When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
Hello everyone. I have an 85 Iroc and have been having the suspension components replaced and upgraded. Moog springs with a coil cut on front and coil and a half on the rear. Sits nicely now. KYB shocks/struts. I know I should have probably spent a bit more on the shocks/struts for improved handing. QA1 Strut tower brace. I want the car to handle better and want to figure out which rear lower control arms to get and any other suggestions. Thanks!
Last edited by fast lenny; 08-28-2017 at 07:17 PM.
I've been extremely happy with my Founders Roto joint rear control arms now so have an extreme joint out now that looks to be a little better even than ones I have. Also replace your panhard bar whether you go adjustable or not a good idea if you've lowered the car you have to get an adjustable panhard. https://www.foundersperformance.com/product/lower-control-arm-extreme-joint-camaro-firebird-1982-2002/
If that car is lowered more than an inch from stock height you have more to change/check than you bargained for. Depending on how much you lowered the car from stock not everything will need changed but at the very least it will need checked. This topic has been covered a hundred times in depth and I even posted this in a similar thread but I'll repost it here.
1. You will need a new front end alignment
2. You will need different struts that are made for a shorter travel or one of the taller aftermarket strut mounts to resolve the lessened travel issue.
3. With the body sitting lower the panhard bar pushes the rear end to the side and the rear end will no longer be centered (though it was never really centered to begin with, for evidence see my adventure here : https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...ml#post6162571 (Long time coming AKA My 91 Z28 Vert build thread) ) and will now stick to the passenger side more. You need an adjustable panhard bar to correct this.
4. Most likely the angle of the rear lower control arms is now positive (not a good thing) and you will need rear lower control arm relocation brackets to correct. LCARB for short.
5. The pinion angle is probably positive now (not a good thing either) and would need to be corrected with an adjustable torque arm. I believe that the factory set these at 0* so as soon as the body is lowered the angle can change to positive. Yes there are some odd cases on the net where someone claims better traction with a positive angulation (of course there are no pictures posted of their measurements to prove their pinion angle is actually positive) but 0 to -3 is what most cars will want.
I've been extremely happy with my Founders Roto joint rear control arms now so have an extreme joint out now that looks to be a little better even than ones I have. Also replace your panhard bar whether you go adjustable or not a good idea if you've lowered the car you have to get an adjustable panhard. https://www.foundersperformance.com/...ird-1982-2002/
I have been looking at Founders and believe I will go with them. I see several adjustable panhard bars on there with poly to poly, rod to rod and poly to rod. Not sure which to get and the differences between them.
If that car is lowered more than an inch from stock height you have more to change/check than you bargained for. Depending on how much you lowered the car from stock not everything will need changed but at the very least it will need checked. This topic has been covered a hundred times in depth and I even posted this in a similar thread but I'll repost it here.
1. You will need a new front end alignment
2. You will need different struts that are made for a shorter travel or one of the taller aftermarket strut mounts to resolve the lessened travel issue.
3. With the body sitting lower the panhard bar pushes the rear end to the side and the rear end will no longer be centered (though it was never really centered to begin with, for evidence see my adventure here : https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...ml#post6162571 (Long time coming AKA My 91 Z28 Vert build thread) ) and will now stick to the passenger side more. You need an adjustable panhard bar to correct this.
4. Most likely the angle of the rear lower control arms is now positive (not a good thing) and you will need rear lower control arm relocation brackets to correct. LCARB for short.
5. The pinion angle is probably positive now (not a good thing either) and would need to be corrected with an adjustable torque arm. I believe that the factory set these at 0* so as soon as the body is lowered the angle can change to positive. Yes there are some odd cases on the net where someone claims better traction with a positive angulation (of course there are no pictures posted of their measurements to prove their pinion angle is actually positive) but 0 to -3 is what most cars will want.
Alignment and new tires will be top on my list for sure. I am debating on going to an 18 inch wheel set up. I appreciate the advice. LCARBS going to be added to cart, adjustable panhard too as soon as I can figure which end combination I want such as poly/rod, poly/poly/, or rod/rod. I just have to research I guess the differences.
Adjustable panhard too as soon as I can figure which end combination I want such as poly/rod, poly/poly/, or rod/rod. I just have to research I guess the differences.
I went with Spohn's Panhard bar and Lower Control Arms (chrome moly)- both are adjustable with the Del Sphere pivot joints. And then I got BMR's rear sway bar and LCARB (Thanks for the tip Tibo). It seems to all work very well together.
I have been looking at Founders and believe I will go with them. I see several adjustable panhard bars on there with poly to poly, rod to rod and poly to rod. Not sure which to get and the differences between them.
For Street use for Street use use the poly joints the last much longer for track use only use the rod end joints they have less play but they wear out very fast on the street
Polly ends are low maintenance and practical. Rod ends improve articulation but are not practical for many people because it requires much more maintenance.
Most other derivations of ends are attempts to give some articulation while being more durable on the street than a spherical rod end. Some of these are poor ideas.
The hybrid designs with two end types usually have polly bushing on the frame side to reduce vibrations into the car, and the rotating joint on the axle side for articulation.
Get one of the packages that include the rear lower control arms and adjustable Panhard bar. Poly bushings will resist the transmission of road noise into the body but unless you are going to take the time to properly center the rear end the rod ends will be better. With the rod ends you can get away with the half assed way of visually centering the rear end to the car because the rod ends will allow for the misalignment. Poly ends not so much. As for the upkeep of the rod ends, last I checked Spohn and founders were using $10 rod ends from QA1. Just case hardened stuff. So if in a few years you noticed play at the joint it's just ten bucks and ten mins to change.
For the ends, I would skip poly personally. We just had the poly pieces in our BMR from A arms disintegrate after just 2 years. I like the UMI rotojoints for the rear pieces and Delrin bushings for the front.
I'm also not a big fan of anything with QA1 on the label. I've seen too many parts failures in the last year on their parts on various platforms.
I'm also not a big fan of anything with QA1 on the label. I've seen too many parts failures in the last year on their parts on various platforms.
Double Ditto, also, any rod ends that are $10 (more like $30+) aren't worth anything or the S&H!
Poly is OK on chassis side (unless track car). You do have to check/inspect as they can deform like anything else. I use the Spohn Del-Shpere shanks. Maybe in a few years, the market will come up with something better. Works well for street with a little track time.
Get one of the packages that include the rear lower control arms and adjustable Panhard bar. Poly bushings will resist the transmission of road noise into the body but unless you are going to take the time to properly center the rear end the rod ends will be better. With the rod ends you can get away with the half assed way of visually centering the rear end to the car because the rod ends will allow for the misalignment. Poly ends not so much. As for the upkeep of the rod ends, last I checked Spohn and founders were using $10 rod ends from QA1. Just case hardened stuff. So if in a few years you noticed play at the joint it's just ten bucks and ten mins to change.
Can't speak for Spohn but we don't and never will use anything from QA1. The rod ends we use are either from FK Bearing or Viking Performance.
Okay so I am learning rod/rod for track and poly/poly for street. Would poly/rod be the happy medium? I have also heard that rod/rod was just fine for the street if its not driven daily.
Can't speak for Spohn but we don't and never will use anything from QA1. The rod ends we use are either from FK Bearing or Viking Performance.
That is good to know. I am 99% positive I am ordering from Founders for my LCARBS, rear LCAs and panhard bar. Any advice on which to choose and why such as poly/poly, rod/rod/ and poly/rod combos?
Well I went with Founders rear 3 piece poly LCAs, LCARB relocation brackets and a rod/rod panhard bar. Will probably have a write up on the overall feel of my suspension upgrade in a week or two.
I have the Founders relocation brackets. They were twisted and nothing lined up. Fixable with a bench vice and some muscle though. I also had to resize the control arm bolt holes because they were too small. Better than too big, I suppose.
The brackets will rotate if you just bolt them on. The shock mount isn't enough to hold them solid. This also lends to possibility that the shock nut could loosen because the movement relieves clamping load. Suggest you cut off the shock mount tab and weld them in place eventually.
Double Ditto, also, any rod ends that are $10 (more like $30+) aren't worth anything or the S&H!
Poly is OK on chassis side (unless track car). You do have to check/inspect as they can deform like anything else. I use the Spohn Del-Shpere shanks. Maybe in a few years, the market will come up with something better. Works well for street with a little track time.
Back from the dead, ain't the search feature an awesome thing?
TEDSgrad are the Spohn Del-Shpere shanks a direct fit with the Lakewood PHB? 3/4-16 Left hand thread or Right hand thread?
Direct bolt-in. Both the Lakewood PHB and the Kenny Brown LCA's are fixed on one end and the adjustable ends are RH threaded. Spohn's are all the same ( Del-Sphere shanks)- LCA's or front Control Arms.
08-28-2017, 07:14 PM
