you have that money IN YOUR HAND.

Since you're 15, I'd suggest a couple of things: doing lots of research, and making up your mind EXACTLY what you want to do, BEFORE starting to do it; acquiring whatever parts, supplies, tools, materials, etc. you will need, BEFORE plowing directly in; waiting until AFTER you've paid for college and for other such things that will determine the course of the rest of your life (unlike a car, which is just .... a car, and won't do a thing to improve the quality of your life for the next 60 or 70 years), and not putting yourself in the poorhouse over a car that some goob will just slam into at a traffic light or something; and saving up some money before you disable your car by taking it apart.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

86FIREBIRDSBC

sofakingdom, thank you for the advice. the only reason that i would have switched to EFI was for the stock 305. when it comes to the 383. i think thats enough power for a first car. so i would probably do carburated. the only reason i took the 305 is that my dad wont find me a 383 let alone a 350. he is afraid of me street racing! (damn street racers) i would never do something like that. i love my car. its beautiful. so i have to build my own 383.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

Well, take it slow; do it right - DON'T try to cut corners, "save money", "use what you already have because it's paid for", etc., because all of those things just end up costing more in the long (and sometimes the not-so-long) run.

Meanwhile, enjoy your 305, and be glad it's not a 6-cyl. Don't get all wrapped around the axle about a 383 just yet, until you've had a taste of owning and operating a car.

I know a 17-yr-old who just got their first job, for which they needed a car. They worked a budget all out with their dad; dad would pay for the car, and the child would pay him back, as a 36-month loan at the going market rate, for the car plus the work it needed at the time to render it road-worthy and dependable for a young child. So he went out and bought the child a car, I guess it was about mid-July. Cost maybe $3800-4000 by the time it was all done. The note would be $180ish per month, plus the child's mother agreed to put them on the house insurance policy, which would cost just slightly over $100/mo.

Fast-forward to now.... the child has actually been working MORE hours than anticipated, so has actually had more income than projected. However, since July, the child has made exactly ONE payment of ½ month's car note ($90ish), and exactly ZERO insurance payments. Furthermore, most of time when the car has needed maintenance, the child has been unable to pay for it, and mom or dad has had to bail them out. Personally I think dad should get his head examined, and mom should slap him around a little bit extra; but that's a whole different matter....

That's the reality of a minor child using a car. Note that I say "using", because they can't "own" one until they're 18. Just like you don't "own" yours. The law doesn't allow it.

Moral of the story is, calm down and wait to see what the situation brings you, before making any big plans.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

The '88 engine is a slight upgrade as it has roller lifters from the factory. The LT1 cam will fit it, but it won't fit the '86 engine.

The factory '86 carb system is pretty good for street and performance. Certainly a lot less hassle getting it running better than it would be to convert to the TPI system, which won't produce any more power (unless you spend a lot of money).

Unless there is something fundamentally wrong with the '86 engine (needs new rings or bearings, for instance), there isn't much to be gained by switching between the two 305's. If you're doing exhaust, all the '86 engine really needs to run better is a cam. Of course, if you keep the stock manifolds on the '86 engine, doing a 3" exhaust isn't going to help much. The '88 exhaust is much better, just putting the stock exhaust from it on the '86 would be a nice improvement (especially if you can get it from dear ol' dad at no cost).

86FIREBIRDSBC

sofakingdom: dont worry, i wont cut corners. and yes, i dont own the car, my dad does.five7kid: good point, i want to do the headers that are emissions approved.

86FIREBIRDSBC

anyone know of someone with a 350 they want to get rid of? i dont care if its blown up, i can get parts, i need the block.

sofakingdom

iTrader: (1)

Your local junkyard.

350s are EVERYWHERE. They come in Chevy trucks. Any idea how many of those there are on the road? Get one out of a 87-up truck, it'll already have the roller provisions cast in, then all you need is to locate the roller guts on ebay or wherever.

Talk to your local machine shop. They probably have a shelf full of them all worked up and ready to go, just waiting for someone to come along and want one.

mxcrazed

the heads on the 88 tpi arn't that bad they should be 081 castings with 58 cc combustion chambers. you should buy a 1987 up 350 from the junk yard for whatever money they will sell it to you for. then you should get a used cam from an lt1 and use the roller lifters and spider to bolt them in place from the 305 tpi. then get an intake manifold and you will have a roller 350 with 081 heads an lt1 cam headers intake and you will always be able to stroke it out to a 383 and it will be plenty fast and cheap. that tpi doesn't flow enough air for the 383 so you could sell it for $300 or more and use that money to buy some parts that is exactly what i did and you can even use this web site to sell it. the 305 short blocks may even fetch you a few dollars from the right people. good luck kid feel free to message me if you want some more help.

86FIREBIRDSBC

today i started my car around 10:00 and it started fine. at about 12 i tried to start it and it wouldn't catch. i figured it was flooded so i let it sit an hour or two and tried again. still wouldn't start. i put a spark plug in and it caught but wouldn't idle. i put two in and it started, very rough. i had to stay on the throttle just to keep it running. after about 2 minutes of full throttle it would idle. roughly. i gave it about 10 minutes and it was idling smoothly. i shut it off and tried to start it again. wouldn't catch again. what could be wrong. like i said before, it started fine erlier?

mxcrazed

what do you mean cars need spark plugs to run

Apeiron

Must be what's wrong with my diesel.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Perhaps you meant you replaced a spark plug. Saying you put one in implies there wasn't one in there already.

86FIREBIRDSBC

there were already 8 in there but seeing how the previous owner took care of the car, they're probably from 1986! is it possible to put all 8 plugs in without removing anything, it was hard doing the first two on the driver side. do i go from underneeth?

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

It's possible to get them all from the top, but that doesn't mean it's easy. Going from the bottom is a little easier for a couple of them.

mxcrazed

it is frowned upon but you can use a swivel to get them loose but you will probably break the plug. and i apologize for poking fun at you couldn't resist. .make sure that you screw them in with your fingers until they are seated then tighten them with a spark plug socket if you strip one it will be your worst nightmare! also make sure that they are all gaped correctly they don't come with the correct gap out of the box. do them one at a time so that you do not mess up the firing order.