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LTX and LSXPutting LT1s, LS1s, and their variants into Third Gens is becoming more popular. This board is for those who are doing and have done the swaps so they can discuss all of their technical aspects including repairs, swap info, and performance upgrades.
HA! "Too much clearance" between the oil pan and crossmember! Most guys wish for that.
I haven't checked on here for awhile, and I didn't realize you tagged me about the motor mounts.
I used UMI adjustable mounts with factory LS1 motormounts/ clamshells/ whatever you want to call them.
With that setup, I could have cleared the factory crossmember with the UMI mounts pushed all the way back, but I had already notched my K-Member; I figure I'm going to be that one unlucky guy who doesn't realize it doesn't fit until the end.
For what it's worth, I'm running the engine pushed all the way back for driveshaft yoke engagement.
Let me know if you have any other questions about how I mounted everything; I'm done with that part of the swap.
I really need to get back to work on this thing...
HA! "Too much clearance" between the oil pan and crossmember! Most guys wish for that.
I haven't checked on here for awhile, and I didn't realize you tagged me about the motor mounts.
I used UMI adjustable mounts with factory LS1 motormounts/ clamshells/ whatever you want to call them.
With that setup, I could have cleared the factory crossmember with the UMI mounts pushed all the way back, but I had already notched my K-Member; I figure I'm going to be that one unlucky guy who doesn't realize it doesn't fit until the end.
For what it's worth, I'm running the engine pushed all the way back for driveshaft yoke engagement.
Let me know if you have any other questions about how I mounted everything; I'm done with that part of the swap.
I really need to get back to work on this thing...
Yea that's fine. It all worked out in the end. I just didnt want any problems because I read somewhere it should be kinda close to k member if you didn't want to modify your driveshaft..
I forgot to run the transmission lines so that will be fun.. I think I will run braided lines for fuel & transmission lines..
I believe the fuel lines are 3/8 & 5/16 correct?
What size are the transmission fittings on 4l60e?
what radiator fan setup are you guys running?
Last edited by 86iroc504; Jan 5, 2020 at 10:53 PM.
Yes, fuel lines are 3/8" pressure, and 5/16" return (which is the opposite of what it should be, at least if you've ever had any training with hydraulic systems. But it worked for GM.)
The fittings that actually screw into the 4L60E are 1/4" NPT (national pipe thread), and from there, you can choose your line size/ diameter.
The factory Firebird lines on my swap were 5/16", but the transmission lines out of the Tahoe donor vehicle were 3/8". I'm going to be using 5/16" lines for my swap; I'll be using a big trans cooler.
For your purposes, though, I would not recommend wiring it the same way as I did in that installation. Either use the PCM to control everything, or use a thermostatic switch.
Yes, fuel lines are 3/8" pressure, and 5/16" return (which is the opposite of what it should be, at least if you've ever had any training with hydraulic systems. But it worked for GM.)
The fittings that actually screw into the 4L60E are 1/4" NPT (national pipe thread), and from there, you can choose your line size/ diameter.
The factory Firebird lines on my swap were 5/16", but the transmission lines out of the Tahoe donor vehicle were 3/8". I'm going to be using 5/16" lines for my swap; I'll be using a big trans cooler.
For your purposes, though, I would not recommend wiring it the same way as I did in that installation. Either use the PCM to control everything, or use a thermostatic switch.
Cool deal. I forgot to ask about what you did for the radiator itself. Would a ls1 radiator work? Obviously the truck radiator and Denali fan set up I bought will not work in 86 Camaro
I forgot to put my lines in until after I had the engine and trans installed too. I used factory 3rd gen lines. All you need to do is pull the “adapters” out of the 700r and install them into the 4l60.
I used a 3rd gen radiator, mostly just because I scored a brand new one on Craigslist for like 40-50 bucks. That’s a good thing though because the third gen trans lines fit right into the radiator, I’m not sure if that works with a 4th gen radiator without modifying.
I forgot to put my lines in until after I had the engine and trans installed too. I used factory 3rd gen lines. All you need to do is pull the “adapters” out of the 700r and install them into the 4l60.
I used a 3rd gen radiator, mostly just because I scored a brand new one on Craigslist for like 40-50 bucks. That’s a good thing though because the third gen trans lines fit right into the radiator, I’m not sure if that works with a 4th gen radiator without modifying.
Yea I see. I am starting from scratch though.. The only transmission I have is the ls 4l60e. I will probably have to fabricate something, and buy another radiator
I forgot to put my lines in until after I had the engine and trans installed too. I used factory 3rd gen lines. All you need to do is pull the “adapters” out of the 700r and install them into the 4l60.
I used a 3rd gen radiator, mostly just because I scored a brand new one on Craigslist for like 40-50 bucks. That’s a good thing though because the third gen trans lines fit right into the radiator, I’m not sure if that works with a 4th gen radiator without modifying.
Yea, that is a good deal. I forgot I also have some electric fans that came out a Malibu or something though. If I didnt already have them I would get that setup.
I will save the Denali fans for when I do my c10 ls swap
I have to find some conversion fittings to screw into the 4l60e if I use those third gen trans linez
Yea it looks like the Dorman and AC Delco ones are what I'm looking for.. Thanks. I'm about to order everything right about now
from someone who orders a lot from rockauto, make sure everything ships from the same location or shipping can kill you if it’s a big order. I usually put the part numbers in eBay and/or summitracing to compare because they usually have free shipping
from someone who orders a lot from rockauto, make sure everything ships from the same location or shipping can kill you if it’s a big order. I usually put the part numbers in eBay and/or summitracing to compare because they usually have free shipping
Yea, I've learned this before.. They should do something about that
Cool deal. I forgot to ask about what you did for the radiator itself. Would a ls1 radiator work? Obviously the truck radiator and Denali fan set up I bought will not work in 86 Camaro
I'm using a replacement Third Gen radiator, I believe it's a Spectra Premium off of RockAuto. Believe it or not, it's got a thicker core than the AC Delco replacement radiator.
I've heard that the factory style LS1 radiator has a thin core, as well. If I were you, just stick with what you know will fit.
For transmission lines, I bent up my own with my Lisle (TM) tubing bender.
Let me tell you this: Once the transmission is actually in place in the car, it's going to be REALLY difficult to remove the lines on a Third Gen, at least in my application.
Here's what I did, and I'll see about adding some pictures later (please be VERY patient...*).
I used 45 degree brass fittings, 1/4" pipe thread on the male side, and 5/16" flare - nut on the female side. I positioned them so that they are pointing down and to the front.
I could not make a bend tight enough that would allow the use of straight fittings without contacting the floorpan. Forget about trying to disconnect them without removing the transmission crossmember and lowering the rear of the transmission.
However, this might be attributable to my engine/ trans mounting solutions. Every swap is different.
My next step (I haven't done this yet) will be to cut and reflare the lines right before they get to the starter, add a brass union, and that is where I disconnect the transmission lines whenever I have to remove/ install it.
*I've been really busy with work, and I haven't laid a hand on the car since my last thread update, but that's going to change soon.
This is correct. I was looking at a set of cross member instructions but forgot that it came with replacement nut plates, hence the 5/16. Sorry for the confusion.
For transmission lines, I bent up my own with my Lisle (TM) tubing bender.
Let me tell you this: Once the transmission is actually in place in the car, it's going to be REALLY difficult to remove the lines on a Third Gen, at least in my application.
Here's what I did, and I'll see about adding some pictures later (please be VERY patient...*).
I used 45 degree brass fittings, 1/4" pipe thread on the male side, and 5/16" flare - nut on the female side. I positioned them so that they are pointing down and to the front.
I could not make a bend tight enough that would allow the use of straight fittings without contacting the floorpan. Forget about trying to disconnect them without removing the transmission crossmember and lowering the rear of the transmission.
However, this might be attributable to my engine/ trans mounting solutions. Every swap is different.
My next step (I haven't done this yet) will be to cut and reflare the lines right before they get to the starter, add a brass union, and that is where I disconnect the transmission lines whenever I have to remove/ install it.n.
I never did the like the way GM ran the cooler lines. On a 3rd gen or some of the other platforms I've worked on.
I eventually did this:
Since those pictures were taken, the rubber lines from the transmission have been replaced with braided steel and the transition from the flex to the hard line was via a bulkhead fitting attached to a tab on the frame rail. All the fittings are accessible from the topside and the lines are no longer a struggle to get to.
I never did the like the way GM ran the cooler lines. On a 3rd gen or some of the other platforms I've worked on.
I eventually did this:
Since those pictures were taken, the rubber lines from the transmission have been replaced with braided steel and the transition from the flex to the hard line was via a bulkhead fitting attached to a tab on the frame rail. All the fittings are accessible from the topside and the lines are no longer a struggle to get to.
Even cleaner with the bulkhead fittings on the frame rails (I never liked the look of the rubber lines and hose clamps, hence the upgrade). I might be able to take/find some pictures at a later date (Car is in storage).
I never did the like the way GM ran the cooler lines. On a 3rd gen or some of the other platforms I've worked on.
I eventually did this:
Since those pictures were taken, the rubber lines from the transmission have been replaced with braided steel and the transition from the flex to the hard line was via a bulkhead fitting attached to a tab on the frame rail. All the fittings are accessible from the topside and the lines are no longer a struggle to get to.
Holy sh*t, Skinny, that looks really good!
I considered routing my transmission lines in a similar fashion for my swap, but they were going to get in the way of too many things (heater lines, A/C lines, wiring, and exhaust), so I pretty much copied the 4th-gen LS1 lines.
I have some stainless braided fuel lines coming in tomorrow. I will be using 6an & quick connect fittings on fuel rail. What do you use to make the transition to the fuel lines on the fuel sender?
How did you guess set your fuel filter up? I plan on using the stock regulator on fuel rail being that it's a stock engine..
I'm thinking of just the regular fuel filter underneath car on drivers side, anyone know what size Male fitting that is that screws in on both side of that filter?
I have some stainless braided fuel lines coming in tomorrow. I will be using 6an & quick connect fittings on fuel rail. What do you use to make the transition to the fuel lines on the fuel sender?
How did you guess set your fuel filter up? I plan on using the stock regulator on fuel rail being that it's a stock engine..
I'm thinking of just the regular fuel filter underneath car on drivers side, anyone know what size Male fitting that is that screws in on both side of that filter?
Even though your LS is stock, it is leaps ahead of what your car came with from the factory. I would not use the stock filter and instead use your new stainless line with a C5 Corvette filter (includes regulator built in). You can use fuel injection hose from your hard lines to your sending unit, or flare the hard lines from your sending unit to connect directly to your braided lines. There are a million ways to do this and luckily there is a ton of aftermarket vendors that sell AN adapters. The subject of this task is universal in that a few youtube videos will provide you with the instructions you need.
Even though your LS is stock, it is leaps ahead of what your car came with from the factory. I would not use the stock filter and instead use your new stainless line with a C5 Corvette filter (includes regulator built in). You can use fuel injection hose from your hard lines to your sending unit, or flare the hard lines from your sending unit to connect directly to your braided lines. There are a million ways to do this and luckily there is a ton of aftermarket vendors that sell AN adapters. The subject of this task is universal in that a few youtube videos will provide you with the instructions you need.
Got it! Being that I am using a ls truck intake, (with a supply & return line) would I just put a t fitting and connect the return of the factory fuel rail and the return fron the c5 filter/regulator? And would I leave the factory regulator in place or what would I do with it
1. Reuse the truck regulator and use your stock feed line and return lines (but with a high quality fuel filter)
2. Use the C5 set-up and you would not use the truck regulator. You would cap off the return, since the return line would go from the C5 regulator back to the tank and then a single feed line would go from the C5 unit up to your fuel rail.
3. Use a full length feed and return line and put an aftermarket fuel pressure regulator in your engine bay.
1. Reuse the truck regulator and use your stock feed line and return lines (but with a high quality fuel filter)
2. Use the C5 set-up and you would not use the truck regulator. You would cap off the return, since the return line would go from the C5 regulator back to the tank and then a single feed line would go from the C5 unit up to your fuel rail.
3. Use a full length feed and return line and put an aftermarket fuel pressure regulator in your engine bay.
I will probably do #1 with the new braided stainless lines because my factory fuel hard lines on camaro are rusting in a few spots.. I will just replace the stock regulator and incorporate a fuel filter retained at the camaros factory location
Guys, I need some help . Me and a buddy fought with the transmission lines and got them on. After that we went to tighten the flywheel bolts (engine belt off) and noticed some resistance.. Something is keeping the engine from turning... We got two bolts in the torque converter, and it was seizing up trying to get to the last bolt.. Its like not turning anymore, so we went the other way and it did the same thing.. Its like its rubbing against something..
When we put the torque converter on, we made sure it snapped in place in the transmission.. then bolted the transmission to the engine and installed both at the same time...
We took the flywheel screws out and engine spins without that problem..
Take everything back off and make sure the converter is seated and the engine still turns over. Look for signs that something was rubbing or in a bind.
Not sure of your order of operations here.
FWIW, I'll fasten the flexplate to the crank. Torque to spec with locktite. Push the converter into the transmission making sure it's fully seated. I doubt you could get a finger between the converter and the bellhousing if it's seated fully. Bolt the engine and trans together. At this point the engine should rotate easily (against compression) and the converter should spin easily as well. Then lastly, the converter bolts.
Not sure of your order of operations here.
FWIW, I'll fasten the flexplate to the crank. Torque to spec with locktite. Push the converter into the transmission making sure it's fully seated. I doubt you could get a finger between the converter and the bellhousing if it's seated fully. Bolt the engine and trans together. At this point the engine should rotate easily (against compression) and the converter should spin easily as well. Then lastly, the converter bolts.
I followed that exact order. I can turn the torque converter with one finger barely but when it gets to a certain spot, it seizes up or get stuck
I followed that exact order. I can turn the torque converter with one finger barely but when it gets to a certain spot, it seizes up or get stuck
With the converter out, you should be able to see the two "dogs" on the trans pump where the gaps on the converter shaft engages. You should be able to rotate the pump by grabbing those dogs with pliers and giving it a twist (soft touch here). I take it this was a functional transmission when you received it.
With the converter out, you should be able to see the two "dogs" on the trans pump where the gaps on the converter shaft engages. You should be able to rotate the pump by grabbing those dogs with pliers and giving it a twist (soft touch here). I take it this was a functional transmission when you received it.
Something to consider and whether it's relevant here or not is that when the converter is pushed into trans all the way, it'll bottom out and there may be contact with the bell housing. Once you're in a position to bolt the converter to the flexplate, the converter will come off of the bell housing about a 1/4" or so giving you the needed clearance. But that it was binding when you were trying to put in the last bolt is a different story. Usually that means the converter hasn't been bottomed out and isn't fully seated to start with. Seems you have some of both going on? But it's to tell through the keyboard!
Something to consider and whether it's relevant here or not is that when the converter is pushed into trans all the way, it'll bottom out and there may be contact with the bell housing. Once you're in a position to bolt the converter to the flexplate, the converter will come off of the bell housing about a 1/4" or so giving you the needed clearance. But that it was binding when you were trying to put in the last bolt is a different story. Usually that means the converter hasn't been bottomed out and isn't fully seated to start with. Seems you have some of both going on? But it's to tell through the keyboard!
Yes I understand stand that.. Thanks to everybody for all the help now and in the future.. I really appreciate it.. I know some of the questions I post maybe elementary too some, but I do look for answers per this forum, youtube etcc.. I'm a shade tree mechanic helper at best! I'm a licensed electrician by trade .
Hey Sparky! Me too! Auto technician first. Then an electrician for the last 3 decades or so.
As for the elementary questions, if you don't ask, how will you find out?
Hey Sparky! Me too! Auto technician first. Then an electrician for the last 3 decades or so.
As for the elementary questions, if you don't ask, how will you find out?
Cool deal man. I'm only 36 but I've been in it for some time.. Yes, I ask anyway.. I only assume the obvious, and technically, you not suppose to assume the obvious,... so I'm screwed either way...
Since I will end up dropping the transmission, I am going to just go with some braided lines..can someone suggest braided line sizes for the transmission cooler lines?
I already have an idea on the fittings I need, but I want to use the smallest hose possible
Since I will end up dropping the transmission, I am going to just go with some braided lines..can someone suggest braided line sizes for the transmission cooler lines?
I already have an idea on the fittings I need, but I want to use the smallest hose possible
This is what I plan on doing
Ok, looks like 5/16 is the factory size so I should be ok with using that in braided lines...
Now im unsure if I will just go braided lines completely or
Make a transition from the hard lines ends to braided lines... I'm just concerned about using too many fittings
I think you'll find the braided line comes in -4 and -6. Which is 1/4" and 3/8" respectively. I exited the transmission with a -6 (fittings readily available although I don't have the PN's handy) and landed on the frame rail. From there a -6 to 5/16th" tube nut adapter and steel line to the cooler.
Whether or not you go to the frame or the more conventional route, the adapter is what you're after if you want hard lines at some point.
I think you'll find the braided line comes in -4 and -6. Which is 1/4" and 3/8" respectively. I exited the transmission with a -6 (fittings readily available although I don't have the PN's handy) and landed on the frame rail. From there a -6 to 5/16th" tube nut adapter and steel line to the cooler.
Whether or not you go to the frame or the more conventional route, the adapter is what you're after if you want hard lines at some point.
Oh ok. That's what I was after.. I guess the thread I read was he was using steel lines...
Any how.. 6an(3/8) will be what I will go with..
The hard lines I bought got a little bent out of shape due to us installing them with transmission and engine already installed.. They are still useable though ... though they come up short , and I will have to make a transition..
Edit
I just have to make sure I get the correct fitting for the hard lines
I believe the fitting that screws in the third gen radiator is AN-1/2 x 20
The trans cooler I'm using is 3/8 flare and accepts quick connect fittings
Last edited by 86iroc504; Jan 14, 2020 at 10:29 AM.
