My last 3rdgen was a 1982 Camaro that I bought for $400 and setup for drag racing in the local street DOT class. It ran well into the 11's before I parted it out and sold it. Although it ran in the "street" class it was never really a reliable street car and I spent a ton of money getting it there.

I am at a point where I am ready to buy another 3rdgen. I would love to buy an 85-90 IROC or 91-92 z28 as they are much more affordable than when I first got into 3rdgens 15 years ago. My goals for the car would be to run in the mid to high 13's on street tires and be street driven with a full interior. I also want it to have a 700r4.

Any ideas as far as what I should be looking for? I don't know a ton about the TPI powerplants or how much room for growth they have. I am in a non-emmissions area so swapping it to a carb isn't a deal breaker for me.

Thanks in advance!

 

buy a cheap rust free and good paint roller or someone else's project and swap in a gen 3 or 4 engine, nothing more reliable with great power and fuel economy. Otherwise for those goals, a simple bolt on 355 engine with a decent converter could run those times.

 

My stock 4th gen runs 13.01 in good weather 13.2 in summer heat and gets 23 mpg mixed city/highway. A stock ls1 in a thirdgen would be good for high 12s in my area. You could build a mild sbc to do the same but I doubt you will get the same mpg out of it.

 

yup. my little bro's car has a 5.3/4l60e swap in it. knocked down 28.5mpg and hoping to hop into the upper 13's with it (stock converter, stock 2.73 gear, etc). the genIII motors have way more potential though. i went 12.02 @ 110 with basically a bolt-on 5.7 ls1 with a 3600 stall and 4.11 gears (275/60 drag radials). that setup was stupid streetable as well.

otherwise a clean l98 car with bolt-ons and a good converter with some 3.23's and a drag radial will do it easily.

 

What about LT1 cars, nobody ever really talks about them? I think because the LS1 cars perform so much better...

I realize this is a 3rdgen forum but still lol.

There is a LT1 Z28 near me with a good running motor and a tranny that doesnt shift into overdrive, I could pick up for $1600, seems like it would be pretty easy to pick it up for $1200 and stick either a th350 or a 700r4 with a 3000 converter in it and be close to my goal.

I just really like the look of 3rdgens. Anyone here have experience with LT1 cars at the strip?

 

because lt1 have finicky optisparks once you start adding power to them or up the rpm range.

 

My L98 with bolt ons ran mid low 13's in good air and go 24mpg on highway. My LS1 4th gen with same mods goes 12.2's in good air and got 24mpg as well. To each his own, but a ls1 swap is NOT cheap and way overkill for 13's.

Buy a L98 car in good shape and swap intakes/exhaust/converter and atleast 3.23-ish gears with sticky tires.

 

LT1's seem to run really well, especially when they're cammed. Big cammed LT1's are blindingly fast even with stock heads. The reason I wont consider an LT1 is that stupid optispark. That's really about it. The LS1's are far better in every way, and far more expensive, until you count all the optisparks you'll be replacing over the years. You can convert an LT1 to run on coil packs... but the cost/benefit ratio doesnt quite make the LS1 a no-brainer, but it makes you think about just doing whatever you wanted to do to the LT1 with a Gen I engine that you already have parts for or just going with an LS1. But the goofiness of the optispark doesn't help. Plus you still have to deal with using/finding/buying a new serpentine setup, possibly getting a new trans or figuring out how to run a 4l60 with a cobbled together TV cable setup or something (T5's iwll break, LT1's use a 4l60e) and other minor swap headaches...

If you've got to buy a new trans to run an LT1... (and I think a new crossmember with the 4th gen 4l60e) then you kind of want to just buy an LS1 trans to begin with. I've always wanted to do a 5.3 swap so I would have everything I needed to do the swap, plus a 5.3 still makes 300hp from the factory... not exactly shabby. It's aluminum heads, roller cam... potential is there. And those 4.8's and 5.3's can be had cheaper than LT1s! So where does that leave you, really?

It's just kind of an stopgap step child engine... it's really good for what it is... but the work and money involved will make you think a little harder about just building a good Gen I roller block or a Gen III+ engine. So it kind of gets left out, despite the fact that it does perform very well due to its great cylinder heads (very similar to Vortecs) and high compression ratio and decent intake.

Still, the LT1 bottom end is pretty much the same as what you get in a Gen I block. So beefing it up costs about the same, whereas an LS1 family bottom end is (allegedly) good to 1000hp from the factory. You can start to see why the cheaper, easier LT1 swap option tends to get overlooked. You can do a 6.0/LS1 Gen III swap for moeny, a small truck Gen III swap cheap, or you can do a roller cam Gen I 350 build... Is there really a niche left for the LT1 in there? Not really in my opinion.

 

i think he was looking at getting a 93-97 car.....if that's the case, full bolt-ons and a converter on an otherwise stock car will go 12's (given that it's got a good tire on it and sfc's)

 

i think the LT1 is one of the best bangs for the buck you can get. nobody wants them because of the opti and the more desireable ls engines. you can pick up an LT1 and freshen it up with new rings/bearings for around $1k. put a cam in it and get the stock heads ported to 200cc and they will flow around 290/200 @.700". put a single plane sbc intake on it along with a distributor and either run a megasquirt or a carb. that combo right there will make around 450rwhp with a manual trans.

we put a bolton lt1 car into the 11's a few years back with a t56 trans, and went 6.40's with a cam'd nitrous'd car with an automatic. mine has touched the 5's and im still running the stock shortblock and head castings.

honestly, a cheap unwanted LT1 car would be a great choice, i would say.

 

I have heard complaints about optispark but then again I've heard guys running it with no issues with new electronics available. Is opti that bad and does it fail that often??

 

If your looking for a mid to low 13sec street car, just get a L98 350 TPI Iroc or Z28. All L98 cars came with the 700R4 I believe, because the T5 Manual couldn't handle the torque. Look for a car with 3.23, or 3:42 gears (Or just swap them in if you can't find one), get some wide sticky tires (Nitto NT555s are good for the street becuase they aren't too slick and have some tread, don't go for the NT555Rs if you want a street car), Get a shift kit for the 700R4 (you'll need it), and some bolt ons, and you'll have a streetable car that get decent fuel milage, does low 13s on the track, and looks beast. Just my two cents. Good Luck, and post when you find your ride.

 

thread title is buying another thirdgen, just assumed he wasn't buying a 4th gen, maybe i was wrong

 

 

I do want to buy a thirdgen, I am just throwing other options out there as when I was last into thirdgens several years ago, 4th gens were still new and incredibly expensive.

So mw66nova I have a question and maybe you can answer it, I have a set of nice rebuilt Vortec heads. There are several very clean 5.0 TPI cars near me, one has a brand new 700r4 in it and just needs paint. My question is are vortec heads on a 305 a good way to go? I noticed that there is a vortec TPI base now, I also would be ok with converting it to carb depending on the performance benefits or drawbacks from running TPI.

What do you think, would a Vortec headed 305 meet my goals?

My last good setup was a vortec 350 with 10:1 compression and an XE274 that ran 12.2's on street tires all day long, so I would imagine if a 305 was even a full second off from those times, it could still do reasonably well? Should I look at keeping the TPI or ditching it?

Thanks again for answering these questions your input is very helpful.

 

Well, A 305 is going to have a hard time competing because of the size of the bore. A 305 TPI with a T5 can get close to a 350 TPI 700R4, but Stock the later model years still only ran late 14s. With a 700R4 Expect mid to late 15s. But, Mod the 700R4 with a shift kit and a corvette servo, and do a little work to the enigne, plus full bolt ons, swap out the rear end gears for like some 3:42s, get some wide sticky tires, and expect to run high 13s. Am I right in saying this guys?

 

the 305 will need to spin a little higher to make the same hp as a 350. the vortec heads as is will lower comp ratio down to ~8.5:1 which will be too low in my opinion to make good power. you're looking at milling the vortecs and angle milling them. then the lower intake needed to make it work. for the goals at hand, i don't know that this would be the best way to go.

if you want to do it with a 5.0/auto, try to mimic my first 305 combo as close as you can. something in the 220* duration range on like a 112ish* lsa, and a 3000-3500 stall with some 3.73's would get you close, and you could use the stock heads. high flow base and runners, get the shift point to ~5500rpm and you'd probably knock down some mid/upper 13's given optimal traction and the tune is dead nuts on.

or
put a 350 together with your vortec heads. put in a mild cam (heck, even an lt1 pullout would do what you need it to) and the matching intake base. do like a 2800 stall, 3.42's, shifting at 5000 rpm, optimal traction etc, and get the same performance. less tuning headaches, better streetability, etc.

i recommend longtubes and a well thought out y-pipe regardless of what you do.