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LTX and LSXPutting LT1s, LS1s, and their variants into Third Gens is becoming more popular. This board is for those who are doing and have done the swaps so they can discuss all of their technical aspects including repairs, swap info, and performance upgrades.
At the behest of my Fiance, she advised that I share my story. She caught me on the site reading one day and said you should share your build. Primarily for some type of documentation for my kiddos of my build journey for you all. So, I have already started my build so I've probably missed so much already that could have been shared and helped some of you. But, at the same time some of this has been covered by everyone else here so it may not be as in-depth.
Here it is:
I've been on the site for a long time, primarily to lurk, contribute rarely, and sell parts or buy parts. After a time I managed to score my current 91 Z28 Camaro from another member in Flordia. Long story short it wouldn't run and had a grinding noise in the rear. A new 4th gen rear was purchased but sat in the driveway. Bought it, my brother did the fuel door trick, and replaced the fuel pump. There is more on that story but I won't go into details. I flew down and drove it home from Florida. It had a 305 TPI/Auto. I drove it for a few years before I had to replace that engine due to an alternator that fell out of the back of someone's truck. It dented the oil pan so badly that it knocked the pickup tube upward and bent up the floor pans. I yanked the old engine and slapped an LT4/T56 combo into it and drove it for a few years until 2010. I started to design what I wanted to do to the car and the parts necessary to get it there. I tore the car down to its bare shell and started work on the clean-up of garbage mistakes and issues. Fast forward 13 years I've had a kiddo, bought a house, had another kiddo, got married, and divorced. The car pretty much sat in the garage on a lift to be out of the way during that time. In the meantime during that time, I watched and read the @ShiftyCapone, @QwkTrip, and the DSE builds. Modified my parts lists and build designs based on their builds and the things they have done/discovered. To be honest my build unintentionally and intentionally has been a combined build from their builds along with my own customized items I wanted to do to get me where I wanted. Since my divorce was finalized in 2019, I've bought parts. They have sat in boxes and up until recently, I started to cut and piece the car together. So, I'm behind on documenting it as I've already started to build.
So to give an idea of where I am going with it here...
LSX 427 Twin Turbocharged. Shooting for around 1200-1500hp depending on boost and fuel
T56 Magnum from Trick Performance
Big Brake Upgrade
Strange Engineering S60
DSE Suspension components
This is just the meat and potatoes.
Individual parts below with links if I can for purchased items. As for the journey and those vendors I have interfaced with I want to give a shout-out to Smeding Performance, Scott @ Big Brakes, Strange Engineering, LP Racing, and Detroit Speed for their help as they have been extremely helpful when discussing my build. Also of course @ShiftyCapone, @QwkTrip, and Bad Luck Garage for the work they have done for their builds.
Engine:https://smedingperformance.com/colle...39813036638266
This is their standard build basically but they were so helpful with any questions I have plus the YouTube Channel they have has a ton of information.
Smeding Performance:
427 LS Power Long Block Specs: Block: DART SHP Iron, 6 Bolt Head Pattern, Billet Steel Main Caps, 4.125" Bore Crankshaft: Smeding 4340 Forged Steel, Internal Balance, 4.000" Stroke, 58x, Std Snout Rods: Smeding 4340 Forged Steel H-Beam w/ ARP2000 Bolts, 6.125" Length Pistons: JE 2618 Forged 2618 Aluminum, Coated Skirts & 0.170" Wrist Pins Rings: Stainless Steel Top, Low Friction Oil, 1.2/1.5/3.0 Camshaft: Smeding Forged Steel Hydraulic Roller Lifters: Smeding Link-Bar Hydraulic Roller Timing Set: Performance Single Roller w/ Thrust Bearing, 4x Oil Pump: Melling 10295 Std. Volume / High Pressure Cylinder Heads: Smeding 260cc CNC Ported 11° 6 Bolt LS3 Heads Head Gaskets: Cometic MLX 5-Layer Head Gaskets Head Fasteners: 6 Bolt ARP2000 Head Stud Kit Pushrods: Chromoly 5/16" w/ Heavy Wall Thickness Rocker Arms: OEM LS3 w/ Upgraded 360* Roller Bearings
Turbos: https://www.lpracing.net/product-pag...-image-package Qty 2 V-band turbine inlet flanges
Qty 2 Gen 2 PT6266 Precision turbos (800 hp each) V-band inlet .82 AR.
Qty 2 V-band turbine discharge flanges
Qty 2 V-band turbine inlet clamps
Qty 2 V-band turbine discharge clamps
Qty 2 Full flow oil drain flanges
Qty 2-Turbosmart Gen V Hypergate 45mm wastegates (choice of base spring pressure)
Qty 1-Turbosmart Powerport BOV
I am adding an additional BOV just to be safe
Suspension:
UMI K member
UMI A-Arms - Modified for Cool Ride
DETROIT SPEED QUADRALINK REAR SUSPENSION KIT - 3 IN. AXLE HOUSING - WITHOUT COILOVERS
DSE Front Anti-Roll Bar Kit
Performance Height Adjustable Panhard Rod Relocation Kit
DSE Rear Swap Bar Kit
Air Ride:
Front Suspension - RideTech CoolRide Front Kit
Rear Suspension - RideTech CoolRide Rear Kit
AccuAir e-Level+ Air Ride Kit System
Steering:
Detroit Speed 12.7:1 Ratio Power Steering Box
Detroit Speed Steering Shaft Kit
Detroit Speed Tubular Tie Rod Adjusters - Includes Jam Nuts
Flaming River FR20004-69BK 33" FLOOR SHIFT TILT COLUMN WITH 2" OD - BLACK POWDERCOAT FINISH
Billet Specialties D Shaped
Moog Suspension Parts
DSE Wiper Motor - which interestingly enough is a special bracket and a newer Corvette Wiper motor and a proprietary controller from DSE.
Detroit Speed Windshield Washer Pump Kit
Body:
Complete new Floor pan - I was dumb back in the day with my original subframe connectors and cut up the floors to put them in so I want to correct that mistake.
DSE Subframe Connectors
F Body Mini Tub Kit
Modified DSE Fuel Door Kit
Fiberglass Z28 hood
Hood Pins Flush Mount Locking
S&W DOM Roll Cage
S&W Drop Side bars
Hood Hinges Billet Ringling Bro
Tilton 600 mount Brake/Clutch Master Cylinder Pedal Firewall Brace Mount Plate
Tilton 600 Pedals
Trackspec Motorsports hood louvres
Wheels:
Cray Eagle Matte Black Front 19x9 - 1990CRE505121M70
ray Eagle Matte Black Rear 20x10.5 - 2005CRE695121M70
Nitto NT555 G2 All- Season Radial Tire-265/35/19 110W
Nitto NT555 G2 All- Season Radial Tire-315/35-20 104W
I wanted to go wider on the rear but since I am not going anywhere soon I just went with 315 until I can dial it in later.
As for items coming:
All new Seals
LED Bulbs Everywhere
Engine
Brian Tooley Trinity Intake
Transmission:
Tick Performance T56 Super Magnum
- Tilton 6000 series Throwout Bearing w/ -4AN Inlet and Remote Bleeder
- Tilton ST-246 Twin disc clutch kit with solid hub, cerametallic discs and all required hardware, will handle up to 1250 lb.-ft. of engine torque.
Electrical:
DOMINATOR EFI ECU
Coach Controls, add Traditional Signaling, Independent Window Drop for Weather Seal
Estop Electronic Brake
I am currently working on the body and additional posts documenting that coming. I am sure there are a few more parts that I am going to use such as cooling and a few others. I am still deciding on those parts but I have placeholders for them. Right now I am just focusing on getting it to be a rolling chassis and getting all the body modifications completed for mechanicals. Wiring, paint, and showroom type stuff is much later.
Here is one of the only pictures I have right after I got her:
I've valued this site and others for years so hopefully the work I am doing inspires someone else as it has inspired me.
Holy smokes, this is one massive project. Can't wait to see your progress as you march along. I need to reread your post a few more times to make sure I'm not missing anything but a few things immediately popped out.
Did you win the lotto? Your wallet is on fire.
Transmission: Make sure you get the F-body magnum so the shifter will be in the OEM location. The shifter on the regular magnum is 2" more forward and you will not be able to retain your coin/ash tray panel in your center console. Have you thought about clutch and clutch hydraulics?
Wheels: You listed the same wheels I have albeit with a 20" in the rear. 20" is a lot in the rear and is to each their own. However, if I would go back in time I'd get different wheels. I still love the way they look but they are very heavy. They are a cast wheel and are easily 5 to 10 lbs more each than a non cast wheel. The price is right with these wheels but I will eventually go to a roto cast, forged or flow form wheel in the future. I probably lose 15rwhp in wheel weight alone.
Rear end: Any reason you like the S60? No judgement here but that is slightly better for an auto trans application. For the power levels you are going for, combined with a sticky 315 rear, you should look into a Ford 9". The massive double pinion bearing design can eat up the shock loads of a high power manual transmission car. Just something to consider. The DSE quadralink is really better suited for drag racing and I don't think comes in an S60 flavor (it may now not sure). You can even see in the ride along videos how much the back end of the DSE car flies around.
Fueling: I didn't see how you are planning to feed this monster. You are probably into dual pump territory and -8an fuel line size. Expect to rewire the entire OEM fuel setup.
Don't be afraid to modify and change your build as your project progresses. I had to redo and or rework a million little things. I am still struggling to shape the interior panels around the mini tubs and roll bar.
So we have already started installing some of the parts on the car. You can see the modification to the spring pocket on the lower A arm.
Drivers side Big Brake Upgrade. I really hope someday Scott is able to get the new spindle design made. Where it uses the newer self contained hub and bearings as it would eliminate the spindle for our cars. Pic of the K member and front suspension New Rear installed.
Another of the rear Drivers side floor pan installed Drivers sub frame Another on the drivers floor pan Drivers side sub fram installed
passenger pan out Ugh rust Found a pocket of rust after pulling the pan out. Did realize that in the passenger side and drivers side there is a hole for water to get in between the outer shell and the inner on the rocker panel. This was a mess. I cut this out and cleaned it up. New pan in
Holy smokes, this is one massive project. Can't wait to see your progress as you march along. I need to reread your post a few more times to make sure I'm not missing anything but a few things immediately popped out.
Did you win the lotto? Your wallet is on fire.
Transmission: Make sure you get the F-body magnum so the shifter will be in the OEM location. The shifter on the regular magnum is 2" more forward and you will not be able to retain your coin/ash tray panel in your center console. Have you thought about clutch and clutch hydraulics?
Wheels: You listed the same wheels I have albeit with a 20" in the rear. 20" is a lot in the rear and is to each their own. However, if I would go back in time I'd get different wheels. I still love the way they look but they are very heavy. They are a cast wheel and are easily 5 to 10 lbs more each than a non cast wheel. The price is right with these wheels but I will eventually go to a roto cast, forged or flow form wheel in the future. I probably lose 15rwhp in wheel weight alone.
Rear end: Any reason you like the S60? No judgement here but that is slightly better for an auto trans application. For the power levels you are going for, combined with a sticky 315 rear, you should look into a Ford 9". The massive double pinion bearing design can eat up the shock loads of a high power manual transmission car. Just something to consider. The DSE quadralink is really better suited for drag racing and I don't think comes in an S60 flavor (it may now not sure). You can even see in the ride along videos how much the back end of the DSE car flies around.
Fueling: I didn't see how you are planning to feed this monster. You are probably into dual pump territory and -8an fuel line size. Expect to rewire the entire OEM fuel setup.
Don't be afraid to modify and change your build as your project progresses. I had to redo and or rework a million little things. I am still struggling to shape the interior panels around the mini tubs and roll bar.
Lotto, man I wish ROFL. I have had a few years and some of the parts I already had bought.
For the Transmission most definitely going to shoot for the F body version. I had my original T56 I was going to reuse but after talking to the guys at Tick they said it was better to just not reuse it as a core and get a brand new one. So far the place holder I have for the clutch is the Tilton Series ST-246 and the 6000 series throwout bearing. I am open to suggestions though as I haven't really gone down what to plop in place. I know I will be using the Tilton 6000 master cylinder and I already have that on hand.
Rear end: Yeah I already had the S60 purchased years ago and instead of scrapping it selling and losing money on it, I decided to just use it till it blows out. I do plan on road racing occasionally so that was the main reason I went with the quadralink plus I really hate the torque arm. It gets in the way and the stresses it put on the transmission mount or even the cross member really bothered me. I wanted to move that to the back end of the car instead of the middle.
Wheels, I went back and forth and I really liked the look. I know it is probably going to change but primarily going to leave them on here for now and worse comes to worse re-use them in another project. Right now just to get this thing on the ground and roll around.
Fuel I was looking toward Loni on this one I think to build something out I think. Definately a dual pump system or even tri with a sump but not sure yet. So the fuel design is still under much discussion internally in my head because I am crazy. I bounce around on it and I think I am a ways out on it to where I can easily change on which direction I go...
I am definitely trying to remain as flexible as possible and semi build this out so as I drive it and use it once done that things are going to change for the better or worse. It's definitely like a marriage that I whole heartedly embrace ROFL.
Last edited by Deaclen; Mar 14, 2024 at 02:25 PM.
Reason: Because I suck at English I guess.
Glad you made a thread, I'm looking forward to following it. You are among friends here.
I would suggest either putting a much more sticky tire under there, or get a license plate that says OVR PWRD to make it easier for the coroner to make sense of what happened.
Glad you made a thread, I'm looking forward to following it. You are among friends here.
I would suggest either putting a much more sticky tire under there, or get a license plate that says OVR PWRD to make it easier for the coroner to make sense of what happened.
I know, my dad said the same thing. I bought the tires last year just to get something on the rims and figured I could move them off onto my ZL1 when I finally decided on a tire. I keep bouncing between a set of Nitto NT555RII, MT ET II, or Toyo R888R. I actually can't decide to be honest yet. I like Nitto and have had good luck with them for years. My biggest concern with the R88Rs they have a really short tire life.
Does anyone have any suggestions? Got time I figure I am at least 2 year ish out before this thing is even on the road.
I started to cut out the wheel wheels Cutting this out slowly bit by bit. Started to put in the sheet metal as a mock up I don't like how they don't cover all the way towards the front. I may grab some more metal trace it out and place it all the way towards the front to make it look cleaner. Not that anyone is going to be looking in here. I know the new well once installed will cover most of this up but it didn't seem uniform enough to me after removing this much material on the rear. This is the front drivers side. There used to be a piece of U shaped sheet metal here that connected the front wheel well, subframe, and rocker panel together. Well, I won't name any names, but some jackass (me, it was me that did it.) back in the day used it as a jack point and squashed it. I don't believe it was providing enough support so I cut it out to rebuild. There is a lot of space in here. I am actually thinking about using a piece of 2x2 square tubing to reconnect this with the DSE sub frame connector and then adding some sheet metal to close it back on up. I am hoping that cleans this back up and brings the strength back. I mean probably overkill but I don't want to get my sheet metal guy in here just to bend back up another piece just to make it look like it used too when I can make it a bit stronger.
Wichita! I think that makes you one of the closer active members of the site! That is a beast of a build you've got going there, looking forward to watching it continue to progress! If you need anything in the KC area, LMK!
Does anyone have any suggestions? Got time I figure I am at least 2 year ish out before this thing is even on the road.
Maybe see what @Orr89RocZ thinks. He has experience with 19" low-profile tires with something around 1200 Hp.
Rule of thumb I have learned with low-profile tires.... traction is proportional to tread wear rating (how soft is the rubber). The lower the tread wear the more traction, but less useful life. I would hold off buying new tires until you get the car on the road because the clock is ticking on useful life from the moment the tire rolls off the factory floor.
May have a hard time hooking more than 800 whp on the street with any of those tires but the mickey et ss is the best out of those. Nitto some guys really like and it is suppose to be a better wearing street tire. The old 555r was just a soft street tire. Nitto had the nt05r which was a true drag radial and was awesome. Scary on wet pavement but hooked better than the 555r. I ran both on a 320 whp ls car lol got good mileage on the nt05r surprisingly. Ive seen them work well on a blown challenger on 20 wheels with a manual trans. It was a 500-600 whp car
i had the 305/35/19 mickeys street radial 2’s which were the model that predated the street ss, on my turbo sbc car and it would hold maybe 750-800 whp on a good day in a high gear roll. Th400, wouldnt hold 2nd often unless under 700 whp. At the track they took 1000 but softer launch. Never pushed them hard in the 60’. They wore pretty well too tho
But its weird, the 15” street ss drags wear very very fast for me. Even before the spool. New they held second gear rolls at 1200-1300 whp and third gear at 1400. But after they start to wear some and harden they dont go over 1000-1100 it seems in 2nd gear. Unless you do a good burn out to remove the hard layer then they come around more but never the same as new and it kills life lol
the compound should be the same on the 20” and 15” street ss now. They probably will require frequent burnouts to clean up imo and dont expect much tire life. They will give you the best shot at holding power tho. Or atleast in high gears, 1-3 trans gears may be useless lol
and with 4” stroke and 6266 turbos I think you will have a hard time hooking it. They should light off very fast and be torque monsters. Id def keep timing out of the low mid range rpms to keep power somewhat linear lol boost control will also be your friend. It will take some playing around. I would have leaned toward slightly larger compressors and turbine for that deal, especially with the cam size.
All great info!!! I've got time for now to figure those details out. I love it when someone has the experience and can lean in on some details. I always had a fear of having a hard time hooking but always figured that I could control it with boost control. I figure if I keep my foot out of it and get up to 4th gear I'd be set on it. To be honest, sometimes I feel I went too big on engine HP goals for the car and should have shot a bit lower. But these days the price point for it seemed negligible and felt go big or go home mentality kicked in and bragging rights.
I partially think those turbines may back up sooner and limit the power before the compressor does. I gotta go back and see but there was a guy who built a 408 or a 427 ls based deal with I think 6466’s and it made 1000 something at the tire before it started seeing high backpressure. It made a lot of power with low boost up to that point then didnt pick up much after that. Forget what he switched to, but it picked up alot, i wanna say 1200-1400 hp after that. I gotta look for his post on the fb group
That's concerning. Hate hearing what works in real world rather than what is said in practical application. Well, hmm. Should I have gone with a set of 6870. I mean in all honesty, I am find with spinning this to max out at 1000-1200. I don't need an abundance of power. I mean bragging rights are awesome but there is always going to be someone that has more power. I want to do a Tim Allen here but at the same time work with what I already have and lose out on cash and time.
Ok checked my messages he had 6466’s and it made like 900 on 15 and struggled to gain more, had to go 25 psi to get over 1000.
switched to some cheap 7675’s and made 1402 on 28 psi
good 64 wheels can certainly make some power but the turbine i feel needs to be bigger like the 7675, so like a 6475 but 6870 def would have been better. But can always see what you get. It will be fun to drive, just maxing it out like he did made alot of heat for no power. But with your tires you may not hook it much anyway so 800-900 on street is fast
8-900 is fast on the street. I will keep it in mind and switch them out later as I get farther along. At the very least I can at least use what I have to get mocked up and its good to know I might be maxing it out at 900 for now.
Welp, I know its been a while since I have been able to update. Life, eclipse, and all the other usual stuff. If you hadn't seen a total eclipse before I mean wow, its pretty powerful event more so then I have ever seen before. It was pretty awesome. That aside, I will upload some pictures here in the next day or two of the latest progress. Been working on getting mini tubs all cut out and put in along with a couple of other minor items like the brake/clutch pedals mounted and the steering column.
Also, just noticed that the paper I had for my measurements for the seat mounts on the floor pan burned up from some rogue welding sparks flying over to my shop table. So if anyone has the measurements for the seat brackets that are on the floor pan that would be great otherwise, I am going to just build and mount them in where seems most comfortable for me I guess.
I know its been a while and I haven't really worked on the car in the last few weeks. I did get a better idea on the rear bumper and the rear bumper support. I picked up some extra steel to build that out and I am going to put the air tank for the airbags behind the rear bumper support. Based on mock up it should fit with the new bumper support that we are welding together. I banged out some of the dents in the front fenders so I can get them mounted back on the car and put the front bumper back on so I can start mocking it up for the changes and the new bumper support up front. hoping in a few more months I can get that completed.
So as you can see my welding isn't the greatest but this is the front subframe connector brace on the passenger side. Another shot of the brace for the subframe connector. Doing some work on the mini tubs as well. The cage is fully welded into the car now so pretty happy about that now. Drivers side down bar. Engine and intake showed up so I put the exhaust manifolds on upside down for now so they don't stick up too much and I can slide this under the bench. Smedding got this done quick. I didn't expect it for a while and BTR said everything was backorder but then it showed up. I need to pick out a set of valve covers. I bought these in September and the just showed up today. Pretty excited that I now have the complete turbos, wastegates, and blow off.
I know its been a while and I haven't really worked on the car in the last few weeks. I did get a better idea on the rear bumper and the rear bumper support. I picked up some extra steel to build that out and I am going to put the air tank for the airbags behind the rear bumper support. Based on mock up it should fit with the new bumper support that we are welding together. I banged out some of the dents in the front fenders so I can get them mounted back on the car and put the front bumper back on so I can start mocking it up for the changes and the new bumper support up front. hoping in a few more months I can get that completed.
I see that BTR Trinity intake has changed slightly. I've got one on my engine and it seems like my runners are shorter and where the throttle body bolts on is angled down at like 30 degrees or so. Yours appears to just go straight out which is what I'd like to have
Well fellas, I just realized I hadn't posted in a while. I have gotten busy with a few other items around the house and it was just freaking hot out over the summer. So hot, I bought a new mini split for the garage. I don't have it completely installed yet but I will get the electrician out soon to have them run some additional wiring to get it going. I will have some new pics up here soon of some recent progress. Was able to start building on a few pieces but trying to wrap up the mini tubs right now. Once that is done Ill start on the front crash bar and some of the remaining metal work. Once that is wrapped I can drop the mechanicals on in and start seeing what else needs to be chopped and cut up. More coming soon.
Yes, it's a metallic blue with white racing stripes. I will keep the same color maybe a different shade of metallic blue. I am thinking of blue pearl in the stripes though. I have been fabricating the front firewall cleanup, bracket install for tilton pedals, and the panhard bar mount strengthening (basically remaking it with a little thicker metal as I don't need the upper panhard bar but want to ensure it doesn't flex a whole lot.
I apologize for the delay on getting this out to everyone for updates. Life tends to get in the way, and sometimes I get super lazy after getting off work. I started mocking up some parts of the firewall with some scrap I had laying around. I was also able to get the engine and transmission put in recently, and started the work on my new panhard bar mount and welded in the mintubs for the most part. Still need to hit the seams on the inside. Don't mind the mess in the garage I am still trying to get things cleaned up in it and get rid of a bunch of junk. That for some reason along with everything else seems to be another full time job LOL. Still have to finish sealing up some spots but for the most part these are in now. I didn't like the idea of just cutting out the bumps and not reinforcing the frame here so I welded back in some plate on both sides to keep it from flexing.
Had to mock up the rear end to make sure everything lined up without issue. My biggest concern here is the air bags and some potential to rub but from the looks of it should be fine but won't know until the rear fully articulates. Just want to be on the safe side here. I need to build out some new bump stop brackets though.
I bought the tires last year just to get something on the rims and figured I could move them off onto my ZL1 when I finally decided on a tire. I keep bouncing between a set of Nitto NT555RII, MT ET II, or Toyo R888R. I actually can't decide to be honest yet. I like Nitto and have had good luck with them for years. My biggest concern with the R88Rs they have a really short tire life.
