So I can get a 5.3L Vortec motor out a 2000 Z71 for pretty cheap, I know I'll need new front accessories (either off a LS motor or brand new), LSx series intake manifold and TB, plus fuel rails, and new gauges except the speedo. But will I need new motor mounts? Will a T56 bolt up to the 5.3L? Will a 700r4? I'm thinking they should but i'm not positive. I want headers to the motor, but truck headers wouldn't work, any ideas on that?

Any help is appreciated. Thanks.

 

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/engi...third-gen.html
You can keep the truck TB, it'll be fine for now, and bolts right up to the LS1 and LS6 intakes. Hawk's has the mounts and headers. The T56 would actually be hess headaches than the 700R-4, but a 4L60E would be even easier if that's what the donor pickup had.

 

All of your stock gauges will work except the speedo if you go the T56 or 4L60E route, I wouldn't fight with putting a 700R4 behind an LSx series motor.

 

Hey guys thanks, I can get the 4l60e from the donor truck, and I can get a new speedo no problem. So the truck TB will bolt up to the LS1/6 intake? Will my driveshaft hook up to the 4l60e? Do the coolant hoses attach at the same place off the 5.3? Any information on the swap is appreciated. Thanks! =)

 

The truck trans wont have the torque arm mounts in the tailhousing. Either swap one in from a 4th gen or fabricate a crossmember mount

The casting for the truck TB is the same for cars. A PCV port will need to be rotated slightly to clear the cable linkage though, nothing to worry about

Your stock DS will fit properly

Rad hoses are different. For the stock 3rd gen radiator use a 93-95 3.4L V6 upper hose and a Ford F250 7.5L lower hose. Some have problems with the lower hose and use a chevy 1500 lower. The chevy hose rubs the idler arm pretty bad so itll need to be insulated

Hopefully this will get moved to the LSx section soon

 

Pocket missed that one! Any GM pickup with the z71 option is 4WD, so that particular 4L60E won't work. You must get a 4L60e from a RWD vehicle. It can come from a pickup, but you just need an F-car tailshaft housing. Not a big problem, there are so many out there.

 

Will the accessories from any LSx series motor work? (besides the truck motors obviously)

Also I have no A/C for my Camaro, can I just delete that easily from the accessories when installing the motor?

How about the transmission lines, I've custom built my own before, but will the truck lines work by any miracle? If not advise on what to get or just make them myself?

Is the K-member for a 4l60e in the same place as the 700r4 or will I need to drill and tap some new holes to remount?

Any advise for headers that will fit the 5.3L but also work in the third gen?

Thanks for all the help guys!

 

as I typed before, Hawk's has the headers you need.

 

Whoops, my apologies, missed that some how, thanks on the headers tip.

So I looked on hawks and didn't see anything that specified vortech headers? Do ls1 headers work or something?

 

Fbody LS1 accessories fit 3rd gens the best, cadillac and GTO accessories are comparable, corvette parts clear some swaps, and are very tight on others

Most do not interchange between sets

AC compressor is the easiest to delete because it runs on its own belt. Just remove the belt and compressor, the rest of the accessories are not affected

Your 700R4 trans lines will fit with a few bends, the truck lines may work, but dont count on it

4L60E crossmember is different because the trans mount is several inches rearward. Buy or build a replacement

Hawks/SSW is the only off the shelf set you can use. Cheaper options are to get a set of 3rd gen LTs, swap the SBC flange for LSx and modify the #1,2,5,6 primaries

Vortec is the class of GM LSx truck engines. Externally they are identical to car LSx. The main difference is the block is iron for trucks and alum for cars

 

I wish that were true. They also called the 5.0 and 5.7 Gen I SBC '96-'99 truck engines "Vortec". Sure confuses things.

But, a 5.3 Vortec is for sure of the LSx family.

Did anyone mention the need to change to an f-body oil pan & pick-up?

(Oh, moved this to the LTX and LSX Engine Swap sub-forum.)

 

One FYI... I noticed you said that you don't plan to run A/C in the Camaro. If that's the case, you can save a bunch of money and buy some of the generic LS motor mount swap plates that bolt to the LS block and utilize your stock SBC motor mounts. This is a much cheaper solution than Hawks/Spohn mounts which cost $80 for the mounts and another $50-100 for a set of 4th gen clamshell mounts (and another $50 if you want poly bushings). The Hawks/Spohn style is only necessary if you plan to run A/C because the SBC mounts occupy the same space as the back of the compressor.

 

deleting the A/C from an LS1 is easy, as it has it's own separate belt.
If you delete it, the cheapest trustworthy versions of the mount adapters are found at www.jegs.com, use the Jegs search for 969-4572.
These are 1/4"-thick steel, which creates less hassles than 3/8"-thick aluminum versions. If you want the lightness, just drill a 1" hole in the exact center.

 

Hey everyone thanks for the great information!

I went to Hawks and I couldn't tell which headers would fit the 5.3L, is it the same ones specified for the LS1 headers?

Thanks five7kid, I knew about the fbody oil pan needed, technically the truck original will fit, but dangerously low, so everyone recommended the fbody pan, thanks though!

Great tip Jim! Will definitely save money, this is sort of a budget build as it is, just want to do it right the first time.

Will the third gen torque arm fit the 4l60e transmission?

Is the 5.3L cable driven throttle body? I'm 90% sure it is but its been a while since I looked at one. Does the 4l60e have a kick down cable?

Sorry if some of the questions seem uneducated, I just want to cover absolutely everything before I start ordering parts..

Thanks for all the help!

 

Yes, LS headers will fit and Yes, the '00 5.3 uses a cable Throttle body.



the 4L60E is all electronic, no kickdown cable is used.

 

Unfortunately, "headers" and "budget" can't go together on a thirdgen swap. Hawks headers are the only option, and they're spendy. Stock exhaust manifolds are the only affordable exhaust option on this swap. Depending on your horsepower needs, the exhaust manifolds may be just fine.

 

http://www.jegs.com/i/Trans+Dapt/969/4572/10002/-1

I've posted before about how easy it is to get an LS1 to 400 RWHP using stock exhaust manifolds, so they're certainly fine for a 5.3L If you want the exact LS1 recipe, I can re-post that.

 

Thanks Purple, appreciate the info.

I'm willing to pay the extra for the headers Jim, I have the money I just want to spend the least amount possible to get this set up in good/reliable running condition ya know? Headers would eventually go on either way, and I'd rather build one custom exhaust for the headers, then two for both the manifolds, then the headers later down the road.

I want to gather ALL the parts necessary for the swap before actually starting on it, is there anything I'm missing? Even little things that don't usually cross peoples minds till they've started in on it? Will the truck injectors work with the LS style intake manifold (LS1/LS6)? Anything will help! Thanks again for all the help

 

Appreciate the link Atilla. I'm planning on just full bolt-ons for now. Trying to have a fair amount of power to play with but still retain semi good gas mileage and reliability. The truck got 16mpg on the highway, I'm not sure what I would get with the less weight though. Planning on throwing 3.73 posi in as well.

Thanks =)

 

Aighty then :-)
You can use the truck injectors for now, no problem.
If you don't goof anything up, you should be able to get 22+ mpg at a sustained 65 mph after installing 3.73:1 gears with a 4L60E. How do I know? Because I did it with a carbureted 350 and a 700R-4. You have the double advantages of precise injection and less cubic inches. You might see 24 if you're a smooth driver and the interstate is flat.
The truck isn't a good reference, not just because of the weight, but because it was under-geared for it's weight and drag, and because it has way more aero drag than our cars.

 

True indeed. Sounds really good to me =) I'm hitting maybe 15-16mpg on my carb'd set up due to running rich . Thanks for the help man, I really appreciate it

 

Fuse/relay box, electric radiator fans (I've never heard of anyone using an engine-driven fan with f-body accessories), throttle cable.

You'll either need a temp sender w/adapter to put in the passenger side head, or an adapter cable to use the stock sender.

I assume you're getting the engine, harness, and PCM from the truck.

 

Hmmm, I think I can get the Fuse/relay box from the donor truck, if that'll work? Have e-fan, and I'll have to buy a throttle cable, he's keeping the one in the truck for his 408. I'll look into adapter cables, any advise on where to get them?

Yes, I'm getting the engine, harness, and PCM (tuned already for headers etc) from the truck.

Thanks =)

 

Should.

Hawks:
http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/co...onversion.aspx

Guess it's more than an adapter. Thought I saw something that plugged into the factory CTS, but I'm not coming up with it right now.

 

Here's my running tally of things I expect to need. My list is far from complete, and obviously a LOT of this doesn't apply to your build, but it should at least provide some insight.

The best thing I can suggest is that you build a similar spreadsheet, and have it open as you're reading the forums. Put anything you learn into that spreadsheet. I've got a tab for "parts" which has the stuff below, along with estimated cost, part number, location, quantity, dependancies (what other parts effect this part choice?) and a couple notes columns. I've also got another tab for parts purchased so I can keep track of what I've bought and from whom, a tab for parts I intend to sell, another tab for machine shop info, another tab for the GM parts I need, and a "notes" tab which is a dumping ground for any good tech info I come across. This may sound a bit ****, but my list is over 125 lines long... that's a lot of crap to keep track of without a spreadsheet!


shortblock
LQ9 used
Crank
Rods
pistons
piston rings
4th gen oil pan
4th gen windage tray
4th gen oil pickup
Oil Pump Pickup Tube Girdle
Cam
Lifter set
Timing Chain
Oil Pump

heads
LS3 heads
Intake Rockers
Rocker Stands
Rocker Trunion upgrade
Pushrods
Valve Springs
ls3 front steam crossover
rear steam crossover?

Intake
LS3
Fuel Rail set
Injector set
throttle body
Throttle Body Gasket
throttle position sensor
Idle Air Control
MAF upgrade
Valley Cover
manifold bolts
Air Intake Plumbing
MAP Sensor
Throttle Cable

Fuel
corvette fpr/fuel filter
line set
Fuel Pump

Exhaust
headers
Oxygen Sensors

misc installation
Motor Mount brackets
poly motor mount bushings
4th gen clamshell motor mounts
power steering pump - 4th gen
PWR steering - 4th gen feed line
4th gen water pump
4th gen accessory mounting brackets
4th gen pullies
4th gen idlers & tensioners
4th gen Harmonic Balancer

Oil pressure sending unit
oil cooler blockoff plate
catch can
Alternator
Alternator bracket
upper radiator hose
lower radiator hose
Inline Radiator Hose Drain
Dipstick
Throttle Cable
throttle Cable Bracket

ECM
f-body harness
f-body ecm
ecm tuning
OBD2 Port Plastic Connector, 16 Pin
Terminals - for OBD2 Port
Terminal Lock

Gaskets & Hardware
Main Bearings
Rod bearings
Cam Bearings
Timing Cover seal
Rear Cover seal
Valley Cover seal
Lifter Guides
Oil Dumbell
Oil Galley Plug
Oil Pan gasket
Head Dowel Pin
Head Gasket set
Copper-Coat® Aerosol
exhaust manifold gaskets
valve cover gaskets
Rod Bolts
Flywheel bolts
Head Bolts
Main Studs - outer
Main Studs - Inner
Crank Bolt

Nitrous
nitrous wet kit
throttle body plate
Ash Tray switch panel

Appearance
Valve Covers

Transmission
tremec magnum T56
flywheel
sfi bellhousing
clutch
Master Cylinder
hydraulic hose
pedals
slave cylinder
crossmember
Driveshaft

suspension
torque arm
panhard relocation kit

Rear
Moser 9"
Drive Shaft

Exhaust
Mufflex 4"
Flowmaster y-pipe collector

Tools
rod bolt stretch gauge
Adjustable Pushrod Checker
Checker Valve Springs
Thread Chasing Tap Set
Crank Pulley Puller

 

Hmm... I just noticed I've got 2 separate "exhaust" sections. Gotta go fix that in my spreadsheet.

 

Rename them to headers and rear exhaust

Thats a pricey build list but should be a monster in the end

 

Nice build sheet I see I need to research a lot more into the little parts. Now I'm trying to decide if I should just go the complete LS1 route seeing as I have to do everything the same for the swap lol

Okay, completely theoretical, Say I have all the parts necessary for a LS1 swap into my '84, I have a garage, engine hoist, and all the tools necessary to do the job. How quick do you think it could get done with 2 people working on it (starting early in the morning, stopping for occasional food breaks etc, late into the night)?

Thanks for all the help guys, its really appreciated! =)

 

That build list, so far, is sitting right at an estimate approaching $18k, and I've got a lot of prices yet to fill out.

Hopefully I'll be able to trim a lot of that by buying discounted or used parts. A big expense that I hadn't anticipated when I started this project was the rotating assembly. I planned on using the stock 6.0 (which is why I sought out an LQ9 in the first place) but when I found out what the miles were on it, out came the credit card for the stroker rotating assembly.

I have 2 tabs on the spreadsheet... one with all the parts I expect to need along with anticipated costs, and another sheet with parts purchased with actual prices paid. It should give me some insight at the end as to how much I was able to save by grabbing used/discounted stuff whenever possible. I'm hoping that my final tally is under $15k, but only time will tell. I think the only way I'll achieve that is if I go with a used T56 instead of a new one. I'm also planning to become a Moser dealer, so my discounted price on the rear end will help a little bit.

 

I'm not starting with a 5.3l, but I sure hope my LS1/4L60E is less expensive than that.

LS1/4L60E drop-out and pick-up - $2400 (have)
LS6 intake/injectors/fuel rails/TB - $475 (have)
Engine/transmission mounts - $150 (will get adapter plates for the engine, Hawks tranny x-member)
Kwik/Sanden AC conversion - $400 (have)
Gaskets (installing 317 heads from the LQ4 for the '57, porting oil pump) - $150
Converter/shift kit - $450 (have converter, need shift kit)
Exhaust (shorty headers, estimate for custom y-pipe) - $900
Air intake parts (elbows, pipes, clamps, filter) - $200
Cable speedo drive box - $250
Misc (hoses, throttle cable, electrical connectors, etc.) - $325
Get AC hooked up and operating - $500
Total - $6200

Still trying to decide whether to get an aftermarket torque arm. If funds allow, I might. I bartered old parts to have the 317's shaved and rebuilt. Will have to see how much I can get out of my ZZ4 clone and TH700 to offset the expenses. Already have 4th gen radiator dual fan, need to figure out how to mount it to a 3rd gen radiator. That also doesn't include PCM re-tune.

 

Daang, circa $900 just to have an A/C, worth it though I suppose. I'd say 6200 definitely isn't too shabby

 

I'm guessing that, since custom hoses will have to be fabricated.

It could be done for less. There are some "upgrades" in there.

 

Sorry for butchering the quote, but I'm new to this online thing and only wanted to ask about a few points made.
for $15,000.00, why not just buy an LS1 fourth gen?
Miles alone shouldn't necessitate a $2,000.00+ bottom end. Was there damage?
Summit sells new skirt-coated hypereutectic LQ9 pistons in a 30 oversize for $29.69 each. Those with good used 5.3 crank and rods, plus rebalancing, would save at least $1,000.00 in the bottom end.

 

The finished product of Jim's build would put any stock LS1 4th gen to shame. I'm not sure of the exact size of the motor he's building, but seeing as its an LQ9 block, and he's building the bottom end himself, that the motor will most likely be bored/stroked and all forged internals with a strong compression ratio(not sure what your thinking Jim? 408ci?). Completely redone valve train makes me think he has a mean camshaft in mind. Besides a well built forged N/A motor, he's throwing a shot of nitrous in there and has a magnum T56 to run the power through. Judging by the supposedly bullet proof Moser 9" rear end he plans on pushing a good deal of power, and wants to make sure nothing breaks I'd be willing to bet we have a 10 second car on our hands here. Built right. Who needs a 13 second 4th gen when you have a 10 second 3rd gen?

Oops, I see that you are indeed going to stroke it Jim at least I guessed right.

 

theres no possible way in using the truck pan right it sits to low an possibly doesn't even clear onto a stock k member right?

 

Oh, it definitely does clear the stock K-member, I did it. But it hangs way too low.

 

the ones that come on your 5-3 are cast Steel all you need to do is cut your collectors off of them and weld your own turn downs that's what I did anyway the Gen 4 headers won't work they will wind up on your wall

 

Mr. 1 post,

Welcome to the site, but if you want to be a help then spend time helping people that need help now. This thread is from 13 years ago and they've all moved along and don't give a hoot any more.

 

I'm still around haha, but wow is this thread old. Blast from the past.