Ghettobird52

Hey all so this weekend im replacing the entire front end suspension. 9 months of collecting parts, its finally time! Heres what im replacing

Front sway bar bushings and end links - Energy Suspension Polyurethane
Front Control arm bushings- Energy Suspension Polyurethane
Ball joints- Moog
Springs- Eibach Pro Kit
Struts- KYB Excel G (formerly GR2?)
Strut Mounts- Founders Performance
Front Brake lines- 'Ac Delco Packaged' (but Sunsong brake lines inside...)

I know what most of you are thinking, wow all that and i went with KYB Gr2! Yeah I know i kind of look back at it and wish i got Konis but i just didnt have the cash at the time... I'll try these out until im not happy.

Any who just a few questions and open to all pointers on doing the job.

Will i be able to get the 24mm Strut bolts off with hand tools? Im scared i wont be able to...

Will brake fluid just gush out when i remove the brake line or will it dribble out and then stop? Any tricks on bleeding brakes afterword?


Im going to attempt the Floor jack under the control arm method with the spring strapped to the control arm for safety. Any tips/tricks/pointers?

Here are my check lists (some of you might remember me from 4 months back on the rear end/fuel tank drop lol). Yeah what can i say im very methodical lol. I just like to know what im getting into before hand and 'try' to make sure i have all the tools ready to go.




direct link upload images

Any thing i should add to the list? Im taking the control arms to a shop to have them push/press out the old ball joints/bushings and press/push the new ones in.

Thanks everyone for your advice and help, love this forum/website!

scooter

iTrader: (11)

Suck out as much brake fluid from the reservoir as you can with a vacuum pump, or a turkey baster because it will drip out of the lines until it's all on the ground.

It may be hard getting the nuts off the old struts, especially if you have stock ones now, with the protective plastic cover over the piston end of the strut. If you get the plastic off, or break it you can get a strap wrench around the piston for more friction. I think I had to break the plastic and I held the piston with two hands while someone else used the wrench up top.

You're probably going to need a spring compressor to get the new springs in, so just lashing the old spring to the control arm is not worth the risk. You should be able to rent one from the local big box store for "free". Get one that goes inside the spring, not on the outside, easier to use and safer

blacksunshine'91

iTrader: (10)

I would suggest getting a set of the rubber shock covers from Rancho or something to cover the upper shaft of the new struts. Don't reuse the plastic cover that comes off the original struts with those strut mounts. They'll be noisy and it will irritate you to no end.

You should be able to do all of this with hand tools. If need be, in the past I've used the stock jack handle to extend my ratchet handle so that it gives you more leverage like that of a breaker bar.



P.S. I don't think that Randy Rhoads Flying V in the bottom right corner of the pic is going to fit your car. You might as well just ship it to me.

Ghettobird52

Damn thats what i was scared of about cracking the brake lines open but okay, turkey baster and a catch for the lines is what i'll try.

Yeah i think im going to have to enlist a helper hand for breaking loose those strut bolts. (and obviously at the end for bleeding brakes)

See using a internal spring compressor is what i was scared about... I know there are two schools of thought here on the forum; one being the spring compressors, the other using a floor jack under the control arm. I feel kind of scared of using a spring compressor after hearing some negative chat around here and a few videos online. So im going to attempt the latter... I found this video that shows a guy who was able to pop his pro kit springs in and jack up with a floor jack ( strapped albeit). He states the 1" lower makes it a bit easier to pop the spring into the control arm for jacking...

crap idk now im second guessing it lol...




What do you think of these Monroe covers (SA1997)
Ok cool yeah i have a 1/2 drive torque wrench and then 1/4 and 3/8 rachets as well. Yeah my floor jack handle perfectly wraps around my 3/8 rachet so i was thinking about using it as a breaker bar when needed. Ive also soaked all the bolts with PB blaster Sunday night, last night and will do again tonight. Might start disassembly tomorrow if i get off early!


hahaha good eye! Sorry but this one is taken!!

blacksunshine'91

iTrader: (10)

Those covers should work fine.

Ghettobird52

Ok cool, thanks guys for your info and advice! Any more comments or tips n tricks are welcome!

Ghettobird52

Just got done disassembling everything. Looks like i tore both my tie rod dust covers using my picklefork to disconnect it from the spindle.


Do these need to be replaced? Do they even sell just moog dust covers?




Thanks again all!

blacksunshine'91

iTrader: (10)

Those are ripped pretty bad. No biggie. Just grab some regular ones off the shelf. They have them at your local parts store. They're just boots, no need to have Moog or anything like that.

Ghettobird52

Ok cool i found some that i think will work.

Will update if i have any more questions or i get further in the job...

thanks again

Ghettobird52

Im going to finally reassemble the suspension tomorrow.

Quick question for Eibach Pro kit owners, or just anyone who would know. How does the front spring go in? I know you have to index it but i see the Pro kit has one side literally flattened out and the stock spring is not like that.

In the picture attached the first one shows it with the flat side on top. The Eibach logo is right up this way.



This second pic would have the eibach logo upside down, and the flat side is on bottom.



Why is one side flat anyways...?
Thanks all once again for info!

TreeFiddy

The flat side goes up into the upper spring pocket, and the sloped/tangential end sits in the spiral depression in the arm. The slope locks it in place.

You seem to be asking the same kind of questions I was when I did this same job several years ago - I used the jack method, easy and much safer than spring compressors, wrote up my experiences here:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...sion-noob.html

blacksunshine'91

iTrader: (10)

The flat end goes on top. Take a look at the spring pocket in the a-arm. You'll see how it is not flat. That is where the uneven end of the spring sits. Make sure you index the spring correctly (it may take a couple of attempts to get the spring to sit correctly when pushing the a-arm up as the spring might shift). Failure to index it correctly can lead to the car sitting uneven. Don't block both drain holes.

instro84

did mine earlier this year took me awhile because i cleaned and paint reaps that were exposed, and had lower arms powder coated. i went with del alum control arm bushings qa1 ball joints. it really simple just take you time.

Ghettobird52

I seriously Do not see how this is possible with out a spring compressor. Sure i can get the spring indexed in the a-arm correctly but up in the upper mount it doesnt match correctly.

How the hell is this put into the upper pocket correctly while keeping it indexed on the arm at the same time????

Ive been fiddling with it for 4 hours.... I think im going to need a spring compressor damn it.

Ghettobird52

This is what happens when i jack up with the spring indexed. If i try to align the upper side first, then the spring just wont go into the arm.

Ghettobird52

If i dont reply back... im dead


bb code img

blacksunshine'91

iTrader: (10)

Dibs on the Flying V. J/k. I remember it being difficult, but I never used a compressor when I put mine in. They are Jamex springs though, not sure how tall Eibachs are uncompressed.

Ghettobird52

Ok i must have some really bad luck today or not doing something correct. I cant get the springs in even with the compressor. The compressor rod is too tall so when compressed the top is hitting inside of the spring mount... Then when i was able to get it once with it on a lower coil, the lower mount got stock on the control arm and was unable to remove... 8 hours just with the springs... im seriously lost

The Pro Kit are literally 1" shorter than the stock springs as shown in my original pic. Do you just literally place your springs on the control arm, index them and then jack up into the upper mount??? When i do this it comes out very sideways as shown in pics....

Any info will seriously help i dont want to have the fbody taken apart in my driveway for weeks on end... Then it will really be a m u l l e t mobile.

blacksunshine'91

iTrader: (10)

Seat the spring, start to jack it up with the jack under the ball joint. As you raise it, use a long pry bar to make sure it stays seated.

Or, if using the compressor, read this:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...y-install.html

Ghettobird52

WOW! Ok so guess we all have our Homer Simpson moments, DOH!

I was attempting this with the spindle/brake assembly on the control arm from the start.

What i did, after reading Treefiddy's link, was i took the spindle off the arm. Let it sit far down with the jack under the ball joint, placed the spring in the upper mount and then gave it a hard 'shove' into the arm and wiggled it over one of the index holes. Then i gave it two pumps and it stayed in place! i put the spindle back on and guided the strut into the mount!! Done in 20 mins!!

Man sometimes i do stupid things, but i watched the video and seen it start with the spindle on, making me think thats how it should start! I got it on, finishing up the brake lines/bleeding tomorrow and will update with pics!!! Probably some questions on bleeding LOL

Just want to say THANK YOU ALL for your help, advice and info!

McLovin1181

The biggest improvement in my 91 RS was completly rebuilding the steering and getting a proper handling alignment.
That alone made the car feel better than new front suspension.

I may or may not have a video explaining how do rebuild the steering.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1nFJRU2bK6g

TreeFiddy

Ghettobird52

Honestly when i replaced my steering linkage two years ago it made it drive ALOT better. The items have less than 20,000 miles on them thats why i didnt replace them.
"Well it was about this time I noticed that this girl scout was about 8 stories tall and was a crustacean from the protozoic era!" ...

On a serious note i was just about to give up for the night. I looked over your thread, went out side to smoke a cig and noticed, as you stated, i could get two more inches taking off the brake/spindle assembly. It doesnt seem like much but it really made the complete difference!!!! I spent 8 hours playing around with one side and then once i realized what i did i got both sides up and bolted in 20mins... Talk about over looking the small things!

TreeFiddy

Lawd we was so scared

Yeah, my spindles weren't on yet. I gather you had the same epiphany moment I did, when you finally got it all lined up and it kind of self-assembled

QUICKCHICKEN

iTrader: (12)

i assume you had a shop do your ball joints and control arm bushings?

unless you have done it before or been on hand while someone is doing it you will give up with a quickness trying to get the bushings out. its a 3 step process.

i have a press so i did them myself.

Ghettobird52

Yes exactly! I kind was working on the car on and off, hadnt eaten all day and was just ready to go to sleep, but right when that happened i instantly woke up and was in a great mood lmao.

So its done!!! I did it! With the exception of a hand helping at bleeding the brakes, i did it all by myself with floor jack and hand tools!!! It was a job but man do i feel like a different person having this under my belt! Car feels TOTALLY DIFFERENT in a amazing way! The response is quick and feels very very tight up front. It also looks like i actually did get a drop out of this but not measuring until after alignment tomorrow! I also did a quick cheap spray of my sway bar and control arms.


My quick notes as a first timer doing this complete front end suspension rebuild;

The control arms with new bushings is a pain to get in! I have Energy Suspension poly and it added about half an inch on each bushings (1" per arm) that seriously made it a sob to get in. I had to use a rubber mallet and slowly find the right spot. Its takes awhile but you just have to go at it slowly and you will find where it will fit. Then take a rubber mallet, or something similar, and hit the arm near one bushing, then the other, and go back and forth until it pops into place.

If you are attempting the floor jack under the arm, take off the spindle! Eibach Prokits literally just pop right into place, easy!! Make sure to tape the spring isolators on the spring before hand.

If you are bleeding the brakes and arent getting any fluid out of the bleeder screw, unthread it all the way and take a can of brake cleaner with the small red nozzle sprayer on it and stick the nozzle inside the caliper, give it a spray and it should knock out the debris and fluid will start to drip. I had to do this on both sides.


Other than that it was honestly a straight forward job, just time consuming. I had a lot of fun at first, got frustrated with the springs, then had tons of fun once i got the springs up in place lol. Take your time, make sure you have the correct tools on hand and its a not bad. I really, once again, blew it out of proportion thinking it was this huge scary job. Just have to use some common sense and be smart about it, springs that is.

Thanks again all specifically those who posted in this thread! Appreciate all of your input and advice, really made the job better! Pics pics pics to come tomorrow! stay tuned

Ghettobird52

Yes exactly. I dont have the tools to do it myself so i paid a local shop $60 to do it for me. Was much worth it from what ive read and heard from a few buddies!

QUICKCHICKEN

iTrader: (12)

"if" you ever have to do it again, push the metal tube out first, then press the bushing out then get between the flange and the arm and use a chisel and hammer. you can heat the bushing and it'll press out easier.

going around the flange will walk it out. i was going to sawzal them out but my saw went south that night. what would have taken 10-15 mins with the saw took an hr using the hammer and chisel.

im doing mine now but its not my daily and we have some other stuff going or i would have finished up today.

one tip to those prepping to build your front end, stay away from the PST kits on back of the magazine. they dont have everything and it was 5 yrs later and i was replacing a part here and there. i built my 83 T/A with ES and MOOG, thought id save a buck and go PST. bad move.

MOOG hard parts, energy suspension soft parts.

Ghettobird52

Yeah i hope i never have to change them again... Or atleast for a long while! lol

So sorry still no pics but car drives great! Took it to work after the alignment today, drove really stiff. The two main differences i notice is

--The steering wheel no longer jitters around when hitting large bumps or holes, i think from the new ball joins

--The car feels far more stable at high speeds. Before hand above 60 it would start to get really 'wiggly'. I only took it up to 65mph so far but it felt like a different car. It doesnt want to wander off the road anymore.

I got to take it down a fav road of mine, its a curvy road that follows a creek that goes into the country. Car felt vastly stiffer and planted on the ground than before, unfortunately i got stuck behind a car so didnt get to really push it.

I will update with pics, just want to say once again thanks all for the help and info!!

Matthew91-Z28

Get the springs located/seated correctly in their perches or you'll ride clown car high.

Ghettobird52

LOL yeah i got them in that night if you keep reading the posts...

Car drives great, looks good with a teeny tiny drop in height. Needs to be washed then pics will come....

QUICKCHICKEN

iTrader: (12)

im finishing mine up tonight, would have had it done last weekend but the wife took on a 2 week foster project. (we foster dogs).

whats taking me the longest is i had to bend my return lines for my power steering cooler. burned my pump up this may at a local road course event so im fixing it now while everything is out, even swapped the steering box for a healthy box.

Ghettobird52

what box did you go with?

QUICKCHICKEN

iTrader: (12)

i had 3 extra boxes and 2 of which were XH boxes(12-1). one of them i got from a low mile parts car i had yrs ago. i'll eventually sen one out to get it built or if i get time i'll read up and do it myself.

Ghettobird52

oh wow ok nice